Well, I recall a lot of people scratching their heads at the Giannis pick.  If the 2013 draft were held again he'd likely be the #1 player taken overall.  By the way- that was Anthony Bennett - perhaps the biggest busts of all time (all apologies to Kwame Brown and Greg Oden). 

At the time, selecting Baker seemed like a head scratcher and who knows maybe he flames out as some of the pundits are saying.  My take today is at #10 overall it's a weird spot to draft and this is clearly a boom or bust type proposition and I am fine with it.  Hammonds has done some of his best work in these types of situations- think Giannis and Brandon Jennings and Larry Sanders and Tobias Harris - all were somewhat risky or lesser known players.   Parker and Henson were not - but they all sort of fit the same mold - good to great athletes that needed some development.  His one flameout pick (Alexander) was that same guy too. 

If they get it right with Thon Maker no one will care he was taken 10th overall.  Heck, some people are griping like he was the first pick in the draft. 

Seems like Joakim Noah to Milwaukee is getting some run - with a few other teams involved.  Washington is rumored to consider offering him a max type salary??? 

How quickly the Bulls have come back to the pack.   Just a few years ago they were the team to beat in the East.  I think Indiana made a big step forward with the addition of Teague.  

Why the F*** would the Bucks be interested in Man-Bun Boy?   He trashed the team and city when the Bucks were thinking about drafting him.   He refused to even come to the city of Milwaukee for a pre-draft workout.

or.....maybe the Bucks want to bring him in so the fans can boo him 41 times a season in person.

Noah would be the perfect Herb Kohl move

Um, yeah... Not liking the thought of that douche on the Bucks. He'll be a Laker or Heat. 

"Stealth play for Dwayne Wade"???

http://m.bleacherreport.com/ar...lation-on-heat-guard

Looks like the Bucks like E'Twan Moore, as well, but other teams also in on him. 

Predominant theme of the off season from Kidd- defense defense defense... 

From the link Music posted:

"Keep hearing that the [Milwaukee] Bucks are making a stealth play for D-Wade," tweeted HBO's Bill Simmons. "He needs one team to offer him four years for big bucks for Miami leverage."

He's 34 years old and his knees are probably equivalent to someone that's about 50 years old. Maybe you do it for 2 years, but I think if he leaves the Heat it has to be for a situation where he can play limited minutes in the regular season and basically be a great role player. If the Bucks pay him max money, they will need him to play 35 minutes a game. He'll never hold up physically if that's the situation.

Teletovic and Dellavadova for s combined $68M... wow! I know nothing about Teletovic, other than he played in Phoenix. Had a kinda breakout year, so whatever that means. 

Dellavadova- is he an upgrade from Bayless, who signed a similar deal in (I think) DC? Younger, maybe more durable- not the same player offensively but defensively better than Bayless, no question. 

Music City posted:

Teletovic and Dellavadova for s combined $68M... wow! I know nothing about Teletovic, other than he played in Phoenix. Had a kinda breakout year, so whatever that means. 

Dellavadova- is he an upgrade from Bayless, who signed a similar deal in (I think) DC? Younger, maybe more durable- not the same player offensively but defensively better than Bayless, no question. 

Almost 10 million a year for Dellavadova? The fact that Cleveland appears to have no intention of matching may be saying a lot.

Jeremy Lin got 36MM over 3 years, so that's what the market is paying right now.  Delly should help them for sure.   

Bayless got 9MM per year with the Sixers too. 

Chandler Parsons- holy ****.  That's crazy money IMO. 

Telly and Delly I can hear it now 

Two solid moves. Delly will help their defense big time and he's and underrated 3 point shooter.  Telly is a real sleeper.  Very good outside shooter off the bench.

Evan Turner basically signed for Khris Middleton type money and he's half the player.  That's a bad deal for Portland 4yrs 70MM 

Teletovic sure is interesting... Knew nothing of the guy, looked him up. Big time shooter, stretch 4, 6'9". Dude's Ersan Ilyasova. But seems like he's more athletic, can handle the ball pretty well for a Big. 

He really is a sleeper. He won't be an all star, but he'll be a big help. Funny- I was advocating for Kevin Love... He's similar and a lot cheaper. 

Having followed the T Wolves for years it just doesn't look like Kevin Love is the same player since leaving Minnesota.  He's still a solid player, but you don't pay those guys like that 24MM per year.  I think the injuries have taken a toll with the guy too.  

I would much rather we pay a guy like Telly 10MM per year as a bit player than a guy like Love - or Wade for that matter - max dollars over 3-4 years.  That's a lot of risk v reward. 

Tschmack posted:

Telly and Delly I can hear it now 

Two solid moves. Delly will help their defense big time and he's and underrated 3 point shooter.  Telly is a real sleeper.  Very good outside shooter off the bench.

 

 

I'm guessing solid is now a synonym for laughable.

I'm guessing you might want to follow soccer or tennis then instead? 

Thanks for the input 

You got it. Glad I could help.

No problem 

Curious why Cal Buc hasn't chimed in on all of the Lakers great moves 

Tschmack posted:

No problem 

Curious why Cal Buc hasn't chimed in on all of the Lakers great moves 

He's probably too giddy to even type. What other reaction to giving 186 million dollars to Jordan Clarkson, Timothy Mozgov, and a 31 year old Luol Deng could there possibly be? 

Music City posted:

Teletovic sure is interesting...

The guy can drain it. A 3 point shooter is such a big need for this team:

Tschmack posted:

I'm guessing you might want to follow soccer or tennis then instead? 

Thanks for the input 

What's wrong with soccer and tennis??? Oh wait, I know the answer. Fedya's favorite sports.

MichiganPacker2 posted:

The general consensus is that the Bucks are out of their minds. 

 

http://www.si.com/nba/2016/06/...ender-brandon-ingram

Milwaukee Bucks: F

As inexplicable as the Papagiannis pick was, the Thon Maker pick was worse. The Kings are always going to be the Kings as long as Vlade and Vivek are in charge, but the Bucks could actually be good. You can't just throw away top–10 picks like they're nothing. 

There's a way to see Maker as a case of the Bucks doubling down on the weirdness of their roster and putting together the most science–fiction lineup possible, and maybe that's how it'll play out, but I don't see it. Maker should have been a second rounder, not a top 10 pick. He has raw tools, but not many skills, and this week there were allegations that he's three years older than he claims. These are not good signs. Really, almost every move Milwaukee's made since drafting Giannis and Jabari—trading for MCW, signing Greg Monroe, trading for Grievis Vasquez, inexplicably drafting Rashad Vaughn—has been a failure. Worse, most of these moves were clearly bad ideas at the time.

Mostly, it bums me out because Giannis is absolutely for real, and Milwaukee should be one of the most entertaining teams in the league. But whoever is running things is screwing this up.

 

Not sure I agree with the assessment that all of the moves ha e been bad. I know most are down on MCW, but I have a strong feeling about his future as a defensive player. And the Monroe's situation, while right now seems to have been a miss, didn't last summer. And Vaughn? Not sure what you saw, but I saw a kid with some real potential. That kid could be really good. Tough to say when he's only 20.

we won't know much about the end result of these moves until 2017/2018. They're all so young...

Jon Leuer got 42 million over 4 years from the Pistons. 

http://www.si.com/nba/2016/07/...stons-sign-jon-leuer

He averaged 8 points and 4 rebounds per game for a team that went 23-59. 

Good for him, but that's just crazy. 

Holy crap! Great for Jon!!!

that just puts everything else in perspective, doesn't it? I don't know or understand why these marginal players are getting such inched me deals, but it has to have something to do with next year's cap...

Biyombo just got crazy money as well. 70 million for 4 years from Orlando. 

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_...al-according-sources

Makes Leuer's contract look reasonable. 

Was walking by the Bradley Center today. The Bucks have me 2.5 million for doing just that.

Horford to the Celtics... That's a really good move. They're going to be pretty good...

On the critique of the Thon Maker pick, I only wonder one thing.

A statistical sketch of when he was predicted to be selected.  Like some selection number with some awareness of spread about  that prediction.

I have no idea, but if it's like he's a high #2 and that likelihood is 95%, well it's a reach, then.

If so, just draft down if you covet him at  10.

I'm sure it will turn out just fine for the Bucks.  But I really would've liked to seen Ellenson in a Buck's uni....power forward.....young, room to grow.....then the Bucks should've traded up to get Baker later in the 1st round if necessary.  But, as usual...I have no idea what the scouts were saying to the Bucks behind closed doors.

None of us do. But there's a lot of smoke screen and BS that circulates. If the Bucks passed on him at 10, getting him later would have been a challenge. 

BS or not, the management said he was their guy. They wanted a stretch 4, and this guy can be even more than that. They they signed one. The Bucks are versatile and deep... 

Durant to Golden State. Durant, Curry, Thompson, Iguodala, and Draymond. With Ezeli and Bogut out they'll need a big guy to eat up a few minutes. 

How do you possibly guard the 3 point line against that team? Draymond Green might never shoot a contested shot next year. 

Losing Harrison Barnes is not a big blow. He just disappeared in Game 7 of the finals. Never like to see anyone play scared. 

Talk about a video game type team now with Durant on board.  Assuming he stays healthy that is a crazy talented team. 

The only question is chemistry.  We've seen a lot in sports how sometimes the "best" team doesn't always win.  

Tschmack posted:

Talk about a video game type team now with Durant on board.  Assuming he stays healthy that is a crazy talented team. 

The only question is chemistry.  We've seen a lot in sports how sometimes the "best" team doesn't always win.  

 

Several discussion points. 

1. Is there going to be enough shot attempts to keep everyone happy? Durant, Curry, and Thompson are all high volume shooters. They are all already on max contracts or will get one next year (in Curry's case), so that may help. 

2. Who gets the ball in a Game 7 playoff game down one with under 10 seconds left? It has to be Durant, but how will Curry adjust to this? 

3. The Curry, Thompson, Green, Iguodala, and Barnes lineup was already lights out and now you swap in Durant for the weak link? 

4. Other than winning Game 7 of the finals, how do you measure if Golden State is better next year? They were 73-9 as it was and would have likely won in the Finals if either Green hadn't been suspended for Game 5 or if Bogut didn't get hurt. Obviously, they have to win a championship or Durant will look like a failure. Give him some credit, there is some pressure on him now. If he goes back to OKC, there is a lot less pressure. 

5. They have to rebuild their bench and get a big guy or two. Livingston is back, but they're going to lose (besides Barnes) Ezeli and Bogut to clear cap room. Speights is a decent 5-10 minute a game guy, but not a defender. Maybe they'll get some big guys to sign for cheap, but who's left? 

6. The 2011-12 Thunder had Durant, Westbrook, Harden, and Ibaka. They played in the finals and all 4 were 22-23 years old. Now it's just Westbrook. Look for him to go full Iverson next year. It's not out of the question he could average 35 a game. Who else is going to shoot? 

I think the real question is how are they going to defend? I said it throughout the playoffs- when they go small, teams should go big and pound away. Cleveland did some of that. Now they can use Dursnt as a big- but he can't defend a C. Though he has height, he's still not strong enough to defend a power big. 

I don't think there is going to be an issue with who gets to shoot- there's plenty to go around at the pace they play. But some of the things that GS did in the playoffs exposed their weaknesses. They're not physical, they aren't great finishing at the rim off the dribble. With Durant they have another finisher to add to Green, and some who can create off the dribble. 

The real loser is the Clippers. They were the other choice. Their window is closing. Durant would have made them legit contenders. Now? It'll never happen...

Zaza Pachulia to the Warriors on a bargain contract (2.9 million) - at least relative to what a guy like Leuer got. 

Hell, I'd love it if Bogut came back to the Bucks.

Bogut's health has always been the issue 

I'm looking at the Mavs... What kind of roster are they trying to put together? They're all over the place. Adding Barnes/Bogut seems kinda pointless. 

At the end of all this, it seems like there are really only 3 teams with a good chance to win a title next year and then a big gap to the Clippers and then another gap to 2-3 teams that might be good enough to scare one of the big 3 in a playoff series.

Warriors - probably win about 70. The only way teams will beat them is to do what the Thunder and Cavs did against them. Crash the offensive boards with guys like Tristan Thompson and Adams and beat them up physically. Except now they have to do that against a 7 foot guy instead of a 6'8" shrinking violet (Barnes) against the "death lineup." Also, the fact that when Curry and Durant run pick and roll it will be almost impossible to defend without helping out which leaves one of the best shooters in history wide open (Thompson). If they stay healthy and want it, I think 75 wins is in play.

Spurs - probably win between 60-65. Gasol is a good fit.

Cavs - probably win around 60

The Clippers would probably be next. If everyone stays healthy, they'll win about 55 games.

Then it's the Celtics, Hawks, and maybe the Blazers. But do any of those teams really have a chance? It's not like signing Horford or Dwight Howard made anyone think that the Celtics or Hawks are championship contenders. I actually think the Wolves have more upside.

This makes for great playoff series in the Western finals and the Finals, but what do you sell if you marketing one of the other 25 or so teams?

I don't think GS wins 73 games again this year. Kerr likes to rest his starters during the grind of a regular season and they won't have the same depth to win those bench games.

They are, of course, a much more dangerous team in the playoffs now. Plus they've also damaged one of their chief threats in the Thunder.

I don't understand the earlier question on how will they defend. I know the GS offense gets all the press, but that team has defended at an elite level the past two years. The Death lineup has been an incredible defensive unit - that's what makes Green so valuable - he can guard every position. Looking back at that Game 7, the defense played well enough to deliver them a title. The last five minutes of that game I think they just gave up that tough Irving three pointer. They made stop after stop, but shockingly couldn't cash in on the other end. That's why they lost; not their defense.

They lose some rim protection for sure with Bogut gone. But they should still be a good defensive team as long as Draymond Green is healthy.