@Shadow posted:Talking out loud, I wonder how Woodson would do in the role.
The more I think about this, the more I like it.
And it's not a far-fetched idea. Woodson is intelligent, articulate, has business experience, and is well respected. Not only by his peers, but as a good man.
Idk if Gute has handled all this as best he could have. But i do know that every time we hear more from Rodgers, when he's not deflecting and sending people Dunn's way, he's caught in some contradiction about things he's previously said.
During the mess of last season, Rodgers said himself the communication had significantly improved. He noted numerous times when he and Gute had spoken. He also said he could "feel" during the season that they were leaning toward moving on. Then comes Feb and he states they said they want him to retire in GB. Then the darkness somehow changed everything...
"Everyone knows that I facetime, so if you try calling me on an archaic telephone, the reception is bad where I live. But i only talk to people i like." Wtf is this trash? It's like gradeschool bullshit. You want people to be direct with you while you play these idiotic games? This alone is reason enough to be happy he's someone else's mvp.
Podcast: Skip to 16:44 for some foreshadowing of the scrutiny 8 will be under this season. 28:28 for the reprise
@Fandame posted:It may be that Gute was not as good a communicator as he could have been; few of us are great communicators, and Gute was a new GM. But if you're that miffed about it, you sit down with the guy and flat-out tell him how you feel -- especially if you're the star QB and you obviously consider yourself a world-class communicator as Rodgers does. Rodgers going all passive-aggressive, pissy, and acting as if it was his FO to run was a huge problem, and I think that story has yet to be told.
I think there will come a time when the whole true story comes out on what exactly shook out in GB.
I have nothing to base it upon and its only my personal feeling but I think the whole thing was a perfect storm with blame on both sides. On one side you have a prima donna QB who wanted to run the show like NBA superstars run some NBA teams. And he got pissy when the team gave him the middle finger on that.
And on the other hand you have a GM who perhaps sucks at communicating. But the question for me does he suck at communication or does he suck at communicating how #12 wanted it done? And let's be honest how much fun would it be for Gute to deal with a guy who had his agent contact the team and ask for you to be fired?
@Boris posted:Rodgers' job is to play football. Not cry about who gets drafted.
The draft is a living breathing moving thing. Nobody knows how the draft is going to fall until it happens that night. Gutey saw a player available (who was wanted by Seattle and Indy) and he felt it was good value at that spot.
Gutey doesn't need to "clear it" with his highness #12
FFS I've heard it all now
Of course he doesn't need to clear it with anyone but a simple heads up to the guy that was the face of the franchise for years (although yes he's clearly a pain in the ass diva) couldn't have hurt.
@Floridarob posted:Aaron may play ten more years since he went to New York especially if he has a little success. He is currently adored by the masses and can swap spit with the movie stars, rub elbows with the rich and famous like him, and get tickets to the ritzy glitzy places Manhatten has to offer. He probably feels like he has died and gone to heaven. And of course the Jets management is kissing his Ass. bending the knee, and kissing the ring daily......
No wonder the guy has a superiority complex when we have people like you capitalizing his "Ass". Treating his backside as a proper noun. For the love of Pete!
@Herschel posted:And TT's silent persona being more successful was two-fold:
1. He had more gravitas.
2. He actually held power, not this silo crap.
McCarthy was also a pretty strong face, not that LaFleur isn't very good in front of the camera. He is, but "Pittsburgh Macho" did seem to have the "Go ahead, make me the bad guy" thing in spades.
I was there and saw it.
Shannon goin off!
@The Heckler posted:And on the other hand you have a GM who perhaps sucks at communicating. But the question for me does he suck at communication or does he suck at communicating how #12 wanted it done? And let's be honest how much fun would it be for Gute to deal with a guy who had his agent contact the team and ask for you to be fired?
It's never looked to me like Gutey had trouble communicating. And as a first time GM he's not going to be stupid and intentionally piss off an HOF player like Rodgers. Rodgers probably saw the Gutey hiring as an opportunity to gain some power within the organization as far as personnel went and it didn't happen the way he wanted.
@13X posted:Of course he doesn't need to clear it with anyone but a simple heads up to the guy that was the face of the franchise for years (although yes he's clearly a pain in the ass diva) couldn't have hurt.
I see no reason for a heads up. If Rodgers objects do the Packers go in a different direction? I doubt it. If Rodgers is informed and the Packers still draft Love does it change anything? I doubt it, he'd still disapprove of the pick. Rodgers knows zero about team building. If we hadn't drafted Love who would our QB be today?
@Packiderm posted:Shannon goin off!
don't usually agree with these two knuckleheads but they nailed it on this!
You lost me at Skip.
@13X posted:Of course he doesn't need to clear it with anyone but a simple heads up to the guy that was the face of the franchise for years (although yes he's clearly a pain in the ass diva) couldn't have hurt.
This kind of thinking is bullshit. The GM is boss 1 and MLF is boss1A. TOOG may have thought he was boss 1 but the Packers showed him! Just as they did with TOG.
If Jack Benny reincarnates and needs a new Rochester…Shannon Sharpe is my pick.
Fedya…a little help here.
Sharpe is overqualified.
Shannon Sharpe might be a loud mouth that nearly ruined all his credibility to cash some checks for serving up the absolute dregs of sports talk debate as filler, but he gave my absolute favorite Hall of Fame Speech I've ever watched. Some guys go up and it's a boring painful slog. He laid out the drive and motivation it takes to rise above humble beginnings and succeed at the highest level. His words were delivered with purpose.
@ammo posted:This kind of thinking is bullshit. The GM is boss 1 and MLF is boss1A. TOOG may have thought he was boss 1 but the Packers showed him! Just as they did with TOG.
It’s not about who’s the boss. Giving Rodgers a heads up couldn’t have hurt as a common courtesy. Yeah the Packers sure showed him who was boss by kissing his ass publicly and then giving him a ridiculous contract.
And I think that was all Murphy. When the truth comes out Gutey did not want to do that. Murphy didn't want a rerun of the TOG fiasco and insured it didn't happen again while he was president. .
@13X posted:It’s not about who’s the boss. Giving Rodgers a heads up couldn’t have hurt as a common courtesy. Yeah the Packers sure showed him who was boss by kissing his ass publicly and then giving him a ridiculous contract.
It's definitely about who is the boss. Rodgers knows nothing about roster building. Rodgers would have reacted just the same way if he got a heads up.
I will agree Murphy screwed up by allowing Rodgers to get away with crap and giving him the contract. No way that happens if Gutey is making the call as much animosity as it's now evident that there was.
@PackerRick posted:It's definitely about who is the boss. Rodgers knows nothing about roster building. Rodgers would have reacted just the same way if he got a heads up.
He certainly might have but who knows. My point was that it wouldn't have hurt anything to give him a heads-up (not input regarding the pick, just basic communication).
@13X posted:He certainly might have but who knows. My point was that it wouldn't have hurt anything to give him a heads-up (not input regarding the pick, just basic communication).
Interesting. So, do they need to give Bakhtiari a heads up any time they draft an OT? Did they need to give Zadarius Smith a heads up when they drafted Gary? Jennings and Nelson must have gotten a phone call when Adams was drafted. Wonder how much "heads up" Alexander got before Stokes was drafted?
He wasn't a victim. He wasn't mistreated. He wasn't screwed over. He wasn't back-stabbed. He was given a new contract. He was given every opportunity to remain the Packers starting QB. If 12 still wanted to be here he would be.
@KonKrete posted:Interesting. So, do they need to give Bakhtiari a heads up any time they draft an OT? Did they need to give Zadarius Smith a heads up when they drafted Gary? Jennings and Nelson must have gotten a phone call when Adams was drafted. Wonder how much "heads up" Alexander got before Stokes was drafted?
He wasn't a victim. He wasn't mistreated. He wasn't screwed over. He wasn't back-stabbed. He was given a new contract. He was given every opportunity to remain the Packers starting QB. If 12 still wanted to be here he would be.
Franchise, superstar QBs are different, period. They're the hardest position to acquire and there's a reason teams throw so many resources into trying to get one.
There is also one of them. Bakhtiari? Two tackles. Z? Good teams have at least three good ones to rotate. Alexander? Good teams need three starting quality corners and a fourth who can play.
There's also the part of a GM's job about managing people. Just throwing some money at them isn't going to cut it. If you've ever actually managed people even semi-successfully in any field it can be frustratiing but it's an important part of the gig.
I don't care how good the player is, if you start treating them differently you'll have problems. I think there was a lot more going on in the locker room than we know and the remaining players couldn't be happier that Rodgers is gone. If you look at the roster spots reserved for Rodgers friends I don't think any of them were even given a sniff at coming back.
Shannon Sharpe, love him or hate him, really laid it out with what a me, me teammate Rodgers was. I saw a comment from Doubs were he said Rodgers barely talked to him. That's a starting WR with no communication with his QB.
Rodgers got exactly as much heads up as he should have. None. Even his agent called him when Love was drafted and said "QB' just to set him off. Isn't Dunn Love's agent also? Another POS.
Brohm was drafted 2nd rd in the midst of 12 becoming the starter. Flynn in the same draft. I don't recall Rodgers calling out his buddy Ted in that aftermath. I'd say once you step over the line and capitulate to your star player, there's no way of telling what ego you're unleashing.
I believed Rodgers took Favre's exit to heart. What I didn't realize all these years was that it also became the playbook on how to assert his own power as well. So even when he laid his cards on the table, and by all accounts he made clear he appreciated some good faith on the part of Gute and the organization, he still sees fit to dump on Gute after the dust has settled. That type of "professional" behavior deserves a heads up as you look toward the future of the franchise? I think it's more likely Rodgers playing such games could be the very reason he wasn't afforded what he believed was deserved. It seems he loves the liberty of playing head games while holding others to being direct and forthright.
he’s nothing but a big crybaby. thanks for the super bowl 12 but well past time to move on
@Goalline posted:Agreed! TT Traded Favre for boatload of whaaaa?????
A 3rd round pick....
However......
That pick turned into Clay Matthews and won us a Lombardi.
So while I was furious with the low amount of capital TT received....it ended up working out pretty well.
No matter what happens in the future...I am thrilled with the compensation Gutey received for "god"
@Boris posted:A 3rd round pick....
However......
That pick turned into Clay Matthews and won us a Lombardi.
So while I was furious with the low amount of capital TT received....it ended up working out pretty well.
No matter what happens in the future...I am thrilled with the compensation Gutey received for "god"
I thought Clay was a first round pick.
Didn't the Packers trade to move back into the first round to draft CM before Belichick could draft him?
No no no. Clay was our last 3rd round pick to do anything for the team other than turn over and die.
Without looking I'm assuming the 3rd was packaged with a 2 to get us back into round 1 so we could draft Clay after already having picked up Raji.
Clay Matthews was taken in the first round of the 2009 NFL draft - 26th overall. To get there the Packers traded their 2nd round pick (41st overall), and two 3rd round picks (73rd & 83rd overall), to New England. GB also got a 5th round pick in the deal. That much I know. The idea explained at the time was that no one pick will be tied to the TOG trade.
You can certainly make an argument that Rodgers has been so vital to the success of the GBP for 15 years that if you’re even considering replacing him, now or in 3 years, then it’s more than fair to have a sit down prior to the draft and explain the possibilities. Because they knew they liked QBs, the years lined up with Rodgers contract, the rookie contract, etc., so I don’t think it’s unfair to say GB owed the guy some transparency and they just didn’t give it.
That said, could they have been thinking that a conversation like that would have cause severe damage and caused him to demand a trade, which they were NOT ready for? Yeah certainly. They know him well. Better than we do. There’s a lot to lose by poking the bear if you don’t have an option in hand. They weren’t then, but obviously they are now. They purged him and as much of his circle jerk of friends as they could, which wasn’t feasible 2, 3, 4 years ago. So I can see both sides of it. Thought the Favre divorce would have been a great ESPN 30 for 30, but the complexity of this divorce absolutely dwarfs that one. In retrospect, that was a pretty simple one because the whole organization, FO to lockerroom, seemed fine with the change. This one is very layered with seemingly lots of background.
I can only speak for myself - but if I were the GM, no one outside of the draft room would know anything - especially players of any position on the roster. Why all the secrecy? First, no one actually knows how the draft will unfold - so why put anything out there? Second, because even if you were reasonably sure it would go your way - why risk a player going on his favorite show for instance and broadcast it to the world - which includes the other 31 GMs? And third, what happens if new information becomes available on draft day that in some way alters the approach? I don't think this is a question of fairness. I think it ensures the integrity of the organization and ensure it's interests won't be compromised. But that is - as I said - just me.
