Boehringer does everything but run routes at this point.  He's got really good speed, runs tough after the catch, shows the ability to go up and high point the ball in traffic, willing to take on tacklers.  He looks great running HS level routes in his highlight video but this kid's potential is sky high.  Can he physically and  mentally learn a route tree?

Here is mine; CBS Big Board, Fanspeak draft simulator;

 

27: R1P27
OLB LEONARD FLOYD
GEORGIA
 
57: R2P26
DT CHRIS JONES
MISSISSIPPI STATE
 
88: R3P25
DE BRONSON KAUFUSI
BRIGHAM YOUNG
 
125: R4P27
ILB NICK VIGIL
UTAH STATE
 
131: R4P33
OT WILLIE BEAVERS
WESTERN MICHIGAN
 
137: R4P39
RB TYLER ERVIN
SAN JOSE STATE
 
163: R5P24
S DEANDRE HOUSTON-CARSON
WILLIAM & MARY
 
200: R6P25
G REES ODHIAMBO
BOISE STATE
 
248: R7P27
TE JAKE MCGEE
FLORIDA

 

 

I'd be surprised if Kaufusi is a first round pick.  The Packers have met with him so there is definite interest there.  But I'm thinking Thompson is probably looking at him at the end of round two.  Interesting thing would be to see where the Packers would play him.  Get him down to 260 and play OLB, or bulk him up to 295 to play DE.  Have to worry a bit that if they take him as a lineman that he could turn out to be the next Mike Neal/Datone Jones. 

DH13 posted:

Boehringer does everything but run routes at this point.  He's got really good speed, runs tough after the catch, shows the ability to go up and high point the ball in traffic, willing to take on tacklers.  He looks great running HS level routes in his highlight video but this kid's potential is sky high.  Can he physically and  mentally learn a route tree?

Everything about the NFL will be exponentially more difficult than what he's confronted up to this point. Especially the physical talent lining up opposite him and (more importantly IMO) the speed and complexity of the game. I've always thought Janis!'s biggest problem was coping with the need for him to see, recognize, and adjust to what defenses were doing pre- and post-snap along with Rodgers' adjustments as every play unfolded. Bo! will have the same challenges.

DH13 posted:

Boehringer does everything but run routes at this point.  He's got really good speed, runs tough after the catch, shows the ability to go up and high point the ball in traffic, willing to take on tacklers.  He looks great running HS level routes in his highlight video but this kid's potential is sky high.  Can he physically and  mentally learn a route tree?

Yeah, but does he have small hands?

Astounding. Especially as the Rams, having fleeced Washington in the Robert Griffin trade, now willingly jumps in the same swamp.

I suppose Kroenke wants to do something to spark interest in the new fan base. What he should really do is fire Jeff Fisher who's as overrated and underachieving a coach as the league has seen. Exhibit A as to how being able to curry media favor helps provide job insurance.

Hungry5 posted:

They want Wentz. Surprised you didn't know that PJ.

I had no clue.  To this point I've just been checking the various top prospect lists and trying to figure out what players Thompson will probably like and what players he probably won't like.  To be honest my interest in the NFL as a whole is pretty minimal these days.  If it wasn't for my love of the Packers I probably wouldn't pay attention to the NFL at all.  I'll probably start looking at the various mocks around the internet this weekend to see how much they are different from the compilation of top prospect lists I've assembled.

Wow, so the Rams traded all of that for a china doll QB who started a whopping 23 games for North Dakota State.  Missed junior season in high school because of arm and shoulder pain.  Two concussions during his senior year.  Surgery to repair torn left meniscus prior to 2013 season.  In 2015 suffered a high ankle sprain and then broke his right wrist.  North Dakota State didn't miss a beat while he was out.  All injury information is from Nolan Nawrocki's book, which I would recommend.

I can't help but to think they could have given up a lot less to spam the position with some dual combination of Lynch/Cook/Hackenberg/Hogan and a late flier on a Stave/Licata/Frohnapfel-type, giving them three shots at their guy and still keeping some of those picks.

ChilliJon posted:

You don't sell tickets in Los Angeles with great LB's! You sell tickets with big splash moves like this for a golden armed QB!!! This has Kroenke's stink all over it. 

 

You forgot to mention jersey sales.  Have to agree that this seems like a move that the owner gave an order on.

 

Fisher and Les Sneed with a Hail Mary to keep their jobs...problem is you need Aaron Rodgere to make a Hail Mary work. No QB will stay healthy and upright with that OLine. This move is slightly less stupid if they're pursuing a franchise LT like Tunsil, which they need because their franchise Guard Greg Robinson sucks at LT.

Wow this seems like a terrible trade.  I just don't see it with Wentz (or Goff for that matter).  And this type of move makes things even worse for Wentz b/c this means he's starting on day 1.  This is why bad franchises stay bad franchises.  I just feel bad for To dd Gurley b/c he's going to get 400+ touches this year, ensuring his career lasts about 4 years before he wears down.  

I'm so jealous of the Titans right now.  I'm of the belief that if you had a have a crappy year to get a top 5 draft pick, this was not the year.  The 3 best players play lower value positions (non-pass rushing LB, DB and 3-4 DE) and the 2 QBs are far from sure things.  Not surprising the Titans were willing to trade back 14 picks.  Very surprising a team actually wanted to trade up 14 picks.  

It's not a fleecing if the Rams believe they can get the guy they think will be "the Man" for them.  In the end, it won't be how much they gave up to get the Q they pick, but whether or not their assessment of that guy was correct.  They must think very highly of whoever they are going to take.  If they traded up for other reasons, that's a fool's foundation.

The Rams drafted four offensive linemen last year and with Robinson probably feel that they've invested all they need to in this unit for now (which is debatable as Robinson hasn't been good as pointed out by GD).  They have Gurley who is a stud.  So they trade it all to add the QB but they don't have much in a pass-catching department.  Britt is a solid player but only good for about 40 catches a year.  Austin is a nice player to have but he's a gadget player and just isn't a real threat as a pass-catcher.  This team looked like it was on the right track to build a solid power-run-offense and if they would have used this and next year's draft to add to the defense...I think that would have been a much better strategy.  Going all in on the QB when the defense was bottom 10 last year and there isn't much for pass-catchers on the roster just doesn't seem to make much sense.

Only bad thing from the Titans perspective is that it sure sucks to have moved down that far.  A chance to take whoever is graded the #1 player on the board and at #15 the top three tiers of the board are probably gone.  I think they'll move back up and target Ronnie Stanley or Jack Conklin.  It would be odd to see the Eagles move back down after having moved up.  But if the Eagles moved up to 8 with the intention of moving up even further for a QB...after seeing the price for that it might make more sense for them to bail out of there and move back down.  Stanley could very well be gone at 8 but Conklin will be there.  If they could work a trade with the Eagles they could give up #15, #45 and #193 and get back #8 and #100.  Then they could draft the tackle to protect their franchise QB and still have #33, #43, #64, #76, #100 and a couple more picks in this draft and those extra picks in next year's draft.  Makes sense for them to move back up.  

Agree on dropping to #14.  I've looked at a few mocks and have yet to see a good scenario for #14.  That seems to be a tipping point in the draft where player rankings get pretty muddled.  I'm thinking they package a third or fourth and move up a few spots to get a guy like Conklin or Stanley.  

I think this trade all but guarantees that 4 QBs go in the first.  Maybe this opens the door for TT to trade the 27th pick so a team picking 31-40 can get Connor Cook.  

If the Rams traded away the farm for the number 1 pick without having a clear understanding of who they were going to select after they got there, then everyone in that sad organization should be fired. 

I don't think that's what's going on though. 

Agree EKB.  Makes zero football sense, but perfect business sense.  Take it from a guy who lives in a town with 2 Kroenke owned teams: he is a shrewd businessman but could care less about winning championships.  Nuggets and Avs have fallen far since Kroenke got involved.  

And saying they haven't decided on a QB makes them look like idiots.  Has to be a favor to the NFL to keep some drama for the first pick on draft night.  

Per Barnwell teams that have traded into the top 5 to grab their guy at QB since 1990 has resulted in Jeff George, Kerry Collins, Ryan Leaf, Mike Vick, Mark Sanchez, and Robert Griffin. 

Paxton Lynch might be the best QB in this draft. Might be Kevin Hogan. Might be Goff or Wentz. 

Never trade up for a QB. Let them fall in your lap. 

That'd be very smart.........so probably precludes the Titans from doing it.  That team is much too comfortable picking in the top 10, doubt they'd want to do anything to jeopardize that.  

So long as the medical rechecks show he has a chance at a full recovery, I'd be ok with the Packers taking him at #27.  It'd be tough not getting anything from your first rounder in year one but I got pretty used it from 2011-2013 with Sherrod, Perry and Jones contributing little to nothing in their rookie years.  It's worth waiting a year for a special talent.  All depends on whether he can still be special after his recovery.  

He's in tier 10 on Thompson's board.

Even if the team physician gives the thumbs up, I still think there will be better prospects available at #27 and #57.  Wouldn't mind seeing Thompson taking him at #88, but if the team physician gives him the thumbs up then other team physicians will have given him the thumbs up and some other team will probably draft him well ahead of #88.

I do agree Ted should crush rounds 3 through 5 with his 2 additional 4th round comp picks. 

Im all kinds of fascinated where he ends up going with his round 2 pick. 

I still think Rd1 is Jarran Reed. My Reggie Ragland dream is dying just like my CJ Mosley dream bled out two years ago. 

If Ted finds a nice collection of starter quality slobs for both lines this draft is a win. 

At #27. It almost has to be DL or OL. I can't imagine any other position falling into his lap but stranger things have happened. 

I really like Eli Apple. If he is there at #27, he should be the pick. Can't have enough CB's. 

PackerJoe posted:

Even if the team physician gives the thumbs up, I still think there will be better prospects available at #27 and #57.  Wouldn't mind seeing Thompson taking him at #88, but if the team physician gives him the thumbs up then other team physicians will have given him the thumbs up and some other team will probably draft him well ahead of #88.

Disagree.  If (and it's a big if) Jaylon Smith is expected to be at 100% by May 2017, drafting him at #27 is akin to trading the #27 pick this year for a top 5 pick in 2017.  But it's even better b/c you get Smith into your program for a full year so he'll actually be more ready for 2017 than a normal first year player.  At 57, it'd be a no brainer.  Talent wise, Smith is top 5 in this draft.  IMO, it'd be worth waiting a year for that.  

Of course, it all depends on the medical recheck.  If he can't fully recover then i agree, Smith at say 90% of pre-injury talent may not be worth it.  But if he's expected to be 100% recovered, I'd take him at #27.  

Tough call. It's been too long since we've had a great LB'r not named Clay.

If presented with the choice, I'm glad it isn't me making the call.

1 thing I do know, is Ted will do what's best for our favorite team when it's our turn to select.

Yeah if he's expected to make a full recovery and returns to form then that's a no brainer at 27. Smith says he's already leg pressing 600 lbs., so it seems as though structurally his knee has improved, the question is the long term health of the knee. He's a force unlike any player in the draft in coverage and rushing the passer.

Grave Digger posted:

I don't understand why you think it's not a talented draft? There isn't a franchise QB or pass rusher at the top, but there will be a lot of really great values...especially in the mid-rounds where TT normally kills it. The values on UDFA's will be great also IMO. 

My take is that there are 3 guys in this draft that are blue chip prospects: Ramsey, Jack and Tunsil.  The first 2 have almost no holes in their game and while Tunsil has all the tools, OL lately has been as risky a top 5 pick as QB.  IMO, those are the only 3 players that go top 10 in 2014 or 2015.  This top 5 reminds me more of 2013.  

But going from 10 through like 50, there's a ton of players that could be all-pros if they develop right.  They all happen to have significant questions that are the difference between journeyman and pro bowl.  Can Elliott be a difference maker at RB worthy of a top 10 pick?  Can Treadwell overcome his lack of speed?  Can Rankins and Billings overcome their lack of height?  Can the Bama DT's learn how to pass rush?  Can Spence stay clean off the field?  Can Ragland play all 3 downs?  Can Fuller catch the ball?  Can Chris Jones play with more consistency?  Can Su'A Craven and Darren Lee find a position?  I could go on forever but would not shock me if any of those guys become all-pros or bounce around the league for awhile.  

Would not shock me if any of the guys above went top 15.......or at #40.  Maybe this is no different than most years but I don't remember seeing the same guy mocked at #15 as #40 this close to the draft.  

ChilliJon posted:

Has anyone been more wrong about more things than Ron Jaworski? Has he ever been right about anything? 

You shut your whore mouth when Mr. Jaworski is talking.  Has he ever been right about anything?  Are you kidding?  More like, has he ever been wrong about anything?

Checkmate.  

CAPackFan95 posted:
ChilliJon posted:

Has anyone been more wrong about more things than Ron Jaworski? Has he ever been right about anything? 

You shut your whore mouth when Mr. Jaworski is talking.  Has he ever been right about anything?  Are you kidding?  More like, has he ever been wrong about anything?

 

Checkmate.  

He says Kaepernick "throws with accuracy". Even when he was flying high, that was one of the weakest parts of his game. In his two playoff games against the Packers, he completed just over 50% of his passes. Accuracy!

UTEP DE-Roy Robertson-Harris was in Green Bay yesterday.  At 6-6, 255 pounds he'd project as an OLB in the Packer's defense.  Pretty mediocre college player, totaled 87 tackles, 17 tackles for loss and 6 sacks over his last two seasons at UTEP.  Earned Conference USA honorable mention honors after the 2014 season.  Posted impressive workout numbers.  Ran a 4.80 40-time, 23 reps of 225 pounds, 4.27 seconds in the short shuttle and 7.0 seconds in the 3-cone drill.  The short shuttle and 3-cone drill numbers are probably what caught Thompson's attention.  Currently grading out as an early-to-mid sixth rounder, it's doubtful that Thompson is looking at this player as a priority free agent.  He'll likely have to spend a draft pick to obtain this player.

Round One:

1. Los Angeles Rams (from Tennessee) - Jared Goff/QB/California (*)
2. Cleveland Browns - Carson Wentz/QB/North Dakota State
3. San Diego Chargers - DeForest Buckner/DE/Oregon
4. Dallas Cowboys - Jalen Ramsey/CB/Florida State (*)

Jacksonville Jaguars trade 1st (#5) and 5th (#146) to Tennessee Titans for 1st (#15), 2nd (#43) and 3rd (#64)

5. Tennessee Titans (from Jacksonville) - Laremy Tunsil/OT/Mississippi (*)
6. Baltimore Ravens - Ronnie Stanley/OT/Notre Dame (*)
7. San Francisco 49ers - Myles Jack/ILB/UCLA (*)
8. Philadelphia Eagles (from Miami) - Jack Conklin/OT/Michigan State (*)
9. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Vernon Hargreaves III/CB/Florida (*)
10. New York Giants - Darron Lee/OLB/Ohio State (*)
11. Chicago Bears - Joey Bosa/OLB/Ohio State (*)

New Orleans Saints trade 1st (#12) to Indianapolis Colts for 1st (#18) and 3rd (#82)

12. Indianapolis Colts (from New Orleans) - Taylor Decker/OT/Ohio State
13. Miami Dolphins (from Philadelphia) - Ezekiel Elliott/RB/Ohio State (*)
14. Oakland Raiders - Eli Apple/CB/Ohio State (*)
15. Jacksonville Jaguars (from Los Angeles Rams through Tennessee) - Sheldon Rankins/DT/Louisville
16. Detroit Lions - William Jackson III/CB/Houston
17. Atlanta Falcons - Kevin Dodd/DE/Clemson (*)
18. New Orleans Saints (from Indianapolis) - Shaq Lawson/DE/Clemson (*)
19. Buffalo Bills - Laquon Treadwell/WR/Mississippi (*)
20. New York Jets - Leonard Floyd/OLB/Georgia (*)
21. Washington Redskins - Jarran Reed/DT/Alabama
22. Houston Texans - Will Fuller/WR/Notre Dame (*)
23. Minnesota Vikings - Josh Doctson/WR/Texas Christian

Cincinnati Bengals trade 1st (#24) and 7th (#245) to Dallas Cowboys for 2nd (#34) and 3rd (#67)

24. Dallas Cowboys (from Cincinnati) - Paxton Lynch/QB/Memphis (*)
25. Pittsburgh Steelers - Mackenzie Alexander/CB/Clemson (*)
26. Seattle Seahawks - Jason Spriggs/OT/Indiana
27. Green Bay Packers - A’Shawn Robinson/DT/Alabama
28. Kansas City Chiefs - Corey Coleman/WR/Baylor (*)
29. Arizona Cardinals - Ryan Kelly/C/Alabama
30. Carolina Panthers - Germaine Ifedi/OT/Texas A&M (*)
31. Denver Broncos - Connor Cook/QB/Michigan State

Round Two:

32. Cleveland Browns - Tyler Boyd/WR/Pittsburgh (*)
33. Tennessee Titans - Cody Whitehair/OG/Kansas State
34. Cincinnati Bengals (from Dallas) - Vernon Butler/DT/Louisiana Tech
35. San Diego Chargers - Hunter Henry/TE/Arkansas (*)
36. Baltimore Ravens - Kendall Fuller/CB/Virginia Tech (*)
37. San Francisco 49ers - Michael Thomas/WR/Ohio State (*)
38. Jacksonville Jaguars - Von Bell/S/Ohio State (*)
39. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Emmanuel Ogbah/DE/Oklahoma State (*)
40. New York Giants - Le’Raven Clark/OT/Texas Tech
41. Chicago Bears - Robert Nkemdiche/DE/Mississippi (*)
42. Miami Dolphins - Artie Burns/CB/Miami, Fl (*)
43. Jacksonville Jaguars (from Philadelphia through Los Angeles through Tennessee) - Su’a Cravens/OLB/Southern California (*)
44. Oakland Raiders - Reggie Ragland/ILB/Alabama
45. Tennessee Titans (from Los Angeles) - Sterling Shepard/WR/Oklahoma
46. Detroit Lions - Chris Jones/DT/Mississippi State (*)
47. New Orleans Saints - Joshua Garnett/OG/Stanford
48. Indianapolis Colts - Christian Westerman/OG/Arizona State
49. Buffalo Bills - Jonathan Bullard/DE/Florida
50. Atlanta Falcons - Austin Hooper/TE/Stanford
51. New York Jets - Shon Coleman/OT/Auburn
52. Houston Texans - Braxton Miller/WR/Ohio State
53. Washington Redskins - Joshua Perry/ILB/Ohio State
54. Minnesota Vikings - Jaylon Smith/OLB/Notre Dame (*)
55. Cincinnati Bengals - Pharoh Cooper/WR/South Carolina (*)
56. Seattle Seahawks - Kenny Clark/DT/UCLA (*)
57. Green Bay Packers - Kamalei Correa/OLB/Boise State (*)
58. Pittsburgh Steelers - Andrew Billings/DT/Baylor (*)
59. Kansas City Chiefs - Keanu Neal/S/Florida (*)
60. New England Patriots - Nick Martin/OG/Notre Dame
61. New England Patriots (from Arizona) - Zack Sanchez/CB/Oklahoma (*)
62. Carolina Panthers - Jerald Hawkins/OT/Louisiana State (*)
63. Denver Broncos - Vadal Alexander/OG/Louisiana State

Round Three:

64. Jacksonville Jaguars (from Tennessee) - John Theus/OT/Georgia
65. Cleveland Browns - Austin Johnson/DE/Penn State (*)
66. San Diego Chargers - Kyle Murphy/OT/Stanford
67. Cincinnati Bengals (from Dallas) - Carl Nassib/DE/Penn State
68. San Francisco 49ers - Dak Prescott/QB/Mississippi State
69. Jacksonville Jaguars - Landon Turner/OG/North Carolina
70. Baltimore Ravens - Derrick Henry/RB/Alabama (*)
71. New York Giants - Karl Joseph/S/West Virginia
72. Chicago Bears - Charone Peake/WR/Clemson
73. Miami Dolphins - Connor McGovern/OG/Missouri
74. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - T.J. Green/S/Clemson (*)
75. Oakland Raiders - Miles Killebrew/S/Southern Utah
76. Tennessee Titans (from St. Louis Rams) - Xavien Howard/CB/Baylor (*)
77. Philadelphia Eagles (from Detroit) - Jordan Howard/RB/Indiana (*)
78. New Orleans Saints - Maliek Collins/DT/Nebraska (*)
79. Philadelphia Eagles - Spencer Drango/OG/Baylor
80. Buffalo Bills - Alex Lewis/OT/Nebraska
81. Atlanta Falcons - Kentrell Brothers/ILB/Missouri
82. New Orleans Saints (from Indianapolis) - Kyler Fackrell/OLB/Utah State
83. New York Jets - Will Redmond/CB/Mississippi State
84. Washington Redskins - Cyrus Jones/CB/Alabama
85. Houston Texans - Bronson Kaufusi/DE/Brigham Young
86. Minnesota Vikings - Leonte Carroo/WR/Rutgers
87. Cincinnati Bengals - Jack Allen/C/Michigan State
88. Green Bay Packers - Willie Beavers/OT/Western Michigan
89. Pittsburgh Steelers - Noah Spence/OLB/Eastern Kentucky (*)
90. Seattle Seahawks - Rees Odhiambo/OG/Boise State
91. New England Patriots - Max Tuerk/C/Southern California
92. Arizona Cardinals - KeiVarae Russell/CB/Notre Dame
93. Carolina Panthers - Jeremy Cash/S/Duke
94. Denver Broncos - Hassan Ridgeway/DE/Texas (*)
95. Detroit Lions (compensatory selection) - Rashard Higgins/WR/Colorado State (*)
96. New England Patriots (compensatory selection) - Malcolm Mitchell/WR/Georgia
97. Seattle Seahawks (compensatory selection) - Harlan Miller/CB/Southeastern Louisiana
98. Denver Broncos (compensatory selection) - Nick Vigil/ILB/Utah State (*)

 

Boris is right, (*) is a player that declared with college eligibility remaining.

For the most part, draft position is fairly close to the consensus opinion of a player as it currently stand (as compiled from top prospect lists of Nawrocki, Ourlads, CBSSports, NFL.com, ESPN, GBN).  There are a few exceptions to that.  After looking at team needs I projected many offensive linemen to go much higher than the board indicates.  On the flip side, there weren't nearly as many teams looking at 3-4 OLBs so many of those edge rushers slid further than expected (note that Michigan State's Shilique Calhoun isn't even listed, and he carries a late round two grade).  Running back is also a position where players slid.  Derrick Henry grade out high in round two but ended up going early in round three.  Several running backs that carry a solid third round grade (Devontae Booker, Kenneth Dixon, C.J. Prosise) aren't listed at all.  Outside of those position groups, Penn State defensive lineman Austin Johnson fell to early round three...he really should go at least a half round earlier than that.  Outside of that, players are pretty much being drafted in the area that the board shows.

So for the folks wondering why Thompson would bring Barclay back...Thompson may see the same scenario that I see in this mock.  Be willing to draft an offensive lineman a round or two early, or go without picking one until late in the draft.  IMO the Beavers pick at the end of round three is a reach, but at that spot it was offensive line or running back and with all the running backs slipping I feel Thompson would gamble that one would still be within reach in round four (if not all the way down to #125 then at least close enough where he could engineer a trade up to still get good value on a running back).

Some teams concerned about Myles Jack's knee.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/...nions-from-nfl-teams

He did the vertical at the UCLA pro day workout, but skipped the 40 and shuttle drills.  At the time he said he'd do those at a workout scheduled for April 1.  Then he cancelled that workout.  His knee was scoped in September, and normally it shouldn't take 7 months for a full recovery.  All media reports have indicated the actual medical report on Jack was OK, so it will be interesting to see if all this talk is smokescreen talk or if some impatient NFL teams are sick of him doing the "I'll run, now I'll do it later, now I won't do it later" stuff. 

They have returning starters at every position, so they should be covered as far as immediate needs. Their needs are immediate depth and long term starters. 

As for Jaylon Smith, I guess it just depends on if there's a team that thinks the knee will be okay long term...if there is then he could go in r1 (ala Willis McGahee) or if there isn't then I doubt he makes it out of r5 (ala Marcus Lattimore going in r4). 

packerboi posted:

Agree?

are only team in NFL w/o any notable “needs” heading into draft. Thompson can take best available

I'm not sure how ILB is not a notable need. Maybe Ryan and Barrington will surprise with massive jumps, but Barrington played one game last year and Ryan was adequate at best. The only other ILB roster (other than CM3 who they claim is going back to the outside) is Joe Thomas who is really a hybrid ILB/Safety. The former Broncos LB is more of an OLB, at least from what I've read.

Also, the DL has just Guion, Pennel, Josh Boyd, and Daniels right now? That would seem a notable need as well.

TT took care of TE, he's got some flexibility to add to the DL, LB, and OL.

No - I disagree. 

ILB, is still an issue.  Barrington will be an URFA next year and Joe Thomas and Bradford haven't shown they can be what we need there either.  So who to pair with Ryan is a question. 

TE - so we rented Cook for a year.  He will be an URFA next year.  I don't think Perillo is any answer or he would have shown more by now.  Henry & Blackman need to show a lot more this year, so there is risk there.  That leaves us with RR.  Need to upgrade - badly.

OL - Sitton, Lang, Bakhtari, and Tretter will be URFA next year.  If your happy with Rotheram and Taylor we are good - assuming the 2 guards leave.  Will need a replacement for Bak at the very least.  And if Tretter plays there, we need depth anyway.  At the very least we need some dependable depth. 

I think we have some notable weaknesses. 

I'd say they need an OLB, ILB, NT and DE who can earn snaps early, a quality  O-line prospect or two (unless they really think Rotheram is going to be a player and they keep Tretter as their swing guy), and probably a wave TE and maybe a RB. 

I don't think it will be disastrous if they don't fill all of them right away, but getting a pass rusher, a couple of thumpers for the lines and the TE would be a priority. 

I've all but given up hoping for a high-quality ILB pick. 

I took that as the Packers don't have any starting spots that need to be filled with rookies, which they don't. Jake Ryan had a poor season, but he was just a rookie and plenty of successful players have gone on to strong careers despite a rough rookie year. I don't know if that is Ryan's trajectory or not, but I doubt he's being written off by the organization. Unless we draft a guy like Ragland in r1, I expect Ryan and either Barrington or Joe Thomas to be the opening day starters.  So top to bottom, this roster has all 24 starting jobs pretty much locked in barring injury, so the only true need is depth (albeit critically needed in some areas). 

ChilliJon posted:
GBFanForLife posted:

Isn't Lang a little old to be enrolling at Michigan?

If you had a chance to play in Michigan wouldn't you choose to play for the best football team in Michigan?

If I had a chance to play in Michigan, I'd decline and take my chances in WI.

Raji quit, Pennel is suspended, they are supposedly moving the underachieving Datone , and Benoit thinks they have no needs ? That's optimistic. 

Clay Matthews and Barrington (on occasion) are their only proven ILB's. 

They have needs. 

Not to mention, it would seem Ted looks at "needs" in terms of the 19 game(playoffs!!??) schedule and beyond. Tough to think they will get through 19 games with Bahk and Bulaga .... and no solid back-up. One might say a back-up OT is a need too. 

I'm just glad we don't have a GM who is short sighted and doesn't plan for the future. TT is usually quite good at making sure a position doesn't "age out" and guys are continually developed and keeping this roster young. Sans a few positions like TE, ILB, etc he's pretty good at seeing past the trees and noticing the whole forest.

You can always improve your team, even if you don't have any perceived "needs"

TT isn't losing sleep this time of the year for nothing. He works harder than anyone else to make our favorite team as fully stocked as it can be. We're very lucky to have him as our GM.

P.S. My NFL Draft tickets showed up today. Looking forward to the 3-day experience in Chicago again.

1.  Defensive Line - either a nose tackle or 5-technique

Guion's ability to play nose tackle or the 5-technique gives Thompson the flexibility to draft a player to play either of those spots and Guion can fill whatever role is needed.  Players like Vernon Butler and Austin Johnson could probably play either, would be really nice to grab one of those two and then figure out the best who-plays-where combination in training camp.

2.  Linebacker

Not convinced that the organization has Matthews' role set in stone.  If Thompson sees an inside linebacker that he likes early, he drafts him and if that guy can play right away then Matthews goes outside.  If Thompson sees an outside linebacker that he likes early, he drafts him and then Matthews goes inside.  Thompson will target linebacker early but once inside that positional group will just look at value, not get hung up over needing an inside guy versus an outside guy.

3.  Running Back

Fans might get all excited about Lacy supposedly being in great shape, but I'd bet Thompson still isn't very happy with what he saw last year.  Lacy didn't figure to be a 10-year player when he entered into the league due to his running style.  Considering that and the fact that conditioning has already proven to be a major issue, would Thompson be willing to give Lacy a big contract if he has a big year?  I'm not convinced.  Starks is old.  They really don't have anybody past those two.  The coaches seemed to be fairly happy with Crockett at year's end but it would probably be best to view him as a camp body with a chance to win the #3 spot.

4.  Offensive Line

Lots of talk about the four upcoming free agents but the Packer's won't lose all four.  If they bring two back that's probably two starters + Bulaga + Linsley...only leaving one opening to fill.  Use a middle round pick this year and an early to middle round pick next year and hopefully find a starter between those two players.  I really think the priority in this draft for the offensive line went down when Thompson gave Lane Taylor that two year deal.  It's pretty obvious that Thompson sees him as being on the 53-man roster next year.  Bakhtiari, Sitton, Linsley, Lang, Bulaga, Tretter, Taylor...already up to seven and most of the time there are only 8 offensive linemen on the roster.  Thompson only really needs one, could take a second one later and carry 9 but that isn't a necessity.  Rotheram still figures into the mix.

5.  Defensive line

Lots of factors go into the second defensive lineman they pick.  Is Ringo a keeper?  If he is then they are set at 3-technique with Daniels and Ringo and can focus on adding another big body.  If Ringo is a camp body, then a backup 3-technique is in play.  Does Pennel move to the nose and take over the backup role there?  If so then they can focus on a 5-technique.   This would be a second defensive lineman picked, what spot does the first one project too?  It's essential that they start the year with 6 defensive linemen and right now they have Daniels, Guion, Boyd (coming off injury), Pennel (suspended), Ringo (practice squad).  Thompson will have to take two players here, and not unreasonable to think that he might take three.

6.  Linebacker

If an outside linebacker is picked first, then they go inside second and vice versa.  They need to pick two linebackers but I don't think Thompson would be motivated to double-up on two inside linebackers unless he was dead-set on Matthews playing outside which I don't think he is. 

7.  Safety

They need to find a real safety for depth.  Not a special teams guy like Banjo.  Not a nickel back like Hyde.  A real safety to get a little insurance if one of the two starters go down.

Don't really see Thompson being that motivated to go after pass-catchers.  With Nelson, Cobb, Adams, Mongomery, Abbrederis, Janis...if he drafts a receiver and nobody gets hurt in training camp then you spent a pick on a player that has to pass through waivers where he is potentially lost, or cut Abbrederis who Thompson spent a fifth round pick on and probably won't want to cut.  The Packers have already been connected to about a half dozen receivers that figure to be seventh round picks or undrafted, seems like Thompson would be perfectly content to sign a couple undrafted guys to the practice squad.  Tight end has Rodgers, Cook, Perillo, Backman (who Thompson spent a draft pick on and won't want to cut) and Henry.  There were some positive things said about Henry at the end of the year, we can sit here and speculate on how much of that was legitimate.  But I will say this, if Henry did show anything last year then Thompson probably would favor him over most the tight ends that will be found late in this draft.  Bottom line is the Packers already have three tight ends with a really good chance of making the 53-man roster...plus a fourth that Ted spent a draft pick on...plus a fifth if they legitimately like Henry.  There just may not be a spot open to pick another one.  Even with losing Heyward, cornerback seems pretty well stocked.  Nine picks, seven positions where I feel pretty confident will take players, that leaves two picks where Thompson can take a second offensive lineman, another pass-catcher, a cornerback, a third quarterback...whatever players float his boat.  But those seven positions listed above, I feel pretty confident that Thompson will fill all of those.

One other interesting note that I found out today.  WR-Kolby Listenbee/Texas Christian was a player the Packers interviewed at the combine.  At that time the draft experts had him as a fourth/fifth round type player.  He missed a couple games this season with a hip injury and then didn't do shuttles at the combine due to a groin injury.  There were no reports to indicate that he had any major issues, and the 4.35 second 40-time certainly would indicate that there were no major issues.  I still found it odd that Thompson was looking at him because he didn't seem to fit Thompson's preferences for a fourth/fifth round wide receiver (he's purely a speed guy at this point, not a player that was super-productive and not very good in traffic).  Turns out Listenbee has a sports hernia injury, and while it's probably not serious it sounds like something that could take the 20th best receiver in the draft and make him into the 30th best receiver in the draft, which would basically take him from a 4th/5th rounder to a 7th rounder.  It will be interesting to see what happens with this player. 

Ted doing his pre-draft presser now (being streamed on packers.com).

Packers general manager Ted Thompson met with the media on Wednesday morning to preview the 2016 NFL Draft. Here are some highlights from his news conference:

Opening statement:

Good morning, I’d like to start off saying that the draft, as we can see today, is a very popular thing. I want to make sure people understand my appreciation for this organization, our coaching staff. Everybody works so hard to try to help us put it all together. Obviously, the personnel people, the football operations people, all the coaches, player personnel, video people – all those people are directly involved in the actual draft process whether it be helping in terms of logistics or arranging for travel for guys we bring in for visits. It’s an enormous amount of work. It seems like most of the attention is direction is directed to me – that’s not warranted because we have a whole team of people who help put this on. We still have a week to go, but we think we’re close to be about where we need to be. I was thinking about this – when we played Washington in the playoffs, we were staying downtown. I went out for a walk. It turned dark. It was 8:30 in January in Washington D.C. and I’m walking along, I’m trying to dodge traffic – there’s a grass area and there’s cars going this way and this way and I’m in this grass area. Right there is the capital building and it’s under construction. I just stopped there in the middle of it – I didn’t go out for a purpose, but when I got there I said this is the reason I went out for a walk. I hope the same thing happens with the draft. That when it’s done we’ll say this is the reason we put in all this work.

On how the first round plays out:

Parts of it do and parts of it don’t every year. I don’t know if one is any more than another. There’s always surprises. I guess it’ll be a little bit of both.

On if they do mock drafts:

No, we don’t. We’ve tried to, but we’re so personal with it and so locked into it, we make it up. If there’s somebody we really like, we say, ‘Oh yeah, we can get him there,’ and we kind of fool ourselves.

On draft-room emotion:

There are gut-wrenching times to where you’re so close to getting the perfect player for your time and they might get picked right in front of you. As it happens, you were better with that happening than the first place.

On picking 27:

It depends. When you’re picking 27, it’s much more difficult to come up with the actual 27 names. It gets to be a little bit mathematically difficult to predict. You have groups of players. You try to say these guys are pretty close. It’s constantly evaluating.

On Leventee McCray:

We thought he had some good snaps in Denver. We think he has a nice body type. He has good athletic ability. He’s shown the ability to be an outside backer.

On the roster:

I think it’s a good roster. I feel pretty good about it going in. We’ve got a number of players that we’re going to add to our roster. We’ll do that through some late free agency, through some drafting, through some college free agent type of stuff.

On immediate holes vs. long-term planning:

We meet every day and talk about personnel and talk about those things: depth and longevity of your players, where you think that is. So you’re always thinking about it and going over it.

On having all the scouts together in one place for pre-draft talks:

It’s good. It’s not always comfortable because there are disagreements where people, rightfully so, think differently. They’re paid to do so. They’re encouraged by everybody, myself included, to make sure their voices are heard. … You still want to have the passion and energy to stand on the table and say, ‘This is what we need to do, and this is the reason we need to do it.’

On inside linebacker:

We think it’s a pretty good group. They’ve been able to get some experience. Sam’s experience got thwarted a little bit with an injury.

On drafting best player available:

We try to draft the best player available. We think it’s important to stay focused and try to take the best player. I think that from a personal standpoint. Situation about needs isn’t normally a temporary one. As long as you’re taking really good players and best players you can identify, then you’re in some respects you’re able to stay a little bit in front of the curve. There can be some of both. You can be in a position where this solves problem A on our roster, but he’s also the best player available. If you get lucky where you can address both – if it comes to one or the other, I prefer to take the best player.

On excitement of draft time:

I don’t know if excitement is the word I’d use. This was the first week our players were back and it’s certainly good to see them in the building and moving around, and that sort of thing. The draft thing gets dragged out so long that you’re kind of ready to do it one way or another.

On changes in the pre-draft process:

There’s been some. There’s a lot more information now. Sometimes that’s good, sometimes that’s not so good. There’s all kinds of analytical stuff you need someone paying attention to. It’s more work. It’s more comparisons. Because there’s more time, I feel like it kind of evens the playing field. Most teams are probably similar.

On if defense has what it needs to move Matthews back outside:

We’re not playing anybody tomorrow. I hope not. I think there are places on our rosters where we’re relatively thin when looking at the 90-man roster. We have a number of guys who were on the team before this spring and going forward.

On Jared Cook:

He’s very athletic. Great catch radius, big target. We think he’ll add some stuff to us athletically of the offensive side of the ball.

@Jeff_McLane: #Eagles have agreed to a trade with the Cleveland Browns to acquire the second-overall pick in the 2016 NFL Draft.

@Jeff_McLane: #Eagles traded 2016 1st, a 2016 3rd, a 2016 4th, a 2017 1st, and an 2018 2nd to get the Browns 2d pick.

@Jeff_McLane: The #Eagles also get a 2017 4th rounder from the Browns.

@Jeff_McLane: #Eagles all but assured that they will draft North Dakota State QB Carson Wentz with the second pick.

lol

@andrewbrandt: If Eagles are to take a QB, which we assume, after signing two for $34M guaranteed in March, they must feel very good about rest of roster.

@andrewbrandt: Eagles just agreed to pay Bradford $22M minimum and to pay Daniel $12M minimum. Now using valuable resources to acquire their replacement.

Friend of mine in Philly is a season ticket holder. He said the Eagles have solid information the Rams are taking Goff. Once they had that info they moved up based on their infatuation with Wentz. He also thinks they will deal Bradford to SF. 

Now watch the Rams take Wentz 

@andrewbrandt: Bradford got $11M signing bonus. Daniel got $6M signing bonus, $3M roster bonus. 2nd pick will get $16M signing bonus. $36M in bonus alone.

@RapSheet: The #Eagles aren't trading Sam Bradford. Instead, they created a situation where their rookie QB doesn't have to play for a year (or two).

Fortunately Eagle fans are a patient and understanding collection. I'm sure they'll be fine giving away 6 early picks so they can watch Bradford **** all over Lincoln Financial for 2 years while the future sits back and learns. 

What could go wrong?

ChilliJon posted:

Fortunately Eagle fans are a patient and understanding collection. I'm sure they'll be fine giving away 6 early picks so they can watch Bradford **** all over Lincoln Financial for 2 years while the future sits back and learns. 

What could go wrong?

For starters, hopefully it doesn't snow wet and heavy on

"Santa comes to the Link" Day. 

The Eagles gave up this truck full of picks to potentially pick a guy who's never thrown a pass in a live game against a DB who will play in the NFL? Check out this scouting report of weaknesses.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/d...1907522/carson-wentz

And then they get the Eagles 2017 first round pick in addition to the #8 overall pick this year? It's well within the realm of possibility that that 2017 pick could end up being Top 5 overall (or better) in a year where DeShaun Watson of Clemson could be an easy consensus #1 pick. Not to mention that Leonard Fournette will be in next year's draft.

 

DH13 posted:

Meanwhile, starting at QB for CLE.....?

Would you rather have a guy that started at North Dakota State (Wentz) and needs a lot of coaching on fundamentals and reading a defense, or RG3 and about 5 extra picks (and only having to drop down from #2 to #8 overall this year)?

There is no reason RG3 can't be a serviceable C- level sort of QB. Wentz is a very risky pick and he's likely only going to succeed if someone if patient with him - that's not likely to happen in Cleveland or in Philly.

Hear me out on this one....

Why wouldn't GB just tank one full entire season, say 2016 for example, go 0-16, get the number one pick in the draft (Which is almost guaranteed to be QB Deshaun Watson out of Clemson) then wait for the dumb**** owners to start lining up to hand over 6 picks in the first three rounds to move up to 1? 

Yes, it's greasy as can be. But if teams can mortgage the future for a one year shot at a Lombardi what's wrong with a one year tank to be borderline great for the next 5?

This seems like the kind of thing Goodell would lay in bed terrified over if he had any common sense. 

ChilliJon posted:

Hear me out on this one....

Why wouldn't GB just tank one full entire season, say 2016 for example, go 0-16, get the number one pick in the draft (Which is almost guaranteed to be QB Deshaun Watson out of Clemson) then wait for the dumb**** owners to start lining up to hand over 6 picks in the first three rounds to move up to 1? 

Yes, it's greasy as can be. But if teams can mortgage the future for a one year shot at a Lombardi what's wrong with a one year tank to be borderline great for the next 5?

This seems like the kind of thing Goodell would lay in bed terrified over if he had any common sense. 

This has already been done for the last 3-4 years in the NBA by the 76ers (tanking to get picks - admittedly not then packaging them in a trade). It hasn't worked.

Question for everyone. Having seen film on Hundley in the pre-season last year, would you rather be going into this season with Hundley, Goff, or Wentz?

Wouldn't you think Hundley would net a first round pick at this point if teams are willing to send Herschel Walker/Ricky Williams level of picks for the latter two guys?

Boris posted:

Now the REAL question is....

Will the Factory of Sadness use the picks well? or just flush them down the toilet like they always do?

Noteworthy....

It’s reminiscent of the 2011 deal with the Falcons, who were as desperate for wide receiver Julio Jones as the Eagles were for a quarterback.

The Browns got Atlanta’s first, second and fourth-rounders in 2011, plus their first and fourth in 2012 in that deal.

They turned those picks into (hold your breath, or your nose) nose tackle Phil Taylor, wide receiver Greg Little, running back Owen Marecic, quarterback Brandon Weeden and then they used the fourth to move up in 2012 for running back Trent Richardson.

So before we congratulate Sashi Brown and Paul DePodesta and Hue Jackson for swindling the quarterback-mongering Eagles, let’s make sure they actually pick guys who can play football first.

DH13 posted:

Meanwhile, starting at QB for CLE.....?

Aaron Rodgers.....

Oh, you didn't know?!?!? 

Colts "Sucked for Luck" in case you forgot....It can be done because the risk isn't as great now as it used to be, thanks to the rookie cap

Can't miss TV will include a game between 2 teams (TBD) who both are intentionally losing games to get the #1 pick.  It will be like 2 boxers who think they are paid to take a dive.  A dance recital will break out.  Finally some one throws a punch and misses and both boxers go down.  This scenario was in the movie "Sargent Bilko" (the Steve Martin version).  They called it "Boxing history" then.  The NFL version will have it's own movie.    I'll buy the DVD. 

Just a stat, none of GBs HOF QBs (Arnie Herber, Starr, Favre) were originally first round picks - although we did give up a first to get Favre from Atlanta.  That will change when Rodgers gets in.  But even then none will have been a top 10 pick.  So all this moving up is way over rated for the teams moving up. 

Troy Aikman 1989-2000
George Blanda (Also PK) 1949-1958, 1960-1975
Terry Bradshaw 1970-1983
Len Dawson 1957-1975
John Elway 1983-1998
Brett Favre 1991-2010
Dan Fouts 1973-1987
Otto Graham 1946-1955
Bob Griese 1967-1980
Sonny Jurgensen 1957-1974
Jim Kelly 1986-1996
Bobby Layne 1948-1962
Dan Marino 1983-1999
Joe Montana 1979-1994
Warren Moon 1984-2000
Joe Namath 1965-1977
Ken Stabler 1970-1984
Bart Starr 1956-1971
Roger Staubach 1969-1979
Fran Tarkenton 1961-1978
Y.A. Tittle 1948-1964
Johnny Unitas 1956-1973
Bob Waterfield 1945-1952
Steve Young 1985-1999
 
Most of the recent ones were first-rounders though, if you're using the Hall as a metric. 
 
Even more of the Super Bowl Champions have been firsts (Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Flacco, Eli, Peyton) 

Have to laugh at the thought of Christian Hackenberg in round one.  I remember at this time last year how a few experts out there slipped Bryce Petty into the end of round one which was equally as funny.  Hackenberg's upside is Jay Cutler on one of Jay Cutler's bad days.

That draft scenario would be absolutely perfect for Thompson.  Doctson, Fuller, Coleman off the board...leaving Treadwell as by far the best WR prospect left on the board.  Hargreaves still on the board, a top prospect at a highly valued position.  Meanwhile Thompson has a whole bunch of candidates still left: Kenny Clark, Chris Jones, Vernon Butler, Austin Johnson, Emmanuel Ogbah, Cody Whitehair...wouldn't be that shocked if Thompson liked Kevin Dodd as an outside linebacker.  Looks like #27 would have a whole lot of value and the board screams trade down.

GB is an enviable position as far as draft position goes. If Paxton Lynch makes it past the Bills and Jets, he likely won't be picked until 28 (Kansas City) or 29 (Arizona)...two teams with veteran QBs major injury histories, who aren't long term answers and minimal depth behind them.  Then you have Denver sitting at 31 who is staring down a season with Mark Sanchez as their #1 guy... Perhaps Denver will feel some heat to jump a division rival that may also be in the market for a QB? GB could probably snag Denver's 3rd and also give up a 4th (they have two other comp picks) or a 5th. 

Ghost of Lambeau posted:

Just a stat, none of GBs HOF QBs (Arnie Herber, Starr, Favre) were originally first round picks - although we did give up a first to get Favre from Atlanta.  That will change when Rodgers gets in.  But even then none will have been a top 10 pick.  So all this moving up is way over rated for the teams moving up. 

I mean, if we're going to stretch your logic to its inevitable conclusion, NFL teams shouldn't even draft a QB, because hey, Bart Starr was drafted in the 17th round!  Since there are only 7 rounds today, drafting a QB ANYWHERE must be overrated, right?  

Grave Digger posted:

GB is an enviable position as far as draft position goes. If Paxton Lynch makes it past the Bills and Jets, he likely won't be picked until 28 (Kansas City) or 29 (Arizona)...two teams with veteran QBs major injury histories, who aren't long term answers and minimal depth behind them.  Then you have Denver sitting at 31 who is staring down a season with Mark Sanchez as their #1 guy... Perhaps Denver will feel some heat to jump a division rival that may also be in the market for a QB? GB could probably snag Denver's 3rd and also give up a 4th (they have two other comp picks) or a 5th. 

I'd love to see us do what Bill Barnwell suggests, and package something to move into Tennessee's 2nd round picks at 43 and 45.

Nebraska offensive tackle Alex Lewis officially visits Green Bay.  Currently projected as a fourth rounder, but I think odds are against him making it past round three.  Tumultuous time in college.  Began as a greyshirt in Colorado and was the starting left guard in his second season there.  Decided to transfer to Nebraska.  Spent a month in jail after beating up an Air Force cadet.  Nebraska's starting left tackle in 2014 and 2015.  Known as being a very tough, over-aggressive player that will take some dumb penalties.  Isn't one of those guys that has the great athleticism to play left tackle, but has the size, smarts and balance to probably play there in the NFL.

CAPackFan95 posted:
Ghost of Lambeau posted:

Just a stat, none of GBs HOF QBs (Arnie Herber, Starr, Favre) were originally first round picks - although we did give up a first to get Favre from Atlanta.  That will change when Rodgers gets in.  But even then none will have been a top 10 pick.  So all this moving up is way over rated for the teams moving up. 

I mean, if we're going to stretch your logic to its inevitable conclusion, NFL teams shouldn't even draft a QB, because hey, Bart Starr was drafted in the 17th round!  Since there are only 7 rounds today, drafting a QB ANYWHERE must be overrated, right?  

I did not mean for it to be taken that way. 

Bart Starr was taken with the 248th overall pick in the 1956 NFL draft.  That pick is in the 7th round today - and it is currently the Packers last pick in this draft.  The difference is there were fewer teams in 1956 - hence more rounds.  In the history of the NFL draft there have always been 250-300 players taken overall.  So I definitely did NOT mean to imply that a QB should NEVER be taken "ANYWHERE" - or if one was they were overrated. 

So I will try to spell it out for you.  I posted what I did in the context of the trade ups that have been occurring in the NFL.  I meant the post to help make the point a team doesn't have to mortgage the future to get the help they need - and this can happen at any position - not just QB.  The Packers certainly haven't.  But while I am at it, neither have other teams.  Pittsburg for instance took Roethlisberger in the first, but he fell to their spot - they did not trade up.  The Patriots got Brady in the sixth.  The Rams got Werner from a grocery store.  And so on.  Hershel made the (good) point that first round HOF QBs are more common as of late.  And there are reasons for that - maybe QBs are a more first round thing to pick - maybe teams just got better at taking first round QBs.  I don't know exactly - but that was a good point as the history shows. 

I think it depends on your starting point as a QB - the better that is the faster results will come.  Then having a fit between QB, coach, and system is a key.  Then having a coach who knows how to develop is key.  In that context, a good QB can be available anywhere in the draft.  It was just a thought to help support the anti trading up talk.  That is it. 

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