+/- Packers/Lions 1.0

#Packers rookie CB Eric Stokes ranks 9th among the 104 NFL cornerbacks who have played at least 40 snaps in @PFF overall defensive grade.

He is 1st among rookies.

They charged the Cephus miscommunication TD to his coverage.

Outside of that: 0 rec on 3 other targets w/ 2 PBU pic.twitter.com/GqMZIzbdch

— Ross Uglem (@RossUglem) September 21, 2021

Positives:

Division win 

Jones is a fast difference maker in the offense

Outside of a couple of sacks I was pretty happy with the young OL

Stokes is raw but you can see the talent and the speed he possesses

Negatives:

Kevin King being immediately picked on by opposing offenses and the 10 yard cushions he gives the offense

The team still even with  the nice win seems slow and maybe rusty. 

Defensive slow start and bend but don't break style.  This defense starts off so passive and gives up plays right off the bat.  I saw on twitter during the game last night that the Packers defense has given up 7 passing TD's through the first 2 games for the  first time in their team history.  No Packers team had done that before and that includes the defenses of the 70s and the 80s.  Hopefully one of these days I can stop bitching about the defense.

+  Lafleur is a really good offensive coach

+  Rodgers is a really good QB

+ Jones is a really good RB

+ Tonyan's 2020 was not a fluke

- Rashan Gary has been flat out terrible these past two weeks. Even his 'sack' of Goff would have gone as a completed pass had Goff not let the ball slip away..It is not Gary's fault that he has been over hyped--but man--this is year three-his pass rush is terrible, he has no range, his pursuit is terrible and he has no instincts--yes--he is out there a lot and he was gassed--by all means give Rivers and Garvin some reps

- small sample size, but Barry looks to be about as effective as every D coordinator since Fritz

-,  The first half.

+, The second half.

@packerboi posted:

Why haven't we done a poz/neg thread yet this year?

Because game 1 had no poz.

+ the new punter!

Paws

+ Interior line played much better.   All 3 had good games.

+ Aaron Jones is a stud.   

+ Stokes making plays is huge.   They are going to avoid Jaire all year, we have to have a CB that can make the occasional break up on the other side.

+ The punting game.   Couple nice kicks in the 4th quarter.

+ Second half pass defense was aided by the Lions but it was still an improvement from the 6 previous quarters.

+ Bobby Tonyan is damn good.   Lock him up now.   

Negs

- The obvious, Kevin King should be the last option off the bench.  He has one nice play last night on that long ball to Cephus but other than that it was another disastrous night.

- Pass rush.   You can't let the QB sit clean for 4 to 5 seconds patting the ball while rushing 4.  Someone has to get home.   Hopefully after our Defensive Coordinator was told that pressuring the QB is a key component of an effective defense, he starts playing more aggressive from the start of the game.   I

+ Hearing everyone rip on Adam Shefter as he walked the sidelines. He heard it, you could see it in his face. I mean, the guy was basically right in the end but you knew the fans were going to be heard.

+ The crowd was 100% behind Rodgers. I expected to hear a few boos after the offseason drama and what happened week 1 but anyone that was butthurt was drowned out to the point of not being heard at all.

+ The pre-game speech from Woodson on the jumbotron with everyone holding up their cell phone lights. I hope they showed that on the TV broadcast. Was pretty chilling in person.

- The jackass in section 131 on the other side of the tunnel. Was being a dick the entire first half. Was escorted out in the 2nd half. Then after the game ended another guy was escorted out and the only excuse he had for his behavior was THIS IS AMERICA!! 

Oh, by the way, new punter spent about 3/4 of halftime warming up on the field. Was watching his practice punts and they were all very deep with good hang time. Great last minute move by Gutey. 

@Johnson posted:

- Rashan Gary has been flat out terrible these past two weeks. Even his 'sack' of Goff would have gone as a completed pass had Goff not let the ball slip away..It is not Gary's fault that he has been over hyped--but man--this is year three-his pass rush is terrible, he has no range, his pursuit is terrible and he has no instincts--yes--he is out there a lot and he was gassed--by all means give Rivers and Garvin some reps

Maybe Gary isn't quite a "look like Tarzan, plays like Jane" guy, but he's close. He's a guy who is good enough to be a rotation guy on an NFL defensive line, but he's not going to become TJ/JJ Watt or Aaron Donald at any point.

Living in Michigan when Gary was in college, every year we'd see stories from Ann Arbor about how this absolutely elite athlete was just about to put it all together and dominate. He wasn't terrible, but he never dominated, even in college.

More of the same in the pros. He's always about to put it all together according to someone, but he never quite does. He's the anti-Runyan in that Gary always looks better in drills and practice than when he actually plays.

NEG: K. King has lost his speed due to all of the injuries.  He wasn't a fluid corner from Day 1, but at least he was fast.  He struggled to stay with former Badger Q. Cephus, who is sloooowww.  Barry needs to figure out his secondary fast.  The experimenting with King in the slot is a disaster.  He's not quick or agile enough to play there.  I think King is strictly an outside corner, who needs to play press man, and come off the bench as needed.  Let Stokes take his lumps now as the starter.

NEG: Our DL is in trouble and cannot dictate the line of scrimmage.  Lancaster was terrible.  I couldn't focus much on Keke or Lowry but they certainly didn't make an (good) impact.

POS:  LaFleur stuck with the run game (mostly).

NEG:  Lack of pre-snap motion and a lot of static and sometimes empty backfield formations.  Visions of McCarthy - yuck.   

+ everyone touched on my obvious picks, and all ST's were not a liability

- the DC must go for this team to have a shot, I am entirely serious.  this team is marginal with this guy in charge.

- tired of the hero balls, we hit one but you CANNOT make a habit of rocket balls, they don't work esp against good secondary's.

- no pass rush, while I saw glimpses from Rivers and Garvin, 52 is a big miss.  this guy does not have the instincts, he simply plays patty-cake or flies straight by the play...sorry, but he needed to be real good yesterday - the TEAM needed him to be real good, he's not it.

- no sighting of the trash cans - no hefflin or slayton; these guys need to get reps; the fact we truck the same garbage play after play and expect different results is delusional

not a great team - no matter how good we think the team is; take the glasses off, this is, at this point, a below 500 team with our schedule.

Feel bad for the kid, by all reports he is one of the hardest workers on the team, but as MP2 pointed out he just can't seem to put it all together. Seems like a guy who does everything in parts, "dis engage blocker and then look for the ball" ...whereas the really good players know where the ball is as they are dis engaging.

Negative - The MVS breakout we were told was about to happen isn't happening.

Through 2 games.

Aaron Rodgers targeting MVS (interception obviously not MVS' fault)

3 for 12, 17 yards, 0 TDs, 1 interception, QB passer rating: 4.9

Aaron Rodgers targeting everyone else

34/41, 371 yards, 3 TDs, 1 interception, QB passer rating: 118.6

6 targets a game for MVS, and some of these seem to be called by MLF by design to get him involved (the first play of the second drive last night, for example)

+

Green Bay Packers running back Aaron Jones said a necklace containing his father's ashes, which went missing during his four-touchdown performance against the Detroit Lions on Monday Night Football, has been found.

Jones confirmed the news Tuesday on 97.3 The Game's The Steve Czaban Show.

+ Goldie posting stoned

I really want to see what this D can do when they’re allowed to play football honestly. The first half it felt like they were all holding back and I refuse to believe all 11 decided to just play mellow football. You have insane amounts of speed on the backend, tons of power on the front end, just let them go. At a minimum these guys need to build confidence and momentum. Bend/don’t break inspires 0% confidence. It has a situational place, it’s not a scheme. Jaire needs to be unleashed like Ramsey, Savage needs to be released like Budda Baker, etc.

I agree. We saw the defense play with a lot more energy after blitzing a couple of times. Made the QB get rid of the ball quickly and then rallied to the ball. Just a couple of those appeared to inject life into the defense.

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

Negative - The MVS breakout we were told was about to happen isn't happening.

Through 2 games.

Aaron Rodgers targeting MVS (interception obviously not MVS' fault)

3 for 12, 17 yards, 0 TDs, 1 interception, QB passer rating: 4.9

Aaron Rodgers targeting everyone else

34/41, 371 yards, 3 TDs, 1 interception, QB passer rating: 118.6

6 targets a game for MVS, and some of these seem to be called by MLF by design to get him involved (the first play of the second drive last night, for example)

Agree, and it seems to be at the expense of Lazard.    That man produces, give his his touches.   

Same theme that is getting floated a lot today.    He may not look the part, but he can play football.   The anti-Gary, the pro Runyan.

@PackerHawk posted:

d the only excuse he had for his behavior was THIS IS AMERICA!! 

Crowds at European Football (Soccer) matches are so well behaved!

I thought the key to the offense was the run game. Getting the linebackers up gave both Adams and Tonyan their openings in the middle of the field.

Not sure what to make of Rodgers continued inability to lock in on where to throw deep balls to MVS. He drops dimes to Adams and Tonyan for big plays downfield, yet always seems to struggle locking in on MVS. Had two open shots on deep balls and over-threw by about 3-4 yards both times.

Defense gave up 3 points in the second half.  Got more pressure. Forced a couple turnovers. They’re going to need some time, but calls about busts and firing DCs is nonsense to me at this point. The Packers are an offensive football team with a serviceable defense with some upside. They may not get better- but they weren’t going to be drastically better in week 2.

Kevin King doesn’t seem to belong on an NFL roster.

@Fedya posted:

+ Goldie posting stoned

  nope, it's only Tuesday and damn, it's only 11:15am.  

"The Packers are an offensive football team with a serviceable defense with some upside. "

Considering the amount of draft capital and FA acquisitions on the D side of the ball, that shouldn't be the case so the bitching and moaning is valid.

Gary - 12th pick
Jaire -18th pick
Savage - 21st pick
Stokes - 29th pick
Clark - 27th pick
King - 33rd pick

Amos - FA signing
Z. Smith - FA signing
P. Smith -  FA signing

The only starters on this D that are not FA pick ups or high round picks are the ILB's and DL outside of Clark.    So 3 to 4 players out of 11-13 (Counting Gary / Stokes as a starter with the heavy rotation)

DL was porous (other than KC of course)

Need to get pressure on the opposing QB! (Obviously having Z would have helped).

So LeFleur had to tell Barry to change tactics? Shouldn’t a DC be able to see that his strategy wasn’t working?

Nice to see Kylin Hill show something in the kick return game. Amari on the other hand hasn’t shown much with punt returns. Hoping for improvement.

People keep underestimating Tonyan. Good! Love this guy!

Is it just me, or did it seem like the OL hasn’t been able to get much of a push on running plays in both games this year??? I realize have 2 rookies starting and not having Bahk is going to be a challenge, but seemed to me they are struggling there.

@Music City posted:

I thought the key to the offense was the run game. Getting the linebackers up gave both Adams and Tonyan their openings in the middle of the field.

Not sure what to make of Rodgers continued inability to lock in on where to throw deep balls to MVS. He drops dimes to Adams and Tonyan for big plays downfield, yet always seems to struggle locking in on MVS. Had two open shots on deep balls and over-threw by about 3-4 yards both times.

Defense gave up 3 points in the second half.  Got more pressure. Forced a couple turnovers. They’re going to need some time, but calls about busts and firing DCs is nonsense to me at this point. The Packers are an offensive football team with a serviceable defense with some upside. They may not get better- but they weren’t going to be drastically better in week 2.

Kevin King doesn’t seem to belong on an NFL roster.

Defense shut them out in the second half.

And you're right about Kevin King.

That pass to Tonyan for a TD was amazing, but it was very Favre like.    Rodgers should have gone to Lazard instead of forcing it.   Poor read, great throw but a lot of luck too.

https://twitter.com/benfennell...315182631178240?s=21

I think the OL is going to be a work in progress for most, if not all of the season.  It will be painful, but need to be patient.

Sadly, it seems the DL is as good as it gets unless it gets infused with someone with talant not named Kenny Clark

MVS was there. AR12 missed.

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

Maybe Gary isn't quite a "look like Tarzan, plays like Jane" guy, but he's close. He's a guy who is good enough to be a rotation guy on an NFL defensive line, but he's not going to become TJ/JJ Watt or Aaron Donald at any point.

Living in Michigan when Gary was in college, every year we'd see stories from Ann Arbor about how this absolutely elite athlete was just about to put it all together and dominate. He wasn't terrible, but he never dominated, even in college.

More of the same in the pros. He's always about to put it all together according to someone, but he never quite does. He's the anti-Runyan in that Gary always looks better in drills and practice than when he actually plays.

And we are probably going to pay him big bucks just like we did with Perry. UGH!

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

Negative - The MVS breakout we were told was about to happen isn't happening.

Through 2 games.

Aaron Rodgers targeting MVS (interception obviously not MVS' fault)

3 for 12, 17 yards, 0 TDs, 1 interception, QB passer rating: 4.9

Aaron Rodgers targeting everyone else

34/41, 371 yards, 3 TDs, 1 interception, QB passer rating: 118.6

6 targets a game for MVS, and some of these seem to be called by MLF by design to get him involved (the first play of the second drive last night, for example)

MVS beat his guy deep. Not his fault the ball was overthrown.

@BrainDed posted:

That pass to Tonyan for a TD was amazing, but it was very Favre like.    Rodgers should have gone to Lazard instead of forcing it.   Poor read, great throw but a lot of luck too.

https://twitter.com/benfennell...315182631178240?s=21

That was no force. In the NFL if the DBs have their back to the ball the receiver is OPEN.

@Music City posted:

They’re going to need some time, but calls about busts and firing DCs is nonsense to me at this point. The Packers are an offensive football team with a serviceable defense with some upside. They may not get better- but they weren’t going to be drastically better in week 2.

Barry is a proven turd two times over.  Serviceable?  By whose standards?  He had to have Mayo tell him how to call a defense.  He's been severely outcoached in just two weeks.

They may not get better- but they weren’t going to be drastically better in week 2.

What?

+ Kylin Hill on ST. 

agree
That 1st return was great and the 2nd one was better than what we're used to.

@Goldie posted:

  nope, it's only Tuesday and damn, it's only 11:15am.  

I was talking about during the game. 

+ Packers win and covered the spread (more on this later)
+ A LB'er got an INT?!?! WTAF???
+ Stokes. I knew that guy had the tools. I hope J. Gray gets the most out of him
+ Rodgers TD pass to Tonyan. HOLY FUCK! MVP stuff right there.
+ Kickoff Returns. 2 nice ones!
+ Aaron Jones, What a night.
+ AJ Dillion with a catch?!?!!? Something else for a defense to worry about.
+ O-Line played much better. Rodgers commented how Josh Myers continues to improve.

- King, I was done with him in January, now I'm REALLY done with him
- Rodgers missing MVS deep THREE times. That's where the pre-season would have really helped. Rodgers himself knows he fucked that up.
- Middle of the defense royally sucks as it has for the last decade. TJ Hockenson is good
- ST's coverage on kickoffs and Punts. I close my eyes every time.
- Pass rush in the first half (Expect to see more of that vs, the Niners)

@packerboi posted:

lol. “Teachable moments” ya, that’s one way to put it…

😂

@ByRyanWood

·

17m

Matt LaFleur said Kevin King had “teachable moments” in debut as a slot corner, but he was mostly pleased with what he saw, given how little King has played inside. “Putting Kevin inside was good for us.” So expect to see more of that.

Finally realized he does not presently possess enough speed to play on the outside?