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Just as American as the National Anthem.  Considering professional sports is seen as one of the few ways out for black youths I’d say it’s more relevant.  

Last edited by Henry

I'm truly comfortable with no anthem at all for games.  It's become abundantly clear that standing with your hand over your heart does not make you a patriot.  

That being said, I don't have a problem with it either, but my opinion is far from the important one here.  

I like where this thread is going..

That said, I shall ignore the black national anthem every bit as much as I'll ignore the white national anthem. 

All the controversy surrounding the kneeling for the National Anthem could have been avoided, had the NFL and the owners played the Anthem while the teams were in their respective locker rooms, pregame, or by not playing it at all. Maybe the NFL , MLB, NBA, NHL and MLS could create their own songs for their sports, so no one is offended, during some sort of protest.

I agree with Mr. Tundra that they should just play the anthem while players are in the the lockerroom......however, if you are into good music and meaningful lyrics....then, I think you will find that "Lift Every Voice and Sing" is a beautiful spiritual hymn with meaningful lyrics.  That being said, I just want to watch football this season.

@mrtundra posted:

All the controversy surrounding the kneeling for the National Anthem could have been avoided, had the NFL and the owners played the Anthem while the teams were in their respective locker rooms, pregame, or by not playing it at all. Maybe the NFL , MLB, NBA, NHL and MLS could create their own songs for their sports, so no one is offended, during some sort of protest.

NFL players only started being on the sidelines during the national anthem for primetime games in 2009. Why? Because the military began paying the NFL millions of dollars out of their recruiting budgets for the elaborate pregame anthem tie-in to the flag and the military and the NFL wanted to paint the players as "patriotic". 

If I understand all the drivel, "we" are supposed to come together as one to work out "our" problems (perceived or real).
With that in mind, I'm not sure how playing anything other than the National Anthem contributes anything meaningful to that end.

In addition to the 2 anthems, they should play a rap song with heavy emphasis on the “N” word. Any white people who sing along will  be flogged at midfield at halftime and forced to write O.J Simpson a reparations check.

In addition, all statues of Pat Boone will be repainted  into Little Richard monuments.

We’ll call it “Unity Day”.

 

The problem with the national anthem is that it has become of symbol of extreme nationalism. 9/11 only served to tie the flag & the anthem to the military, police, first responders. As a result, ANYTHING seen as pushback vs. these institutions is "unpatriotic".  I go back to Kap taking a knee & AR calling for the fans to follow suit with the team in locking arms during the anthem......what did the majority of fans choose to do? They put their hands over their hearts or saluted the flag, saying "F You" to anything that went against nationalism. In my rural area anytime a "black lives" or similar sign goes up, you can bet that within a week a neighbor will put up a "back the blue" sign will go up right along side with their american flag ....sorry if I got "off anthem" topic.  

I think it's a nice gesture, but I agree with others that this anthem business is ridiculous at this point. My experience is that 1/3 of the crowd is 12 beers deep at that point and are just cheering/booing anything that happens, 1/3 are in line to get more beer (or in the bathroom) and don't even realize the anthem is playing, and the remaining 1/3 are people who are just happy to be there and don't care what is happening. The easy solution is just don't anything and give players more warm up time. 

I'm old, I remember being at County Stadium back in the Braves days.  When the stirring last line 'and the home of the brave' was drowned out by a raucous  'BRAVES'.  Even as a kid I wondered how that fit in with reverence, tradition and patriotism.  Seemed to cheapen it, much like playing it all the time does.

Reserve the anthem and the flag for special occasions. 

You know patriotism also means dissent.  It's defense of country even from internal threats. 

The problem isn't patriotism, it's the bastardization of the word to mean militarism and authoritarianism.

Pat Tillman thought it was bullshit.  The NFL and the military hijacked his ideals after he took two bullets to the head from 10 feet away.  Friendly fire my ass.  He was a patriot for entirely different reasons.

Last edited by Henry
@Chongo posted:

Patriotism is a dying virtue. If you are outwardly patriotic, you are racist. Just stop the anthems altogether and be done with it.

Patriotism is the virtue of the vicious. 

Patriotism does not equal racism and no one thinks that. People who drape themselves in the flag, call themselves patriots yet fight against peaceful protests aren't patriots at all and aren't defending America's honor. They're fighting because they don't want people of color to exercise their rights as Americans. 

Last edited by Grave Digger

The study, published Monday in the journal Nature Astronomy, suggests that white dwarf stars are the main source of carbon atoms in the Milky Way, a chemical element known to be crucial to all life.

Now we know the reality of our universe making all of this meaningless. 

 

They should play this version of the national anthem. One of the best versions I've heard. Marvin Gaye at the all star game. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNydcwDriuU

YES!  Thank you for the reminder.  I loved his version!  I remember watching it live and thought it was the best rendition EVER.  Other artists have done memorable versions, too.  But Gaye's version was dripping with emotion and personal meaning.

Agree with GOLDIE on Whitney's version, too.  Good God, Rosanne was booed out of San Diego....I don't think she ever came back after that fiasco.

Maybe the "other anthem" to be sung... any recording of Ray Charles' version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1GEpg0c1fw

 

 

Last edited by SanDiegoPackFan

They should play this version of the national anthem. One of the best versions I've heard. Marvin Gaye at the all star game. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNydcwDriuU

Guess I'm not keeping up on what is considered acceptable these days.

Is the current "correct" thinking is that in order to make up for the sin of racism the NFL should play Marvin Gaye's rendition of the National Anthem because, while he is a documented abuser of women, that abuse can be excused because Marvin Gaye was African-American?

 

"Marvin Gaye was quoted telling his biographer “I like to see women serve me…And that’s that. In Jan’s (his mistresses) case serving me meant feeding my fantasies.. My evil fantasies.” Gaye was famous for his domestic violence. He broke up with his first wife whom he beat quite frequently and married his mistress.

https://sites.psu.edu/globalhe...gaye-was-a-bad-dude/

"Gaye’s jealousy turned violent. One day, high on a blend of psychedelic mushrooms and cocaine, he started to talk about Jan’s betrayals and became “enraged.”

“He took a kitchen knife and put it to my throat,” she writes. “I was petrified, paralyzed. I thought it was all over.”

Gaye told her, “I’ve loved you too much. This love is killing me. I beg you to provoke me. Provoke me right now so I can take us both out of our misery.”

https://nypost.com/2015/05/03/...how-he-tortured-her/

@SteveLuke posted:

Guess I'm not keeping up on what is considered acceptable these days.

Is the current "correct" thinking is that in order to make up for the sin of racism the NFL should play Marvin Gaye's rendition of the National Anthem because, while he is a documented abuser of women, that abuse can be excused because Marvin Gaye was African-American?

 

"Marvin Gaye was quoted telling his biographer “I like to see women serve me…And that’s that. In Jan’s (his mistresses) case serving me meant feeding my fantasies.. My evil fantasies.” Gaye was famous for his domestic violence. He broke up with his first wife whom he beat quite frequently and married his mistress.

https://sites.psu.edu/globalhe...gaye-was-a-bad-dude/

"Gaye’s jealousy turned violent. One day, high on a blend of psychedelic mushrooms and cocaine, he started to talk about Jan’s betrayals and became “enraged.”

“He took a kitchen knife and put it to my throat,” she writes. “I was petrified, paralyzed. I thought it was all over.”

Gaye told her, “I’ve loved you too much. This love is killing me. I beg you to provoke me. Provoke me right now so I can take us both out of our misery.”

https://nypost.com/2015/05/03/...how-he-tortured-her/

I get your point. You can make a case against the majority of entertainers and songwriters on all these points. 

Francis Scott Key was also a slave owner who advocated for sending freed slaves back to Africa and was an anti-abolitionist. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Scott_Key

And in fairness, I would also call the knuckle draggers with rifles at the state capital in Michigan a totalitarian mob...just not a woke one.

The only mob me and Boris appreciate is the Eye-talian one.

@Blair Kiel posted:

I guess some of those MLK statues might come down too?

We have passed absurdity and are headed towards totalitarian woke mob rule.

Yes. MLK had his demons also. 

https://www.businessinsider.co...-watched-rape-2019-5

https://theconversation.com/im...he-same-light-118015

It's almost like people are almost never completely saints or completely sinners. What a concept. I do think the statues of Confederate figures should come down and go into museums though. 

It's a discussion that rationale people should be having while using it to educate everyone. I know that's a pipe dream. 

I think you have to consider what the person is being honored for. Statues of Confederate generals (Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson) who actively fought against and killed US government troops during a rebellion aren't something that should be supported. They are being honored for being traitors to the country.

Statues of prominent Americans who founded this country but who owned slaves and were troubled with the hypocrisy and released them upon his death are appropriate (Washington). He is being honored for his principles involved in founding the US government, not because of his slave ownership. 

Statues of prominent Founding Fathers who did great things that set the foundation for our country, but did despicable things in their private lives are a tougher call. We honor Thomas Jefferson for writing the Declaration of Independence and for decisions in government that made the US what it is today (the Louisiana Purchase). The problem is that Jefferson was also a 45 year old guy who started raping a 14 year girl that he owned (Sally Hemings). Even given the "benefit" of living in those times, that is reprehensible. Yet, he is clearly one of the most important 2-3 figures in the history of the United States and he is being honored for those contributions, but I have trouble with this one especially. 

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