Rodgers & Green Bay

I suspect Rodgers was beyond pissed off the way the Seattle game went down last year. It's hard enough to play against that defense on one leg. The defensive meltdown, ST miscues, and MM's weak red zone play calling and decisions (two chip shot FGs) probably pissed him off. One could imagine AR telling MM to fix the other two areas and let him and his buddy TC run the offense.

If true, that part is understandable. What's less understandable, though, would be AR getting pissed that TC was relieved of his duties. B/c it's very clear the things that AR is frustrated with now were there even moreso under TC. Maybe he just thought TC deserved more time after years of loyalty/being blocked and the injury to Nelson. But if true, AR has to get over it…this team is better when MM is calling the plays. TC had a chance and did not impress, no matter how much AR may have wanted him to.

By the way, while I don't fear them, is there a more disrespected 14-0 team than Carolina? What more do they have to do? Carolina, Arizona, and Seattle are the top 3 NFC teams. GB can be dangerous, but they have a ways to go.

And those comparisons between Cam and AR may look decent over the full year. But the last two months tells a very different story. AR, the highest rated QB of all time, hasn't broken 100 since the SD game. Cam has been rated over 100 in 6 of his last 7 games. Cam is playing better than AR right now.

There's probably closer to 8 QBs playing better than Rodgers right now. Maybe more. 

I'll take our guy over all of them. His season of fail is still stellar. And Aaron ain't going away quietly this year. Neither is this team. 

Plus Rodgers threw the Hail Mary.  To me that earns him a few more games before cutting him loose. 

Looking back to the reorganization of the offense from jsonline

7/30/2015

Rodgers said the meetings have taken on a different feel with the insertion of new coaching personalities. Bennett, he said, does a lot of the talking as offensive coordinator. Clements sticks mostly with play-calling. Van Pelt and Getsy do most of the hands-on coaching with the quarterbacks and receivers.

Building comfort, then, is as much an exercise in group dynamics as Xs and Os cohesion.

"It was interesting going into it (with Getsy) being a young coach and how he'd approach it," Nelson said. "Would he be quiet and not confident in what he's doing? But he's confident and has done good things for us. Alex (Van Pelt) has never been with the receivers, but he's always been a part of the receivers, so it's just the little things."

Added Rodgers: "There's some moving pieces that we've got to get moving in the same direction, but it's fun. It's fun to be with the guys."

The adjustments continue on the practice field, where Nelson said the playbook's marginal notes are communicated from players to coaches. The receivers become the coaches, and it is up to them to illustrate and explain the nuances of catching footballs from Rodgers.

Call them tailored tricks of the trade.

"Just the little things that we have with Aaron that aren't technically in the playbook but we know," Nelson said. "So it's teaching them that.... I think it's all been great." continue

I wonder how much of that original plan they stuck with and for how long. I'd also wonder if Rodgers watches some inexperienced guys coaching the WRs and gets irked because it's not the way it has been in the past.  In a sense his static is more with the WR coaches than the WRs.  The WRs possibly being coached and corrected differently from the understanding 12/WRs/Bennett have had over the past four years.  12 is in the room and wants to get those pieces moving... the way he likes.  Tension builds from there as the season goes on. 

12 is possibly more mad at MM for the way the offense is being coached in those meeting rooms than anything about the playcalling.  He also doesn't appreciate Clemmons taking all the heat when it's more about organization than playcalling. 

He's seen the offense coached better in the past and also doesn't appreciate MM giving away the offense's keys in the preseason.  12 holds a grudge (which he has reputation for) 

MM's tinkering bit him in the ass and now he's scrambling to see if he can pull his team back together in time to make a run.  I know a few weeks ago he mentioned in his podcast that he was starting to spend more time in the offensive meetings 

/rampant baseless speculation             

Edgar Bennett's lack of focus and time on the WR's should also be noted. Maybe he's not the reason why. But I distinctly recall JJ, Jordy, Cobb and even Finley talking about what a stickler he was and how much he road their ass.

I think MM may be learning what's not broke don't fix. 

By the way this was from McGinn on Sunday. Some interesting points:

Shortly thereafter, McCarthy had to deal with possible staff defections. The Packers, according to a source, had at least one contact from a team interested in wide receivers coach Edgar Bennett for its job as offensive coordinator. St. Louis and Jacksonville wanted to discuss coordinator jobs with Alex Van Pelt, the quarterbacks coach.

The Packers for years had been denying their assistant coaches permission to interview for jobs before the expiration of their contracts. By NFL rule, they were allowed to do so, but in some cases it left scars that didn't heal quickly.

Among others, James Campen, Darren Perry, Joe Whitt and Clements had been previously denied.

It was shortsighted of McCarthy and Thompson to hoard all these coaches. If a coach has a chance to better himself, let him better himself and then demand of yourself to find a capable replacement.

Suddenly, McCarthy had several potentially disgruntled employees to placate. So he reorganized the staff.

Wanting to give Bennett more money and a title, McCarthy made him offensive coordinator. Van Pelt no doubt received a salary increase as well after his duties were expanded to include wide receivers.

That left Clements, the erstwhile quarterbacks coach who had replaced Joe Philbin as offensive coordinator in 2012.

Remember, McCarthy was only three weeks removed from being heavily criticized after the collapse in Seattle followed by the unexpected death of his 47-year-old brother, Joe.

At some point, McCarthy decided to hand the title of associate head coach and the play-calling duties to Clements, his trusted lieutenant for almost a decade. At the same time, he wouldn't have to deal directly with Rodgers and his pattern of changing so many of his calls at the line.

Certainly, Rodgers was keen on the idea.

Clements had been instrumental streamlining Rodgers' delivery and helping resurrect his career after a wholly unimpressive start. At the same time, their personalities just clicked.

Alas, it just didn't work. Rodgers would come to the sidelines and there would be at least four coaches with playsheets and two backup quarterbacks hovering about.

By the time McCarthy stripped Clements, the Packers were last on first down, 26th on third down, 23rd in passing and awful in short yardage.

At least 50% of the blame rests with Rodgers. Given his ability and experience, he has played well below his standards. Some say Clements was structurally sound as an offensive tactician, but that's hard to judge because with McCarthy in the wings somewhere Rodgers saw the chance to impose his vision on the offense.

"Aaron changes so many plays at the line that, honestly, to us, it doesn't matter who's calling the plays," guard T.J. Lang said after the Dallas game.

Snip-

There's little doubt that Rodgers was disappointed if not angry when McCarthy informed him of Clements' demotion. To make the break more dramatic, McCarthy banished Clements to the coaches' booth in the press box even though he had been Rodgers' sideline adviser for years.

Rodgers surely didn't appreciate that, either, but it's the price that needed to be paid when McCarthy at last came to his senses and returned to what he does best in an attempt to save the season.

Rodgers' news conference last Sunday was interesting, to say the least.

http://www.jsonline.com/sports...325z1-363053691.html

So Bob says this is half Rodgers fault. OK. But who gave Rodgers all this power to change the plays whenever he wanted? MM. And who also gave these assistants all these extra duties and power? MM. Lastly, who shooed Rodgers buddy up to the coaches booth and away from AR? Yep. MM.

Mike and Aaron need to talk this out. They each have a ring because the other was better than they thought. 

I've always assumed winning the Lombardi, especially for this team, was above all this petty, school-girl playground horse****.

guess not.

grow the **** up.

I am so glad I got fishing to fall back to.  

At no point did Halas, Brown, Lombardi, Madden, Knoll, Grant, Landry, Walsh, Shula, Levy, Parcells, Johnson ever think petty school-girl playground hore**** couldn't submarine a season. 53 Alpha males thinking they knew better. All dying to make a name. They communicated that noise out. Fast. 

None of those coaches ever told their teams to grow the **** up either. They coached. They left that **** talk for guys like Glanville, Rex Ryan, Erickson, Coslet and Kotite. 

You forgot Ditka

Whoa. A lot of speculation, and getting worked up over speculation, going on here.

That's a media beast you're feeding, and like all media creations, it is being overblown, IMO.

I am glad this topic came up.  

So do Aaron's alleged frustrations cause receivers to run poor routes, drop easy passes, fumbles, poor blocking and botched FGs or terrible punts?

I think there is something deeper that is wrong.  You hear MM's post-game press conferences and today his interview with Larry M... and MM seems to be going out of his way to explain to us  how things are going well and that the Raiders game was their biggest win of the year.  Just seems like he is trying too hard to paint a better picture and trying to keep this team together.  Even last year I don't recall him being so overly optimistic about his team.

As for Aaron Rodgers, I think he is immensely frustrated.  So many easy drops over the last two months and WRs who are just not getting it done when it counts.  Adams has looked worse than a rookie.  He dropped two yesterday.  Kuhn drops a simple screen pass that would have gained 8-15 yards.  Richard Rodgers drops an perfect pass for a first down.  Janis cant figure out how to get open.  Lacy runs timid and then misses a blitz block and AR gets slammed for sack.  BUT AR did miss a wide open JJ at the Oakland 20 just seconds before the first half ended.  That was bad.  And his INT was worse.

Everybody gets so hyper-sensitive these days.  So AR is angry and refuses to talk at length.  Maybe he deferred to MM because he didn't want to say something he would regret?  So we all begin speculating..."what if?"

I still wonder if we may be witnessing the beginning of the end for the MM era.  10 years is a long time for a HC to stay in one place.  And while I like MM, all good things come to an end.  Guess we will just have to wait and see.

But I think they all will play a great game in AZ.

I read that article from Bad Bob and it left me feeling happy, hopeful, worried and discouraged.  Generally, when you see an organization, business or department begin to deteriorate in simple tasks and make uncharacteristic mistakes it is because there is unrest or instability at the top and then "things" seep down into the ranks and soon the once strong foundation begins to crumble.  After some of the losses we have seen this season, it makes me think that the loss to Seattle left a deeper scar on this team that we all thought and MM hasn't been able to heal it.

AR was quite a bit more amicable today....maybe he won't asked to be traded after all

http://www.packers.com/media-center/index.html 

Oh goody! We still have a QB

FLPACKER posted:

AR was quite a bit more amicable today....maybe he won't asked to be traded after all

http://www.packers.com/media-center/index.html 

 

Ask?  I thought a demand was on the table....

When Brett Favre is GM of the Vikings in 2020 he'll give Aaron $25 million per season and hold the press conference at his steakhouse in Green Bay on a buy 1 get 1 groupon night. 

"Do I think Aaron has anything left? Maybe. I know I did. That's not my decision though. Am I doing this to make people forget what a jackass I was? I don't know. I do know we'll all be back here in 6 years to retire Aaron's jersey which are available in my gift shop tonight only for $149.99 with purchase of the Pick Six Shrimp"

Coaches coach and players play. If Rodgers is questioning the plays called then he is following in Favre's footsteps. 

The post above is what I thought about all night last night. It's a terrifying thought. Rodgers needs to get his mind right first and foremost. Then MM has to check himself about being a stubborn dick tater. 

12 was getting hammered all night, he's shellshocked.  i think its a two fold problem, 1. he's getting hammered in there 2. he wants more maturity on the team, whether that's vets or rookies, he wants the other guys to want it as much...by the way he is acting, he doesn't believe the 'hunger' is there.  

I don't think it has anything to do with being in GB and to a lesser degree the coaching.

Last week, after winning @OAK, Rodgers looked down or pissed about the way they have been playing. Yesterday, they get boat raced, and he is Mr. Optimist about their chances in the playoffs. WTF?

The arrival of the heir apparent caused a veteran QB to start to propose retirement early and often.  I wonder if the presence of Hundley is starting to affect A-Rod.  Sound crazy?  The guy who ultimately may make the call acknowledging the next generation is here seems to be having a falling apart from his future HOF QB.  Sounds familiar.  I hope this is not the case.

Hungry5 posted:

Last week, after winning @OAK, Rodgers looked down or pissed about the way they have been playing. Yesterday, they get boat raced, and he is Mr. Optimist about their chances in the playoffs. WTF?

I can understand it.  Make sure no one thinks there isn't room for improvement after the win, and try to lift people up after the loss...

Or he's just a contrarian.  

Bull****. The previous QB started to fall apart far before the arrival of Rodgers.

CAPackFan95 posted:

Hungry5 posted:

Last week, after winning @OAK, Rodgers looked down or pissed about the way they have been playing. Yesterday, they get boat raced, and he is Mr. Optimist about their chances in the playoffs. WTF?

I can understand it.  Make sure no one thinks there isn't room for improvement after the win, and try to lift people up after the loss...

Or he's just a contrarian.  

Rodgers sounds like a lot of posts on X4.

I think everyone knows this team isn't going anywhere this year.

Unless....

After they lose to Minnesota next week, something dramatically changes for the playoffs.

Unscouted looks? Going to need quite a few to win 4 games after Jan. 3rd

RatPack posted:

The arrival of the heir apparent caused a veteran QB to start to propose retirement early and often.  I wonder if the presence of Hundley is starting to affect A-Rod.  Sound crazy?  The guy who ultimately may make the call acknowledging the next generation is here seems to be having a falling apart from his future HOF QB.  Sounds familiar.  I hope this is not the case.

 

Brett Favre started his retirement BS after they lost to the Falcons in the playoffs. That was years before they drafted Rodgers. By 2004, he was spewing that crap in the middle of the season. That was the season before they drafted Rodgers.

RatPack posted:

The arrival of the heir apparent caused a veteran QB to start to propose retirement early and often.  I wonder if the presence of Hundley is starting to affect A-Rod.  Sound crazy?  The guy who ultimately may make the call acknowledging the next generation is here seems to be having a falling apart from his future HOF QB.  Sounds familiar.  I hope this is not the case.

 

Worth a discussion but completely different circumstances.

Rodgers was coming off an MVP season last year and was 31 years old. Favre was 35 years old.

Rodgers was a first round pick, Hundley was a 5th.

I am optimistic about Hundley's future, but it's much more likely he's the next Aaron Brooks than he is the next Aaron Rodgers.

CAPackFan95 posted:

Hungry5 posted:

Last week, after winning @OAK, Rodgers looked down or pissed about the way they have been playing. Yesterday, they get boat raced, and he is Mr. Optimist about their chances in the playoffs. WTF?

I can understand it.  Make sure no one thinks there isn't room for improvement after the win, and try to lift people up after the loss...

Or he's just a contrarian.  

He has seemed to always know what to say and when to say it, so I'll go with your initial response... though he is a smartass, so the second reason posed could be true too.

Good read.

But the primary culprit has been the coaching staff's inability to adjust and help the league's best quarterback keep looking like the league's best quarterback — first offensive coordinator Tom Clements and now head coach Mike McCarthy.

It feels like Clements (through the first dozen games) and McCarthy (in the last three) are just throwing darts with the league's strongest arm and hoping something sticks.

Winning match-ups isn't just on the players. McCarthy and staff talk about putting their players in position to succeed, but if the players are consistently losing match-ups, then the staff need to adjust.

Still learning how to copy Tweets the fancy way:

Best passer rating on screen passes:

Aaron Rodgers 117.3
Alex Smith 116.6
Kirk Cousins 115.0

Rodgers ranks 13th in NFL in passer rating.

Only 23rd on non-screens.

Hungry5 posted:

Have this DVD'd and will watch tomorrow......

What is it?  Says I need to sign in to watch video.

Just more videos of Arod drop kicking cancer victims.

Knowing Goldie, it's "news" about Rodgers winning SB45.

Just more proof Rodgers isn't focused on football.

Clearly

Fedya posted:

Knowing Goldie, it's "news" about Rodgers winning SB45.

I think I should resent that Fedya, right?     

No, just resent Fedyayaya.