Rodgers not Elite?

Rodgers is having a tough time seeing what’s in front of him because 2019 is nothing he’s seen the last 4 years. Guys are actually open on time. It’s not easy given what he’s been asked to do the last few years. And it’s a frustrating bitch to watch.

GB NEEDS, NEEDS, NEEDS a possession chain mover #2 WR that runs perfect routes to take pressure off Adams. Whether that’s a rookie WR or slot WR I don’t know. Lazard is going to be a great 3 or 4 WR but he’s not the #2 option Rodgers needs right now.

All I know is this offense is close. MLF is dialing up some nasty plays. And Rodgers needs to wrap his entire head around it. 

Pakrz posted:

If guys weren't getting open I'd tend to agree with you that the WRs are the problem.  That's not the case though.  Guys are open... AR has been either missing them with poor throws or not seeing them at all.  

But yea, timing... 

Yeah, because you see it for a split second.  I'm sure that's all that goes into it.

We can go back and forth all day... the reality is that the 2019 Green Bay Packers can 100% win the Super Bowl this year but it's going to take Aaron Rodgers playing better football.  He has it in him.  

Pakrz posted:

We can go back and forth all day... the reality is that the 2019 Green Bay Packers can 100% win the Super Bowl this year but it's going to take Aaron Rodgers the entire pass offense playing better football.  They have it in them.  

ChilliJon posted:

Ben Fennel posted a pass by Rodgers in Detroit last week where his entire body and feet were pointed to 10:30 on a clock but he threw it 50 yards flat footed to 2:00 to Lazard and the ball was perfect. The torque on his shoulder was pure insanity  

Can someone help me out with this?  I only have a digital clock on hand (wrist, whatever).

PackLandVA posted:

ChilliJon posted:

Ben Fennel posted a pass by Rodgers in Detroit last week where his entire body and feet were pointed to 10:30 on a clock but he threw it 50 yards flat footed to 2:00 to Lazard and the ball was perfect. The torque on his shoulder was pure insanity  

Can someone help me out with this?  I only have a digital clock on hand (wrist, whatever).

Sure. Rodgers was standing at the State Capitol in Madison and was facing to throw towards Eau Claire but tossed a perfect strike to Sheboygan.

So Sheboygan didn’t “short arm” it? And did he throw it to Sheboygan because Eau Claire ran the wrong route or is sub par?  

I’m guessing he relies on throwing to Sheboygan way too much.

Say what you want, but Rodgers still has a strong arm.

He overthrew Superior.

PackLandVA posted:

So Sheboygan didn’t “short arm” it? And did he throw it to Sheboygan because Eau Claire ran the wrong route or is sub par?  

I’m guessing he relies on throwing to Sheboygan way too much.

The Pass looked like it was going to hit Manitowoc but the receiver made a nice jumping catch and got both feet in before he went into Lake Michigan.

Inside Aaron Rodgers' declining numbers: Magic missing on Packers' extended plays

Pretty good analysis by Ryan Wood.

After the game against the Lions, I heard that the US military has asked LaFleur and Gute if AR can be flown over to Iran.  Apparently they want him to "overthrow" their government.

After Packers Bent to His Will, Aaron Rodgers Now Needs to Put Up or Shut Up

The 36-year-old Rodgers set a Hall of Fame standard for himself from 2010 to '14. He has fallen well short of that standard in recent seasons. The Packers spent the last two years eliminating the reasons/excuses for his decline. Now it's time for him to perform to that standard again, because the Packers won't be able to beat their playoff opponents by scoring 20 to 24 points and trying to squat on the lead.

....

But if Rodgers can't take this Packers team to the Super Bowl, it really means the next thing that must soon change in Green Bay is the quarterback. And it will all be because the quarterback himself refuses to change.

Pretty harsh piece, but a lot of truth there.

MLF looks like he's building an offense that could weather a QB change much better than it did the last couple years.  He still makes a few ridiculous throws every game but he's no longer forced to do that consistently in order for the offense to have success.  I'm with others who think next year will look much different once he's fully acclimated to the offense and there is more talent at WR,TE.

michiganjoe posted:

After Packers Bent to His Will, Aaron Rodgers Now Needs to Put Up or Shut Up

The 36-year-old Rodgers set a Hall of Fame standard for himself from 2010 to '14. He has fallen well short of that standard in recent seasons. The Packers spent the last two years eliminating the reasons/excuses for his decline. Now it's time for him to perform to that standard again, because the Packers won't be able to beat their playoff opponents by scoring 20 to 24 points and trying to squat on the lead.

....

But if Rodgers can't take this Packers team to the Super Bowl, it really means the next thing that must soon change in Green Bay is the quarterback. And it will all be because the quarterback himself refuses to change.

Pretty harsh piece, but a lot of truth there.

There is a lot truth in there and I'm glad the spotlight is being shown on Rodgers and how he is part of the problem on offense.

But the author detracts from his own piece by stating: "Rodgers had Adams (for most of the year), Jones, a serviceable Jimmy Graham and familiar-if-ordinary receivers like Geronimo Allison and Marquez Valdes-Scantling to throw to."

Graham and Allison will likely not be playing in the NFL next season and MVS is on his way out of the league unless he improves markedly next season.

That said, the point still stands that other QBs have done more with less around them than Aaron has.

a serviceable Jimmy Graham

michiganjoe posted:

Inside Aaron Rodgers' declining numbers: Magic missing on Packers' extended plays

Pretty good analysis by Ryan Wood.

The times they are a-changing. Hopefully, the powers-that-be see this too.

The truth is there if you're looking for it.  

Lots of theories floating around regarding "what's wrong" with AR. After seeing him hit some lasers and then just totally overthrow some, my feeling is it's really a mechanics  issue. The idea that more talent at the receiver position is needed has merit but I think it's more than that. BR posted a story from The Ringer on Keys to the NFL Divisional Round . There's some good clips showing AR throwing off his back foot. Previously he's done this only from time to time and it's worked out when he had receivers that could handle the throw. The receiver corps he has now is not at that level and he needs to throw a very catchable ball in order to have consistency again. Could be more to it but this is very glaring and I do agree that he will the difference between moving on and one and done.

Honestly, I think Rodgers is still thinking too much.  He knew the old system inside and out so that most of it was automatic, but now having to think more about the system is also disrupting the actual throwing.  He's basically a rookie again, but I think once the system is more automatic for him (and the receivers actually know what they are supposed to do as well), everything else will click into place again.  

I concur, Doc.

And his mechanics have never been great.  He's thrown off his back foot and off-platform since at least 2010.  He just has that much arm talent.

But there is certainly merit to the idea that he used to have receivers that could bail out a tough/contested throws.  Believe it or not, WR's can make a QB look better.  And he doesn't currently have that however the offense is designed to get guys open enough to not require the tough throw.  As the Dr. pointed out, he's still learning to trust that concept.

He learned the throw off the back foot then back peddle thing from Favre. One of the reason both of these guys escaped season ending knee injuries for their careers. They only plant and throw with a nice clean pocket.  

Looking at highlights of the 2010 divisionals vs Atlanta, he threw off the back foot more often than not. The noticeable difference was that his receivers were catching balls in very tight windows. His mechanics are not likely to change. Not related but also from this game, Tramon W had a huge game. 

Dr._Bob posted:

Honestly, I think Rodgers is still thinking too much.  He knew the old system inside and out so that most of it was automatic, 

AKA....muscle memory -- which Rodgers has mentioned numerous times.

It'll happen.....perhaps on Sunday. 😉

and remember that article of “put up or shut up”.   Where was that again???  I thought he PUT UP today didn’t he???

He did.

Packers enter NFC championship under first-year coach LaFleur

Good piece by Michael Silver that details the audible by AR on a critical third-down throw to Adams.

Hungry5 posted:

Is that elite?

No.  He took a sack.  

Ketchman has a good piece on AR this morning.  Brief but insightful.  He's been critical of AR when deserved and even suggested the Packers hold off on the new contract until this offseason, for various reasons.  

What we witnessed last night was a masterpiece of quarterbacking. Rodgers did it all. He hard-counted, he made line adjustments, he rolled away from Clowney, he half-rolled toward Clowney and threw back into the flat opposite Clowney, he audibled with his voice and with his fingers behind his back. If you like scheme football, last night's game was your dream come true. Rodgers was a maestro, the football was his baton and the Packers offense was his symphony. A rested team beat a tired team, and an elite, somewhat-aging quarterback out-witted the Packers' tormentor. More than his ability to throw a football, what Rodgers displayed last night was superior command of how to direct a football offense. I get the sense it's what he's always wanted to do more than anything else. He wanted to prove he's smarter than everyone else, and he is.

Ask Vic link 

That 32 yard strike to Adams at the end was vintage. I can't fault his mechanics because it's that unconventional delivery that lets him release the ball so quickly. Those 30 yard strikes look like he's just flicking his wrist. I think the only time he puts the ball behind his ear is on a hail mary.

"He's got some Pat Mahomes in him".

I thought all along before this Seahags game that it depended on which Rodgers would show up as to whether the Packers would win.  Would it be the Rodgers of week 17 in Detroit who was extremely shaky, or would it be the Rodgers we saw vs. the Raiders earlier this year where he basically played a perfect game?  We got something pretty darn close to the Raiders' game last night and it was a good time for it.  Can we get 2 more weeks of that level of play?  If we can, anything is possible.

Packers opening drive. 3rd and 7 on Seattle 20. Rodgers goes hard count with 11 seconds on the play clock. Seattle doesn’t flinch. Linsley fucking turns his head back to Rodgers and says, clear as can be, “Hey. What do you wanna do here?” 7 seconds on the play clock... Rodgers calls the audible and moves Jones from his right side to his left side. Rodgers sees what he wants. 1 second on the play clock. 
Adams wide open for an easy pitch and catch for 7. 
Not elite my ass. 

Fedya posted:

No.  He took a sack.  

Correct.....he gets a "minus" on the play  😂

He was proving he still has it & he was the best QB on the field last night. (Wilson's legs excluded)

Russell took 5 sacks last night. He probably doesn't feel too good this morning. 

Just to piggyback on that opening drive TD. Adams and Geronimo ran what looked like a textbook over/under switch crossing route to Adams. And Seattle DBs tried to play it that way. Only Adams put a foot in the ground and broke his cross off to a post and Flowers was toast. 

That was next level filthy play design by MLF. Got to credit Geronimo for not engaging coverage and keeping his arms down and just squatting on his route. Seattle had no chance of defending that play and Rodgers knew it.