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Gary was the top recruit in the Class of 2016, not only using his immense size and outstanding agility to dominate the competition at Paramus Catholic High School in New Jersey as the state's top Defensive Player in 2014 and 2015, but also excelling in the classroom. He had followed former Wolverines star defender Jabrill Peppers at Catholic, and then again followed the path of the 2017 first-round pick of the Cleveland Browns to Ann Arbor. Gary played all 13 games as a reserve his freshman season, making 27 tackles, five for losses, and a sack. His potential really began to show in 2017, when he earned first-team All-Big Ten honors with 66 stops, 12 for loss, and six sacks in 13 starts. Gary was a first-team pick again as a junior, compiling 44 tackles, seven for loss, and 3.5 sacks in 12 games. He joined teammate Devin Bush and others in skipping Michigan's bowl game to prepare for the draft.

Overview

Five-star defensive end prospect coming into Michigan who leaves with those same five-star traits and loads of potential but a lack of development in key areas. Gary is a face-up rusher who seems content to hit tackles with bull-rush attempts rather than working the edges. He's explosive out of the blocks and in closing to the quarterback, and is just waiting for hand development and additional rush moves. His size, strength and motor could make him a plus run defender in short order. He has elite potential if a defensive coordinator can harness the energy and focus his approach.

Strengths
  • Freaky triangle of height, weight and speed
  • Active and strong with NFL size
  • Has all the tools to set a strong edge
  • Forceful into initial contact at point of attack
  • Good contact balance, thanks to sturdy base
  • Has disruptive qualities when he bends and plays low
  • Very good pursuit speed from backside and makes tackles down the field
  • Fires out of a track stance with energy and twitch
  • Can make conversion of speed-to-power look easy
  • Uses long-arm bull-rush to collapse the edge into quarterback
  • Strong enough to overtake tackles in late phase of the rush
  • Quick laterally and it shows up on twists
Weaknesses
  • Production as rusher failed to match traits and talent
  • Rush plan is somewhat basic at this stage of development
  • Long-arm bull rush is his only real rush tool
  • Hands lack skill and have yet to be unlocked as rush weapon
  • Lacks classic hip bend to dip and run the arc
  • Runs himself around the pocket rather than working back under
  • Plays fast but with no regulator for control
  • Lacks instincts and awareness for misdirections and counters
  • Tends to lose pad level on inside counters
  • Doesn't come to balance consistently as open-field tackler


Great ideas rooted in love.(R)

Last edited by packerboi
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

 https://www.nfl.com/prospects/...59-8729-700e2dfb98cd

Overview
Five-star defensive end prospect coming into Michigan who leaves with those same five-star traits and loads of potential but a lack of development in key areas. Gary is a face-up rusher who seems content to hit tackles with bull-rush attempts rather than working the edges. He's explosive out of the blocks and in closing to the quarterback, and is just waiting for hand development and additional rush moves. His size, strength and motor could make him a plus run defender in short order. He has elite potential if a defensive coordinator can harness the energy and focus his approach.
Strengths
  • Freaky triangle of height, weight and speed
  • Active and strong with NFL size
  • Has all the tools to set a strong edge
  • Forceful into initial contact at point of attack
  • Good contact balance, thanks to sturdy base
  • Has disruptive qualities when he bends and plays low
  • Very good pursuit speed from backside and makes tackles down the field
  • Fires out of a track stance with energy and twitch
  • Can make conversion of speed-to-power look easy
  • Uses long-arm bull-rush to collapse the edge into quarterback
  • Strong enough to overtake tackles in late phase of the rush
  • Quick laterally and it shows up on twists
Weaknesses
  • Production as rusher failed to match traits and talent
  • Rush plan is somewhat basic at this stage of development
  • Long-arm bull rush is his only real rush tool
  • Hands lack skill and have yet to be unlocked as rush weapon
  • Lacks classic hip bend to dip and run the arc
  • Runs himself around the pocket rather than working back under
  • Plays fast but with no regulator for control
  • Lacks instincts and awareness for misdirections and counters
  • Tends to lose pad level on inside counters
  • Doesn't come to balance consistently as open-field tackler
Last edited by Sufferinginmn
Blair Kiel posted:
This is a very similar reaction to the Kenny Clark pick. Mock drafts had him going in the 2nd round. Most mocks had the Oackers selecting DTs that are currently backups at best. Kenny Clark seemed like a reach at the time. Sometimes scouts know more than us.
by Mike 8:13 PM

What?!? How can that be? I thought the mocks were gospel and the last word on talent assessment. 

Blair Kiel posted:
This is a very similar reaction to the Kenny Clark pick. Mock drafts had him going in the 2nd round. Most mocks had the Oackers selecting DTs that are currently backups at best. Kenny Clark seemed like a reach at the time. Sometimes scouts know more than us.
by Mike 8:13 PM

The same scouts that brought us Damarious Randall and Meech Goodson

I don't think he'll be a bust like Harrell or Worthy.  He plays the run, can set the edge, has a high motor and will chase plays.  That in itself will get you drafted in the 4th round and sets you up for a 10 year career.  But I give him about a 10% chance he lives up to the #12 pick in the draft.  I just don't remember that many players who get to the NFL and THEN develop pass rushing moves.  That's why I liked Brian Burns so much and did not like Gary.  I actually think Burns had a higher bust potential than Gary because if Burns can't rush the passer, he couldn't do anything else.  Worst case Gary can still play first and second down.  Not what you want from your #12 pick but better than a bust.  

Boris posted:
BrainDed posted:

Not pleased...   High probability he would have been there at 30.  

You mean like Clelin Ferrell was supposed to be there at #15 for Carolina?

These teams know where players are slotted.

Yup.

Does anyone think that the fact the majority of the top 10 were already wearing colors/patterns that reflected the teams that drafted them was a co-inky-dink?!?!?!

After that, I figure there's some 'play' but yeah, the teams know where who's going to go, even with 'shocking/stupid' picks.

I still enjoy it!

 

CUPackFan posted:

I don't think he'll be a bust like Harrell or Worthy.  He plays the run, can set the edge, has a high motor and will chase plays.  That in itself will get you drafted in the 4th round and sets you up for a 10 year career.  But I give him about a 10% chance he lives up to the #12 pick in the draft.  I just don't remember that many players who get to the NFL and THEN develop pass rushing moves.  That's why I liked Brian Burns so much and did not like Gary.  I actually think Burns had a higher bust potential than Gary because if Burns can't rush the passer, he couldn't do anything else.  Worst case Gary can still play first and second down.  Not what you want from your #12 pick but better than a bust.  

Upside was probably the biggest decider between the two. Burns is a lot closer to his ceiling than Gary is, Gary is a lump of clay at this point. A lot more you can do with the latter.

RatPack posted:

She ain't cooking that's for sure.

Sure seems like Gary is a candidate for something.  Crossing guard for the bike riders?  

That first time the girls seat on a Schwinn goes up his ass and he is staring at the streamers hanging off the handle grips, with a cameraman, mom, and beaming child looking at him, he'll realize how fast he needs to peddle.

da Yooper posted:

Packer fans during draft - WFT. What a horrible pick. Shoulda got some third string LB from Wisconsin. Hand me another Grain Belt.

At Training Camp - We LOvE you Rashan! Will you ride my kid’s bike?

Oy!

Any Packers “fan” whose go-to beer is a Minneapolis home brew doesn’t deserve an opinion about who the Packers draft. 

michiganjoe posted:

"Affecting the passer" is accurate.  I watch the vast majority of MI games & while Gary didn't rack up the sacks (which I would have loved to have seen), he does get into the backfield a lot.  And he's good against the run.  While I was a bit surprised at this pick & would have personally preferred one of the OTs with how the draft fell, I think Gary has a chance to be real good.

RatPack posted:

Wasn't Nick Perry a DE hand on the dirt guy that we tried to teach a new position too?  

Yes.  This may be the one thing that does bother me a little.  Perry was solid when he wasn't being a puss.  I don't think Angry Bald Man is going to Wizard all over Gary though.  It's pretty clear a lot of pressure is going to be coming right up the gut with this defense, the Smithi and now Gary make it pretty clear.  Having a corp of guys that can bring it from multiple positions depending on down/distance should be pretty damn interesting.  I can see why they would also be looking for a pure FS like Savage and previously MLB's like Burks to absorb more of the coverage work.  I think OLBs will be more run/rush orientated than coverage but I guess we'll see. 

Last edited by Henry

It would be interesting to go back and look over the last twenty years how picks like this have actually worked out.  

Gary was the #1 rated HS prospect in the country, yet managed to get 10 career sacks.  Granted, he probably attracted a lot of attention from the opposition but as we know college isn’t the pros. 

Either he’s just not that good or he lacks motivation and effort.  So he underachieved in college and now is due a big payday and we should expect him to become an impact player?   If he does it would go against the grain.  

I’m fine with taking that type of risk at 30 but 12?  Cmon Gute.  

 

Last edited by Tschmack

First reaction is thank you El Ka Bong I can't read anything else.

Ok many hate this pick but I would hope that they ran it by the angry bald guy and asked him what he thought.  If the Pettine is happy with it and thinks he knows just how to use him I will trust the process and the coaching staff.   It doesn't matter at this point what mock draft say because no draft room is worth its salt if they pay attention to that.

FinnLander posted:
michiganjoe posted:

"Affecting the passer" is accurate.  I watch the vast majority of MI games & while Gary didn't rack up the sacks (which I would have loved to have seen), he does get into the backfield a lot.  And he's good against the run.  While I was a bit surprised at this pick & would have personally preferred one of the OTs with how the draft fell, I think Gary has a chance to be real good.

I also watched a bunch of their games and he doesn't get the big sack totals but he is disruptive and gets in the back field.  I am not saying he is the next Reggie White but I think he has the potential to be a good one.

It's all on Pettine and crew to make a player out of Gary, now. The videos they watched of Gary must have been really compelling to pick him at #12 and to give up both 4th round picks(114 & 118) for him. In truth, the last guy I wanted to pick at #12 was Gary. We'll see how this goes as I feel Gute has some more surprises up his sleeve for Day 2.

mrtundra posted:

It's all on Pettine and crew to make a player out of Gary, now. The videos they watched of Gary must have been really compelling to pick him at #12 and to give up both 4th round picks(114 & 118) for him. In truth, the last guy I wanted to pick at #12 was Gary. We'll see how this goes as I feel Gute has some more surprises up his sleeve for Day 2.

???

mrtundra posted:

It's all on Pettine and crew to make a player out of Gary, now. The videos they watched of Gary must have been really compelling to pick him at #12 and to give up both 4th round picks(114 & 118) for him. In truth, the last guy I wanted to pick at #12 was Gary. We'll see how this goes as I feel Gute has some more surprises up his sleeve for Day 2.

It's early in the morning, and I just had my first sip of coffee....but didn't the Packers give up the two 4s to move up from 30 to 21 for Savage? 

The more I think about this pick, the more comfortable I'm getting with it. Pettine worked wonders with a banged to sh#t defensive unit. The guy has proven he knows what he's doing in the past, and he was Doug Henning in '18, keeping us in games when our offense stalled. If he signed off on Gary, that's a ringing endorsement. If he's been "on their radar" for some time, I'm good. Take that freak athletic ability, and tear some sh#t up, big man! 

In a Detroit Free Press story, team-mate Devin Bush gave Gary a ringing endorsement, saying he would've drafted Gary before himself. Says the shoulder issue is really  a media thing.  So it'll be interesting to see if Gary was one of reasons guys like Devin Bush looked so good. He took up a lot of attention on the field. I'm going to assume Gutie / Pettine know what they're trying to do until it's obvious they don't. As always time will tell, no need to panic.

https://www.freep.com/story/sp...football/3563701002/

So I woke up with a new perspective on Gary this morning.  The fog of the Crown has worn off too.   

I came to the obvious conclusion that I don't know schit about Rashan Gary or any other player for that matter.  Sure, I read stories and looked at mocks like most others.  The reality is that all the information presented to us as fans are nothing more than opinions... opinions from people that normally aren't professional football talent evaluators. So, for me or anybody else to proclaim that Gary sucks or this was a crap pick is completely laughable.  

I've seen Rashan Gary listed as high as the 6th best talent in the draft and as low as the 58th (I think that was it).

My point is this:  The kid was, at one time, the #1 overall football recruit in the country.  His size/speed/athleticism are off the charts. His teammates speak highly of him and he appears to have the character you're looking for. His production wasn't what you'd like to see but almost everybody says he was "disruptive" and that he faced double/triple teams during college that allowed other guys to make plays.  

Gute, the guy that gets paid quite a bit of money to actually do what we like to dabble in, had Gary targeted since February and felt fortunate he "dropped" to GB. I'm good with that. 

I think Gary can play inside and outside, depending on the down/distance. If Gute hits on this kid, he has a chance to be a monster addition.  

Last edited by Pakrz

Haven't had a chance to watch any clips yet, but I've done more reading about him and I feel better with him now. The fact that he's a high academic performer who's already started his own agency firm helps with some of the work ethic concerns. Even with that, I strongly believe guys like Daniels and Clark aren't going to be very pleased with him if he starts slacking off, and will have no problem letting him know so if that does turn out to be the case,. And of course I'm sure Pettine and Lafleur won't be turning a blind eye to that.

Also, he was double and triple-teamed a lot at Michigan. No NFL team will be able to do that to him while holding off Clark, Daniels, Martinez, the Smiths and dare I say Fackrell. Let's see how training camp goes but I don't think this is going to be the nuclear franchise-killing disaster some are making it out to be.

michiganjoe posted:

Top ten talent guy who didn't have the expected production at Michigan. Nobody knows how the pick will pan out (including Gute) but I love the willingness of the GM to take chances. It's like the stock market- the higher the risk and higher the potential reward.

I don't want potential at 12, I want production.   Potential is for late 1 or early 2.

Pakrz posted:

So I woke up with a new perspective on Gary this morning.  The fog of the Crown has worn off too.   

I came to the obvious conclusion that I don't know schit about Rashan Gary or any other player for that matter.  Sure, I read stories and looked at mocks like most others.  The reality is that all the information presented to us as fans are nothing more than opinions... opinions from people that normally aren't professional football talent evaluators. So, for me or anybody else to proclaim that Gary sucks or this was a crap pick is completely laughable.  

I've seen Rashan Gary listed as high as the 6th best talent in the draft and as low as the 58th (I think that was it).

My point is this:  The kid was, at one time, the #1 overall football recruit in the country.  His size/speed/athleticism are off the charts. His teammates speak highly of him and he appears to have the character you're looking for. His production wasn't what you'd like to see but almost everybody says he was "disruptive" and that he faced double/triple teams during college that allowed other guys to make plays.  

Gute, the guy that gets paid quite a bit of money to actually do what we like to dabble in, had Gary targeted since February and felt fortunate he "dropped" to GB. I'm good with that. 

I think Gary can play inside and outside, depending on the down/distance. If Gute hits on this kid, he has a chance to be a monster addition.  

Well said and I agree. 

Gary may also be one of those guys who is just a step above other players, but who does not have to use that step at the level he's playing to have success. Every draft sheet says he has elite potential and athleticism; well, maybe he didn't have to use all his skills to still have success in college, and now he'll be challenged to use all of it as a pro. I think Daniels especially will get on his case "just because" and Gary will, hopefully, respond.

ChilliJon posted:

Hate. Hate. Hare. Hate. Hate. Hate. Hate the pick. Everything about it is shit. 

Oh boy...Hispanic Soup Jon doesn't realize the guy was double and triple teamed.

Now why would they do that?

The guy is a flat out stud if you actually knew how to guage "talant".

I mean...we are talking "Jerel Worthy" kind of talant here...think about it.

 

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