McCarthy asked how he feels about his job security with new GM coming in: "It's fit. I'm very comfortable with where I am in my career. Frankly, I'm more concentrated on the fit of the GM. And fit is a two-way street. It has to fit together."
â Ryan Wood (@ByRyanWood) January 4, 2018
I have to admit, I am beginning to understand Ball's appeal. He's impressive in his own right:
JSOnline: Packers' Russ Ball a man of immense influence and intrigue
Packers' Russ Ball plays hardball with a heart
I remember when much of Packer Nation was upset when Thompson made the call to go with Rodgers over Favre. Perhaps we'll grow to appreciate Murphy's decision to go with Ball over the other options.
Brainwashed Boris posted:Damn check out the Jags with $75 million.
Kirk Cousins in Jax?
How TF is JAX that far under? I thought they signed a bunch of FA$ on D the last couple years. If they get a real QB that team could be very well positioned for the near future.
That chart is eye opening. this year's playoff teams are distributed randomly, with 6 in the top half and six in the lower.
I think the rookie salary cap has as much to do with the modern landscape as anything.
Grave Digger posted:I don't think it's just managing the cap though, it's the negotiation and contract structure that I think is Ball's real value. Teams don't get bogged down with cap problems anymore really, but not all players have identical contracts. The places where teams get killed is the dead money or bloated contracts on the back end. GB hasn't had to cut players because of their cap number in many years, I can't think of the last guy that happened with...maybe Woodson in 2013?
All of those thing are true... but none of them make you a good GM candidate. They do make you a good finance guy though, which Russ Ball is.
In the end, none of us have a clue how good or bad a guy will end up being. Perhaps I will be wrong on Ball if he gets the nod... but as of this moment, I think there are much better candidates.
does anyone remember who the candidates were when Thompson was hired?
Floridarob posted:does anyone remember who the candidates were when Thompson was hired?
There were none in reality. Harlan called Wolf and asked him who he'd hire, he said Thompson. The rest was history.
Hungry5 posted:League sources... we all know what that means.
That time of year when coaches' agents (and some coaches) change their names to "League Sources"..
â Andrew Brandt (@AndrewBrandt) December 31, 2017
I'll wait until Ray Barone's column comes out in Newsday.
If ball gets it, wonder if McCarthy will have final say in personnel with ball basically managing numbers?
DH13 posted:Brainwashed Boris posted:Damn check out the Jags with $75 million.
Kirk Cousins in Jax?
How TF is JAX that far under? I thought they signed a bunch of FA$ on D the last couple years. If they get a real QB that team could be very well positioned for the near future.
Most of their home grown talent is still on their rookie deals.
Orlando Wolf posted:If ball gets it, wonder if McCarthy will have final say in personnel with ball basically managing numbers?
Hope not. No real reason to believe MM is any better at personnel than Mike Sherman.
Lambeau Lobo posted:I have to admit, I am beginning to understand Ball's appeal. He's impressive in his own right:
JSOnline: Packers' Russ Ball a man of immense influence and intrigue
Packers' Russ Ball plays hardball with a heart
I remember when much of Packer Nation was upset when Thompson made the call to go with Rodgers over Favre. Perhaps we'll grow to appreciate Murphy's decision to go with Ball over the other options.
âGuys like Russ save head coaches. I mean, they just save them.â
may be the most interesting quote in the whole thing.
After reading that JS article I think Ball IS the better choice. "Manager" is the title and the duty. Define subordinates roles; Give them the resources to fulfill them; identify and address the issues that prevent them from succeeding. This includes managing their managing styles, if necessary.
Pakrz posted:All of those thing are true... but none of them make you a good GM candidate. They do make you a good finance guy though, which Russ Ball is.
In the end, none of us have a clue how good or bad a guy will end up being. Perhaps I will be wrong on Ball if he gets the nod... but as of this moment, I think there are much better candidates.
You're right. I don't think Ball's lack of experience in scouting is a huge hindrance though. To me it's the same debate about whether to get a HC whose background is defense or offense. Whatever background you want then they have to hire someone excellent of the opposite background as a coordinator. Get a great personnel staff in place and everything will be fine.
Russ Ball was labeled by most as a cap manager and contract negotiator. Admittedly, I bought into that narrative. But based upon the more in-depth articles I've been reading recently, it appears that he is a much more well-rounded individual when it comes to football knowledge and experience.
That JSOnline article mentions how Ball recognized that the knock against him (i.e., a potential weakness) was a purported inability to evaluate and recognize talent. So what did he do? He's apparently made that a point of emphasis over the past 5-6 years, during which he's spent more time observing practice, attending the NFL scouting combine on the field, having direct contact with players, and staying involved in personnel and draft meetings. I appreciate that desire and commitment to improve.
It seems like nearly everyone he's ever interacted with in the football community holds him in high regard.
After looking into the option more, I'm much more intrigued with Russ Ball. With the right people around him--and everything I've read suggests that he'll surround himself with talent--I think he can succeed as the Packers' GM.
Lambeau Lobo posted:I have to admit, I am beginning to understand Ball's appeal. He's impressive in his own right:
JSOnline: Packers' Russ Ball a man of immense influence and intrigue
Packers' Russ Ball plays hardball with a heart
I remember when much of Packer Nation was upset when Thompson made the call to go with Rodgers over Favre. Perhaps we'll grow to appreciate Murphy's decision to go with Ball over the other options.
Wow that's very interesting, thanks for sharing. The debate is really who do you want to lose? If Ball is passed over I have to think he looks to move on. Sounds like he would get snapped up quickly. On the flip side, you probably also lose Wolf and Gute, who are both seemingly well thought of. Personally, based on Ball's experience and how he conducts business, I think he's the right choice. It's not like there's an ace track record from Wolf or Gute for finding amazing talent. Sounds like they're good at their jobs, respected around the league, but not irreplaceable. Ball might actually be.
Lambeau Lobo posted:Russ Ball was labeled by most as a cap manager and contract negotiator. Admittedly, I bought into that narrative. But based upon the more in-depth articles I've been reading recently, it appears that he is a much more well-rounded individual when it comes to football knowledge and experience.
That JSOnline article mentions how Ball recognized that the knock against him (i.e., a potential weakness) was a purported inability to evaluate and recognize talent. So what did he do? He's apparently made that a point of emphasis over the past 5-6 years, during which he's spent more time observing practice, attending the NFL scouting combine on the field, having direct contact with players, and staying involved in personnel and draft meetings. I appreciate that desire and commitment to improve.
It seems like nearly everyone he's ever interacted with in the football community holds him in high regard.
After looking into the option more, I'm much more intrigued with Russ Ball. With the right people around him--and everything I've read suggests that he'll surround himself with talent--I think he can succeed as the Packers' GM.
Attending the combine is not everything.......
Lambeau Lobo posted:Russ Ball was labeled by most as a cap manager and contract negotiator. Admittedly, I bought into that narrative. But based upon the more in-depth articles I've been reading recently, it appears that he is a much more well-rounded individual when it comes to football knowledge and experience.
That JSOnline article mentions how Ball recognized that the knock against him (i.e., a potential weakness) was a purported inability to evaluate and recognize talent. So what did he do? He's apparently made that a point of emphasis over the past 5-6 years, during which he's spent more time observing practice, attending the NFL scouting combine on the field, having direct contact with players, and staying involved in personnel and draft meetings. I appreciate that desire and commitment to improve.
It seems like nearly everyone he's ever interacted with in the football community holds him in high regard.
After looking into the option more, I'm much more intrigued with Russ Ball. With the right people around him--and everything I've read suggests that he'll surround himself with talent--I think he can succeed as the Packers' GM.
If this is the case, then he may be a good hire. Knowing what you don't know and then working to improve on that is the mark of someone who is humble enough to realize he doesn't know everything, and that he is willing to put in the effort to learn. It might also show that he was told years ago that he could be in line as GM if he learned the other aspects of the business.
In the end, any of the three might be good choices, and it might come down to which guy(s) the organization can live without.
Give him a break. He had a lot on his plate. He cleaned that plate about 30 minutes before this picture.
Pikes Peak posted:Lambeau Lobo posted:That JSOnline article mentions how Ball recognized that the knock against him (i.e., a potential weakness) was a purported inability to evaluate and recognize talent. So what did he do? He's apparently made that a point of emphasis over the past 5-6 years, during which he's spent more time observing practice, attending the NFL scouting combine on the field, having direct contact with players, and staying involved in personnel and draft meetings. I appreciate that desire and commitment to improve.
Attending the combine is not everything.......
Heh. Perhaps that's why the article stressed that Ball wanted on-field experience at the combine.
My interview process would consist of one question:
1. Would you have drafted TJ Watt?
Meh. The TJ Watt vs. King & Biegel debate is not settled. Let that simmer for a few years before we call the winner.
The question that Ball will have to answer---since you have zero actual experience actually evaluating players, who is the guy that's going to do that for you. And, no, the choice can't be Wolf or Gutenkest because they are most likely gone after this year when their contracts are up.
Sorry, but I don't care how many stories praising Ball he managed to get placed in the papers, it doesn't change the fact he has no demonstrated ability to peform the task the Packers need the most right now--player evaluation.
I may be in the minority here, but I think I'm just going to sit back and wait to see what ACTUALLY unfolds, and then wait for the results from said events, before I proceed to **** my pants all over the internet.
Disagree. True fans will fret and worry hardcore.
Rusty posted:I may be in the minority here, but I think I'm just going to sit back and wait to see what ACTUALLY unfolds, and then wait for the results from said events, before I proceed to **** my pants all over the internet.
Except I won't **** my pants.
GBFanForLife posted:Rusty posted:I may be in the minority here, but I think I'm just going to sit back and wait to see what ACTUALLY unfolds, and then wait for the results from said events, before I proceed to **** my pants all over the internet.
Except I won't **** my pants.
Wimp.
Ball's prom picture:
I think we can all agree, bad decisions started early in his life.
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Rusty posted:I may be in the minority here, but I think I'm just going to sit back and wait to see what ACTUALLY unfolds, and then wait for the results from said events, before I proceed to **** my pants all over the internet.
That is just the kind of laissez-faire attitude that is going to end up killing the internet
michiganjoe posted:Orlando Wolf posted:If ball gets it, wonder if McCarthy will have final say in personnel with ball basically managing numbers?
Hope not. No real reason to believe MM is any better at personnel than Mike Sherman.
I'd guess he'd be worse.
âIâll just say it again: I believe in Brett Hundley,â McCarthy said, repeating a phrase heâs used on a weekly basis since Rodgersâ injury. âI believe in Brett Hundley as a quarterback, and I believe he will improve. And thatâs where we are.â
Speaking of judging talent, is he involved in judging the talent of the coordinators and other coaches.....I seem to recall the term "outstanding football coach" coming out of his pie hole. Color me leery.
I know we all have our opinions, but I remember this clip from Mora.
PackerJoe posted:michiganjoe posted:Orlando Wolf posted:If ball gets it, wonder if McCarthy will have final say in personnel with ball basically managing numbers?
Hope not. No real reason to believe MM is any better at personnel than Mike Sherman.
I'd guess he'd be worse.
âIâll just say it again: I believe in Brett Hundley,â McCarthy said, repeating a phrase heâs used on a weekly basis since Rodgersâ injury. âI believe in Brett Hundley as a quarterback, and I believe he will improve. And thatâs where we are.â
Just asking...as a coach... do you expect him to say something different knowing 12 is out for the year and Hundley is your guy for the rest of the season?
Yeah, he should have said: "We're ****ed!"
Ya, pretty sure our defense wasn't good.
No. But I didn't expect him to continuously stick with a player that was quite obviously not as good as he advertised.
I underestimated the ego of Mike McCarthy.
I will say, Hundley didn't get very much help from his receivers or the rest of the team. The losses & poor play isn't strictly on Hundley. So he's got that going for him....which is nice.
We watched the same games. I also wondered how our backup was so unprepared. But I never thought not going to the 3rd string QB was due to ego, I thought it was because of what he saw every day in practice. But who knows...
I believe "ego" which goes back to the statement he issued quite tersely, "The QB room is fine!"
I believed him....until I saw the first game Hundley started. Then I was really pissed off & knew that MM wasn't doing his job very well.
There has to be a thin line between what you you say to the media and what is the truth. If you say it in a press conference you are also saying it to your team. As a coach you canât be too honest if you think your players arenât great because at some point you might have to count on them to win games for you.