This link includes players salaries, so it is more than just picking 53. Don't know if they'll update their list of players once the UDFA and try-outs are given a contract for OTA's and training camp.
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H5, I'm holding you personally responsible for the amount of hours I'm going to waste on this link. It's like internet cocaine.
CJ - 1st ones free. Next version of this will cost you.
Other than the cocaine thing, I like where this thread is going.
That site's going to keep me busier than a one armed drummer...
Rick Allen of Def Leppard disagrees
No. | Player | Po. | Ht | Wt | Age | Year | College | Salary |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 63 | Linsley, Corey | C | 6-3 | 301 | 22 | R | Ohio State | $ 449,527 * |
| 73 | Tretter, J.C. | C | 6-4 | 307 | 23 | 2 | Cornell | $ 598,977 |
| 24 | Bush, Jarrett | CB | 6-0 | 200 | 29 | 9 | Utah State | $ 2,033,330 |
| 33 | Hyde, Micah | CB | 6-0 | 197 | 23 | 2 | Iowa | $ 539,527 |
| 37 | Shields, Sam | CB | 5-11 | 184 | 26 | 5 | Miami (FL) | $ 5,625,000 |
| 31 | House, Davon | CB | 6-1 | 195 | 24 | 4 | New Mexico State | $ 720,145 |
| 38 | Williams, Tramon | CB | 5-11 | 191 | 31 | 8 | Louisiana Tech | $ 9,500,000 |
| 29 | Hayward, Casey | CB | 5-11 | 192 | 24 | 3 | Vanderbilt | $ 902,651 |
| 98 | Guion, Letroy | DL | 6-4 | 315 | 26 | 8 | Florida State | $ 1,018,120 |
| 95 | Jones, Datone | DL | 6-4 | 285 | 23 | 2 | California-Los Angeles | $ 1,753,770 |
| 76 | Daniels, Mike | DL | 6-0 | 300 | 25 | 3 | Iowa | $ 645,146 |
| 94 | Thornton, Khyri | DL | 6-3 | 304 | 24 | R | South Mississippi | $ 556,748 * |
| 93 | Boyd, Josh | DL | 6-3 | 310 | 24 | 2 | Mississippi State | $ 531,140 |
| 90 | Raji, B.J. | DL | 6-2 | 337 | 27 | 6 | Boston College | $ 4,000,000 |
| 96 | Neal, Michael | DL | 6-3 | 285 | 26 | 5 | Purdue | $ 3,750,000 |
| 56 | Peppers, Julius | DL | 6-7 | 287 | 34 | 14 | North Carolina | $ 3,500,000 |
| 65 | Taylor, Lane | G | 6-3 | 324 | 24 | 2 | Oklahoma State | $ 497,333 |
| 71 | Sitton, Josh | G | 6-3 | 318 | 27 | 7 | Central Florida | $ 6,400,000 |
| 70 | Lang, T.J. | G | 6-4 | 318 | 26 | 6 | Eastern Michigan | $ 5,100,000 |
| 77 | Adams, Aaron | G | 6-5 | 303 | 25 | 2 | Eastern Kentucky | $ 420,000 |
| 50 | Hawk, A.J. | ILB | 6-1 | 242 | 30 | 9 | Ohio State | $ 5,100,000 |
| 57 | Lattimore, Jamari | ILB | 6-2 | 237 | 25 | 4 | Middle Tennessee State | $ 1,431,000 |
| 59 | Jones, Brad | ILB | 6-3 | 242 | 28 | 6 | Colorado | $ 3,925,000 |
| 58 | Barrington, Sam | ILB | 6-1 | 235 | 23 | 2 | South Florida | $ 507,250 |
| 2 | Crosby, Mason | K | 6-1 | 207 | 29 | 8 | Colorado | $ 3,400,000 |
| 61 | Goode, Brett | LS | 6-1 | 255 | 29 | 7 | Arkansas | $ 836,250 |
| 52 | Matthews, Clay | OLB | 6-3 | 255 | 28 | 6 | Southern California | $ 10,943,800 |
| 53 | Perry, Nick | OLB | 6-3 | 265 | 24 | 3 | Southern California | $ 2,045,250 |
| 55 | Mulumba, Andy | OLB | 6-3 | 260 | 24 | 2 | Eastern Michigan | $ 496,666 |
| 91 | Bradford, Carl | OLB | 6-1 | 252 | 21 | R | Arizona State | $ 510,027 * |
| 60 | Vujnovich, Jeremy | OT | 6-5 | 300 | --- | 2 | Louisiana College | $ 510,000 |
| 69 | Bakhtiari, David | OT | 6-4 | 300 | 22 | 2 | Colorado | $ 608,850 |
| 67 | Barclay, Don | OT | 6-4 | 305 | 25 | 3 | West Virginia | $ 570,833 |
| 75 | Bulaga, Bryan | OT | 6-5 | 314 | 25 | 5 | Iowa | $ 3,829,000 |
| 8 | Masthay, Tim | P | 6-1 | 200 | 27 | 5 | Kentucky | $ 1,240,000 |
| 12 | Rodgers, Aaron | QB | 6-2 | 225 | 30 | 10 | California | $ 17,550,000 |
| 10 | Flynn, Matt | QB | 6-2 | 225 | 28 | 7 | Louisiana State | $ 986,875 |
| 44 | Starks, James | RB | 6-2 | 218 | 28 | 5 | Buffalo | $ 1,370,310 |
| 30 | Kuhn, John | RB | 6-0 | 250 | 31 | 9 | Shippensburg | $ 1,026,880 |
| 23 | Franklin, Johnathan | RB | 5-10 | 205 | 24 | 2 | California-Los Angeles | $ 596,367 |
| 27 | Lacy, Eddie | RB | 5-11 | 230 | 23 | 2 | Alabama | $ 771,003 |
| 32 | Banjo, Chris | S | 5-10 | 207 | 24 | 2 | Southern Methodist | $ 495,000 |
| 21 | Clinton-Dix, Ha'Sean | S | 6-1 | 208 | 21 | R | Alabama | $ 1,625,990 * |
| 42 | Burnett, Morgan | S | 6-1 | 209 | 25 | 5 | Georgia Tech | $ 4,843,750 |
| 82 | Taylor, Ryan | TE | 6-3 | 254 | 26 | 4 | North Carolina | $ 659,794 |
| 81 | Quarless, Andrew | TE | 6-4 | 252 | 25 | 5 | Penn State | $ 1,250,000 |
| 89 | Rodgers, Richard | TE | 6-4 | 257 | 22 | R | California | $ 556,478 * |
| 86 | Bostick, Brandon | TE | 6-3 | 250 | 25 | 2 | Newberry | $ 495,000 |
| 84 | Abbrederis, Jared | WR | 6-1 | 195 | 23 | R | Wisconsin | $ 456,140 * |
| 18 | Cobb, Randall | WR | 5-10 | 192 | 23 | 4 | Kentucky | $ 1,021,180 |
| 11 | Boykin, Jarrett | WR | 6-2 | 218 | 24 | 3 | Virginia Tech | $ 570,000 |
| 87 | Nelson, Jordy | WR | 6-3 | 217 | 28 | 7 | Kansas State | $ 4,375,000 |
| 17 | Adams, Davante | WR | 6-1 | 212 | 21 | R | Fresno State | $ 744,757 * |
Biggest cuts - Worthy and Sherrod
9.1M under the cap still.
No way they cut Worthy & Sherrod. Maybe they get hurt though....
I think Richardson sticks over Banjo. Other than that, nice list!
Boris, I think Brad Jones is a cap casualty/performance casualty, too. One of the UDFAs takes him down. Also think Janis will win a spot. Agree on Worthy and Sherrod.
Probably not, but production, or lack thereof, and contracts stick out...
Also - I'd prefer to keep a 6th WR and only 3 TE, but no way GB does that. Hell, they might keep 5 TEs...
I agree with Richardson over Banjo. Love how competitive the Defensive roster is looking.
It is always important to set a roster in May
Vujnovich and Adams are long shots to make it on the OL...don't need that many since you've got 2 C that can also play guard, and an OG (Lang) that can play center.
13 seconds of truth there IC.
This might be the last year for Bush.
Originally Posted by Iowacheese:
It is always important to set a roster in May
Just go on the site once and cut Hawk. It's wildly satisfying.
Do they really need 2 Rodgers from California? One of them really takes up a lot of cap space.
Originally Posted by Boris:
No way they cut Worthy & Sherrod. Maybe they get hurt though....
I'm betting they cut Worthy...which means he is, what's the term? BULLETPROOF!
Originally Posted by ChilliJon:
Just go on the site once and cut Hawk. It's wildly satisfying.
Wow, it was orgasmic.
Originally Posted by Goalline:
Wow, it was orgasmic.
Hey, IC owns the 13 second post.
No. | Player | Position | Height | Weight | Age | Experience | College | Salary |
2 | Crosby, Mason | K | 6-1 | 207 | 29 | 8 | Colorado | $ 3,400,000 |
8 | Masthay, Tim | P | 6-1 | 200 | 27 | 5 | Kentucky | $ 1,240,000 |
10 | Flynn, Matt | QB | 6-2 | 225 | 28 | 7 | Louisiana State | $ 986,875 |
11 | Boykin, Jarrett | WR | 6-2 | 218 | 24 | 3 | Virginia Tech | $ 570,000 |
12 | Rodgers, Aaron | QB | 6-2 | 225 | 30 | 10 | California | $ 17,550,000 |
16 | Tolzien, Scott | QB | 6-2 | 213 | 26 | 4 | Wisconsin | $ 645,000 |
17 | Adams, Davante | WR | 6-1 | 212 | 21 | R | Fresno State | $ 744,757 * |
18 | Cobb, Randall | WR | 5-10 | 192 | 23 | 4 | Kentucky | $ 1,021,180 |
21 | Clinton-Dix, Ha'Sean | S | 6-1 | 208 | 21 | R | Alabama | $ 1,625,990 * |
23 | Franklin, Johnathan | RB | 5-10 | 205 | 24 | 2 | California-Los Angeles | $ 596,367 |
27 | Lacy, Eddie | RB | 5-11 | 230 | 23 | 2 | Alabama | $ 771,003 |
28 | Richardson, Sean | S | 6-2 | 216 | 24 | 3 | Vanderbilt | $ 571,667 |
29 | Hayward, Casey | CB | 5-11 | 192 | 24 | 3 | Vanderbilt | $ 902,651 |
30 | Kuhn, John | RB | 6-0 | 250 | 31 | 9 | Shippensburg | $ 1,026,880 |
31 | House, Davon | CB | 6-1 | 195 | 24 | 4 | New Mexico State | $ 720,145 |
32 | Banjo, Chris | S | 5-10 | 207 | 24 | 2 | Southern Methodist | $ 495,000 |
33 | Hyde, Micah | CB | 6-0 | 197 | 23 | 2 | Iowa | $ 539,527 |
37 | Shields, Sam | CB | 5-11 | 184 | 26 | 5 | Miami (FL) | $ 5,625,000 |
38 | Williams, Tramon | CB | 5-11 | 191 | 31 | 8 | Louisiana Tech | $ 9,500,000 |
42 | Burnett, Morgan | S | 6-1 | 209 | 25 | 5 | Georgia Tech | $ 4,843,750 |
44 | Starks, James | RB | 6-2 | 218 | 28 | 5 | Buffalo | $ 1,370,310 |
45 | Doughty, Jake | ILB | 6-0 | 227 | --- | R | Utah State | $ 420,000 * |
50 | Hawk, A.J. | ILB | 6-1 | 242 | 30 | 9 | Ohio State | $ 5,100,000 |
52 | Matthews, Clay | OLB | 6-3 | 255 | 28 | 6 | Southern California | $ 10,943,800 |
53 | Perry, Nick | OLB | 6-3 | 265 | 24 | 3 | Southern California | $ 2,045,250 |
55 | Mulumba, Andy | OLB | 6-3 | 260 | 24 | 2 | Eastern Michigan | $ 496,666 |
56 | Peppers, Julius | DL | 6-7 | 287 | 34 | 14 | North Carolina | $ 3,500,000 |
57 | Lattimore, Jamari | ILB | 6-2 | 237 | 25 | 4 | Middle Tennessee State | $ 1,431,000 |
58 | Barrington, Sam | ILB | 6-1 | 235 | 23 | 2 | South Florida | $ 507,250 |
61 | Goode, Brett | LS | 6-1 | 255 | 29 | 7 | Arkansas | $ 836,250 |
63 | Linsley, Corey | C | 6-3 | 301 | 22 | R | Ohio State | $ 449,527 * |
65 | Taylor, Lane | G | 6-3 | 324 | 24 | 2 | Oklahoma State | $ 497,333 |
67 | Barclay, Don | OT | 6-4 | 305 | 25 | 3 | West Virginia | $ 570,833 |
69 | Bakhtiari, David | OT | 6-4 | 300 | 22 | 2 | Colorado | $ 608,850 |
70 | Lang, T.J. | G | 6-4 | 318 | 26 | 6 | Eastern Michigan | $ 5,100,000 |
71 | Sitton, Josh | G | 6-3 | 318 | 27 | 7 | Central Florida | $ 6,400,000 |
73 | Tretter, J.C. | C | 6-4 | 307 | 23 | 2 | Cornell | $ 598,977 |
75 | Bulaga, Bryan | OT | 6-5 | 314 | 25 | 5 | Iowa | $ 3,829,000 |
76 | Daniels, Mike | DL | 6-0 | 300 | 25 | 3 | Iowa | $ 645,146 |
77 | Adams, Aaron | G | 6-5 | 303 | 25 | 2 | Eastern Kentucky | $ 420,000 |
78 | Sherrod, Derek | OT | 6-6 | 321 | 25 | 4 | Mississippi State | $ 2,100,360 |
81 | Quarless, Andrew | TE | 6-4 | 252 | 25 | 5 | Penn State | $ 1,250,000 |
84 | Abbrederis, Jared | WR | 6-1 | 195 | 23 | R | Wisconsin | $ 456,140 * |
86 | Bostick, Brandon | TE | 6-3 | 250 | 25 | 2 | Newberry | $ 495,000 |
87 | Nelson, Jordy | WR | 6-3 | 217 | 28 | 7 | Kansas State | $ 4,375,000 |
89 | Rodgers, Richard | TE | 6-4 | 257 | 22 | R | California | $ 556,478 * |
90 | Raji, B.J. | DL | 6-2 | 337 | 27 | 6 | Boston College | $ 4,000,000 |
91 | Bradford, Carl | OLB | 6-1 | 252 | 21 | R | Arizona State | $ 510,027 * |
93 | Boyd, Josh | DL | 6-3 | 310 | 24 | 2 | Mississippi State | $ 531,140 |
94 | Thornton, Khyri | DL | 6-3 | 304 | 24 | R | South Mississippi | $ 556,748 * |
95 | Jones, Datone | DL | 6-4 | 285 | 23 | 2 | California-Los Angeles | $ 1,753,770 |
96 | Neal, Michael | DL | 6-3 | 285 | 26 | 5 | Purdue | $ 3,750,000 |
99 | Worthy, Jerel | DL | 6-2 | 304 | 24 | 3 | Michigan State | $ 1,076,780 |
Brad Jones is missing...
I agree with the 53 with one exception, and it's nothing more than a gut feeling Joe Thomas is going to be a better ILB project than Doughty.
If, IF, Lyerla beats the odds and earns a spot on the 53, who's not making it???
I went through this list 4 times and you can't shake the thought that if Ted cut anyone on this list he immediately loses a good player to make room for someone that could blow a cog any second. I guess maybe Tolzien or Doughty / Thomas but crap, you end up understanding why Ted is taking a long time to even give Lyerla a longer look than a rookie tryout.
at least 3 of these guys are hurt in training camp
Hawk is not going to be one of them. He's never one of them.
if Lyerla makes it, Taylor or Bostick is gone. They keep Quarless and Rich-Rod.
That was harder than I thought. I tried to sign a free agent and couldn't do it in the end. Also had to consider special team players. Final observation is that I wish you could coach up an offensive lineman to long snap...why don't teams do this. My final roster doesn't include a ufa...so is unrealistic.
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No. | Player | Position | Height | Weight | Age | Experience | College | Salary |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 63 | Linsley, Corey | C | 6-3 | 301 | 22 | R | Ohio State | $ 449,527 * |
| 73 | Tretter, J.C. | C | 6-4 | 307 | 23 | 2 | Cornell | $ 598,977 |
| 38 | Williams, Tramon | CB | 5-11 | 191 | 31 | 8 | Louisiana Tech | $ 9,500,000 |
| 29 | Hayward, Casey | CB | 5-11 | 192 | 24 | 3 | Vanderbilt | $ 902,651 |
| 37 | Shields, Sam | CB | 5-11 | 184 | 26 | 5 | Miami (FL) | $ 5,625,000 |
| 31 | House, Davon | CB | 6-1 | 195 | 24 | 4 | New Mexico State | $ 720,145 |
| 33 | Hyde, Micah | CB | 6-0 | 197 | 23 | 2 | Iowa | $ 539,527 |
| 24 | Bush, Jarrett | CB | 6-0 | 200 | 29 | 9 | Utah State | $ 2,033,330 |
| 39 | Goodson, Demetri | CB | 5-11 | 197 | 24 | R | Baylor | $ 420,000 * |
| 93 | Boyd, Josh | DL | 6-3 | 310 | 24 | 2 | Mississippi State | $ 531,140 |
| 95 | Jones, Datone | DL | 6-4 | 285 | 23 | 2 | California-Los Angeles | $ 1,753,770 |
| 56 | Peppers, Julius | DL | 6-7 | 287 | 34 | 14 | North Carolina | $ 3,500,000 |
| 98 | Guion, Letroy | DL | 6-4 | 315 | 26 | 8 | Florida State | $ 1,018,120 |
| 90 | Raji, B.J. | DL | 6-2 | 337 | 27 | 6 | Boston College | $ 4,000,000 |
| 94 | Thornton, Khyri | DL | 6-3 | 304 | 24 | R | South Mississippi | $ 556,748 * |
| 96 | Neal, Michael | DL | 6-3 | 285 | 26 | 5 | Purdue | $ 3,750,000 |
| 76 | Daniels, Mike | DL | 6-0 | 300 | 25 | 3 | Iowa | $ 645,146 |
| 70 | Lang, T.J. | G | 6-4 | 318 | 26 | 6 | Eastern Michigan | $ 5,100,000 |
| 65 | Taylor, Lane | G | 6-3 | 324 | 24 | 2 | Oklahoma State | $ 497,333 |
| 71 | Sitton, Josh | G | 6-3 | 318 | 27 | 7 | Central Florida | $ 6,400,000 |
| 59 | Jones, Brad | ILB | 6-3 | 242 | 28 | 6 | Colorado | $ 3,925,000 |
| 58 | Barrington, Sam | ILB | 6-1 | 235 | 23 | 2 | South Florida | $ 507,250 |
| 50 | Hawk, A.J. | ILB | 6-1 | 242 | 30 | 9 | Ohio State | $ 5,100,000 |
| 57 | Lattimore, Jamari | ILB | 6-2 | 237 | 25 | 4 | Middle Tennessee State | $ 1,431,000 |
| 2 | Crosby, Mason | K | 6-1 | 207 | 29 | 8 | Colorado | $ 3,400,000 |
| 61 | Goode, Brett | LS | 6-1 | 255 | 29 | 7 | Arkansas | $ 836,250 |
| 55 | Mulumba, Andy | OLB | 6-3 | 260 | 24 | 2 | Eastern Michigan | $ 496,666 |
| 53 | Perry, Nick | OLB | 6-3 | 265 | 24 | 3 | Southern California | $ 2,045,250 |
| 52 | Matthews, Clay | OLB | 6-3 | 255 | 28 | 6 | Southern California | $ 10,943,800 |
| 91 | Bradford, Carl | OLB | 6-1 | 252 | 21 | R | Arizona State | $ 510,027 * |
| 78 | Sherrod, Derek | OT | 6-6 | 321 | 25 | 4 | Mississippi State | $ 2,100,360 |
| 67 | Barclay, Don | OT | 6-4 | 305 | 25 | 3 | West Virginia | $ 570,833 |
| 75 | Bulaga, Bryan | OT | 6-5 | 314 | 25 | 5 | Iowa | $ 3,829,000 |
| 69 | Bakhtiari, David | OT | 6-4 | 300 | 22 | 2 | Colorado | $ 608,850 |
| 8 | Masthay, Tim | P | 6-1 | 200 | 27 | 5 | Kentucky | $ 1,240,000 |
| 12 | Rodgers, Aaron | QB | 6-2 | 225 | 30 | 10 | California | $ 17,550,000 |
| 10 | Flynn, Matt | QB | 6-2 | 225 | 28 | 7 | Louisiana State | $ 986,875 |
| 44 | Starks, James | RB | 6-2 | 218 | 28 | 5 | Buffalo | $ 1,370,310 |
| 30 | Kuhn, John | RB | 6-0 | 250 | 31 | 9 | Shippensburg | $ 1,026,880 |
| 23 | Franklin, Johnathan | RB | 5-10 | 205 | 24 | 2 | California-Los Angeles | $ 596,367 |
| 27 | Lacy, Eddie | RB | 5-11 | 230 | 23 | 2 | Alabama | $ 771,003 |
| 21 | Clinton-Dix, Ha'Sean | S | 6-1 | 208 | 21 | R | Alabama | $ 1,625,990 * |
| 42 | Burnett, Morgan | S | 6-1 | 209 | 25 | 5 | Georgia Tech | $ 4,843,750 |
| 28 | Richardson, Sean | S | 6-2 | 216 | 24 | 3 | Vanderbilt | $ 571,667 |
| 89 | Rodgers, Richard | TE | 6-4 | 257 | 22 | R | California | $ 556,478 * |
| 86 | Bostick, Brandon | TE | 6-3 | 250 | 25 | 2 | Newberry | $ 495,000 |
| 82 | Taylor, Ryan | TE | 6-3 | 254 | 26 | 4 | North Carolina | $ 659,794 |
| 81 | Quarless, Andrew | TE | 6-4 | 252 | 25 | 5 | Penn State | $ 1,250,000 |
| 11 | Boykin, Jarrett | WR | 6-2 | 218 | 24 | 3 | Virginia Tech | $ 570,000 |
| 87 | Nelson, Jordy | WR | 6-3 | 217 | 28 | 7 | Kansas State | $ 4,375,000 |
| 84 | Abbrederis, Jared | WR | 6-1 | 195 | 23 | R | Wisconsin | $ 456,140 * |
| 17 | Adams, Davante | WR | 6-1 | 212 | 21 | R | Fresno State | $ 744,757 * |
| 18 | Cobb, Randall | WR | 5-10 | 192 | 23 | 4 | Kentucky | $ 1,021,180 |
Originally Posted by Sufferinginmn:
That was harder than I thought. Final observation is that I wish you could coach up an offensive lineman to long snap...why don't teams do this.
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all 32 teams would love an extra roster spot
all 32 teams use a dedicated long snapper
Its not easy to be perfect at it; and they don't want their actual OL running down the field and covering punts.
The long snappers are practicing snapping while the OL is working on other things
Long snappers weigh 250-260, OL weigh 300+
Teach your kids to be longsnappers 
Teach your kids to be longsnappers
One of the kids at my high school was one of the most highly recruited in the country and ended up getting a full ride to Alabama. Smart kid. Knows you can get a full NFL career out of it without the wear and tear that leaves you crippled at 50, and the salaries are around a half mil a year. We'll see if he makes it. Cole Maaza.
It's a real bitch trying to thin this list down to 53. Couple things jump out. The camp battle at LB is going to be incredible. The best shot guys like Richardson and the new rookie tryout from Hawaii, Charles Clay, have of making this team is to unseat Bush as the ST assassin.
Clay has an interesting highlight reel. It's heavily slanted toward his work on ST. He's really good at it. Factor in Bush's $2.0 million contract, the fact that he's a FA next year, the FA's GB needs to sign next year and this could be the year someone finally takes Bush's roster spot. Like always, Bush isn't going to lay down and hand that spot over without a fight.
Ill be shocked if the 4 ILB's week 1 in Seattle are Hawk, Jones, Barrington, and Lattimore. 1 of those guys won't be on the team. My money is on Jones being that guy.
What Chillijon said. I think there are gonna be some real surprises getting down to 53, and two of the biggest may be at ILB. For sure Hawk will be there. Anyone else can't be sleeping easy.
Good comments from Vic. I know it's a corporate website, but I appreciate his take on things.
http://www.packers.com/news-an...14-ac6e-16d964a75c72
All the leg humping dip****s that have been hating on Bush for the past 8 seasons better finally wake the **** up. He aint going anywhere.
He has missed 6 regular season games in his career. He has the accountability and availability factor down. And from all accounts works as hard or harder than anyone on the team.
Unlike all the Michael Sam fans around here...some of us still like Bush.