But rather the Viking receiver found a so called "window" in the pass coverage. Scratch one rationalization for that cluster**** that was the 3 man rush on 3rd and 11 in a tie game.
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It's 1 of 2 things.
Either he blew the coverage or the Safety didn't get over fast enough.
Why would Heyward just sit there & cover a zone that no Viking was in?
Ponder isn't smart enough or good enough to find a "Window" in the coverage on a regular basis. What... Ponder is all of a sudden Peyton Manning?
Either he blew the coverage or the Safety didn't get over fast enough.
Why would Heyward just sit there & cover a zone that no Viking was in?
Ponder isn't smart enough or good enough to find a "Window" in the coverage on a regular basis. What... Ponder is all of a sudden Peyton Manning?
Dom's 4th and 26? Whether it was a bad call/scheme, poor execution or a combination thereof it was inexcusable.
To me, it looked like the receiver was deep enough that the safety should have had it. Heyward needs to stay in his zone in case the QB runs or another receiver comes into his area, either out of the backfield or cutting across the field.
Maybe it was his fault, but we can't say that for sure.
Maybe it was his fault, but we can't say that for sure.
quote:Originally posted by michiganjoe:
Dom's 4th and 26?
Did I miss something or was this game against the Vikings meaningful?
After the game, one Vikings player said they knew GB would drop into that exact zone in that situation. They had planned for it and designed routes to go right into the gaps in that zone.
Film study.
Film study.
quote:Originally posted by YATittle:
We don't do zone well.
Great post! and i am not being sarcastic
quote:Originally posted by FreeSafety:
After the game, one Vikings player said they knew GB would drop into that exact zone in that situation. They had planned for it and designed routes to go right into the gaps in that zone.
Film study.
Damn, they are so frickin brilliant ... we just poor stupid folk in Green Bay.
quote:Originally posted by tundra_power:quote:Originally posted by YATittle:
We don't do zone well.
Great post! and i am not being sarcastic
Nobody does zone well when your backers have to play run first especially if he happens to be the 'Best' running back in the last decade. It makes all zones reach the break point. Capers was rong to play zone as much as we did. Ponder proved it yesterday.
quote:Originally posted by Grave Digger:
Did I miss something or was this game against the Vikings meaningful?
I'd much rather play SF at Lambeau and the difference between a #2 and #3 seed is pretty meaningful.
Didn't work so well the last time they played SF in Lambeau.
The PACKERS enter a game verses a team with a weak QB, mediocre receivers & a great runner. Capers goes with 3 down linemen & plays mostly zone. And the RB & the weak QB rip them a new one...and they lose. Most DC's would pressure the the QB with 4 - 5 rushers & cover the receivers in man-to-man & attempt to limit the RBs runs. Ponder doesn't throw to a spot he throws to the open man. If the coverage is man he'll usually look for some other receiver. Not Capers best game.
quote:Originally posted by Grave Digger:quote:Originally posted by michiganjoe:
Dom's 4th and 26?
Did I miss something or was this game against the Vikings meaningful?
MM sure thought it was meaningful when he threw that flag.
It is easier to play the run out of the zone. In man the CBs have their backs to the LOS and are slow to react to the runner.
quote:Originally posted by Mcpacker64:
The PACKERS enter a game verses a team with a weak QB, mediocre receivers & a great runner. Capers goes with 3 down linemen & plays mostly zone. And the RB & the weak QB rip them a new one...and they lose. Most DC's would pressure the the QB with 4 - 5 rushers & cover the receivers in man-to-man & attempt to limit the RBs runs. Ponder doesn't throw to a spot he throws to the open man. If the coverage is man he'll usually look for some other receiver. Not Capers best game.
Surely they did not think the Bears were a bigger threat and played the Arizona bait-n-switch game?
quote:Originally posted by Goalline:
MM sure thought it was meaningful when he threw that flag.
It is easier to play the run out of the zone. In man the CBs have their backs to the LOS and are slow to react to the runner.
Playing vanilla and not caring are different things. You can't just not play, but it doesn't mean you throw everything you've got into a game that you don't really need to win.
Anyone notice Capers didn't use NEARLY the amount of exotic blitzes, line stunts, or even his signature ILB blitz that he usually does? I think they were going to ride the offense in this game, if they win then they win, but if they lost they didn't want Minny to have an idea of the next weeks defensive gameplan. It's a win-win for the Packers. Minnesota has false confidence if they win, GB gets the #2 seed if they win.
I expect Capers gameplan to be faaaaar different next week.
As deflated as I was last night I tried to talk myself into the bait-n-switch scenario. I couldn't do it.
Could have thrown everything at Minny and secured a week off and the 2 seed.
I need to watch the game again but it seemed like a conservative scheme on D. Then again better execution of the plan Capers installed is good enough to win yesterday.
Still bitter!
Could have thrown everything at Minny and secured a week off and the 2 seed.
I need to watch the game again but it seemed like a conservative scheme on D. Then again better execution of the plan Capers installed is good enough to win yesterday.
Still bitter!
When we shifted into the zone defense, I immediately had flashbacks from 4th and 26. Too bad, it happened again. Bad things happen when you let the QB just sit back and scan the field. Defensive coordinators never learn.
Sorry Gravedigger, I don't buy that at all. There was no "vanilla" or "holding back" by the defense. They just sucked.
At least at Lambeau they'll have a home crowd behind them, and I think Ponder's ordinary throwing arm is not as effective in cold weather outdoors as it is in a nice comfy dome. Let's hope we see the Ponder of a few weeks ago instead of the Ponder of yesterday.
At least at Lambeau they'll have a home crowd behind them, and I think Ponder's ordinary throwing arm is not as effective in cold weather outdoors as it is in a nice comfy dome. Let's hope we see the Ponder of a few weeks ago instead of the Ponder of yesterday.
What's more likely, Capers played a vanilla gameplan or Christian Ponder beat the Packers because he's just that good.
I feel like some of you want to believe this defense sucks so you're not disappointed if they lose in the playoffs. "Well I saw this coming, this D has stunk since week 17!" This was a really good D in the NFL this year, tops in Sacks. They had good CB play, they survived injuries, young and veteran players are coming into their own, etc.
No, Capers had a vanilla gameplan. I didn't see any of the defense in that game that I had seen any that year. The execution was poor definitely, Tramon pussed out on multiple occasions and everyone else just looked low energy.
I feel like some of you want to believe this defense sucks so you're not disappointed if they lose in the playoffs. "Well I saw this coming, this D has stunk since week 17!" This was a really good D in the NFL this year, tops in Sacks. They had good CB play, they survived injuries, young and veteran players are coming into their own, etc.
No, Capers had a vanilla gameplan. I didn't see any of the defense in that game that I had seen any that year. The execution was poor definitely, Tramon pussed out on multiple occasions and everyone else just looked low energy.
Gravedigger may on to something here.....Pack plays rope a dope to fake out the Vikes for next week....brilliant strategy by Capers. Give the Vikes fake confidence and pull the rug our next week.
I like your football takes GD and they are mostly spot on.. but it's silly to me to even suggest GB went into that game with anything but winning on their mind. MM made it very clear it was a playoff type game and the team was full speed ahead with a goal of obtaining the bye. Come on now... GB went to Minny and ran into a football player in AP that they couldn't stop...again.
Not buying it. Good coaching doesn't ever gameplay a loss, regardless if you are 12-4 or 4-12.
Unless you are sitting guys and punting the game, I didn't see that as the case yesterday.
Unless you are sitting guys and punting the game, I didn't see that as the case yesterday.
I can almost buy the "let's play conservative on D today and let the offense try and grease this one out and in the off chance the Queens take this we can give them a completely different look next week".
And then I remember the number 2 seed, a week off, and a home divisional game was sitting on the table and I don't like that approach to yesterdays game at all.
Still bitter. #tacklesomeonetramon
And then I remember the number 2 seed, a week off, and a home divisional game was sitting on the table and I don't like that approach to yesterdays game at all.
Still bitter. #tacklesomeonetramon
quote:Originally posted by Grave Digger:
What's more likely, Capers played a vanilla gameplan or Christian Ponder beat the Packers because he's just that good.
Sometimes you have to give an opposing team some props. Ponder made some great throws yesterday, and on a couple of throws just got really really lucky that the balls bounced their way. 99 times out of 100 Ponder isn't going to play as well as he did yesterday, but give him some credit, he made some very good throws at some critical times.
Ponder is a different player in that dome than he is on a cold day at Lambeau as I think we'll see this coming weekend. They surprised a much better 49ers defense at the Metrodump this year as well.
Sorry guys I'm not buying the "this defense sucks" mantra. Capers didn't throw the playbook at the Vikings, he was very conservative. The execution was poor definitely, but I don't think they were looking to give anything away that they didn't have to. They weren't giving the game away, not at all what I'm saying, I don't think they showed all their cards though.
As far as Ponder, he came into the game with a 75 rating, 15 TDs, and 12 INTs to his name and leaves with 3 TDs and a 120 rating? Again, what's more likely, something clicked and he finally found his game or the Packers were playing soft (both scheme wise and execution wise)?
As far as Ponder, he came into the game with a 75 rating, 15 TDs, and 12 INTs to his name and leaves with 3 TDs and a 120 rating? Again, what's more likely, something clicked and he finally found his game or the Packers were playing soft (both scheme wise and execution wise)?
What's more likely to me is the gameplan was to sellout against the run to stop AP from beating them and it didn't work.
I suggested yesterday as kind of a joke to replace Tramon with Bush against the Vikings for no other reason than run support. The more I think about it, why not? Bush would be a significant downgrade in pass coverage but the guy is aggressive and tackles. Minny's game plan next week will be the same. Run AP until they prove they can stop it... and then run some more. Does anybody else think the X4 fan base are the only ones that saw Tramon running away from contact? If I'm Minny, I find #38 next week and run at him all day long.
I'm probably still a bit angry though and not seeing things clearly at the moment.
I suggested yesterday as kind of a joke to replace Tramon with Bush against the Vikings for no other reason than run support. The more I think about it, why not? Bush would be a significant downgrade in pass coverage but the guy is aggressive and tackles. Minny's game plan next week will be the same. Run AP until they prove they can stop it... and then run some more. Does anybody else think the X4 fan base are the only ones that saw Tramon running away from contact? If I'm Minny, I find #38 next week and run at him all day long.
I'm probably still a bit angry though and not seeing things clearly at the moment.
So angry....I do like your idea of Bush getting involved next Saturday a bit more. You are almost a jeenious.
Bush will bring the pain and lives for the hitting. Sneak McMillen up a bit more too.
Bush will bring the pain and lives for the hitting. Sneak McMillen up a bit more too.
Packers best answer for AP is Desmond Bishop. Which means guys that normally try and avoid contact have no choice but to man up and get involved. Hasn't happened in two games this year. It has to happen Saturday.
I hate rushing only 3 players, and that's something Capers tends to do in big spots. I don't care how many players you have in coverage, if you give any QB all day to throw, he'll eventually find an open receiver.
How can anyone say this game was meaningless? And if the coaches felt that way, why play their starters and risk an injury? Does anyone think the Packers didn't want/need a first-round bye given all the injuries?
Yeah, the Packers played vanilla on purpose because now they have the Vikings right where they want them.
Going into this game, I thought the Packers would have stacked the box against Peterson and manned up on their receivers, daring the Vikings to beat them with the pass.
Yeah, the Packers played vanilla on purpose because now they have the Vikings right where they want them.
Going into this game, I thought the Packers would have stacked the box against Peterson and manned up on their receivers, daring the Vikings to beat them with the pass.
quote:Packers best answer for AP is Desmond Bishop.
Also Nick Perry. Still in infancy as pass rusher but the kid is really able to set the edge.
quote:Originally posted by Sep:
How can anyone say this game was meaningless? And if the coaches felt that way, why play their starters and risk an injury? Does anyone think the Packers didn't want/need a first-round bye given all the injuries?
Yeah, the Packers played vanilla on purpose because now they have the Vikings right where they want them.
Going into this game, I thought the Packers would have stacked the box against Peterson and manned up on their receivers, daring the Vikings to beat them with the pass.
Agreed. It would be indefensible if Capers (or M3 for that matter) held anything back yesterday that could have changed the outcome. Also, if there is any offense in the league you don't need to hide anything it's the Vikings.
How stupid of me, of course Christian Ponder is headed for Canton. That has to be what happened.
He's not going to Canton, I'm sure of that. But he is an NFL quarterback that gets paid play football just like everybody else. While he hasn't set the world on fire, he has played pretty good football over the past month... and why not? Every team that lines up against Minny plays the run, which sets up very favorable pass coverage. If you can stop AP with a 7 man front, you can kick the hell out of Minny. The problem is most teams have to bring 8 or 9 guys in the box just to give themselves a fighting chance.
I know you realize it is possible for somebody to have a "good" game. He had a decent one yesterday but that tipped pass, the inexplicable Jennings miss of the TD pass to Jenkins and Hayward in no man's land are the three plays that made the game "good" for Ponder instead of typical.
How in the F did that tipped pass over the middle get completed????
I blame Tramon.. why not?
I blame Tramon.. why not?
The tipped pass wouldn't have been completed if the Packers had a TO available to challenge.
It wasn't completed. It hit the ground. But MM cound't challenge it. And he couldn't challenge it becasue of Tramon Williams!!!
Still bitter. #ducttapethatvaginetramon!
Still bitter. #ducttapethatvaginetramon!