Official Packers 2025 Off-Season Thread

Sidetrack:  There seems to be more consternation about the Packers going into this offseason than last.

2024: Team and Love surprised and looked ahead of schedule, nearly reaching the NFCCG.  Lot of excitement about the WR group.  Lot of excitement about anticipation for a DC change.

2025: Team won more games but didn't finish strong.  Love and WRs were very up and down, mostly down at the end of the schedule.  Defense was refreshing, despite the holes in the roster.  Jacobs and McKinney made huge impacts as welcomed FA additions.

Feels like there are more questions than a year ago.  Can MLF improve as HC and play caller?  Can WRs take a step forward?  Can Gute improve the roster in all the places it needs it?  Can Love get back to his late 2023 form and stay closer to that level?

There also is a sense that our standing in the NFCN and (NFC overall) is more in doubt than it has been in a very long time.  DET and MIN may be in for a down year in 25 but many thought the same thing last offseason.  They both have a good infrastructure in place now and will remain a tough out for the foreseeable future.  Then there is the Bears.  It seems no matter what they do they fall on their faces.  But this latest iteration looks like it will be in a better position than it has been as long as we can remember.

cmoun, man, this amerika - it's money all the way down, nothing else matters

money is speech, money talks, money money money

people?  who gives a fuck

Per Rap:

#Bucs DL coach and run game coordinator Kacy Rodgers is interviewing today with #Packers coach Matt LaFleur for their open D-line position, sources say.

Rodgers' contract in Tampa is up and he’s viewed as a top free agent assistant who will have a robust market.

Don't look now, but the Commanders have a 5 year window with Daniels. Who had them on their bingo card? Could be a Seahawks type run. That's all we need.

Well 31 other teams were not put here to tickle GB's fancy.

@Tdog posted:

cmoun, man, this amerika - it's money all the way down, nothing else matters

money is speech, money talks, money money money

people?  who gives a fuck

Did you just rewatch Magnolia?

@DH13 posted:

There also is a sense that our standing in the NFCN and (NFC overall) is more in doubt than it has been in a very long time.  DET and MIN may be in for a down year in 25 but many thought the same thing last offseason.  They both have a good infrastructure in place now and will remain a tough out for the foreseeable future. 

We'll see. Detroit has Jahmyr Gibbs and that O-Line..once their defense gets healthy, maybe. We'll see with a new coordinator - it's going to be a brand new year in 2025 for the Lie-Downs.

I told you they were going to lose. I just thought it would be to the Packers, not the Redskins.

Vikings gonna Viking. I thought they would choke in December but it took longer than usual. Their last 2 games were not an anomaly. I imagine Darnold lost Millions of $$$ with his last 2 games. McCarthy will start. Watch & see what happens with Darnold.

I think Washington has the infrastructure in place plus the QB (if he stays healthy) to continue being a tough out.

DET could very well have a drop off but it's not like they're cleaning house on all the coaches.  They have a system in place on both sides of the ball, overseen by Campbell.    I'm sure they'll keep those systems and have whoever the best last man standing is after all the defections, run them.  Continuity is key with success.  You have to wonder though if DET is looking at Goff right now the same way LAR looked at him right before dealing him.

WAS/Daniels is the girl with the curl right now.  Even if they ride this surge all the way to the SB, let's see what happens after defenses have an offseason to adjust.  We all thought GB was in the first year of a dynasty in 2011.

Favre redux update:  I just saw an article last week suggesting MIN is the best next stop for AR.  Forgot to grab it and post a link.  I don't think KOC will see him as the answer either, especially if they don't improve the OL.

https://packerswire.usatoday.c...tor-for-dl-coach-job

The third known interview in the Green Bay Packers’ search for a new defensive line coach is former Chicago Bears defensive coordinator Eric Washington, according to Jonathan Jones of CBS Sports.

The Packers are looking for a new defensive line coach after firing Jason Rebrovich. Other reported interviews for the job include New York Jets defensive line coach Aaron Whitecotton and Tampa Bay Buccaneers defensive line coach Kacy Rodgers, two other experienced line coaches.

Hope 1 of them can pull some magic with Van Ness

CHI's biggest weakness on D was their IDL.  I don't know if that was Washington or lack of talent on the roster.

I also think the Washington has the core of players there to be dangerous and they have finally gotten the stank of Dan Snyder off that franchise and are well run now.  My biggest concern if I was that team is can, they continue to let Daniels run so much?  He is listed at 6' 4" and 210 but he looks real skinny to me and the NFL will eventually start wearing on him if he runs too much.

One thing about Washington people forget he actually got the Falcons to the super bowl before choking the game away to NE. So I do think the guy can really coach so their window may be wide open going forward.

As for the Lions, they have lost both their OC and DC so far this offseason and not matter what kind of organization you have in place that can really hurt them going forward.   I am not sure why I feel that team may have already peaked and could come back to the rest of the team.

As for the spearheads, I really think they had a real good season but I also still think they could fall back fast.  9 of their wins were by a touchdown or less and i think the odds are against them to repeat that.  They also were very healthy this year and sold their soul to the devil to get the year they managed to get out of Darnold.

As for the DL coach all I want is a guy who can keep getting them better against the run and somehow get them to be better pash rushers.

@The Heckler posted:

One thing about Washington people forget he actually got the Falcons to the super bowl before choking the game away to NE. So I do think the guy can really coach so their window may be wide open going forward.

Wha?  This hurts my head.

You mean Quinn got ATL to the SB?  The previous post was talking about CHI DL coach,Eric Washington.

Scratch Kacy Rodgers as the Lions are supposedly hiring him for their DL coach. Rodgers is from Detroit and played at Michigan before starting his pro career.

That sucks.  He was supposedly the hot DL candidate.

For a 27 year old phenom? You kiddin'?

But Mark Davis isn't even this stupid..

A trade pitch that would land Maxx Crosby in Green Bay 🗺️ https://t.co/mBinzakFDk pic.twitter.com/wHZS9VAKOr

— The 33rd Team (@The33rdTeamFB) January 23, 2025

Fantasy football G Ms.

After the Davante deal, I would imagine LAV would either refuse to work with Gute again or seek a higher price.

Regardless, I would send this year's RD1 and probably a mid RD pick in 26 for Crosby.  Just think of Gute trading any one of his RD1 defensive draft picks from recent years.  Not really giving up much.

Good read on how poor Packers WR were this season as a group...

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers...watson-and-receivers

Telling that Jaire was still the second most productive guy even only playing about 1/3 of the season.

@Chongo posted:

Good read on how poor Packers WR were this season as a group...

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers...watson-and-receivers

Reed had three 100-yard games in the first nine games but hit 50 yards just once the rest of the season. In critical road losses to the Lions and Vikings, he caught 1-of-5 targets for just 6 yards.

Of 84 receivers who were targeted at least 50 times, Reed finished 17th with 2.20 yards per route and he caught 8-of-12 contested catches. Of 69 receivers who were targeted at least 10 times on passes 20-plus yards downfield, Reed’s 12-of-15 produced a league-best 80.0 percent catch rate.

Reed was first with a 137.5 passer rating when targeted and ninth with 7.2 YAC per catch. The Packers averaged 0.93 yards more per rushing play with Reed on the field than when he was on the sideline, the best mark on the team and a sign of the eyeballs he draws when he’s motioning all over the formation.

However, only one player had more drops than Reed (10), whose drop rate of 15.4 percent was third-worst in the league behind teammate Dontayvion Wicks and former Packers receiver Allen Lazard.

The second and third paragraphs are the most interesting or puzzling.  Despite having the best passer rating and being in the top tier of so many other categories, he really faded down the stretch.  He had drops but I also remember Love not targeting him as much either.  Did the reduction of targets follow the drops or did defenses start paying more attention to him, resulting in less open targets.

As 2nd year players I'm willing to give them another chance.  They may have all been pressing a little too much trying to prove they were the guy.

@ammo posted:

As 2nd year players I'm willing to give them another chance.  They may have all been pressing a little too much trying to prove they were the guy.

My worry is that it's going to be even worse next year. None of these guys are making anywhere near big money yet (other than maybe Watson and Reed). If these guys end up as just depth chart pieces in free agency for other teams, they aren't going to be in the league for long, and this is probably the only chance they have to make money in their lives.

Last year this is what the salaries were in the WR/TE Group. The entire group of 9 guys made a cumulative 12 million. There were 23 WRs and 11 TEs making more than that by themselves last year (including Allan Lazard at 13 million).

They'll all bump up 15-20% just for next year just based on the way the contracts are structured, but it's still relatively peanuts.

The main goal of all of these guys (which would be my goal too) is to get a second contract that sets them up financially for the rest of their lives. 1 million a year is a lot of money, but if you only get it for 3 years, it will run out pretty fast if you have to go find a job making 50K a year.

These guys all want the Allan Lazard type contract. Watson was in line to get something like that before the injury (at least an MVS like deal - 3 years, 30 million), and Reed was trending in the right direction but his crappy play the last two months put him back into #3 or #4 WR money on the open market.

Heath, Melton, Wicks, and Doubs are just as likely to be out of the league in 2 years as they are to get a second contract any more than a one year deal.

Watson 2.5 million

Reed 1.6

Doubs 1.1

Wicks 990K

Heath 915K

Melton 915K

Musgrave 1.9 million

Kraft 1.3

Sims 915K

Having all these young receivers seemed like a blessing at this time last year, but feels like a curse right now. IF Watson stayed healthy and he is your #2 Reed #3, Doubs #4 , you have an excellent group. But with Doubs, Reed, and Wicks as your 3 best you are probably at the bottom of the league. Gutey has to bring someone in from Free Agency.

Trade: cooper Kupp for Jaire.

thoughts?

Like Jaire, some injury concerns with Kupp. Out of a possible 51 games from 2022-2024, Kupp has played in only 33 games. That includes missing five this past season due to an ankle injury.

Doubs IMO should be very careful.    As the old commercial said, a brain is a terrible thing to waste.

@YATittle posted:

Trade: cooper Kupp for Jaire.

thoughts?

Why would the Rams want to trade him? He and Nacua are a great tandem.

Watson won't be fully ready till 2026 season...they can talk all the bullshit they want about "he's ahead of schedule," blah blah blah. It takes 9 months just to go through and recover from the surgery. I have seen plenty of ACL injuries on soccer players who go to the top guy in the world on ACL's...Dr Ramon Cugat in Barcelona. There is no one better at ACL repairs than him...technique and stem cell therapies put guys way ahead of schedule. I haven't seen anyone come back to full fitness in anything less than 15 months.

Assuming CW is getting the same level of care in the USA, I don't care how hard of a worker he is...he's not getting back to full speed in 12 months.

They can trot him out there all they want...he's just not gonna be the same till 2026 season.

Reed has a lot of career left in front of him. Davante had a poor 2nd season, but it was later revealed he had an ankle injury he dealt with the whole season.

Doubs...concussions are bad things to be prone to getting. They can put him through all the recovery they want, hyperbaric, cutting edge stuff. And maybe that will be enough...but he gets another one or two...he'd probably best call it a career. He may be one of those dudes prone to getting them.

Wicks, Heath and Melton were all project guys anyway...if you hit on one of them as a great #3 WR, you were  playing with house money.

If Gutey is serious about competing for the SB in 2025, they are gonna have to dip the toe into the FA market, or trade. You're not gonna be an explosive offense with Reed, Jacobs and Kraft...they are essential guys to be certain, but you are trying to win a race with only 3 wheels without at least one quality WR.

@FLPACKER posted:

Having all these young receivers seemed like a blessing at this time last year, but feels like a curse right now. IF Watson stayed healthy and he is your #2 Reed #3, Doubs #4 , you have an excellent group. But with Doubs, Reed, and Wicks as your 3 best you are probably at the bottom of the league. Gutey has to bring someone in from Free Agency.

The fact that not a single one of the WRs seemed to improve at all is the most puzzling thing. Is it coaching? Or they just weren't ever going to be that good to begin with? A combination of both?

@Chongo posted:

Watson won't be fully ready till 2026 season...they can talk all the bullshit they want about "he's ahead of schedule," blah blah blah. It takes 9 months just to go through and recover from the surgery. I have seen plenty of ACL injuries on soccer players who go to the top guy in the world on ACL's...Dr Ramon Cugat in Barcelona. There is no one better at ACL repairs than him...technique and stem cell therapies put guys way ahead of schedule. I haven't seen anyone come back to full fitness in anything less than 15 months.

Well, maybe Cugat ain't that great if takes 15 or more months.

According to most research, the average time for an NFL player to return to play after an ACL injury is 9 to 12 months.

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

The fact that not a single one of the WRs seemed to improve at all is the most puzzling thing. Is it coaching? Or they just weren't ever going to be that good to begin with? A combination of both?

Was it the WRs, or the QB though? Or a combination of both?

The 2025 season will answer so much, but we may not like the answers.

I think we were fooled a bit in that when the passing game was really humming in the second half of last season, guys were schemed wide open. I don't know this, but were many of the catches made as a result of winning a one-on-one, or a great play on the ball? In other words, how many catches were made that any other average NFL receiver wouldn't have made? I do think the WRs are what people thought they were coming out of college, other than Watson, who's obvious injury problems and some difficulty with body control have stunted his development.

   If the WRs were good enough last season, why weren't they this season, when they were essentially the same guys. It speaks more to scheme, play calls, DC's figuring us out,  Jordan Love, or Watson's absence? One of the things that was different was us going a lot more shotgun. Initially it seemed they did this because of Love's injury, later it seemed that MLF decided it fit with Jacobs running preferences better.

    If Watson hadn't gotten the ACL injury I think I could have lived with the current group, or a rookie or 3-4 type vet added to it, but now we need a top level vet there. In addition, MLF has to figure out what went wrong with the passing game in the last month.  

@D J posted:

Well, maybe Cugat ain't that great if takes 15 or more months.

According to most research, the average time for an NFL player to return to play after an ACL injury is 9 to 12 months.

https://www.google.com/search?...trn+from+acl+%2B+nfl

Of course "return" and "be exactly the same" could be different things.  

@FLPACKER posted:

Of course "return" and "be exactly the same" could be different things.  

If you can play, most are 100%, or we'd see many re-injured players.

@D J posted:

Well, maybe Cugat ain't that great if takes 15 or more months.

According to most research, the average time for an NFL player to return to play after an ACL injury is 9 to 12 months.

https://www.google.com/search?...trn+from+acl+%2B+nfl

Heck, Xavier Cugat could do better.

@Fedya posted:

Heck, Xavier Cugat could do better.

"Cuchi-Cuchi"

@Chongo posted:

...He may be one of those dudes prone to getting them...

A "Paper Head".

Legend has it that Jim Marshall of the 70's era Vikings was one.
If it began snowing, teammates had to make sure he put his helmet on before a flake knocked him out.

Adrian Peterson tore his ACL on Christmas Eve 2011.  He played ALL 16 games in the 2012 regular season and rushed for over 2000 yards. I would imagine surgery and rehabs techniques are even better in 2025. I wouldn’t rule out Watson playing and being effective at some point during this upcoming season.

Oh, and another example of recovery is John Ross. While he missed a college season due to his ACL injury, he came back and set the Combine record in 2017 in the 40 (which lasted until last April).

I went back and looked at NFL.com combine reports on Watson, Wicks, Doubs, Reed, and Heath. Watson was projected as a 3rd or 4th WR....the others "average backups".

McGinn and Co. did their annual "NFC North All-Star Team", including specialists.

Green Bay had ONE starter: Elgton Jenkins at LG.   (McKinney lost out to Joseph and Branch, Jacobs to Gibbs)

This season also put them in a hole, record-wise, against Campbell and O'Connell.

I don’t know who the hell these sportlite360 guys are but if this is legit, it raises some pretty big flags about Jaire Alexander. https://sportlite360.com/break...m1-amIoXVeAHyWYvaPow

Anyone else seeing this?

Im guessing that’s his suspension from 2023

Oh never mind, it’s satire

@Chongo posted:

Good read on how poor Packers WR were this season as a group...

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers...watson-and-receivers

You could summarize the article up, by 1) talking about injuries to key players, in Watson and Doubs and their availability for next season. 2) the amount of dropped passes GB had to endure from all of their receivers. The drops also negatively affected Love, whose numbers, of course, went down with each dropped pass.

Scott Tolzien the Cowboys QB coach is reportedly leaving Dallass. Wonder if MLF would have any interest since Clements retired?

"Ian Rapoport of NFL Media reports that quarterbacks coach Scott Tolzien is set to leave the team. Tolzien’s contract is up and his next stop is not known."

Meh.....

https://packerswire.usatoday.c...rs-from-2024-season/

@RoyalWulff posted:

I don’t know who the hell these sportlite360 guys are but if this is legit, it raises some pretty big flags about Jaire Alexander. https://sportlite360.com/break...m1-amIoXVeAHyWYvaPow

Anyone else seeing this?

Okay, I should have looked at this more closely before posting. Looks like a total BS website. I don’t know why anyone would even bother operating a website of such total nonsense.

Go about your business, folks. As Frank Drebbin once said, “nothing to see here, nothing to see here.”