Thanks a lot, NFLPA.

Based on what has been reported, there are a few differences from then and now. (Then) Big hit, sound football, cause turnover - player on player incentive. (Now) Big hit, sweep the leg, knock the player out of the game - coaches involved.


Not saying what was done in the 90's is/was okay, just noting the differences as I understand them.

One thing that is vastly different is that in the 90's I remember really clearly the Packers won a defensive struggle with somebody (9-6, 12-7 some very low scoring game) and it was early in Whites tenure here and he is being interviewed after the game and he says smiling that Sara (his wife) was going to be mad at him becaause she was going to have to break out the checkbook to reward a couple of guys for great plays!

So the Saints contention that they didn't do anything wrong, maybe the players have a case, but for the coaches to get involved I do see a difference but only for the staff not the player
Pack88

another difference is that if the league told Wolf and Holmgren to knock it off they would without question. The Saints on the other hand when told to knock it off kept thumbing their noses at the league. If they would have stopped when they were told they would have been fine and we would have never heard the word bounty except on TV commercials for the quicker picker upper. But they didn't. Saints since Katrina act like a lot of the people that live in New Orleans. They feel entitled to do whatever they want and whenver they want.

The fans are so blatantly biased to this and fail to realize the fact that this was punitive because they did not quit when told. They can claim mistreatment from Goodell from now till Jesus comes but that franchise deserves every bit of what that has happened to them.

Man I am from the old school. As far back as pop warner football when I played in the early 70's you were rewarded for snot slobbering hits on defense. You played mean and tough the whole time I played through high school then on various military bases I was on in the states and Europe. I almost can’t watch the game today, the hit Mosses (sp?) had this past week was text book how it should be done. The media will turn the NFL into flag football before long. Why do the players get paid so much money? Because it is a tough sport, don’t like it go get a job at Walmart. This may not be the spot for me ranting and raving but I love defensive football and its being removed one hit at a time.

quote:

but I love defensive football

I feel your pain. same here.

The other big difference from then and now is coach involvement and the salary cap. Greg Williams, being a coach and representative of the organization, giving a player $5,000 is A LOT different than a player like Reggie White giving a guy $5,000. The team can't pay a player over what is contract requires because it has salary cap implications. That's the point of the salary cap, the NFL regulates every cent these players are getting. That's the part the league hates about these "pay for performance" or "bounties", they can't control the extra dollars being thrown around. In '93 or whenever, there was no cap and so it didn't matter how much each player was getting. When was the salary cap instituted, '96? That's the difference between 1994 Reggie White giving $5,000 for big plays and Greg Williams giving $5,000 for big plays.

The ironic thing about all these "pay for performance" systems is that every team in the league participates, they even build it into their contract. I read an article after Bounty Gate broke about this and they used I think Ahmad Brooks (OLB - 49ers) recent contract as an example. It had all kinds of stipulations and incentives about certain Sack numbers giving/taking away X amount of dollars if he does/doesn't achieve X amount of Sacks in a season. It's like that with every team. That's pay for performance. What's the difference between the team giving X amount of dollars for X amount of sacks and Jonathan Vilma paying X amount of dollars for X amount of sacks? The difference is that the team doing it is on the books so the owners can track the money.

Vilma et al weren't paying for sacks, but for taking players out of the game.

Allegedly

Sorry, Moses did not make a textbook hit. Textbook tackle is head up, shoulder to the chest, drive the hips through the play (commence the jokes on that line), and wrap up the arms. Moses did not drive through the tackle by moving his feet and driving the hips, he left his feet and shot himself forward like a missile. He did not wrap his arms at all. He missed the chest entirely. He also dropped his head. These are things my high school coach would have yelled at me for that. Dropping your head increases that chance you miss and increases the chance of injury to the tackler. Not wrapping up means you aren't able to control that ball carrier. Leaving your feet sure helps make the tackle look awesome, but once you leave your feet you have giving up any chance of adjusting to the ball carrier. That was a bad tackle.

quote:

Originally posted by packman15:
I almost can’t watch the game today, the hit Mosses (sp?) had this past week was text book how it should be done.

Exactly what I said when it happened, and I knew it would be flagged. Goodell ripped up that old text book, packman15. Too bad. It was the big hits that drew me to the game in the first place. The game really is a lot less enjoyable these days.

quote:

That was a bad tackle.

I respectfully disagree.

Now, Perry's tackle of Luck was a good textbook tackle....and look how that worked out for him.

quote:

Originally posted by packman15:
Man I am from the old school. As far back as pop warner football when I played in the early 70's you were rewarded for snot slobbering hits on defense. You played mean and tough the whole time I played through high school then on various military bases I was on in the states and Europe. I almost can’t watch the game today, the hit Mosses (sp?) had this past week was text book how it should be done. The media will turn the NFL into flag football before long. Why do the players get paid so much money? Because it is a tough sport, don’t like it go get a job at Walmart. This may not be the spot for me ranting and raving but I love defensive football and its being removed one hit at a time.

You and me, Bro. NannyFL is happy happy happy the ladies like it.

quote:

Originally posted by Hungry5:
Vilma et al weren't paying for sacks, but for taking players out of the game.

Right. As we have now learned, a "cart off" is slang for a big hit.

And big hit is slang for the QB broke a nail.

Just because the idiots in the booth said he "launched" doesn't make it reality. He hit the guy with his arms extended. No helmet involved. Just another crap call. The pussification continues.

quote:

The game really is a lot less enjoyable these days

It wasn't a textbook tackle, but it surely was an effective one!

As much as I agree about the games being pussified over the years, I also bemoan the lack of said textbook tackles.
As football athletes became bigger and realized that just making contact can knock a player down or out of bounds, tackling became all about the collision and technique be damned because you can't argue with the results.
And the players are right--but only to a point. They can't (or won't) realize that, over the long haul, following sound technique will produce more tackles. And I doubt those techniques are likely to return. Sad.