AJ Hawk: Makes 2013 All-Dissapointment Team

Hawk bashing gives pasty white boys street cred

I buy that he's been playing different.  I talk about when he tackles the front of the ball carrier and when he tackles them from behind.  Maybe that is a scheme thing (when Clay is out, they ask him to be more conservative), but it seems odd to me that they would stop asking him to do what seemed to make him have more of an impact on defense.  It is true he hasn't been beaten out, but I think that has been because he's only been challenged by an ER unit.  I do think he sets the defense, but after last week, than might not be a plus.  I also think guys figure out how to set defenses, there are usually two guys on every team in the NFL doing this.  I would guess if Hawk was replaced, someone else would figure out how to set the defense. 

I appreciate the dialog, thank you for explaining you position.

Jody- stop being a pussy and grow some balls. 

...but don't grow your balls too big, it may shorten your life according to a recent study.

so take steroids

you will live longer

I was thinking AJ has been more aggressive (less conservative) when Clay was out, except for the last game.

With pimples...

Everyone knew and said the Packers had to draft a linebacker with their 1st selection in the 2006 draft. Everyone.  So I looked up the stats of all LB drafted in rounds 1 & 2 in 2006 which is 10 players.  Most have played in about the same number of games with Hawk, Chad Greenway, Demarco Ryans and Dquill Jackson leading the way. Only 2, Greenway with 829 and Ryan with 825 have more total solo and assisted tackles than A.J with 781.  Jackson is 4th with 762. All others have 600 or less. 

Sacks, Kameron Wembley has 49.5, Manny Lawson has 19, A.J. is next with 16.5.  Greenway is next with 13.  And as for Wembley he was a LB in college but is a pass rush DE in the NFL.

Passes defensed. Ryan has 31, Thomas Howard has 29, A.J. next with 27, Greenway is next with 26.

Forced fumbles. This is A.J.'s  downfall. He only has 2. Wembley leads with 9. The other 9 have 5 or more except Bobby Carpenter who has 0.

And as far as the number of teams they have played for A.J., Greenway and Jackson are still with their original team.  Ernie Sims is with his 4th, Wembley and Lawson are with their 3rd team.   Carpenter is out of the NFL already.

You can make the argument that maybe the Packers should have drafted Vernon Davis, Haloti Ngata, or even Tamba Hali.  I can accept that. But when it comes to LB only Chad Greenway at #17 and Demarco Ryans, the 1st pick in the second round are as good as A.J.  I can not imagine the whining going on in here if the Packers would have drafted any of the other 7 LB taken in the 1st 2 rounds in 2006.

Wow!  That was some nice data there Ammo!  Good job!

I like Hawk. But lets not get carried away. 

when compared to other crappy players, AJ does stand out firmly in the middle

Not getting carried away, just pointing out the Pack could have done worse with any of the other highly drafted LB. And also remember the 1st Lb taken in the 3rd round was Abdul Hodge. Think about that.

So now it's Capers that isn't allowing Hawk to be more aggressive?  I haven't seen excuses like this for a Packer since Favre.  

When you look at the list it's pretty accurate I think with the exception of Hawk and Tramon Williams.

The reality is that both guys are playing better this year than they have in the last couple of years but overall they've been disappointing for different reasons.   Back in 2010, Tramon Williams was on the upswing and then he got hurt the following year and has never returned to that 2010 level of performance.   Hawk has never lived up to the hype but he's been improved this year sans the Chicago game.

I know a lot of us have bashed both guys but they are who they are as players.   Sure, they can be starters in this league, but neither guy is a difference maker and I think at some point soon (maybe next year) they will turn the page on both guys.   Put it another way- House and Hyde haven't played any worse than Tramon, and guys like Palmer and Mulumba and Lattimore have stepped in and made plays as well.   Making matters worse is that Tramon and Hawk are making big $$$ so in theory you expect more but it's not happening.  

It wasn't a slam dunk that GB had to take a linebacker in that draft. VD, like you pointed out, was a viable option...D'Brickashaw Ferguson could have been justified at the time too. If Reggie Bush or Mario Williams fell to #5, they would have been no brainer picks at the time.

I've always said this about Hawk : If he were picked in the late 1st round (Packers usual stomping grounds) there'd be much less talk about his play. He'd be considered reasonable value. Being the #5 pick put expectations in many Packer fans that he'd be a Ray Lewis type of talent...which he clearly isn't. He's been playing the best football of his career this season, last week notwithstanding, but I agree that the Packers could still use an upgrade there.

LB was an area of need and Hawk was widely viewed as a "safe" pick, but there was significant talk about going with VD and the team didn't have to go LB.  That's just the nature of the NFL draft- a bit of a roll of the dice. He's not the expected player at that slot, but he's also not Aaron Curry who's no longer even in the league.

for the record, I couldn't give two ****s where he was drafted at this point.  Those high expectations were tempered through how little he improved year to year for the last 8 years. 

I hope like hell he plays like a madman against Philly. 

Personally, I'd take Hawk over Lewis since I can't stand that murdering thug.

Karlos Dansby agreed to a 1 year deal with AZ paying him $2 million for 2013.

He's top 10 in tackles. Has 3 sacks. Has 10 passes defended (best of any LB), An INT and a forced fumble so far this year. I thought he'd be an upgrade at ILB for GB.

Then again I thought Huff would make a nice upgrade at S too...

I want to believe TT knows he can do better than Hawk. And at some point he'll have to. But I'm guessing TT has a priority checklist of needs to address and a guy that's serviceable and available that's not a glaring liability can wait until the bigger issues are fixed.

The top of that 2006 draft was filled with disappointments

Haloti Ngata was the winning pick in hindsight

http://www.drafthistory.com/index.php/years/2006

Mario Williams, Reggie Bush and Vince Young have played on 10 teams between them

AJ clearly isn't special but TT has treated him as if he were; seems reasonable to wonder why and maybe Chilli is right- it just never rose to the level of importance that other spots have

I gotta call BS on that.

There were tons of people who wanted Vernon Davis.

As evidenced with the drafting of AR, I don't think TT ever goes into the draft thinking he HAS to draft a certain position in the 1st round. 

The thing everyone forgets is that Hawk wasn't drafted for the role he's in. He was drafted to play WLB in a 43 D and he did pretty well in that role. Since his switch to ILB in the 34, his numbers across the board have dropped on average. We've seen his ratio of Solo Tackles to Assisted Tackles drop from 3:1 to 2:1. Moving to ILB hasn't been good for his stats which for some people (not singling anywhere her out) is all that matters. 

Actually, I think Hawk is having one of his best seasons as a Packer.

Yup, and VD was a cats whisker from being out of SF he was so awful until Greg Roman got there.

Some of us have failed to measure his heart and grit in our evaluations.

#raiseshand

Because stats always tell the whole story. Charles Woodson only had 2 INT in 2010, bum.

Chuck's BFI was off the charts in 2010,  moron

I wanted Davis &/or Huff in that draft. 

Hawk is like having a coach on the field. I think everyone sees he isn't an impact player including the coaches, however, his communication to the defense plus he's available & accountable. These are the reasons he is still playing.

Is he an impact player? Not even close. Can you win with AJ Hawk & an excellent supporting cast? Yup....

Would be nice to have an Impact ILB. Hawk and Jones get exposed in coverage an awful lot and don't make many explosive plays. In their partial defense, one has to wonder about the scheme when you see one of the NFL 's finest pass catching RB's running free across the middle like last game. That was pathetic.

ILB is still the weakest part of this defense IMO. Once Clay and Perry are back the pass rush should  be better and cover up for weak coverage guys like AJ.

Was refreshing too see Lattimore make splash plays, but who knows if his game will be well rounded enough to be a every down player. Guy definitely seems to be on the rise though. 

Call it BS all you want but it's true.  I remember most of the pundits were saying the Packs biggest need was a LB and Hawk was the perfect fit.  More than 50% of the posters on here wanted a LB too.

I acknowledged Davis, Ngata or Hali were talked about as being a good choice when the Packers drafted.  Without seeing the Packers board you have to assume they had Hawk in the 5th slot or else they would have gone in a different direction.  If TT had Davis as the 5th best and Hawk as 10th he would have selected Davis  no matter how bad the Packers needed an impact LB, which Hawk has not turned into.  A serviceable steady performer that is always on the field, yes. But impact, no.

Latest Michael Rodney tweet...

BTW, his web site seems to be up again.

http://packerupdate.net/

MM on Hawk: "I'm very happy with his game." Ladies and gentlemen, there's 1 of the reasons this D hasn't been any good since the Super Bowl.

Wow, did u just say he has looked pretty good??? I want what you are smoking

It kills me to hear people say he is the quarterback or the guy in charge of communication for the defense. Have you seen the confusion on our D time and time again? Who to blame for that?

Only 9 missed tackles out of 604 play so far this season...hmmm!   Really?  That makes a disappointment?   How many exceptional plays has he made this season?  Probably about the same number.

To be fair, lying underneath an OL and flailing your arms about hoping to trip the ball carrier probably shouldn't count as a missed tackle. 

I know you are being facetious here, but grit is actually 1 of the things I'd like to see in our MLB ... that usually translates into some snot-knocking message making tackles at the LOS and receivers going across the middle. The next time Hawk does that will be one of the first ...

But that's just me, I'd like to see the Packers not leave the impact making plays up to CMIII only ... spread the wealth a little.

I like to call it "Intimidation Re-Distribution".

When hawk sheds a block or causes a turnover, hell froze over.

And opponents smell weakness because they run right at him most of the time.

I'm so sick of watching him get knocked out of plays.

I agree with H5's post on page 1; the author seems to be a bit lazy with some of his picks, and his picks that seem to fit are the most obvious ones.

I agree Weeden has been somewhat a disappointment, and his draft position was horrid, but if Gabbert's actually playing worse, ....he has many more years experience, for heavens sake!

Richardson was a 'good' pick at RB, but Rice was one of his 'lazy' picks.

Ditto for Wallace, and Austin and Little, respectively.

Pettigrew seems a bit lazy at TE. He's filling his role, and I doubt the Lions want to feature him in game plans over Megatron.

I don't know enough of the OL and DL guys to comment on his picks, but there's plenty of disappointment across the league.

Tramon is another lazy pick. While I agree he's not playing nearly as good as he was in '10, he's playing much better this year as opposed to last, both in coverage and tackling.

Which leaves us at LB, and I have no problem saying Hawk is as big a disappointment as any in the league. There have been plenty of posts of his attributes and shortcomings, real or perceived, but the way I see it, a LB has to be able to do something good. They may be good in coverage, they may be a monster at the LOS; some manage to do both. Hawk does nothing well.