@Harry Manback posted:If Saleh gets fired, that would be my first choice.
Saleh doesn't like GB. I'd be surprised if he took them up on an offer, especially to work under a guy he knows is soft as Charmin.
Negatives?
MLF is a complete dipshit. He’s more worried about how he looks on the sidelines than how he prepares and executes. The Packers got schooled today on both sides of the ball. Fuck you MLF. Moron.
Campbell is done. Toast. Buh bye.
Our safeties are fucking atrocious. Ford just sucks. Owens is a try hard guy but no one back there can cover and their instincts are terrible.
Positives?
We have a good WR and TE group and Love made some nice throws today.
Aaron Jones is an all time GBP.
+ With the Jets being eliminated from playoffs today, our 2nd round pick we got from the Rodgers trade almost definitely will be in top 50 and maybe top 40.
- The 3rd round pick from the Bills trade continues to get worse in value as the Bills are starting to play better football.
“MLF is a complete dipshit. He’s more worried about how he looks on the sidelines than how he prepares and executes”.
LOL, yes I’m sure he cares more about his looks than how his team plays. Very wise observation! I hope you’re not driving!
@Packy posted:“MLF is a complete dipshit. He’s more worried about how he looks on the sidelines than how he prepares and executes”.
LOL, yes I’m sure he cares more about his looks than how his team plays. Very wise observation! I hope you’re not driving!
Relax. He's right about the first part.
I mean, if MLF got canned tomorrow would anyone other than his personal stylist care?
This team is a mess right now and they deserve a leader and unifier. That ain’t the eyebrow king.
@ammo posted:Where to start. On a 1st and 10 Van Ness had a 9 yard sack. So it's 2nd and 19 and he is taken out of the game. What the hell? Preston Smith disappeared for 2nd week in a row, he is done. Nixon is the worst DB on the field and since he is not making any returns, cut him tomorrow. Either Alexander plays or cut him, waste of a roster spot.
Because I can be a glutton for punishment when GB loses, I decided to review some situations and the resulting plays: On second-and-7, give up 24. On third-and-4, give up 12. On first-and-10, give up 14. On first-and-10, give up 25. (the latter two on successive plays) On third-and-6, give up a 19-yard TD. On third-and-3, give up 8. On first-and-10, give up 16. On first-and-10, give up 25. On second-and-29, give up 24. (The play after the Van Ness sack.) Total: nine plays, 167 yards in the first half.
Moving on, on third-and-six, give up 18. On third-and-12, give up 15. On first-and-10, give up 22. On second-and-18, give up 21. (after a Clark sack) On second-and-7, give up 22. On third-and-4, give up 11. On third-and-3, give up a 52-yard TD. On second-and-5, give up a 22-yard run (at the 2-minute warning). Total: eight plays, 183 yards in the second half.
All total, 17 plays for 350 yards, an average of 20.5 yards per play. Here's the theme this week by the coaches: we have to stop the explosive plays; one guy out of position; guys not on the same page; guys missing assignments; blah, blah, blah. Blame laid everywhere but on the coaches. SMH.
"We have to stop the explosive plays"
The best thing will be....they will rush 3 and drop 11 to "limit big plays"
Can't wait!!
Amazing how two games changes the season perception and how MLF is viewed as a head coach changes quickly. Maybe relax and realize we’re rebuilding. It’s a process.
MLF is not going anywhere. Regardless of what you think of him, his early success buys him some time with a first time starting QB and the youngest team in the league. Love has progressed to the point where he will be the QB for at least the next several years and hopefully more. Even if a change is made at DC, the secondary has to get fixed. As mentioned elsewhere, I have some concern that 23 not playing more "complicated" than just his shoulder.
Coming into next year, the improvement/development of this team must show promise. Along with this, making the playoffs has to be expectation. If not, MLF will officially be on the hot seat. The complicating thing is who actually has the power to make changes at coordinator and/or head coach.
I'm demanding a win next week. Although the chances are slim, we could get into the playoffs and in doing so beat 2 division rivals. That would be pretty sweet.
@Packy posted:Amazing how two games changes the season perception and how MLF is viewed as a head coach changes quickly. Maybe relax and realize we’re rebuilding. It’s a process.
There's not one single thing to point to on defense that justifies using the rebuild as an excuse. In fact, Barry promised he'd put a defense on the field that would surprise people. And furthermore, this team was supposed to be predicated, in theory, on running the ball and playing defense, so your qb could grow into his role as leader.
Idk that anyone disputes MLF's ability to scheme an offense. That's the job of an OC. He's not the OC. His failure lies within his head coaching ability, or lack of. If we get such trash results on defense with the amount of capital invested, it tells me the rebuild on defense is sinking this ship, and Barry has to go. The regression in two weeks is not being overreacted to. It's who they are becoming, and it's seriously absurd at this point.
@Packy posted:Amazing how two games changes the season perception and how MLF is viewed as a head coach changes quickly. Maybe relax and realize we’re rebuilding. It’s a process.
I am okay with MLF as HC -- except that he is too accepting of poor coaching and preparation by his assistants. Drayton, and now Barry, have flat-out cost MLF and this team several wins. The HC sets the tone and when you accept poor planning and coaching in your assistants, the team follows suit. And you have to be even more aware of that when you have a young team.
I agree, Doc, that he is not going anywhere....but I will also say he is not the right guy to run a team without the benefit of having a HOF QB to make up for his deficiencies. Trying my best to take the higher road and avoid the emotion of a bad loss...but he is soft (beta/pussy - take your pick), his coaches are soft/incompetent, and his team reflects that. We don't have anyone on this team like a Fred Warner or Fletcher Cox or a Charles Woodson that adds some heart and soul to the defense. I think this team has some great potential on offense once they add a bit to the offensive line and running back depth. The defense, however, as some have noted, has never gelled. The scheme is way too soft, giving pedestrian or less QB's like Mayfield, Desmond Ridder, and Tommy Corleone career days. Lafleur doesn't have answers, or the stones to make changes when the problem is obvious to outside observers. His press conferences after a loss are cut and paste" "Gotta give credit to (insert team name). They outplayed us, outcoached us...gotta look at the tape...blah, blah, blah." He's lucky he has a pretty benevolent press corps to deal with - he wouldn't last a minute in NYC or Boston. Never expected much this season, just wanted to see Love and his receivers develop, but the wins over the Lions and Chiefs only got my hopes up. That's why the last two sting so much.
@Packy posted:Amazing how two games changes the season perception and how MLF is viewed as a head coach changes quickly. Maybe relax and realize we’re rebuilding. It’s a process.
Rebuilding his shitty hires? I think most of us understand that the team is young, but the hiring of Joe Barry is inexcusable. And he is far from Lafleur’s worst hire.
@Fandame posted:Because I can be a glutton for punishment when GB loses, I decided to review some situations and the resulting plays: On second-and-7, give up 24. On third-and-4, give up 12. On first-and-10, give up 14. On first-and-10, give up 25. (the latter two on successive plays) On third-and-6, give up a 19-yard TD. On third-and-3, give up 8. On first-and-10, give up 16. On first-and-10, give up 25. On second-and-29, give up 24. (The play after the Van Ness sack.) Total: nine plays, 167 yards in the first half.
Moving on, on third-and-six, give up 18. On third-and-12, give up 15. On first-and-10, give up 22. On second-and-18, give up 21. (after a Clark sack) On second-and-7, give up 22. On third-and-4, give up 11. On third-and-3, give up a 52-yard TD. On second-and-5, give up a 22-yard run (at the 2-minute warning). Total: eight plays, 183 yards in the second half.
In total, 17 plays for 350 yards, an average of 20.5 yards per play. Here's the theme this week by the coaches: we have to stop the explosive plays; one guy out of position; guys not on the same page; guys missing assignments; blah, blah, blah. Blame laid everywhere but on the coaches. SMH.
Glad I missed the game.😳😢
While things look bleak right now all is not lost.
The Vikings could well lose out, (Lions, Packers, Lions). Makes them 7-10 and out.
Packers win out. Makes them 9-8 and 7-5 in conference games.
Rams are H with Saints, @Giants, @ San Fran. They go 2-1, are 9-8final and 7-5 conference. But Packers own head to head tie break.
Falcons go 3-0, that gives them 6-6 in conference, Packers eliminate them based on conference record. However they play at Bears and Saints Chances are they lose one of those and finish 8-9.
Saints have 3 tough games, @Rams, @Tampa and home to Falcons. Even if they go 2-1 it makes them 6-6 in conference, Packers eliminate them. If they win all 3 the Packers hold the head to head tie break.
Seahawks. They must lose to Philly tomorrow night. The only conference game they have left after that is @ Arizona on the last day. Even if they win that their conference is 6-6 and Packers move on.
Tampa. They have to win the South.
I think I have all this right. It is going to come down to Packers beating Vikings. If the Vikings win in 2 weeks they will more than likely eliminate the Packers. And the Packers must also beat Panthers and Bears.
I ain’t playing that game.
I wouldn't want to see the team I saw today in the postseason. But I don't think there is much for me to worry about on that front. I think it's more likely they lose out than win out. Most likely I think is one more W somewhere somehow unless Barry has lost the lockerroom.
@Packy posted:Amazing how two games changes the season perception and how MLF is viewed as a head coach changes quickly. Maybe relax and realize we’re rebuilding. It’s a process.
The Packers are rebuilding on offense. The defense, on the other hand, is just an absolute mess, and that starts with the players and the coaching. The defensive backfield is a fucking mess. There's so little talent back there it's infuriating when you consider all the resources poured in to that side of the ball, including the backfield.
How do you mitigate a shitty defensive backfield? Obscene amounts of pressure up front is the best way, but sure, drop everyone and just get body punched all game long.
And with this shitty control structure, who even controls what? Was it actually even LaFleur's choice to hire Barry, or was it some committee thing? They've cheaped out on ST coordinators before.
Speaking of Special Teams, it's usually the depth players that make up the majority of them. Maybe, just maybe, the continued lack of depth is a big reason the Special Teams struggles. The funnel all the best toys into Mamulas, mainly as Coq au Vin for the defense, and leave the offense and special teams to make chicken salad from chicken shit.
Teams are rarely powerhouses at every position, but the well-run ones don't let one become a total void, either. This "youngest team in the league" bullshit has been done repeatedly with "exceeds mediocrity" as a high point even with a HoF QB.
This team has operated for a long time under the "make the playoffs, keep the stands full, churn the roster and pimp the sledding hill" rather than making a real effort to win it all, and without a HoF QB things likely just get worse.
I'm not holding my breath. While it would be good for the kids to experience playing in a meaningful January game and give them another game of experience, it would be even more frustrating to watch the remaining three games with any hope.
I can accept the Packers are rebuilding. I can’t accept Joe Barry can do his part in the project because we’ve seen this shit all 3 seasons he has been here.
MLF is the HC…if he isn’t going to make the corrections it’s time for a new HC.
++ O showing signs of life but MLF struggling to find what works with shift from Dillon to Jones. Love learning how to deal with blitz/pressure. 13+ 11 + 85 shined.
-- D had no adjustments, just chasing down the play after the fact. Bucs WR said they exploited tendencies again and again. Got sacks but let Baker cook up perfect QB rating.
++ Special teams not an issue this week.
-- MLF admits he was out-coached (again) and doubled down on Barry.
I will try to just enjoy last 3 Packer games and not buy into the "playoffs!" hype again.
NFL Week 15:
13 teams with winning record (but only 4-5 really good)
6 teams at .500
13 teams with losing record. (GB 6-8)
Picture of parity.
Put Alexander on IR and if he doesn't like new DC next year trade him to AFC.
@Goalline posted:Rebuilding his shitty hires? I think most of us understand that the team is young, but the hiring of Joe Barry is inexcusable. And he is far from Lafleur’s worst hire.
The hiring of Barry was bizarre. keeping him after last season was criminal. It’s a fireable offense in my opinion.
I like MLF but he’s replaceable. I don’t view Love as having the potential to be a superstar. IMO his ceiling is Matt Ryan level. So I don’t give a fuck if a new OC stunts his development. In fact, trade him for a 1st and bring in a vet QB that can run a new offense. This WR and TE group has skill and could be great with a QB that can make the play in front of him consistently.
Remember how In college, Love had a great Jr year then the next year new OC, new players, new everything and he threw a bunch of INTs?
I don't want to get rid of MLF...not for 2024 anyway....but the defense needs to be fixed like before the start of this season. 🤬
@Blair Kiel posted:I ain’t playing that game.
Ain't no game, simply maths. I know you ain't too good with maths. 
@Boris posted:Remember how In college, Love had a great Jr year then the next year new OC, new players, new everything and he threw a bunch of INTs?
I don't want to get rid of MLF...not for 2024 anyway....but the defense needs to be fixed like before the start of this season. 🤬
I agree on MLF and keeping him around to help JL grow as a QB at least for one more year. Offense has had some struggles this year but it hasn't been the biggest reason for the team's problems. I actually like the job MLF has done on offense considering he hasn't had Watson or Jones for the majority of the season. I honestly like what they are building on offense and I think going forward it will be a lot of fun watching that young offense grow.
The defense? WTF can we even say at this point? There is no physicality to them at all they play soft, are chasing the offense instead of taking the game to them, and my god what is with the hand checking that is supposed to be tackling?
Not sure who can be hired as a DC that can fix that mess but someone needs to be brought in who doesn't have a system of playing Charmin soft and prevent defense the entire game.
@Herschel posted:This team has operated for a long time under the "make the playoffs, keep the stands full, churn the roster and pimp the sledding hill" rather than making a real effort to win it all, and without a HoF QB things likely just get worse.
And the money keeps rolling in
Evita
F LaFluffy and the entire operation top to bottom. It needs flushed.
this is year 4 for love under LaFluff
+++ Kraft and Wicks had solid games for us. Doubs caught a few nice passes and did some solid blocking, especially for Kraft. Love played well, overall. Yeah, he had a fumble. On that fumble he was face masked with no flag thrown. That should have been a 1st down for the Packers, with 15 yards added on. Reed played well but looked like he was hurting. Van Ness and Enagbare played well, when they were on the field. Did Van Ness get hurt?
---- Every receiver and OC, in the League, wants to play against GB's defense. HFA is no longer a concern for opposing teams, coming to Lambeau. Somebody might not get fired.
@Iowacheese posted:F LaFluffy and the entire operation top to bottom. It needs flushed.
this is year 4 for love under LaFluff
That's fine as long as they don't try to bring in a brand new offense. You gotta give Love a chance
I think Barry will be gone after this season. There’s zero justification to keep him. He’ll have had three seasons and that’s plenty of time to prove he’s not capable.
MLF (or whoever) made a poor choice in hiring him but I think he’ll will be allowed one more chance to get it right. It’s easy to want to fire a coordinator after one or two seasons and yes, it sends a message to the team that underperforming won’t be tolerated. The problem with that is you have to find a new, more competent DC, and when a team develops a reputation of firing guys every year or two, it makes potential replacements hesitant to want to coach for your team. It also makes free agents hesitant to want to play for your team when there’s a good chance that they’ll have to learn a new playbook every year.
I also don’t believe that MLF is at all worried about hiring a DC that outshines him. His job will be tied to his next DC hire. He has one more chance to get it right.
@bdplant posted:I think Barry will be gone after this season. There’s zero justification to keep him. He’ll have had three seasons and that’s plenty of time to prove he’s not capable.
MLF (or whoever) made a poor choice in hiring him but I think he’ll will be allowed one more chance to get it right. It’s easy to want to fire a coordinator after one or two seasons and yes, it sends a message to the team that underperforming won’t be tolerated. The problem with that is you have to find a new, more competent DC, and when a team develops a reputation of firing guys every year or two, it makes potential replacements hesitant to want to coach for your team. It also makes free agents hesitant to want to play for your team when there’s a good chance that they’ll have to learn a new playbook every year.
I also don’t believe that MLF is at all worried about hiring a DC that outshines him. His job will be tied to his next DC hire. He has one more chance to get it right.
bdplant, Good post on how you have to achieve a balance between holding coaches accountable and at the same time being able to attract coaching talent and players to come to GB.
As for MFL, and the DC hire or staying the course I think he knows that whatever he decides to do will directly impact his future. He cannot stay the course with the DC and IMHO he desperately needs to find someone who coaches actual defense and not like the current system designed not to lose games.
I hope MLF and Gute and really feeling the heat on how to finally fix that side of the ball. Sometimes I think about how many more games and potential championships this franchise would have had if they you know stopped other teams.
