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@Packy posted:

Packer fan/ Reds fanâ€ĶCongrats to the Brewers again winning the division.  Sure is nice to see the Cards down.  Doubt that lasts long.  Survey , regarding a Reds player who you may hate.  Do you think Joey Votto is HOF worthy or not?  Just curious.  Good luck in the playoffs!

Before Moneyball, probably not. But given the new appreciation for walks, he has a decent chance. I think the comparison that fits the best is Dwight Evans. They'll up with roughly the same career counting stats in terms of total hits and home runs with Evans playing a lot more games. Both walked a lot. Votto has a significantly higher overall OBP because of a better batting average, but Evans has more RBIs. That balances Evans' superior defense. Votto has won a gold glove at first base, but Evans was one of the best defensive outfielders of all time and won 8 gold gloves.

I'd vote for him, but unfortunately, it's tougher for a guy that never played in a major media market.

Here's the stats on Joey Votto's HOF chances. He's right at the standards for an average HOF first baseman.



Black Ink
  Batting - 17 (166th), Average HOFer ≈ 27
Gray Ink
  Batting - 158 (91st), Average HOFer ≈ 144
Hall of Fame Monitor
  Batting - 89 (217th), Likely HOFer ≈ 100
Hall of Fame Standards
  Batting - 42 (145th), Average HOFer ≈ 50
JAWS

  First Base (12th):
    64.4 career WAR | 46.9 7yr-peak WAR | 55.6 JAWS | 5.1 WAR/162
 

Average HOF 1B (out of 24):
    65.0 career WAR | 41.8 7yr-peak WAR | 53.4 JAWS | 4.8 WAR/162

@Blair Kiel posted:

If Donaldson is the asshole this snippet presents him asâ€Ķwe don’t need that kinda player.

IMG_5332

I saw the interview. Rowdy was laughing about it and said Donaldson is a great clubhouse presence. Donaldson said something like, "everybody knows who I am" when someone asked him about greeting the players.

He did say it took Burnes 4 days to greet him when he came over from Toronto. Nothing serious about it.

Last edited by PackerRick

Counsell is gone.  Burnes and Woodruff are gone either in offseason or in 2024.   I get the feel good vibe but this group should feel confident about nothing.  

The bravado of fans is undeserved.  It is the Brewers we are talking about here.

How fitting they play STL.  A team that is out of it but owned their asses for 40 years.

This team plays AZ or a cocky Cubs team in R1 and they are fucked.

This is such a Brewers thing and yes Mark Attanasio can fuck off.  Sell the team to someone that actually cares.  The bad mojo kicking Stearns and Counsell to the curb will bite them in the ass guaranteed.

Last edited by Tschmack

I always thought Counsell would retire as a Brewer because of his roots, including his father working in the clubhouse for years. I just can't see him uprooting from Milw. and going to NY. I wouldn't be surprised if he retired.

The Brewers are definitely getting the Cubs or AZ unless the Marlins or Reds get into the playoffs somehow.

@Tschmack posted:

The baseball gods never forgive or forget.  

A lot of speculation out in last 24 hours about Counsell being done as skipper.   We all know Burnes and Woody won’t stay.  Add in the arrogant bites at the apple narrative and it’s not a good recipe.  Sorry to piss on the parade but the karma matters.

As long as they have Burnes, Woodburn, and Peralta starting games and Williams closing them, they have a chance. Not as much as they would have had Attanasio spent some money the last couple of years to try to maximize this window. He didn't and that sucks.

But I'm going to try to enjoy this last run. I agree Attanasio is going to sell off these guys in the off-season, but at least he took enough crap last year after selling off Hader for almost nothing that he didn't do the same to Burnes and Woodruff this year.

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