Monday morning GM.

--Get something for Flynn, somehow
--Resign Finley to an incentive laden contract
--Get an experienced safety to replace Collins in the free agent market
--Draft heavy on defense
--Thank Clifton and Driver for their services
--Don't resign Bush and Peprah

quote:

Originally posted by lambeausouth:
What do you do?

I'd take the week off.

I'll go first (if somebody doesn't beat me to it. I can be long-winded).

My primary area of concern is the lack of a pass rush. The defense that lost yesterday was essentially the same unit that won the Super Bowl last year, with two notable exceptions-Cullen Jenkins, and Nick Collins. Now, the defense came up with several impact plays against Pittsburgh. You had the first Roethlisberger interception by Nick Collins, and that was returned for a TD. The pick came because of the pressure applied by William Green. You also had the Bush interception, the Clay Matthews forced fumble, etc.

This season, the Packers ranked dead last in defense (yards), and were in the middle of the league in points allowed. They lead the league in takeaways (tying with the 49ers). So, while they often bent, they didn't break every time. Yesterday, they did.

Watching a replay of the game (not the whole thing), there was too much of Eli Manning standing around unharassed, followed closely by a big pass play downfield. The cornerbacks and safeties did not play well, but they didn't get a lot of help.

In my humble opinion, the best way to improve this defense immediately is to find a premier pass rusher. Clay Matthews is an elite talent, and has incredible pass rushing skills. BJ Raji is a fine player, but took a slight step back last year. Desmond Bishop is a great linebacker. But outside of Matthews, nobody gets consistent pass pressure. If Dom Capers is going to dial up blitzes, we need to make sure they hit the quarterback.

So, in my first post as GM, I will be looking at who is available in the draft, as well as free agency, with the goal being to immediately upgrade the pass rush. A strong pass rush can help alleviate some of the issues in pass coverage. A better pass rush means more turnovers, more stalled drives for the opposing offense, and a defense that gets more time to rest.

But who? What about Nick Perry, 6-3, 250 lbs from USC. Junior, top ranked DE in the draft, listed as going #16. What about free agents. What defensive ends/tackles can immediately improve this defense. Who will bring toughness, and a nastiness, with them? What about Robert Mathis of Indianapolis? The Colts had a horrible season, and Mathis is not happy with the lack of a long term deal. He will be 31 years old. 83.5 career sacks, 39 forced fumbles in his career. 4 time Pro Bowl selection.

quote:

Originally posted by YATittle:
--Get something for Flynn, somehow
--Resign Finley to an incentive laden contract agreed, and I mentioned this yesterday. Let him get his money, but make him earn it with on field performance.
--Get an experienced safety to replace Collins in the free agent market
--Draft heavy on defense defensive line, secondary, and I also think we need to look at running back.
--Thank Clifton and Driver for their services Clifton yes. Driver I would welcome back for another season at a reduced rate.
--Don't resign Bush and Peprahamen, brother. Bush is going to want more money. Glorified special teams player. He and Peprah are pass liabilities.

quote:

Originally posted by chickenboy:

quote:

Originally posted by lambeausouth:
What do you do?

I'd take the week off.

Get to work, slacker!

Pass rush is #1 IMHO. Eli was able to stand in the pocket like a statue most of the game under little duress and pick apart the D waiting for a guy to get open. Much of the time it seemed that coverage was required way longer than a receiver would normally need to be covered if there was some sort of pass rush.

Duress makes passers do things quicker and without as much thought which can cause mistakes. I think this is the key to the defenses lack of success this year.

There will be posters on the forum that know a lot more about how the cap works, and what picks we have/how to package them.

But basically, my priorities are:

1.) The aforementioned defensive line help. Pass rush was virtually nonexistent, that has to change. I do not expect the Packers defense of 2012 to be the same incredible unit that we saw in 2010, but I don't want them to play as poorly as they did in 2011.

2.) My next move depends on the health of Nick Collins. A pass rush will help, but we obviously need help in the secondary. Woodson can't play forever, so we need to find another safety that can play corner as well, bare minimum. We might have Woody one more season.

3.) Do we look at running back? I think we should. Ryan Grant, though better late in the season, is not a running back that other teams will fear. James Starks it seems has issues staying healthy, and all the talent in the world cannot justify keeping a guy that can't stay on the field. Saine? Alex Green? What will they give us next season?

quote:

Originally posted by lambeausouth:
3.) Do we look at running back? I think we should. Ryan Grant, though better late in the season, is not a running back that other teams will fear. James Starks it seems has issues staying healthy, and all the talent in the world cannot justify keeping a guy that can't stay on the field. Saine? Alex Green? What will they give us next season?

IMO that is the one area they don't need help in. I'm a firm believer that you don't pay big dough to that position (like TT is) and I really like the threesome of Starks, Saine and Green (Grant will be gone). That position is set even more than QB since Flynn most likely will be gone.

quote:

IMO that is the one area they don't need help in. I'm a firm believer that you don't pay big dough to that position (like TT is) and I really like the threesome of Starks, Saine and Green (Grant will be gone). That position is set even more than QB since Flynn most likely will be gone.

Breaking news.............Hell just froze over

A CB post I totally agree with.

quote:

Originally posted by oldnavy:
I titally agree with.

What a year. And what a shame it ended like that, but I wasn't too surprised -- the defense had major issues all year and late in the season the Packers receivers contracted a major case of "the dropsies."

I agree with the posts thus far regarding the need for another pass rusher. Losing Jenkins to free agency killed the pass rush. Matthews and Raji had down years because offenses could double-team them without a third pass rusher to worry about. In the case of their pass rush, one man really does make a big difference.

Hopefully one year removed from surgery, Mike Neal will be what management had hoped he'd be -- a comparable replacement for Jenkins. That would be huge.

The needs are obvious, it doesn't take a genius. They need a DE, FS and OLB, and in that order of importance. If Neal can be the DE, the possibility of vastly improving in one off-season by "hitting" on one FS or OLB in the draft becomes attainable.

On offense, I'd start looking for another LT.

Regarding the Packers' free agents:

I'd franchise Flynn and try to trade him.

Given Finley's incredibly disappointing season, I'd either resign him to a mid-level contract or otherwise let him walk. He's not the same guy he was before his injury. Thompson is good at finding receivers, I have no doubt Finley can be replaced in a year or two.

Later, Grant. Draft a RB.

Pass rushers are at such a premium that finding a FA with something left in the tank would be like winning the lottery.

I don't know if trades are possible. But if we could trade Flynn, JMF, or Hawk we'd be able to demand quality and still have people with a reasonable proximity to replacing them. Throw in Bush and Peprah if they're tradeable. I'm sick of watching them in the secondary giving up big plays.

IMO, the draft is the only realistic way to go to shore up the defense. I'd go BPA all Defense. And try to find backup OL via the FA or trade route.

It was a GREAT and EXCITING season. See all of you around Draft time.

1) If you believe in a higher power, pray that Nick Collins' career is not over and that he's got a couple more years left.

2) Draft Four Front 7 players in the first 5 rounds. Probably 2 DL, and 2 LB for competition. At the very least, 1 top starter needs to be found that can have an impact for 2012 in the front 7. Hard to do when you're picking as low as the Pack is, but not impossible.

3) 6 years ago, Ted Thompson went out and found Ryan Pickett and Charles Woodson in free agency to help turnaround a poor defense. He may need to revisit that type of free-agency signing again. Pickett and Woodson were more mid-tier free agents that Thompson hit the jackpot on. He may have to hit the jackpot on someone again this year. I don't know if 1 draft can fix all the problems that ail this defense.

4) The Jermichael Finley decision is a tough one. His play this year didn't warrant a franchise tag but there were extenuating circumstances. He had a rough off-season thanks to the injury and the infection he got after the surgery. The lockout did not allow the coaching staff to monitor this guy and he kind of did his own thing.

Perhaps a 1 year franchise tag, being healthy, and having the coaches monitor what he's doing all off-season allow Finley to take the step he didn't take this year. It's a gamble, but he is talented enough, and the other TEs didn't show much of anything. For today, I say the Pack keeps him, but I totally understand if they're ready to bounce him. He was pretty unreliable at key moments this year.

I believe the best way to address team needs is through the draft.

Trades is football are rare as compared to baseball.

FA signings are a possibility. However, the possibility of getting a Reggie White type signing is not all that great. After that the chances of signing a quality starter are 50/50, there is usually a reason--talent or personality--that a guy hits the FA market.

the rosters of 6 years ago and today are totally different, which is why you won't see Ted sign a big name free agent.

Woke up at 4:20 this morning thinking, "We need to retool this defense." Right now, Neal and Wilson have shown us they are backups, nothing more. Walden is probably gone. Jones and Zombo are backups. So'oto is an unknown commodity. DJ Smith can play, but where? Woodson is showing his age -- move him to safety? Peprah is barely a backup and "just a guy." Bush is a special teams player of value, but is less than a backup on D. Tramon had a horrible year; look for him to rebound next year. Shields was solid and steady. Hawk is solid, but never special. Matthews wasn't a stud this year, seems to be nicked up constantly (is this a theme?) and definitely needs someone on the other side to help him. He came up small yesterday.

And what to do about Dom? I don't think he called his best game yesterday. He started with pressure, then got scared out of it despite some success. Instead, he rushed three and we were eaten alive. Any NFL QB given that kind of time will find someone open. And since these "communication issues" have been going on for most of the season, why couldn't he get them straightened out or put someone in who could take charge? That has been worrisome for quite some time now. Maybe he really wasn't into it, maybe he felt he didn't have the guys, or maybe he had a bad year, but he has to be worried about straightening it out.

On O, later, Cliffy, Grant, Driver (hate to lose him and it's only due to age). If we keep Driver, look for Jones to go. Our Oline yesterday did pretty darn well against the Giants, whose Dline is very good. Newhouse held up well. Finley, incentives. Hope Quarless can contribute. Everyone else, think how awful yesterday felt when are tempted to take a day off training.

Here is the full list of Packer UFA's

Matt Flynn
JerMichael Finley
Scott Wells
Ryan Grant
Howard Green
Pat Lee
Jarrett Bush


And the rest of the free agents: Footballs Future

I think we could lose all our UFAs, except Wells. They've been trying to replace him for years, but he just keeps on playing the position too well, luckily.

the law firm of Wells, Fin and Flynn is all that really concerns me.

Wells deserves to get paid based on how he has played the last couple of years, but I am afraid that contract will not pan out for future performance.

Finley is surrounded by as much mythology as fact in Green Bay. Fact is he talks to much and dropped way to many balls *emphasis. Mythology is that he is a locker room problem, an average TE, or that the current crop can compensate for him (Quarless knocks down Jerod Allen and catches a pass and suddenly Packernation forgets he drops more balls than Fin). Essentially Finley played poor enough that the tag is not a sure thing, but the tag is also not to prohibitive to burden the cap. If no tag, I think he is gone. Ted won't sign him for what he thinks he is worth and someone else out there will see what TE's have become in the league and give him big cash. I could see Fin a scenario where Fin is franchised and traded to move up in the draft.

Flynn. I still think he leaves and GB gets draft compensation next year. I don't see the tag coming and some team offering a second round pick for Flynn. I guess you only need one team enamored with him, but I just don't see it. Some team isn't going to give up picks to have him start until a rookie is ready, so that takes out all the guys drafting QB's this year (or last year). That means it needs to be a team that is close but just needs a solid QB to get over the hump. The best match for that scenario is Denver, and I just don't think that will happen.

Wells is going to be an issue. Don't be surprised if he ends up getting the tag. I don't think they have anyone on the roster to replace him.

Miami, El-Ka, for Flynn. Or Jacksonville, possibly even Cleveland which isn't convinced McCoy is the answer. Holmy is there as well, and you can bet he has been keeping an eye on Flynn's development.

I would be OK signing Wells to a 3 year incentive laden deal, but not much more. We just need to draft Peter Konz.

I will say this, and it's a shot in the dark. But as special as Finley could still be, we won a Super Bowl without him, and I think DJ Williams will be a very good TE that actually catches the ball (here's hoping I'm right).

Now that the Wells issue is raised, I would rather franchise him than Fin if it comes down to it. Very good centers don't grow on trees, and I don't think there are any more Pouncey brothers on the way to the NFL.

It's a tough call, but I'm more about protecting Aaron Rodgers than I am making sure one of his many weapons stay.

Now, IF Finley were to go, we're looking at Jennings, Nelson, Jones, Cobb, DJ Williams and the other tight ends. Do we feel that's enough weapons to adequately spread the other team's defense out? If we lose Finley, do we keep Driver for one more year just so Rodgers has one more weapon that knows the offense?

As far as the running back comments go, ok, if you're going to go with those guys, then make sure they're the ones running the ball, and not Aaron Rodgers. Because Rodgers running around and getting hit when the protection broke down/receivers weren't getting open...just scared the piss out of me.

If Aaron Rodgers sustains a major injury running the ball, Green Bay is screwed. We haven't proven that we can win games in other ways. This defense, as it stands now, cannot take a game over, and this running game cannot take a game over.

Packers need to take a broker's advice, and diversify diversify diversify. Rodgers will be the guy as long as he is here, but he cannot win every game by himself. When he is off, for whatever reason, we cannot win...or we will have a damned near impossible time winning. In order to do so, we have to play a perfect game. That means no turnovers like we had today.

Miami is reasonable, but I Jacksonville would mean that they have given up on Gabbert, which NFL teams just don't do after one year. If the Browns and Phins think they are a playoff team with a vet QB and want to go that route rather than waiting for a young guy to develop, they could be possibilities.

I just think that plan requires way to many "what ifs" to work out smoothly. If someone really wants Flynn and fears he won't come via free agency, then a move could happen. I just think the chances are slim.

How do we feel about Randall Cobb's readiness to step up and play receiver full time. If Donald Driver has played his last game as a Packer, then Randall is going to fill the slot position (or maybe Jones).

I don't think DJ will have trouble catching the ball, but unlike Finley, he doesn't prove a matchup problem for any team in the NFL.

Hard to cover and dropped the ball to much this year

-or-

easy to cover and we think he'll make catches.

I think we need this to be TT's best draft ever. We have a lot of holes to fill on D, more than many think we do.

I think we need this to be MM's best call yet on his staff, and to reflect on his own performance in passing, passing, passing...

Think about this: three of the four teams to survive yesterday had strong, strong running games and way-above-average defenses. Those are two things we lack.

Time for Woodson to move to S.

Pass rush help on day 1 and 2 of the draft.

Keep Wells.

Tag Finley and let him earn the big contract under the tag.

Another CB.

Yeah, it is clearly skill at pass rush.

With TT's record drafting DL, maybe this is one time that invites FA (getting a known commodity). Maybe packaging Flynn + more could return a strong pass rushing DL.

I admit to being obsessed with it, but I would also reinforce OL (primarily tackle). If Clifton is gone and Sherrod doesn't pan out, I think it's thin.

The other position is safety, I think.

• Still think it will be very tough to pull off a tag and trade with Flynn. Again, if any GM can do it, its TT, but I'm only expecting a 2013 compensatory pick for his exit
  
  
• As frustrating as Finley's drops are, they will not determine this decision. It should solely be based on the team's opinion of potential vs. price, both of which could be through the roof. And while an incentive laden deal sounds nice for the fans, why would he take that vs. straight up cash from another team? Just for starters, there's a squad here in Chicago who's never afraid to spend money and will need to compensate for the last OC's gutting of all quality TEs. All signs point to the franchise tag for #88 delaying the decision/negotiations for another year.
  
  
• Wells has proven to be the most valuable Olineman this team has. The whispers swirling about throughout the season have suggested the team was trying to work out an extension, but they wouldn't meet on what Wells thought market rate was. I see this playing out very similarly to Cliffy a few years back where they let him test the market, but ultimately bring him back.
  
  
• Cliffy hangs 'em up and goes out a fan favorite. At worst, the team can win with Newhouse, but I expect Sherrod to take that job pending on his recovery.
  
  
• Driver is a very tough call if he still wants to play. On top of all the intangibles and locker room stuff, he showed yesterday he's still an asset ON the field. My guess is he stays one more year, and the team keeps 6 WR next year with Borel or Gurley fighting it out in camp.
  
  
• The needs on D have been very well covered. The optimist in me sees Neal making a huge leap, Tramon playing better fully recovered from the shoulder and Collins coming back better than ever. That alone probably brings the D back to respectability. But no doubt it will have to be addressed heavily in the draft. Thompson has stated that need can break a tie with BPA, so I think we see the front 7 get some draft attention.

Oline needs a couple of road-graders to open up some running lanes. Bulaga is proving his worth at RT, but we have no interior studs who clear out lanes for our RBs.

D I mentioned earlier.

The Packers defense needs an infusion of new talent. The defense needs help on the offensive line, a better OLB opposite Matthews, and one or two new safeties. Another CB wouldn't hurt either.

In the secondary, Woodson is still one of the best players on the defense, but there has been a noticeable drop-off in play from 2010. Tramon and Shields regressed this year. Burnett shows flashes of ability but still has a penchant for giving up a big play. Bush and Lee are good special teams players, but at this point I don't think either would be a viable starter. Peprah has played admirably, but he is limited.

For OLBs, I think MM was counting on Walden or Zombo stepping up. Perhaps Zombo could still be a solid player, but injuries definitely hampered him. Walden showed flashes of ability, but his arrest at Thanksgiving seemed to put an end to any positive production from him. Brad Jones also has shown flashes, but has also been inconsistent and has struggled to stay healthy. Matthews is a star of the defense, but he can't do it all alone.

For MLBs, Bishop and Hawk are both solid. DJ Smith provides good depth, and Francois has also proven to be a solid backup. Probably the Packers most settled area on the defense.

On the DL, Raji took a step back this season. I think he got worn down, and I still believe his best position is as NT instead of DE. Pickett is still a valuable player, but he is starting to get older and might have a hard time staying healthy as he gets older. At this point, I don't think the Packers can count on Mike Neal, and there is a big drop off after that. Likely the Packers' biggest weakness, IMO.

Of course TT rightfully drafts BPA, so it would not surprise me to see an offensive player taken in the 1st round. Still, I am hopeful some of these areas can be addressed.

- sign Wells, stays healthy and anchors OL
- Finley, incentive based or let him go. Doesn't seem like he and Rodgers are on the same page.
- Find some DL help in draft.
- Let Grant go, grab a RB in draft if there is real value. Still would love to see one real West Coast back that can catch the ball out of the backfield and pick up the blitz.
- Driver gone, consider trading Jones if there is a buyer. TT knows WR and we are loaded.
- Look for a veteran safety in free agency or draft one high. Consider moving Woodson to safety depending how draft/free agency goes.
- Find a ROLB in draft or free agency.
- START SMITH OVER HAWK! I was watching how much better Hawk played in the 4-3 (Giant's 2008 playoff). The inability of him to rush the QB is painful. Good guy but calling the D for the worst defense in the league isn't a plus. He doesn't create turnovers.
- Franchise and trade Flynn. It's too bad Hue Jackson traded the farm for Palmer as the Raiders would have been great trade partners. I just think that there have to be some GM's who will make a move for him versus an unknown rookie in the draft.

My only concern is we will be losing some locker room leaders in Driver, Clifton and Grant...maybe Pickett.

An interesting point made in SI today, that Rodgers said the man-to-man D of the Giants meant he had a hard time finding anyone open. If that's true, then our receivers aren't as good as we thought they were. Either that or they weren't open by three yards so Rodgers could feel safe in throwing to them. When they were wide open, Rodgers missed (see, Jennings, Finley) or they dropped it (see, Finley, Crabtree).

quote:

An interesting point made in SI today, that Rodgers said the man-to-man D of the Giants meant he had a hard time finding anyone open. If that's true, then our receivers aren't as good as we thought they were. Either that or they weren't open by three yards so Rodgers could feel safe in throwing to them. When they were wide open, Rodgers missed (see, Jennings, Finley) or they dropped it (see, Finley, Crabtree).

That is why we need to see Cobb start and play lots of slot. He is too shifty to get caught in bump and run.

I would re-sign:
Scott Wells
J Bush
Finley (make a fair offer)

I would draft:
DL rusher
FS
LB
OT
QB
TE
RB

quote:

Originally posted by Fandame:
An interesting point made in SI today, that Rodgers said the man-to-man D of the Giants meant he had a hard time finding anyone open. If that's true, then our receivers aren't as good as we thought they were. Either that or they weren't open by three yards so Rodgers could feel safe in throwing to them. When they were wide open, Rodgers missed (see, Jennings, Finley) or they dropped it (see, Finley, Crabtree).

Rodgers had open guys and missed them. He missed Jennings on opening drive, he had Nelson open on deep corner in 2nd half and didn't throw him the ball, was stripped sacked when Jennings open for a TD, and the throw to Finley in 3rd quarter. Hit a couple of those TD passes, and game/momentum changes.

Despite everything, opportunities were there and they were missed.

If I'm TT, I remind myself how quickly Wolf's SB winning team started to fall off from the high level it achieved during the 96 and 97 seasons. This is a very competitive league. (Look how quickly Indy dropped off after they played in the SB two years ago.)

I agree with everything covered here: Need talent infusion at all D areas: Last year's D played at a very high level (perhaps higher play level than talent level??) but this year they took several steps back. And perhaps we need to bolster the OL as well.

If Im MM, I will never let my starters rest on the last game of the season. They were flat, and there was no momentum.

-Sign Scott Wells to a four year deal.
-Work something out with Flynn to get an early second round pick from Washington or Miami. Based on what happened with Cassel, this is completely reasonable (even a little conservative).
-Sign Finley to an incentive laden 4 year deal. I think that would be best for both sides. He has the talent, but his performance this year was poor considering where he should have been.
-Sign Lee to the minimum. He reminds me of Bush, but less inept in the defensive backfield.
-Sign a mid-level free agent safety and pass rusher (d-line or OLB). Not a Duke Preston type, but a guy that can be a quality starter. I'd love to rely on the draft, but a reliable safety takes years to develop (even Collins struggled until his 3rd or 4th year).
-Let Peprah, Bush, Grant and Green go. Green was a huge letdown this year. Peprah was flat out awful (not even good enough to be a backup any more). Bush will likely command a raise, which makes him not worth the money. Grant is just ok, and i think Starks, Green and Saine are all better (or have the potential to be better).
-Bring back Driver only if he wants to play for around $1m this year. He played well yesterday and definitely has value, but I expect Cobb to surpass him in the offseason. $1m for your #5 WR is plenty. That, and Gurley will make the roster next year.
-With the first and second pick, take the best DB or pass rusher available.
-With later second round pick, take defensive BPA.
-Remainder of draft, take BPA.