NFC North now the best division for QB's?

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:
In comparing the divisions, that division is better than the NFC North.

What are you comparing, how good they would fare on Family Feud?

Just because Vince Young sucks and Collins is the starter by default, doesn't make him quality QB material. QB rating of 73.8 and one season of over 4,000 yards doesn't make for a stud.

Cutler = 7 = Collins

Cutler has a rating of over 87 plus a 4,500 yard season passing along w/ a 25 and 20 TD season under his belt.

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:

quote:

Romo is the most overrated QB in the NFL. He's at-best a poor man's Favre, but he always seems to choke in big games and seems to love 'the life' more than working.

What are you basing this on? That he dated Simpson? I don't think that's particularly fair. He's been a very productive player. This year will make or break him, though.

I'm basing it on his history of serious choke-jobs in big games, the fact that he's been anonymously taken to task by other players and coaches for not working nearly hard enough and the latest tidbit where the folks at Valley Ranch are telling him to drop some weight. Parcells saw that possibility in him before he left, and if Parcells had stayed in Dallass, I'd bet Romo would be an elite QB right now. If he played for, say, the Ravens or the Texans, he'd be just another average QB with potential who hasn't figured it out yet. He gets his balls washed like he does because he plays for Dallass, is a good guy, makes some crazy plays once in awhile and he's got a good image.

Agreed that this year will make or break him, but I can't see Jerrah getting rid of him if he bombs out. He's not very far into his contract.

quote:

Originally posted by The Artist fka TD:
Come on cop. Music is pure jenyus.

My original comparison was for what I thought they would do in 2009. Let's compare the passer ratings from last year:

Manning: 95.0
Schaub: 92.7
Collins: 80.2
Garrad (see Timberlake? I spelled it right!!!): 81.7

Rodgers: 93.8
Cutler: 86.0
Favre: 81.0
Culpepper: 63.9

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:


Garrad (see Timberlake? I spelled it right!!!): 81.7

Quit now.

OK, whenever I need a spelling lesson, I'll call.

You got leased!

(and at a very reasonable rate)

quote:

Cutler has a rating of over 87 plus a 4,500 yard season passing along w/ a 25 and 20 TD season under his belt.

I'm not comparing their careers. Collins was a big part of why the Titans got as far as they did. I'm not saying he's great in any way- but neither is Cutler. Big arm, but is not proven to be a great QB. I am saying that Schaub is at least an equal.

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:
I'm not comparing their careers. Collins was a big part of why the Titans got as far as they did.

Big part?

The threw a whopping 12 TD's in all of 2008 with a 80 QB rating along with the 27th ranked passing "attack".

The Vikings and T-Jax ranked higher.

A great defense can make a QB look much better than he really is.

The mere fact that Collins only had 4 games with over 200 yards passing is even more staggering.

I'll bet the farm Tennessee won't even sniff 13 wins next year.

Of course the Titans D was the reason they won. But Collins was able to have some success in Oakland in 2004-05 on a BAD Oakland team. He didn't put up great numbers, but he won last year because he kept the team from making mistakes.

Collins out-played Flacco in that game, and were it not for a terible Alge Crumpler fumble and a blown delay of game call on the Ravens' drive, the Titans may have made it to the AFC Title game and who knows. Either way, Collins is a winner. He does enough, and he played well against a very tough Ravens D in the playoffs. I would take a younger playwer over him, but that's not what we're talking about, is it...

quote:

Either way, Collins is a winner.

He's a winner? http://www.pro-football-refere...ayers/C/CollKe00.htm

Is it that glorified 79-85 record you were looking at?

quote:

I would take a younger playwer over him, but that's not what we're talking about, is it

We are talking about best division for QB's. You said you would take a younger QB which would be Cutler but you gave them both 7's.

quote:

Originally posted by chickenboy:
What about Romo, McNabb, Manning and Campbell?

An argument could be made that three of those guys are better than anybody in the North.

Bingo. I second that notion.

quote:

Originally posted by Boris:
That makes 5 divisions!!

What about the CFL East. The Winnipeg Blue Bombers have...

two dumbs don't make a right

quote:

Originally posted by Iowacheese:
two dumbs don't make a right

They make a left.

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:
You really think Rodgers is just about to Manning's level? I love the guy, but I'm not willing to say that.

Yes I do.
90% vs. 100% on your rating scale.
Do you really think Manning will continue to play at a HOF level this season? That offense is starting to take some hits as is Manning.
At the same time Rodgers has every chance to put up even better numbers than last season.

Packer fans recall Schaub just fine.
I think your recall is questionable though. As in do you not remember that Collins was aided by one of the top rushing attacks in the NFL last season? That Garrard is a backup on a team with a halfway decent QB?

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Yuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:
You really think Rodgers is just about to Manning's level? I love the guy, but I'm not willing to say that.

Yes I do.

Put up all the numbers you want but ARodg ain't sniffin' Peyton Manning's level yet.

I know you have a hard time grasping football Chicken but look at the numbers from last season.
The argument wasn't whether Rodgers was a HOF QB who will have a better career than Manning. The argument was concerned with the performance of the QBs in question for the 2009 season.

Manning 2008: Yds: 4008, TD's: 27, Int's: 12

Rodgers 2008: Yds: 4038, Td's: 28, Int's: 13

As their numbers from last season are nearly identical......
Yes I do believe Rodgers will be nearly as good as Manning in 2009.
I suggest you get off MC's nutsack and pay attention.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Yuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Music City:
You really think Rodgers is just about to Manning's level? I love the guy, but I'm not willing to say that.

Yes I do.

Put up all the numbers you want but ARodg ain't sniffin' Peyton Manning's level yet.

Yeah.....I see you've got a real solid grasp on this topic.

Remember.....you aren't required to leave the baseball forum.

BTW....nice edit after I responded.

I never thought I'd see the day when this forum would go from TOG ballwashers to Manning ballwashers.

quote:

Originally posted by chickenboy:
I must say, we Packer fans are the most cocky fans of a 6-10 team that I have ever seen.

- If we were at war, you'd be shot for spying or at least treason ... be a man and tell everyone that your true love is "Purple with the Yellow Braids".

quote:

Originally posted by chickenboy:
What about Romo, McNabb, Manning and Campbell?

An argument could be made that three of those guys are better than anybody in the North.

I wouldn't take any of them ahead of Rodgers.

quote:

Originally posted by trump:
If we were at war, you'd be shot for spying or at least treason ... be a man and tell everyone that your true love is "Purple with the Yellow Braids".

I'm green and gold to the gills but I also know when it's time to shut up and prove it on the field.

Seems like some are taking on the identity of that jabber jaw they just signed from Pittsburgh.

LOL...your knowledge of "shutting up" wouldn't fill your tiny little jock.

Yeah...I had to laugh at the shutting up comment as well.

Music and CB,

Can you tell me which side you two are arguing about. First it's based on last year then you are telling me that Collins is a career winner and Rodgers hasn't reached Manning's level yet. Music claims "Gerard errr....Garrad" had a down year but uses last years QB rating. Then bases Schaub's game against the Packers as his only "evidence" of the guy who is about as durable as Brent Fullwood.


Hmmm.... enlighten me just like you guys do in the Brewers forum since you were the biggest Yost defenders which proved to be just as "floundering".

BTW, Rodgers stats his first year blow away Payton in light years. Chomp on that one.

Rodgers first year:
63.2%
4038 yards
28 TDs
13 Ints
93.8 rating

Mannings first year:
56.7%
3739 yards
26 TDs
28 Ints
71.2 rating

I'd say Rodgers wins.

AR also won twice as many games, as sorry as the 6 v 3 number is. Just for poops and giggles, here is Manning's stat line for his fourth year in the league:

2001 Indianapolis

Rating 84.1
Completions 343
Attempts 547
Percentage 62.7
Yards 4131
TD's 26
INT's 23

I'm certainly not saying AR is in Manning's league yet overall, as he'll need to win an MVP and a SB along with a few other things. However, he's certainly off to a start that indicates he could get there if he stays healthy.

The real measure of a QB is how well he performs when he doesn't have a solid running game or a good defense. When the other team is stuffing the run, can you take over the game and keep your team in it. Rodgers and Cutler did that. They had decent/good games when their teams couldn't run the ball and they kept their teams in the game. Romo couldn't do that, neither could Garrard or Collins.

Not fair, you used facts ...

quote:

I'm certainly not saying AR is in Manning's league yet overall, as he'll need to win an MVP and a SB along with a few other things.

This. He needs to stop slacking and starting auditioning for pitchman jobs.

quote:

Originally posted by Ghost of Lambeau:
Rodgers first year:
63.2%
4038 yards
28 TDs
13 Ints
93.8 rating

Mannings first year:
56.7%
3739 yards
26 TDs
28 Ints
71.2 rating

I'd say Rodgers wins.

Manning took over a 3-13 team. ARodg a 13-3 team. I suppose that doesn't matter however...

quote:

Originally posted by The Artist fka TD:
Music and CB,

Can you tell me which side you two are arguing about.

I'm not discussing the NFC North QBs versus the AFC South. I'm discussing a post that stated that ARodg is "just about" to Manning's level. Which I don't agree with. ARodg sure as sausage could get to his level...maybe even better. But one good season doesn't do it for me yet.

And I guess that also means I'm a MC ball washer or something as well...

Yes and you still haven't grasped the concept that your buddy MC was comparing 2009 Manning to 2009 Rodgers.....which if you look at the stats and their play of last year it's very easy to see that YES, Rodgers is very close to Manning....and could very well surpass him.

Let me know if I need to break this down into smaller words so you can understand what I'm saying.

trying to outtap more dumb than MC, chicken?

http://www.pro-football-refere...m/teams/clt/1998.htm

Yeah, that 98 Colts team only had first ballet HOF Marshall Faulk and Marvin Harrison on plus Pathon, Pollard, and Dilger were respectable players.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Yuck:
Yes and you still haven't grasped the concept that your buddy MC was comparing 2009 Manning to 2009 Rodgers.....which if you look at the stats and their play of last year it's very easy to see that YES, Rodgers is very close to Manning....and could very well surpass him.

Let me know if I need to break this down into smaller words so you can understand what I'm saying.

And you don't get that I don't care about the numbers. A first-year QB with one good year, is not at the level of a 33-year-old, three-time MVP, Super Bowl Champ and MVP QB. Manning was also hurt early on last year so his numbers were down early on.

My perception of level is who is the best QB(s) in the game. Who do you want QB-ing your team on Sunday to win the game. ARodg isn't at Manning's level as far as I'm concerned right now. If you are rebuilding, yes, I would take ARodg. If you are shooting for the bowl this season, I take Manning 10 times out of 10 over ARodge. 2008 stats and all...

quote:

Originally posted by The Artist fka TD:
trying to outtap more dumb than MC, chicken?

http://www.pro-football-refere...m/teams/clt/1998.htm

Yeah, that 98 Colts team only had first ballet HOF Marshall Faulk and Marvin Harrison on plus Pathon, Pollard, and Dilger were respectable players.

Their record was 3-13. What more has to be said. Your link points that out as well.

quote:

Manning was also hurt early on last year so his numbers were down early on.

And Rodgers wasn't? keep it simple.