Too little, too late, but very best explanation I've seen...
http://profootballtalk.nbcspor...-call-was-incorrect/
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Just spent a few minutes reading the comments below the article. The gist of it is.....people are going to see and believe whatever they want to believe. No one is going to change anyone else's mind, one way or another. Heck, I've been following the facebook comments on the math problem - where there should be no gray area whatsoever....and people are still arguing over the answer. This is full of gray area and fandom and passion.
What you say is compelling japf. I'm now of the same mind as you on this issue.
Anyone that thinks the final play wasn't the 2nd INT of the drive, is a Seattle homer or a sheep following the NFL
and the fact that the replacements weren't up to speed on what constitutes a simultaneous catch just burns me up to no end. the rule WASN'T interpreted correctly and for the NFL to stand behind it on Tuesday morning burns me up even more. the ONLY thing that will put out my fire is ol' Rule 17. the fact that goodell will not do the obviously correct thing and implement it tells me he has no balls. goodell must go - lousy commish, ruining the game.
quote:Hochuli defined a simultaneous catch as one in which four hands secure the football at the same time. It is not a simultaneous catch, he says, if one player has it in mid-air and then another joins him in the act of possessing it. The player who had possessed the ball first (in the case of Monday's game, Jennings) is the one who should be rewarded with possession.
It also does not matter if the initial grab occurs before the player hit the ground.
"I will tell you I've worked over 450 games in this league. I have never seen a simultaneous catch," Hochuli said. "To get four hands on the ball at the same time is a pretty unusual situation.
"I've seen simultaneous recoveries. That's not uncommon. You un-pile the players, they're going after a loose ball and there are two guys who are completely wrapped around the football, you have a simultaneous recovery. You're going to give the ball to the offense.
"But a simultaneous catch is a hard thing to have."
quote:Originally posted by Boris:
Anyone that thinks the final play wasn't the 2nd INT of the drive, is a Seattle homer or a sheep following the NFL
Don't forget the Packer haters. Lots of Vikings and Bears fans think the final play was called correctly.
quote:Originally posted by Boris:
Anyone that thinks the final play wasn't the 2nd INT of the drive, is a Seattle homer or a sheep following the NFL
I will blame my age but I cannot remember the first of the drive.....can one on you young fellas help me out?
quote:Originally posted by Tdog:
and the fact that the replacements weren't up to speed on what constitutes a simultaneous catch just burns me up to no end. the rule WASN'T interpreted correctly and for the NFL to stand behind it on Tuesday morning burns me up even more.
The part that kills me is that they weren't even able to determine if Seattle needed to kick an extra point after the touchdown. They actually announced "the game is over". What casual fan doesn't know that you have to kick an extra point after a touchdown in regulation time? That only reinforced the fact that these guys were completely in over their heads and did not know what they were doing.
Hochuli has the experience to know what he's talking about. Think about it: 450 games and not one. Bill Leavey isn't a slouch either, and he's never seen it -- ever. As for me, I'm still searching even for one of Tate's hands in the photo that accompanies the article. All I see are Packer hands...
It's a joke. Japf is right: no one at this point is going to change their mind, especially that *^$%&^*& Goodell, the existence of Rule 17 or not. I'll never get over it, but I will move past it.
It's a joke. Japf is right: no one at this point is going to change their mind, especially that *^$%&^*& Goodell, the existence of Rule 17 or not. I'll never get over it, but I will move past it.
quote:Originally posted by Pikes Peak:quote:Originally posted by Boris:
Anyone that thinks the final play wasn't the 2nd INT of the drive, is a Seattle homer or a sheep following the NFL
I will blame my age but I cannot remember the first of the drive.....can one on you young fellas help me out?
I'm not positive but I think Shields would have had a pick if he hadn't of been mauled by the WR while getting called for PI. That's kinda like getting shot in the face by a cop then being arrested for carrying a concealed bullet in your sinus passages.
I'm neighbors with a hard core Chicago everything sports fan. He came over on Tuesday and said he wanted to give me a bad time but he couldn't do it. The call was that over the top bad.
He said in the history of bad calls (Denkinger, Jeffery Maier, Hull in the crease, 72 Olympics, Rice fumble) it's at the very top of the list for two reasons. It was clearly an interception when you watched it. They reviewed it and still got it wrong. He brought up another good point. The ref that signaled TD was standing on the 3 yard line when MD was on his back in the end zone with the ball. He didn't have a view of anything.
Still have to expect it from some Bear fans and ALL Minny fans. 52 years of complete and total failure does whacky things to a fan base.
Anyone that watches that play and thinks it was called correctly is trolling for attention or completely lacking football knowledge. I've got time for neither.
He said in the history of bad calls (Denkinger, Jeffery Maier, Hull in the crease, 72 Olympics, Rice fumble) it's at the very top of the list for two reasons. It was clearly an interception when you watched it. They reviewed it and still got it wrong. He brought up another good point. The ref that signaled TD was standing on the 3 yard line when MD was on his back in the end zone with the ball. He didn't have a view of anything.
Still have to expect it from some Bear fans and ALL Minny fans. 52 years of complete and total failure does whacky things to a fan base.
Anyone that watches that play and thinks it was called correctly is trolling for attention or completely lacking football knowledge. I've got time for neither.
quote:Originally posted by Pikes Peak:quote:Originally posted by Boris:
Anyone that thinks the final play wasn't the 2nd INT of the drive, is a Seattle homer or a sheep following the NFL
I will blame my age but I cannot remember the first of the drive.....can one on you young fellas help me out?
On the questionable roughing the passer call against Walden, McMillian (I think) tipped and picked the ball. It was actually the previous drive.
1-10-SEA 20
(8:44) 3-R.Wilson pass intended for 82-E.Moore INTERCEPTED by 22-J.McMillian at SEA 26. 22-J.McMillian ran ob at SEA 26 for no gain. PENALTY on GB-93-E.Walden, Roughing the Passer, 15 yards, enforced at SEA 20 - No Play.
RE Shoeless:
Boris is referring to McMillan's awesome INT(it was a really impressive, athletic feat) negated on a ridiculous roughing the passer call on Walden. No ref with any semblance of competence throws the flag on that play.
Shortly after that bungled abortion of a call, Shields was flagged for a 30-40 yd PI play, when he was covering the WR about as well as a player could. With so much horrible officiating jammed into one drive, I can easily see how someone could get the details mixed up a bit
Boris is referring to McMillan's awesome INT(it was a really impressive, athletic feat) negated on a ridiculous roughing the passer call on Walden. No ref with any semblance of competence throws the flag on that play.
Shortly after that bungled abortion of a call, Shields was flagged for a 30-40 yd PI play, when he was covering the WR about as well as a player could. With so much horrible officiating jammed into one drive, I can easily see how someone could get the details mixed up a bit
That happened with 8:44 left certainly not the last drive.
This is the last drive,
Seattle Seahawks at 0:46 GNB SEA
1st and 10 at GB 46 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep middle to E.Moore (C.Woodson).
2nd and 10 at GB 46 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass deep right to S.Rice to GB 24 for 22 yards (T.Williams)
.
1st and 10 at GB 24 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep left to G.Tate (S.Shields)
.
2nd and 10 at GB 24 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep middle to E.Moore.
3rd and 10 at GB 24 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep right to G.Tate.
4th and 10 at GB 24 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass deep left to G.Tate for 24 yards, TOUCHDOWN [C.Matthews]. The Replay Assistant challenged the pass completion ruling, and the play was Upheld. 12 13
S.Hauschka extra point is GOOD, Center-C.Gresham, Holder-J.Ryan. 12 14
DRIVE TOTALS: GB 12, SEA 14, 6 plays, 46 yards, 0:46 elapsed
Which play was the 2nd overturned INT?
This is the last drive,
Seattle Seahawks at 0:46 GNB SEA
1st and 10 at GB 46 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep middle to E.Moore (C.Woodson).
2nd and 10 at GB 46 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass deep right to S.Rice to GB 24 for 22 yards (T.Williams)
.
1st and 10 at GB 24 (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep left to G.Tate (S.Shields)
.
2nd and 10 at GB 24 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep middle to E.Moore.
3rd and 10 at GB 24 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep right to G.Tate.
4th and 10 at GB 24 (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass deep left to G.Tate for 24 yards, TOUCHDOWN [C.Matthews]. The Replay Assistant challenged the pass completion ruling, and the play was Upheld. 12 13
S.Hauschka extra point is GOOD, Center-C.Gresham, Holder-J.Ryan. 12 14
DRIVE TOTALS: GB 12, SEA 14, 6 plays, 46 yards, 0:46 elapsed
Which play was the 2nd overturned INT?
quote:Originally posted by Fond Du Arrigo:
Boris is referring to McMillan's awesome INT(it was a really impressive, athletic feat) negated on a ridiculous roughing the passer call on Walden. No ref with any semblance of competence throws the flag on that play.
Shortly after that bungled abortion of a call, Shields was flagged for a 30-40 yd PI play, when he was covering the WR about as we'll as a player could. With so much horrible officiating jammed into one drive, I can easily see how someone could get the details mixed up a bit
No, he clearly said the last drive.
How can you be so obtuse ?
quote:Originally posted by Pikes Peak:
No, he clearly said the last drive.
Brois was mistaken there...
quote:Originally posted by Pikes Peak:
Which play was the 2nd overturned INT?
1st overturned INT happened on the 2nd to last drive for SEA that has been mentioned above by me and Fundu.
The 2nd overturned INT that Boris referred to is the final play. While it technically was not called an INT, Boris is right in calling it an overturned INT.
My mistake. In my mind it was the last drive. Perhaps a bit too much sauce that night
Then again, being pickled may be the only possible way of getting through a complete NFL game this season
Thanks, the first official (boris) made a mistake, the white hat (me) called him on it, a conference with all officials (everyone else) ensued. The right call was made in the end
If only that procedure was followed on Monday nite!
If only that procedure was followed on Monday nite!
The view from 14,000 feet is sometimes obscured by a lack of oxygen to the brain
quote:Originally posted by Satori:
The view from 14,000 feet is sometimes obscured by a lack of oxygen to the brain
The view from 14,000 ft as correct sir!
The Shields PI BS was on the same drive as the McMillian INT / questionable roughing call on Walden.
Obscured by clouds is my guess.
quote:Originally posted by Tdog: and the fact that the replacements weren't up to speed on what constitutes a simultaneous catch just burns me up to no end. the rule WASN'T interpreted correctly and for the NFL to stand behind it on Tuesday morning burns me up even more. the ONLY thing that will put out my fire is ol' Rule 17.
I hope you have asbestos undies 'cause you're gonna be waiting a looooong time.
the eternal flame will not be extinguished - never forget.
I'm past it but I'll never be over it. Fire goodell, FTNFL.
I'm a GBP fan period now. Won't be buying anything that is NFL, won't watch other games (altho I will take notice), just 3 hours of football once a week.
I'm past it but I'll never be over it. Fire goodell, FTNFL.
I'm a GBP fan period now. Won't be buying anything that is NFL, won't watch other games (altho I will take notice), just 3 hours of football once a week.
Pathetic... they don't even understand their own rules.
How about applying RULE 17 for the last 3 weeks of football. What should be deemed unfair is playing a professional sport with refs that don't understand the rules and can't keep a game under control.
Just make this year a 13 game season.
Just make this year a 13 game season.
quote:“I didn’t do anything wrong,” Easley said in the report. “You have to not only have the ball but have either two feet or a body part on the ground, and that never happened.”
bolded part completely false. easley, please have a talk with hochuli about this so you can get over your stupid self.
I was going to make a joke that he's saying Jennings can fly but then it hit me, he might actually think Jennings can fly.
If I was dealing with his bank I thank I'd close my account. 
If they are not going to invoke Rule 17 for this atrocity, what would they invoke it for. The League knows they F'd up, and over 40+ years of the NFL this has never happened. Now that a bogus call has cost a team a game, the league knows it, the players know it, the fans know it, the media knows it, why even have the rule.
To me, this seems like the exact right time to invoke this Rule, and if it opens a can, it is what it is, but I'd be surprised if this happens again over the next 40 years.
To me, this seems like the exact right time to invoke this Rule, and if it opens a can, it is what it is, but I'd be surprised if this happens again over the next 40 years.
What a prick...
I had some sympathy for the replacement refs because they had an amazing offer dangled in front of their face and weren't given enough training, but this makes me not sympathetic to him in the slightest. Newsflash dickhead, you didn't do a damn good job, you didn't even DO your job. You threw some flags at some obvious calls so people would think you knew what you were doing, but when the truly difficult calls came along you couldn't handle it. Man up, say you did the best you could do under the circumstances (the circumstances being unprepared and not ready for that kind of responsibility) and go back and hide at the high school games you ref for.
quote:“We did a damn good job . . . for the most part,” Easley said.
I had some sympathy for the replacement refs because they had an amazing offer dangled in front of their face and weren't given enough training, but this makes me not sympathetic to him in the slightest. Newsflash dickhead, you didn't do a damn good job, you didn't even DO your job. You threw some flags at some obvious calls so people would think you knew what you were doing, but when the truly difficult calls came along you couldn't handle it. Man up, say you did the best you could do under the circumstances (the circumstances being unprepared and not ready for that kind of responsibility) and go back and hide at the high school games you ref for.