Pike
He is doing well. he says tho that his lungs have still not fully recovered and maybe never will.
My grandsons baseball coach from little league thru High school died from covid last week. It really shook him up. It was sad. He left three little ones. So incredibly sad. Just take the shot already..
I do think the offensive issues rested almost entirely with LaFleur and Hackett. They didn’t have an answer for the pressure even though Spagnuolo is famously pressure happy and they didn’t do anything to get Love in rhythm. It’s not to say Love needed the gameplan dumbed down, but he needed easier throws and completions to build confidence and move the chains. Every QB, including Rodgers, needs those thing. Not only Love though, but they needed to get the OL some wins and make life easier on them with scheme. KC’s defense should have been on their heels expecting a diverse gameplan with a QB they had little film on, instead the offense was on its heels trying to stay above water. MLF is a good coach, but he needs to keep his cool and not outthink himself.
Understandably some Packers fans (many?) are a little alarmed by 10's performance, but they need to wrap their heads around the fact this FO has gone all-in on him.
They are not trading him, they are not pulling the plug on him. In fact, I believe nothing has changed, and they will still deal 12 to some other franchise in the off-season. That was the plan all along. The people that make those decisions are ready to move on from the "complicated fella."
@DH13 posted:What I still don't get is where AR would think he'd have a better opportunity to win, if he has any say in it. DEN looks like more than a QB away and they just dealt Von Miller. Maybe he could coerce DEN into loading up the way TB did for Brady? CLE? The other teams that need a QB need much more than just a QB.
Pittsburgh. Rodgers very complimentary of coach and organization when we played Steelers this year. But every team has holes.
Agreed. To their detriment IMO. I personally think the FO would be insane not to extend Turd Ferguson for at least another couple of years.
Also agree Mayo didn't do a great job with play calling but when the KC defense literally rushes 7 you have to have a QB who can actually make the pass. The one jail break Nub completely whiffed on a open Lazard even though he was clearly in his field of vision in front of Adams.
If Nub is the guy, pretty much think it will be absolutely necessary to build a monster defense and oline.
I can't help but think what McGinn (I know) and Joe Lombardi have said about MLF & Murphy deciding after year one they needed to get a QB that would unquestionably run MLF's offense ... and MLF's chest bumping celebration when the Love pick was announced .... I wonder if they are now humbled into acknowledging that a HOF QB makes any offense look better?
@GreenBayLA posted:Pittsburgh. Rodgers very complimentary of coach and organization when we played Steelers this year. But every team has holes.
They're in soft rebuild mode. I don't think they want to replace an aging QB with another aging QB. And their OL needs a lot of work.
@Chongo posted:Understandably some Packers fans (many?) are a little alarmed by 10's performance, but they need to wrap their heads around the fact this FO has gone all-in on him.
They are not trading him, they are not pulling the plug on him. In fact, I believe nothing has changed, and they will still deal 12 to some other franchise in the off-season. That was the plan all along. The people that make those decisions are ready to move on from the "complicated fella."
I think you are correct about moving on from AR, we will see how how they really feel about Love. They see him everyday, we don’t. This will be quite the off season. Buckle up.
Speaking of Mahomes, him and Love had basically the same game. Both missed a lot and had similar stats. I thought all the knocks on Mahomes were BS cuz it's not like he doesn't have Kelce or Hill and he's still a great QB but something is just not right with him.
Glad we didn't pay Love half a billion dollars.
@Chongo posted:Understandably some Packers fans (many?) are a little alarmed by 10's performance, but they need to wrap their heads around the fact this FO has gone all-in on him.
They are not trading him, they are not pulling the plug on him. In fact, I believe nothing has changed, and they will still deal 12 to some other franchise in the off-season. That was the plan all along. The people that make those decisions are ready to move on from the "complicated fella."
I'm convinced they will sign Rodgers to a 5 year deal in Feb.
+ I still own a piece of the best franchise in the League.
- People making any judgement on J. Love after his first start under these weird circumstances.
But I was judging him since he was drafted so I get a pass. Right?
Also, there's nothing weird about having your backup QB stepping in when needed regardless of injury or dumbassery. That's what backup QB's do. Love isn't ready to fill the backup QB roll either.
Judging since Day One is silly too.
18 months = day 1
I think 12 will be back next season.
Do we have to wait until his career is over before we judge? That's such a long time! Then again, maybe it won't be? Either way, I am pulling for him and want him to succeed, but he didn't really even show a lot of baseline that he can build upon. Hopefully that changes.
@Pikes Peak posted:I think you are correct about moving on from AR, we will see how how they really feel about Love. They see him everyday, we don’t. This will be quite the off season. Buckle up.
Exactly. We are a bunch of idiots on a message board giving our opinions on Love based on what we see on TV. What really counts is what the coaching staff thinks of him and his progress based upon seeing him every day.
+ After watching the highlights I'm upgrading my even grade to a plus for Love. He made three sensational plays under duress-if he and Davante Adams had another week to work on timing issues, they would have connected on three passes that otherwise looked terrible. If Love had the exact performance of superstar Mahomes the pundits would have been just as rough on him.
-I'm a passive aggressive wienie that is done with 12
I'm not sure how anyone watched that game and came to the conclusion 'he had the same game as Mahomes... like yeah Mahomes wasn't good, certainly not by the standards of his contract. But he was noticeably better than Love. He suffered more from drops. And sure that pass that went through King's hands should have been picked but Love had a couple of close calls as well. The play Mahomes made to convert that last first down and seal the game was a lot better than anything Love did the entire day.
In the alternate universe where Love is a 4th round pick and Rodgers is out a week with the flu nobody is saying anything other than the obvious, Love did not capably run the offense and was the biggest reason they lost the game.
I'm not saying that one game has to define his career, but it's not nothing either. It was an opportunity and he didn't capitalize. He'll have more opportunities but opportunities in the NFL are hardly infinite.
This was also something fans noticed and called in on sports radio this AM. As a leader and certainly someone who could help mentor Love, this also annoyed me. I fully get Love and Adams chemistry is basically non-existent since they haven't worked together, but dude help the kid out..
Could do without Adams throwing his hands in the air after errant throws. I’ve already seen this a number of times as I rewatch the game.
— Michael Rodney (@PackersNotes) November 8, 2021
@packerboi posted:This was also something fans noticed and called in on sports radio this AM. As a leader and certainly someone who could help mentor Love, this also annoyed me. I fully get Love and Adams chemistry is basically non-existent since they haven't worked together, but dude help the kid out..
Could do without Adams throwing his hands in the air after errant throws. I’ve already seen this a number of times as I rewatch the game.
— Michael Rodney (@PackersNotes) November 8, 2021
Yah, didn’t care for that from Adams……..be a team player, and do as much as you can to have this rookie succeed.
Gotta remember, he's playing for a contract
Is he flailing in frustration at Love or the refs for not getting a PI call?
@packerboi posted:This was also something fans noticed and called in on sports radio this AM. As a leader and certainly someone who could help mentor Love, this also annoyed me. I fully get Love and Adams chemistry is basically non-existent since they haven't worked together, but dude help the kid out..
Could do without Adams throwing his hands in the air after errant throws. I’ve already seen this a number of times as I rewatch the game.
— Michael Rodney (@PackersNotes) November 8, 2021
I noticed this as well during the game and was disappointed in Adams' body language. He would either throw his hands in the air - and maybe that was looking for a flag - but he would also put his hands on his hips, as if annoyed. Not the best way to support a young, struggling QB. I actually thought Love targeted Adams too much, forcing some throws at times when others were open. Reminded me of Favre early in his career, when he focused on Sharpe almost exclusively. Overall, I certainly wish Love had played better, but I am not ready to judge him on this small sample size. He is essentially a rookie, having lost all of training camp and preseason his first year, and he wasn't helped out by LaFleur calling so many plays that took too long to develop in the face of heavy blitzes.
@FinnLander posted:Judging since Day One is silly too.
The tape man! The tape!
@Johnson posted:+ After watching the highlights I'm upgrading my even grade to a plus for Love. He made three sensational plays under duress-if he and Davante Adams had another week to work on timing issues, they would have connected on three passes that otherwise looked terrible. If Love had the exact performance of superstar Mahomes the pundits would have been just as rough on him.
-I'm a passive aggressive wienie that is done with 12
If the + is due to passive aggressive towards Turd Ferguson I agree.
Nub was not good though. I never worried about his mechanics before but they were pretty damn horrible yesterday. Fixable. I'm still concerned about his decision making. Cobb bailed him out on a pass that never should've happened.
You can't give Love a pass because the KC defense knew he couldn't do shit. That's his bad performance properly being keyed in on by an opposing (and horrible) defense.
@RochNyFan posted:I'm pretty sure he has enough on tape to remind GM's of his talent.
True, but they don't have much tape on him where he doesn't have a HOF QB throwing him the ball.
Outside of BH of course. 
I didn't see anything positive from Love.
Poor decision making and compound that with what appeared to be avg arm strength at best. If you're gonna be a gun slinger, you have to have a gun. I didn't see it. I saw ducks and floaters on top of missed reads.
I also saw that he likes to escape right, never left. Teams are gonna pick up on that fast and it's going to lead to a lot of sacks. He did step through the middle a couple times, but never left.
So you criticize him for not having great arm strength and then pile on that he didn't run left. Even the greenest of football fans know that a right handed QB has less zip on the ball when running left. Now you are just being foolish with your assesment.
You saw nothing that you thought was positive?
I thought he escaped the rush at times pretty well. He took one sack when honestly he could have taken several more.
I liked what I saw on the scoring drive. He made some decent reads and throws there.
Now, there were a ton of things I didn’t like. On a number of throws, his feet weren’t set. The throwing motion was off as I think he was worried about getting sacked so his follow through was shaky at times. Bottom line, his mechanics weren’t very good at all for a QB.
For his first game, I was expecting more, but have to remind myself it’s one game. Sure, he wasn’t facing the 2000 Ravens defense, but it’s still very loud in KC and it takes time to get in sync with your receivers. I also think not having Tonyan hurts because TEs offer a big target and nice escape valve when things aren’t there. Look no further than Kelce saving Mahomes bacon.
@4 Favre posted:I'm not sure how anyone watched that game and came to the conclusion 'he had the same game as Mahomes... like yeah Mahomes wasn't good, certainly not by the standards of his contract. But he was noticeably better than Love. He suffered more from drops. And sure that pass that went through King's hands should have been picked but Love had a couple of close calls as well. The play Mahomes made to convert that last first down and seal the game was a lot better than anything Love did the entire day.
In the alternate universe where Love is a 4th round pick and Rodgers is out a week with the flu nobody is saying anything other than the obvious, Love did not capably run the offense and was the biggest reason they lost the game.
I'm not saying that one game has to define his career, but it's not nothing either. It was an opportunity and he didn't capitalize. He'll have more opportunities but opportunities in the NFL are hardly infinite.
I think one of the most interesting things about Mahomes performance was his last pass, probably the best one he threw all day. For much of the rest of the game, he'd drop back, have a clean pocket, and really show poor accuracy for a guy that less than a year ago looked like he might end up as a top 10 QB all-time. If you didn't know his prior work, you'd think he was a guy with terrible accuracy.
On the final pass of the game, he rolled right, was under strong pressure from Gary, and just reacted and threw the ball. He didn't have time to think and when that happened he looked like the "old" Mahomes for the first time all game. I think he's in his own head and wants to throw a 60-yard bomb and thread it through triple coverage to lead the highlight shows that week. He reminded me a lot of early 2000s Favre who would often play poorly for large parts of the game and then when they were behind would look great because he was no longer overthinking things.
@FLPACKER posted:I'm interested to see AR's demeanor in his remaining press conferences .... will he be as open / candid / insightful as before....or will he be butt-hurt over media ripping him and give canned short answers?
FWIW, I think the feeling is mutual: the media is butt-hurt over his trying to keep things from them.
Edit: I think the media have that sort of butt-hurt in general; this is just a rather more extreme case of trying to keep things from them.
@PackLandVA posted:Joe Barry, who you praised above this comment, was the DC of the some of the worst defensive units with Detroit and Washington.
You make a good point there, I didn't think of it that way. Obviously MLF knows potential coaches better than we do, and he must have saw something in Barry and Drayton that made him think they would be successful here. So far, good on Barry. Drayton? Sometimes you miss. And it's not like great ST coordinators are just sitting out there waiting to be hired at this time of the year. I hope Mo can get it together, because we need him to.
I saw a lot of indecision and little to no confidence in JLs throws. That starts in the head. His body may not be able to physically follow, but he just wasn't reacting to what he saw when there was pressure. He looked okay when he had time or the play was clear in front of him (the Dillon toss in the flat from the 4 that went for about 15 or so yards), but too often he looked lost. Again, a lot of that was when Spag's was sending 5+.
@50k Club posted:On a day when the OL had to be at their best, they were not. Patrick and Freeman seemed especially bad. I don't know if that is due protection calls by Patrick and/or Love.
LaFleur takes the blame for the gameplan/playcalling, which sounds nice as a soundbite in a press conference, but why not adjust sooner in game? The whole first half was a shitshow for the O.
I do not know how the defense is holding up so well. Truly a credit to coaching to get the most out of the sum of the parts. I hope Clark is not out too long - he is much needed. The real "tests" for the defense were playing premier QB's like Mahomes and Murray. I would say they have passed with flying colors.
I'm not sure Patrick was a big issue. Newman, however, was just plain bad in pass pro. I think other teams have figured him out and he needs to adjust. For example, on Love's chaotic pass to Big Dog, the RDT comes upfield inside and Patrick picks him up, but Ingram(?) is lurking unblocked in position for a delayed blitz. Patrick rides him initially, then passes him off to Newman. However, the LDT initially crashed straight in to Newman and Turner is picking him up with an initial double, but Newman has his blinders on by that point and never slides to the passed off RDT.
I think when Bak comes back, we should have Jenkins play center, move Patrick to RG, and leave Runyan at LG. That puts our best 5 on the field, anyway.
