and another day living in hell in Queensland.
Ugh.....
bdplant posted:GBFanForLife posted:NumberThree posted:-Another wasted year of Rodgers's career.
Another year wasted by Rodgers himself. He has played like crap all year, except for his play against the inept bears in the first game
Exactly! The Packers haven’t wasted the last two years of AR’s career. AR’s injuries and downright mediocre play have been just as much of a problem as anything else.
Not like poor play calling and o-line protection had anything to do with those injuries.
+ contrary to popular belief Favre was great and made watching the packers a joy and kept them in serious contention every year. Ditto for Rodgers and still in present form.
- too many games characterized by widespread injuries and predictable plays.
Pikes Peak posted:excalibur posted:Rodgers is the problem.
One of them
No, for this toad it's always been about Rodgers and has been since day one.
excalibur posted:GBFanForLife posted:Rodgers is Favre part 2. He is a waste of 30 million and the team is now ****ed with his salary. McCarthy should be fired tomorrow. The coaching in this game was beyond inept and he allowed Tramon Williams on the team.
We better hope there is some real AR in Rodgers come 2019, 2020, or this will get old real quick. From GOAT to goat.
This is why I wanted to draft a QB this last draft. Paying one player that much just screws the payroll. Plus the recent injury history he has had.
Yeah, drafting a QB would've totally made that Rodgers problems go away. Hey rookie, fill Aaron Rodgers shoes so we don't have to worry about a contract coming up this year! Never mind the guy put the whole team on his back with an injury in the first game of the season to beat the current division leader (inept). Rodgers hasn't played well in two years!
Makes total sense.
Here's the reality, it's a collective cluster**** (redundant?) but just like all you petunias clamoring about TT, who is no longer GM, the guy at the top of the current shit ass mess is McVince. Whether Rodgers isn't playing well still rests on McVince, be it fair or not. When injuries occur it's up to MM to adjust. When shitty coaches are on staff, it's up to McVince to shit can the guy.
Considering this team is a collection of rookies/scrubs trying to plug holes in certain areas where TT left talent gaps along with injuries it isn't all McVince's fault. Yet, he trots out the same crap. Rodgers is part of the problem but malaise lies at the feet of the HC, a HC who is stale. It isn't even a matter of McVince being a horrible coach, he isn't, but it's not working in Green Bay anymore. This isn't some new McVince specific thing in the NFL.
Teams know what you're going to run, you have rookies trying to get up to speed, yep, you're going to have issues in the offense.
That's why it's exciting to watch the defense, which is completely different. The talent gap is on the defensive side of the ball along with the bulk of the injuries and still the creativity is there. That's exciting when looking forward to a reload of talent under a new GM. That doesn't exist on the offensive side of the ball.
Statistically, size bigotry by personnel managers and scouts is very likely to end with mediocrity because it shrinks (the irony) the talent pool, and mediocrity is pretty close to being fully ensconced in Green Bay. Despite having one of the best QBs in the NFL.
Meanwhile, it's a lot of fun to watch the Rams (Cooks) and the Patriots (Edelman) and the Chiefs (Hill) and the Bears (Gabriel) and the Steelers (Brown.)
Finally a voice of reason
Fedya posted:+ I was in bed by halftime
- Same old, same old
Well, at least you got to see a fairly decent first half....
Pikes Peak posted:excalibur posted:Rodgers is the problem.
One of them
Rodgers to me is not the problem with the offense. The problem to me is that they have one WR in Adams who can make plays and there is not much else there because of injuries/inexperience.
Positives? The defense played their guts out even though they were depleted and playing inexperienced players everywhere. I have to give Pettine credit he has the D playing with determination
The Packers made a real effort to run the ball with Jones
Negatives? Damn this team and their injuries! year after year it seems like this team loses half the team to injuries.
Having to have 11 or 12 rookies active for this game. You can't have that many rookies on the active roster and not feel it.
The Heckler posted:Pikes Peak posted:excalibur posted:Rodgers is the problem.
One of them
Rodgers to me is not the problem with the offense. The problem to me is that they have one WR in Adams who can make plays and there is not much else there because of injuries/inexperience.
Positives? The defense played their guts out even though they were depleted and playing inexperienced players everywhere. I have to give Pettine credit he has the D playing with determination
The Packers made a real effort to run the ball with Jones
Negatives? Damn this team and their injuries! year after year it seems like this team loses half the team to injuries.
Having to have 11 or 12 rookies active for this game. You can't have that many rookies on the active roster and not feel it.
Get used to a lot of rookies and cheap plug ins. The road ahead is clear.
I think the road ahead is clear and that is I trust the GM to make the bold moves to make this team better and in a hurry. Sure we have been spoiled these last 25 years but I also do not think the Packers will suddenly slide in to the 70s and 80s dark ages.
Debunking the Myths of Mike McCarthy, Aaron Rodgers and the Packers Offense
Pretty good piece by Andy Benoit that I largely agree with. His conclusion: much of the issue is AR playing sandlot ball rather than staying in the structure of the offense.
I made it through 3 quarters of the game. At half I was thinking it should end in another tie. Neither team looks worth a turd. Dull inconsistent football. Then by the end of the Q3 it was more clear that one of these teams brought a rubber band to a gun fight.
Adams is a treat to watch work against the best CB's in the league. While the rookies look promising, they still need to add a higher round WR to the stable. Been saying that for 3 years now.
Can't wait to see more improvement on D if Pettine makes it out the other side of the upcoming housecleaning.
Goldie posted:and another day living in hell in Queensland.
Take heart Goldie, in a few weeks you can look forward to a new coach and the draft whilst laughing your ass off at Queenie fans as their Super Bowl dreams are flushed down the toilets in The Big Stapler
Totally agree Heckler
We have our franchise QB. They have some decent pieces around him
They need a reset and not a rebuild. I like what Gute did in year one and expect things to continue to improve
+++ Davante Adams gets 1000 yards receiving for the 1st time. ESB has been pretty good all year. Aaron Jones had a good night, overall. Our defense played well but were gassed late in the game. We should get good draft picks if this level of play from the offense continues. The vikings were beatable, again. Their season, once again, will have a bitter end to it.
---- Our O line is in deep trouble without Bahk and Taylor playing. Spriggs is not the player we need anywhere on the line. Playing zone, on defense, allowed the vikings to move the ball at will. Tramon should hang it up after this season. His footwork and fall allowed a vikings' TD. His stupid play on the return allowed the vikings to turn over the ball when we needed a scoring drive to stay in the game. There is so much need on this team. One draft cannot provide all the answers we need. We neglected the O line in this past draft. Now, it is imperative we find players to plug those holes and provide real depth. I do not even know just what will be available as far as O Line position players go in the next draft. Gute has to look at FA for a lot of answers to our O Line problem. We will still need help at Pass Rusher, Safety and CB. MM is done and he knows it. That means Zook and Moss are done, too, I hope. Zero road wins, yet.
phaedrus posted:I think the main problem is the losses of Cobb (I know he can't be relied upon, but when healthy...) and Geronimo. And I think Rodgers has under-performed while under that impediment.
I posted last night that this has a 2005 feel/look.
Incumbent coach on 1 yr prove it deal.
Vet QB playing with unproven WRs due to injuries.
Stale offense leaning on that vet QB to make a play with the likes of WRs Chatman, Gardner, Thurman.
McCarthy did have the look of guy who knows it's over.
michiganjoe posted:Debunking the Myths of Mike McCarthy, Aaron Rodgers and the Packers Offense
Pretty good piece by Andy Benoit that I largely agree with. His conclusion: much of the issue is AR playing sandlot ball rather than staying in the structure of the offense.
Not exactly an earth-shattering article. Pretty much what's been debated here for weeks.
Packiderm posted:Goldie posted:and another day living in hell in Queensland.
Take heart Goldie, in a few weeks you can look forward to a new coach and the draft whilst laughing your ass off at Queenie fans as their Super Bowl dreams are flushed down the toilets in The Big Stapler
Thank you.......we have a Holiday party this Sat to attend .....don’t know if I’ll be able to stand the gloating the queen fans will be doing. Ugh....am really dreading going.
I am really torn on what to think of Rodgers. Part of me thinks that his play being far below his past standards might be related to injury - both his knee and perhaps his collarbone break and repair that may have altered his mechanics and throwing motion. Despite his many epic Hail Marys that dominate his highlight reel, for me the best representation of Rodgers' skills are the pinpoint lasers like the ones he threw to Jennings in the Super Bowl win over the Steelers - the one for a touchdown that fit into a tight window and got Jennings blasted by the safety in the process, and the game-sealing 3rd down conversion that could not have been thrown more perfectly. I can't remember him ever throwing passes into the dirt like he's done this year, and his throws seem to float now, instead of being zipped down the field with greater velocity. I noticed in replays that he seems to be throwing with just his arm, flicking his wrist, instead of using shoulder motion as well.
Then there's the thought that maybe this is a guy who has gotten too big for his britches. His comments and tone always seem condescending, like he is always the smartest guy in the room. His body language is awful and he looks disinterested on the sidelines, often sitting by himself. As much as I despise the Patriots and BB, I have come to have great respect for the way Tom Brady conducts himself in the late stages of his career. He still has fire and passion, and can often be seen getting in the face of his teammates, trying to fire them up. I know that Rodgers has never been the demonstrative type, but he is getting to the farther extremes of showing almost no emotion. Is he spending too much time in the off-season playing in celebrity golf tournaments, filming commercials and fulfilling endorsement deals, and hob-knobbing with Danica at the Dalai Lama's pad at the expense of training....who knows? All I know, from observations this year, is that he is not the same QB. Yes, he may be frustrated with an obsolete system (though some, such as Benoit in his article, point out the adjustments MM has made this year and how Rodgers has ignored the favorable matchups presented), but it is also clear that he is passing up some safe, effective throws looking for the big play, and is clearly off on his accuracy. Only sure thing is that if MM is let go, this is going to be an interesting off season.
Goldie posted:Packiderm posted:Goldie posted:and another day living in hell in Queensland.
Take heart Goldie, in a few weeks you can look forward to a new coach and the draft whilst laughing your ass off at Queenie fans as their Super Bowl dreams are flushed down the toilets in The Big Stapler
Thank you.......we have a Holiday party this Sat to attend .....don’t know if I’ll be able to stand the gloating the queen fans will be doing. Ugh....am really dreading going.
Just wear a Bills jersey to the party. That should shut them up.
I was terrible tonight!! Period
— J. Jones (@JoshJones11_) November 26, 2018
Henry posted:michiganjoe posted:Debunking the Myths of Mike McCarthy, Aaron Rodgers and the Packers Offense
Pretty good piece by Andy Benoit that I largely agree with. His conclusion: much of the issue is AR playing sandlot ball rather than staying in the structure of the offense.
Not exactly an earth-shattering article. Pretty much what's been debated here for weeks.
So you have what knowledgeable people say is the most physically gifted QB to every play and who excels in situations where he can improvise to make plays. He's always looked great in two minute drills. He still does. Why wouldn't you game plan to optimize those strengths. Let him run a hurry up offense where he calls the plays at the line much more often. You don't have to snap the ball right away all the time - get to the line and let him read the defense. Playing with a quicker pace would help slow down the pass rush. You could still play Aaron Jones - in fact it might make him even more effective.
It appears Aaron Rodgers has some weaknesses in playing the way that MM wants him to run the offense. However, those haven't changed in a decade. Why not play more to his strengths? You wouldn't run an offense for Tom Brady or Payton Manning that required a high-level of mobility to make it efficient. Good coaches figure out their players strengths and play to them - especially transcendent talents.
Goldie posted:and another day living in hell in Queensland.
Why? It's bad enough driving through occasionally, why live there and family is not an answer.
like many, this was another one that i could not watch fully. only stomach 3 qtrs. from what i saw, same bs
special teams snafus. i went to bed right after 38 botched the return. even wayne and larry were like 'uggh'
draft position improved and we should keep that moving in the upward direction, so i am not saying to tank, but...ya. there is problems all over. time to put a bow on the season. Nobody will touch NO or LA, so there is no prize for making the playoffs in my mind.
I watched most of the game last night hoping maybe the NFL had gotten better. I had not heard of Mathews getting penalized for hitting a QB so I watched. This Coach has so lost control of the team. The difference on the two sidelines was whorrible. In between sidelines is bad but not as bad. Gute needs to make this stop for everyone.
MichiganPacker posted:So you have what knowledgeable people say is the most physically gifted QB to every play and who excels in situations where he can improvise to make plays. He's always looked great in two minute drills. He still does. Why wouldn't you game plan to optimize those strengths. Let him run a hurry up offense where he calls the plays at the line much more often. You don't have to snap the ball right away all the time - get to the line and let him read the defense. Playing with a quicker pace would help slow down the pass rush. You could still play Aaron Jones - in fact it might make him even more effective.
It appears Aaron Rodgers has some weaknesses in playing the way that MM wants him to run the offense. However, those haven't changed in a decade. Why not play more to his strengths? You wouldn't run an offense for Tom Brady or Payton Manning that required a high-level of mobility to make it efficient. Good coaches figure out their players strengths and play to them - especially transcendent talents.
That's the whole point of the article, you're assuming it's McCarthy that is the problem. If Benoit is to be believed, it sounds like MM is scheming to compensate for the inexperience we're relying on and Rodgers is not executing. Rodgers has full input into the gameplan, the play call, and the freedom to change things at the line, probably more freedom than any QB in football. It doesn't appear to be McCarthy forcing him to do something he's not comfortable with, the offense is entirely tailored to Rodgers, his skills, and his preferences.
Can we package McVince and McRodgers to Cleveland for their entire 2019 draft?
Green and Gold posted:Can we package McVince and McRodgers to Cleveland for their entire 2019 draft?
Don't look now but they have the same number of wins without them. That's with a rookie QB and head coach turmoil.
Hey, McStale and AR had extra time to fix this, they failed.
Eventually, for the dumb ones, the Packers need to find AR's replacement. This last draft had ample opportunities. Rodgers has missed so many open guys this season that it is scary.
If AR does not return to form in 2019, 2020, it will get ugly fast with that contract they gave him.
Grave Digger posted:MichiganPacker posted:So you have what knowledgeable people say is the most physically gifted QB to every play and who excels in situations where he can improvise to make plays. He's always looked great in two minute drills. He still does. Why wouldn't you game plan to optimize those strengths. Let him run a hurry up offense where he calls the plays at the line much more often. You don't have to snap the ball right away all the time - get to the line and let him read the defense. Playing with a quicker pace would help slow down the pass rush. You could still play Aaron Jones - in fact it might make him even more effective.
It appears Aaron Rodgers has some weaknesses in playing the way that MM wants him to run the offense. However, those haven't changed in a decade. Why not play more to his strengths? You wouldn't run an offense for Tom Brady or Payton Manning that required a high-level of mobility to make it efficient. Good coaches figure out their players strengths and play to them - especially transcendent talents.
That's the whole point of the article, you're assuming it's McCarthy that is the problem. If Benoit is to be believed, it sounds like MM is scheming to compensate for the inexperience we're relying on and Rodgers is not executing. Rodgers has full input into the gameplan, the play call, and the freedom to change things at the line, probably more freedom than any QB in football. It doesn't appear to be McCarthy forcing him to do something he's not comfortable with, the offense is entirely tailored to Rodgers, his skills, and his preferences.
Yep.
AR has been awful at times. Maybe it is mental after the injury in game 1. Maybe it is that awful injury to his throwing shoulder which I mentioned last year as being a concern going forward. But it ain't a $30 million man wearing his uniform this season.
I think Rodgers carried the team so much on his back in 2016/early 2017 that he kind of gave everything he had and is paying the price a bit. The Pack was a house of cards ready to crumble and Rodgers was the one thing holding that house of cards together. Rodgers went down in early 2017 and the house of cards collapsed and with it he's received some collateral damage both physical and mental from the collapse as well.
I absolutely think Rodgers and the Pack can come back from this slide but a lot of tough decisions and smart personnel decisions will have to be made before it can happen. That very well may include a new head coach even though I think MM is a good man who can leave the job knowing he did a lot of great things in GB. Hell, Tom Landry was forced to step aside for the Cowboys to make room for a guy who would go on to win 3 Super Bowls. If Tom Landry can be pushed aside, then MM can also be pushed aside and it's sad because he's a good coach and a good man, but it probably has to happen.
Not get too far down this rabbit hole because I don't think it's necessary, but they can release him after the 2020 season with a post-June 1 designation and only be on the hook for $23M in dead money spread out over 2021 and 2022. There's an out if there is any sign of decline.
excalibur posted:Hey, McStale and AR had extra time to fix this, they failed.
Eventually, for the dumb ones, the Packers need to find AR's replacement. This last draft had ample opportunities. Rodgers has missed so many open guys this season that it is scary.
If AR does not return to form in 2019, 2020, it will get ugly fast with that contract they gave him.
You mean the rookie who was supposed to step in so they didn't need to give Rodgers a contract? ****ing idiot.
Henry posted:excalibur posted:Hey, McStale and AR had extra time to fix this, they failed.
Eventually, for the dumb ones, the Packers need to find AR's replacement. This last draft had ample opportunities. Rodgers has missed so many open guys this season that it is scary.
If AR does not return to form in 2019, 2020, it will get ugly fast with that contract they gave him.
You mean the rookie who was supposed to step in so they didn't need to give Rodgers a contract? ****ing idiot.
You haven't aged well.
I never said a rookie should be playing this year. I did say that I thought, and said so pre-draft, that they should draft a QB. Have a good day.
Grave Digger posted:Not get too far down this rabbit hole because I don't think it's necessary, but they can release him after the 2020 season with a post-June 1 designation and only be on the hook for $23M in dead money spread out over 2021 and 2022. There's an out if there is any sign of decline.
That makes things a bit brighter if AR doesn't return to his MVP form.
As the line in '1968' by Chris Gaffney goes 'Oh Johnny, that was so long ago'.
