MNPackman posted:After this pick was announced, I heard vikings color guy Pete Bercich say on KFAN, "Well, obviously the Packers are afraid of Cousins." Yes, he really said that.
PA and Bersich are such rubes!!!!
Brainwashed Boris posted:Josh Jackson - 1st round grade
A wise man once told me - "Let it go, Henry...Let it go. You're better than that & worth it."
True story bro. 😎
My buddy said the same thing to me because of my stance on TOG.
To me, it doesn't matter JJ is a football player, which has been said, throw 40 times/strength out the window. He's a DB who can read/diagnose the play and has football intelligence. Ecstatic how this draft worked out.
Good read if you want to get caught up on Jackson and Burks.
PackerRuss posted:To me, it doesn't matter JJ is a football player, which has been said, throw 40 times/strength out the window. He's a DB who can read/diagnose the play and has football intelligence. Ecstatic how this draft worked out.
A lack of speed is trouble, especially t this level, and there's very little difference between fast enough and not.
That said, at worst I think Jackson ends up being a pretty decent Safety. It may not be ideal but that's a darned solid floor even if all else doesn't go as hoped.
For **** sakes McGinn. Stop talking about the corners. Seriously.
His 40 time wasn't great at the combine, but it was around Casey Hayward level. I was looking at old combine stats for Hayward and Jackson beats some of his stats (including the 40), but Hayward was better at the quickness drills like short shuttle. Jackson has a 38 inch vertical plus long arms and he's over 6'. That, plus great instincts and timing can make up for not being a 4.3 guy.
Anybody that watched the Big Ten, you saw just how dominant Jackson could be if you went after him too often. Will there be a learning curve for Jackson in the NFL? I think so, but on this team, he might be able to begin 2018 as 3rd or 4th corner and by 2019 maybe move up a slot or 2 in the pecking order if some of the veterans don't stick around.
Any thoughts on moving this kid to Safety? Good ball skills and he seems to be aggressive.
I didn't think so when he was drafted, but he did nothing as a rookie. A healthy King and Alexander (I know, I know) is a great start, can Jackson be a quality 3rd corner? Maybe the kid is a safety, I don't know, but either he needs a world of off-season work with playing corner or a position switch. This is assuming he was healthy all year.
Maybe he is still incredibly raw (he really only had the one great season with Iowa) and the game really got big for him.
So far it looks like the pre-draft assessments were pretty accurate....limited speed, weak in man coverage, poor tackler vs very strong in zone, nose for the ball, good hands. In breaking routes are Achilles heal.
Hopefully he's better in year 2. For his sake he might need to see more zone or a position change might be in the cards.
He doesn't like to tackle so he'd fit right in at S.
Losing hope
Has Jackson even played in a game this season? I don't recall hearing his name called, ever.
I’ve seen him out there but his impact has been zero. Definitely doesn’t look like the guy who was dominant in the B10. It hasn’t translated to the NFL.
Edit: Not as many Alex Hornibrook’s to feast on at this level.
He looked good in preseason of rookie year. Then as the season went on he faded. Now he isn't getting much PT so it's hard to say. Obviously you want more from a 2nd rounder and part of that would have been beating out Williams for PT.
I don't think he is a good fit in our D. Another Hyde / Randall situation where if he was able to play S he would show better. I don't think he got snaps there this preseason so it's looking like a situation where he walks after year 3 and gets moved to S by some other team.
Hard to call Jackson a bust when he just hasn't gotten the playing time. He's played like 3-6 snaps a game. And he also missed a large chunk of TC. I don't doubt that Gutey will move on if he feels he's wasting a roster spot on him.
But with Raven Greene hurt, Kevin King who can't stay healthy, and Redman in the concussion protocol, there's next to no chance he's going anywhere in 2019.
With a new draft, new FA, who knows. But I'd like to see him play significant time again before concluding he's a bust.
DH13 posted:Good read if you want to get caught up on Jackson and Burks.
That's a lot of time spent proving you don't know what you're talking about
Looking for someone who's hindsight is not 2020.....
Gutey's made a lot of really good moves, but Josh Jackson and Jimmy Graham aren't two of them.
michiganjoe posted:Gutey's made a lot of really good moves, but Josh Jackson and Jimmy Graham aren't two of them.
They aren't good moves, but they aren't Jason Spriggs level players either. Jimmy Graham is still a serviceable NFL TE, but he's not worth the salary they are paying him. Josh Jackson is good enough to be on an NFL roster, but he wasn't worth the draft slot he was picked at.
The best way to say it is that Jimmy Graham is not the reason they lost games last year or this year. He's not bad enough to get you beat, but he's not good enough anymore to be a real difference maker.
No problem whatsoever with Gutey giving Graham a shot. Issue is with him compounding his mistake by not cutting the cord after the first year.
packerboi posted:Hard to call Jackson a bust when he just hasn't gotten the playing time. He's played like 3-6 snaps a game. And he also missed a large chunk of TC. I don't doubt that Gutey will move on if he feels he's wasting a roster spot on him.
But with Raven Greene hurt, Kevin King who can't stay healthy, and Redman in the concussion protocol, there's next to no chance he's going anywhere in 2019.
With a new draft, new FA, who knows. But I'd like to see him play significant time again before concluding he's a bust.
He's had 25 snaps the last two weeks and, from what I can tell, is primarily playing FS in place of Amos who is filling in for Greene. Jackson had a pretty rough rookie season at CB, targeted 64 times allowing 40 completions and a rating of 106. Thus far he hasn't been targeted this year and perhaps playing that centerfielder role in zone will allow him to attack the ball, which is what is strength seemed to be at Iowa. He's kind of a square peg in a defense so heavily predicated on leaving CBs on islands in man coverage, so FS might actually play to his strength. I know several here suggested that would be a better fit for him this offseason (and even when he was drafted I think).
I don't begrudge Gute grabbing him or Graham really. Jackson had a stellar college career and was available much later than expected. Graham is a savvy veteran who they gambled still had some life in his legs. I just hope the experiment with either doesn't drag on too long with either, but thus far Gute has not shown a tendency to hang on too long to projects (see Deshone Kizer).
Way I see it, Gute only kept Graham as a stopgap until Sternberger and Tonyan grow up.
DH13 posted:Looking for someone who's hindsight is not 2020.....
Mine is 2019
I don't have a problem with drafting Jackson at all. The thing I've noticed with Pettine is when these guys aren't performing or he doesn't think they're ready they just disappear. Burks was completely MIA last year. It could either be Pettine is protecting the guys from losing confidence or he won't put up with guys nursing at the teat while on the field.
We have zero evidence right now as to effectiveness of approach considering Burks is hurt. We truly have no idea how either of these guys are progressing.
Pettine's D seems heavily reliant on smart play from the ILBs, so I think having a rookie (Burks) in there was not something he preferred. Mart is a good ILB, but there's a reason this scheme requires 2 ILBs, he can't cover both spots. Goodson has mostly been worthless and I think having a Safety play in the box full time is fine if they're clean of OL, but an OL getting his hands on a Safety is a death sentence for any kind of run support.
Henry posted:DH13 posted:Looking for someone who's hindsight is not 2020.....
Mine is 2019
I can't imagine why YA hasn't like this post yet.
Sorry Fedya. Despite what Blair Keil says, I do have my standards.
Grave Digger posted:Pettine's D seems heavily reliant on smart play from the ILBs, so I think having a rookie (Burks) in there was not something he preferred.
With all these defensive coordinators needing vets to run the defense, how do rookie linebackers even ever see the field?
Josh Jackson played five snaps against the Raiders and gave up two completions, including a TD. He doesn't really play, and when he has, he hasn't been good.
— Zach Kruse (@zachkruse2) October 22, 2019