@PackerHawk posted:It was quick but it sure looked like Watson went into a "fencing" position for a couple of seconds on the ground after that hit. But he was stable when he got up. Glad it wasn't the noggin again.
I hope that this is the week he breaks out and shows the "WORLD" what he is made of.
Part X.
@PackerHawk posted:It was quick but it sure looked like Watson went into a "fencing" position for a couple of seconds on the ground after that hit. But he was stable when he got up. Glad it wasn't the noggin again.
They basically said he just got the wind knocked out of him from the hit, but were playing it safe.
Yep, same thing they did with Jones. You could see Jones was "himselfing" to get back in the game.
@DH13 posted:I thought I recalled that as well but wasn't sure. That game started off in full Favre fashion with Deion pick-sixing him, maybe on the opening drive? I remember thinking "oh no. not again."
I think it was right before the half. The Packers seemed to be in control and then Favre gave him one on a quick pass out to the right side of the field and Deion jumped it. I thought that would be a turning point, but Green Bay came back out after half-time and dominated. I think Levens might have had a career day. I'll look it up.
Found the box score of the 1997 game. It was classic in many ways. Levens had 190 yards and, with the Packers OL, basically just took the Cowboys manhood in the second half.
I had to LOL based on current events when I saw that the Cowboys kick returner in the game was Herschel Walker (coming back to Dallas later in his career).
On the drive that really decided the game, the Packers ran the ball 10 straight times (no passes) for a 74 yard drive to go up 31-17. Levens had almost all of it.
Finally, the Packers got a classic Darren Sharper stat padding fumble return to push the score to 38-17 and then GB ran up the score scoring on a TD pass at the end of the game to make it 45-17. Holmgren was all brake, no gas.
Thought this interesting:
The Green Bay Packers' wide receiving corps is apparently tired of being scapegoated for the team's offensive struggles.
Jeremy Fowler of ESPN reported the criticism of the receivers "isn't sitting well" given Aaron Rodgers' decision to not attend voluntary offseason workouts.
The Green Bay offense has been completely lacking in chemistry all season, with Rodgers going from back-to-back MVP to one of the worst starting quarterbacks in football. Rodgers currently sits 27th among starters in QBR, and his seven interceptions are already the most he's had over a full season since 2016.
No Packers wideout is currently on pace to top 1,000 receiving yards. Allen Lazard leads the team with 427 yards on 30 receptions, but he's been nowhere near a consistently reliable target. Rookies Romeo Doubs and Christian Watson have dealt with injuries and have not been particularly impressive when they've been on the field.
https://bleacherreport.com/use...2b-b5c7-1467935ff0f7
@Goldie posted:Thought this interesting:
The Green Bay Packers' wide receiving corps is apparently tired of being scapegoated for the team's offensive struggles.
Jeremy Fowler of ESPN reported the criticism of the receivers "isn't sitting well" given Aaron Rodgers' decision to not attend voluntary offseason workouts.
The Green Bay offense has been completely lacking in chemistry all season, with Rodgers going from back-to-back MVP to one of the worst starting quarterbacks in football. Rodgers currently sits 27th among starters in QBR, and his seven interceptions are already the most he's had over a full season since 2016.
No Packers wideout is currently on pace to top 1,000 receiving yards. Allen Lazard leads the team with 427 yards on 30 receptions, but he's been nowhere near a consistently reliable target. Rookies Romeo Doubs and Christian Watson have dealt with injuries and have not been particularly impressive when they've been on the field.
Wasn't there SOMEONE around here complaining about Rodgers not playing in the pre-season and was told it was not necessary . I did not like him (Rodgers) doing that for the obvious reasons. I rest my case ! 
I still think it is the mushrooms also.
@MichiganPacker posted:Found the box score of the 1997 game. It was classic in many ways. Levens had 190 yards and, with the Packers OL, basically just took the Cowboys manhood in the second half.
I had to LOL based on current events when I saw that the Cowboys kick returner in the game was Herschel Walker (coming back to Dallas later in his career).
On the drive that really decided the game, the Packers ran the ball 10 straight times (no passes) for a 74 yard drive to go up 31-17. Levens had almost all of it.
Finally, the Packers got a classic Darren Sharper stat padding fumble return to push the score to 38-17 and then GB ran up the score scoring on a TD pass at the end of the game to make it 45-17. Holmgren was all brake, no gas.
I remember it well. I watched at a bar named Be Bop in Blaine, Mn, we had a Packer room in the back with a few tv’s and 10 or so tables. There were consistently 30 or so fans there whenever the Pack was not on locally. We even had decorations in the room…..quite festive and great fun. After getting our hopes dashed in what seemed to always be away games in Dallas we were hot for a win. As the game ended there was jubilation in the room, dancing, hugging and if I recall correctly a few shots down our hatches.
Fun times and what seemed to be the real turn around for the team, and fans.
@Goldie posted:Thought this interesting:
The Green Bay Packers' wide receiving corps is apparently tired of being scapegoated for the team's offensive struggles.
Jeremy Fowler of ESPN reported the criticism of the receivers "isn't sitting well" given Aaron Rodgers' decision to not attend voluntary offseason workouts.
The Green Bay offense has been completely lacking in chemistry all season, with Rodgers going from back-to-back MVP to one of the worst starting quarterbacks in football. Rodgers currently sits 27th among starters in QBR, and his seven interceptions are already the most he's had over a full season since 2016.
No Packers wideout is currently on pace to top 1,000 receiving yards. Allen Lazard leads the team with 427 yards on 30 receptions, but he's been nowhere near a consistently reliable target. Rookies Romeo Doubs and Christian Watson have dealt with injuries and have not been particularly impressive when they've been on the field.
The WRs should watch this .... they spent more time laying on the turf than the Lions ground crew Sunday
The #Packers claimed former #Raiders safety Johnathan Abram off waivers, per source.
— Tom Pelissero (@TomPelissero) November 9, 2022
@Tavis Smiley posted:Am I the only person who gets confused by posts by michiganjoe and MichiganPacker ? Both are very good posters IMO, but I struggle remembering who posts what. I almost had to to a "cut and paste " getting the proper capitalization of their moniker names in here, and I'm still not 100% I got it right.
You probably get confused by Goalline and Goldie too.
@FLPACKER posted:The WRs should watch this .... they spent more time laying on the turf than the Lions ground crew Sunday
Rodgers had a poor game, but this Warner film review is an indictment of Sammy Watkins and Amari Rodgers. They seem to have no idea what to do. That has nothing to do with reps in training camp. That's just a lack of understanding the offense. There's no excuse for either of them. Amari is now a second year player and Watkins should be an experienced veteran.
If I'm Toure and Doubs, I think they have a right to be tired for the scapegoating. They are the ones that needed the reps in the summer and at least they seem to be doing the correct things.
Thanks for posting that FL Packer. What a damning video for the clown show the offense is right now. Watkins is awful and cannot beat press coverage. Lazard can't keep his feet. Our WRs do not run routes correctly. Although I don't like how he's currently handling the partly deserved criticism, I can see why Rodgers doesn't want to take all the blame...
Makes you realize just how good Adams was getting off press coverage .... DBs rarely got a jam on him. It is obvious from the plays Warner showed that at least Watkins, Lazard, Toure have great difficulty with it. Gotta use bunch formations, crossing routes, pick plays to get guys free. Our receivers aren't good enough to get off the LOS and run routes independent of each other. Maybe Cobb and Watson? The others haven't shown it.
@Fedya posted:You probably get confused by Goalline and Goldie too.
One is a cherished token* black poster .
The other a cherished tokin’ poster
*Meant with love and to make the joke work.
@FLPACKER posted:Makes you realize just how good Adams was getting off press coverage .... DBs rarely got a jam on him. It is obvious from the plays Warner showed that at least Watkins, Lazard, Toure have great difficulty with it. Gotta use bunch formations, crossing routes, pick plays to get guys free. Our receivers aren't good enough to get off the LOS and run routes independent of each other. Maybe Cobb and Watson? The others haven't shown it.
Watkins should not get any more snaps. He's not going to suddenly become a polished route runner or develop a improved grasp of offensive principles after close to a decade in the league.
Cobb is a guy that needs to be in motion more often to help him beat press coverage.
Lazard is just not a good enough athlete to be even a consistent NFL WR#2. He's a poor man's James Jones, meaning he's a contributor but not a difference maker.
Watson was playing against guys 12 months ago that are probably selling insurance right now. He is an incredible athlete that now is always lined up across from another incredible athlete (instead of playing against guys that he is vastly physically superior to). To think he was going to have no growing pains with this (even without injuries) was a stretch. His body is also not used to getting hit my guys that are this good. He needs a good year in strength and conditioning program to reduce his chances of getting dinged up by guys this fast and explosive (unlike guys like Jefferson and Chase that are playing against future pros every week in the SEC).
Agree on scheming guys open more, but the Packers receiving core often seems like they can't even run basic route trees correctly. Again, that shouldn't be happening no matter how many reps they have with a QB.
It's also an indictment of MLF and the WRs coach. There are many plays where guys seem to be running patterns directly into each other every week.
Tom Oates captured it well.
Who is this "help" that's going to help Rodgers throw better passes?
more time in the pocket would do wonders, but I don't know where that's coming from.
That Warner video does give me pause to cut Rodgers a little slack, but his attitude and body language still suck. I would cut Watkins today - the film shows he clearly doesn't know what he's doing, and he admitted as much when discussing the last play in the Loins game. Winfree or some other young receiver sitting on someone's practice squad has to offer more than he does.
@MichiganPacker posted:I had to LOL based on current events when I saw that the Cowboys kick returner in the game was Herschel Walker (coming back to Dallas later in his career).
And here I just read Herschel Walker didn't go or do anything to lose.
watching that warner video was enlightening. Our WRs spend more time on the ground than running a route. It is either they really suck or the WR coach cant teach worth a damn. That is embarrasing.
@michiganjoe posted:The #Packers claimed former #Raiders safety Johnathan Abram off waivers, per source.
— Tom Pelissero (@TomPelissero) November 9, 2022
Savage you are on notice. 
He is known as a hard hitter so another ex-Raider for Special Teams.
@FLPACKER posted:Makes you realize just how good Adams was getting off press coverage .... DBs rarely got a jam on him. It is obvious from the plays Warner showed that at least Watkins, Lazard, Toure have great difficulty with it. Gotta use bunch formations, crossing routes, pick plays to get guys free. Our receivers aren't good enough to get off the LOS and run routes independent of each other. Maybe Cobb and Watson? The others haven't shown it.
Dead on FLPACKER. My question is why can't the WRs watch videos of Adams doing it. Loved it when Adams would do that shuffle dance, fake out move then shoot out on his route. Can't that be taught? I saw Watson get jammed hard at the line last week.
I know they aren't as well liked around here anymore but a HEALTHY Cobb and Lazard can get off the line okay. And they have good hands. A little slower nowadays maybe but not ready for pasture. If you ask me.
@Pikes Peak posted:e up with the tackle-eligible play that called for Rodgers to throw the ball to David Bakhtiari, a guy who can barely practice during the week because of the four surgeries he’s had on his left knee?
Yes, I think that's exactly the kind of thing LaFleur would draw up. It's misdirection and something they'd "never think of".
Coaches/coordinators have seen Philly and others do gadget plays successfully that have turned even big games around and they want to be spoken of in those same words or praise.
Heck, Rodgers doesn't like throwing to unreliable receivers where he can't place the ball, so why would he want to throw to a bumbling lineman? Did Rodgers also make up the play throwing to Peppers in the NFCCG under McCarthy?
@The Grinder posted:Dead on FLPACKER. My question is why can't the WRs watch videos of Adams doing it. Loved it when Adams would do that shuffle dance, fake out move then shoot out on his route. Can't that be taught? I saw Watson get jammed hard at the line last week.
I know they aren't as well liked around here anymore but a HEALTHY Cobb and Lazard can get off the line okay. And they have good hands. A little slower nowadays maybe but not ready for pasture. If you ask me.
AR was pressed today regarding problems with the offense and if he wasn't "running the offense as MLF designed it". He opened up quite a bit more (without naming names) and said receivers are still not doing things correctly that are "day one installs". Used as one example "if the route calls for a cut after 7 steps and a guy makes the cut after 5 steps he isn't going to be open". Said coaches are trying a lot of different things to teach and young receivers practice habits are improving but it hasn't shown up on game day. Also talked about the "robotic" aspect of just running the routes, but then the instinctual part of making adjustments; basically said that if they would just run the routes as they are taught they would be making more plays.
In addition to a new OC and OL coach we also have a new WR coach. It is not shocking there could be a glitch in the development of those positions.
@FLPACKER posted:The WRs should watch this .... they spent more time laying on the turf than the Lions ground crew Sunday
Great post, thanks for sharing this. Jesus fuck, that was brutal and tragically comical on so many levels. Sammy earning a free soda each game and nothing more …would be vastly over paying him. Wtf is also with soft ass WR’s going to the ground on apparently a slight breeze ? I can’t.
@FLPACKER posted:AR was pressed today regarding problems with the offense and if he wasn't "running the offense as MLF designed it". He opened up quite a bit more (without naming names) and said receivers are still not doing things correctly that are "day one installs". Used as one example "if the route calls for a cut after 7 steps and a guy makes the cut after 5 steps he isn't going to be open". Said coaches are trying a lot of different things to teach and young receivers practice habits are improving but it hasn't shown up on game day. Also talked about the "robotic" aspect of just running the routes, but then the instinctual part of making adjustments; basically said that if they would just run the routes as they are taught they would be making more plays.
Again, “it’s not my fault, there’s nothing I did wrong.” Rinse, repeat, same shit. Silverstein says it well!
Silverstein: Aaron Rodgers needs a lesson in how to be a leader for his Packers teammates
@FLPACKER posted:AR was pressed today regarding problems with the offense and if he wasn't "running the offense as MLF designed it". He opened up quite a bit more (without naming names) and said receivers are still not doing things correctly that are "day one installs". Used as one example "if the route calls for a cut after 7 steps and a guy makes the cut after 5 steps he isn't going to be open". Said coaches are trying a lot of different things to teach and young receivers practice habits are improving but it hasn't shown up on game day. Also talked about the "robotic" aspect of just running the routes, but then the instinctual part of making adjustments; basically said that if they would just run the routes as they are taught they would be making more plays.
@Grinder
It's not just learning how to do that one isolated move that 17 used to do. It's knowing when and to whom to do it to. You can't just line up and do that move every time you want to run that route. It doesn't work like that. WR's, good WR's, do a lot of setting DB's up on one route so they can spring something else on them on another. Not to mention the adjustments they have to make on the fly while reading the D. Some play designs can get guys open just by their design but that won't work on every play either.
Exactly what AR said . Scheme itself will only get you open if "the exact right play is called vs. the right defense". Most times the WR and the QB must "read" the defense / individual defender, which tells him where to go / what to do. What AR is saying is that guys still aren't even running the scheme correctly let alone reading the defense.
There is not one player or coach above criticism this season. 5 in a row, this team top to bottom fucking stinks from the guy calling the plays to the guy throwing the ball...and everyone in between.
Burn it all down and start over...that includes #10. If he was an NFL QB, we'd know by now. Another Gurt mistake.
Massive organizational failure in the draft not trading both 1s to move up for Olave or Wilson from O$U. Making matters worse was using both 2s to draft Watson and then basically doing a victory lap (similar to Love). Clearly, he’s not ready or used to playing at the NFL level.
Cobb and Big Dog were ARod’s buddies but they also shouldn’t have taken up roster space or gotten a ton of reps.
I’ve been critical of MLF but more and more it sounds like 12 is going off script way too much.
I started watching the Warner video and was finished when he said the one down the middle that was knocked away was not a bad throw. The DB made a good play. But he was only able to make a good play because the ball was short. Idk if Rodgers spoke on that one, but he had plenty of terrible balls regardless of mistakes or bad routes on the part of the WRs. I think we could probably count on two hands the number of times in his career Rodgers made a throw like that where a DBs late finish knocked it away. He's always been great at putting a ball out there where only the WR can go get it. That was a bad ball, which happens. But let's not pretend it was something it was not.
It's perfectly reasonable to hold the WRs to account. They're idiots, it seems. At least the younger guys have the excuse of being young and inexperienced. Watkins? Maybe this is why his career's been in the toilet. Lazard does too many little things well to really have a gripe about his shortcomings. He is what he is, and it's not as a WR1, but he makes plays when he's on the field. I know the injuries and constant shuffling of this group is an issue, but it seemed like the first month of the season they were able to scheme guys open. There was pre-snap movement and even with that the mistakes were not so numerous.
It's been talked about on this board quite a bit, but how much of this is a battle between HC and QB for scheme vs schoolyard ball? The few plays that had impact in the second half on Sunday were very much Rodgers just winging it. The throw to Toure on fourth down...not a great ball but Toure made a nice adjustment to keep them alive. Schoolyard ball. If the QB is only seeing results when he goes off script, it makes sense he would lean toward that in big spots. Problem is he has no Adams and Cobb is out and Lazard is one guy. Rodgers still needs to own the ridiculous throws he made even when the scheme provided opportunity. The ball off the helmet and the Bakh eligible were crushing plays that cannot be blamed on his whipping boys. The mistakes in the passing game are so numerous that there's more blame to spread around than I've seen since Favre was still here. Even when we get done blaming all 11 guys, there's plenty of helpings to still go around. In the previous three years, even when they played poorly, it was never at this level of suck, and most times there was a sense of most guys knowing their role.
Hear AR's response when asked about going "off script" begins at the 13 minute mark
@FLPACKER posted:Hear AR's response when asked about going "off script" begins at the 13 minute mark
He's looking for not robotic sometimes and robotic other times. I don't think any could argue he's not the smartest guy on the offensive side. But it seems if he's following scheme, the throw to DeGuara in the middle should be automatic. The guys around him have certainly been unable to rise to his level. But if that's agreed upon, it seems taking what's given to you should be the default plan. They moved the ball well for a significant part of the game. After 5 straight L's, the game plan should probably be to stack the small successes and build from there. I'm guessing that's what would feel robotic to a hof guy, but the shit you've been doing isn't getting you into the endzone. It should be obvious that the chunk plays they're looking for aren't going to come until they establish something else, anything else, as a basis. It's been astonishing that two guys who won 40 games in 3 years together haven't been able to figure any of this out.
There were plenty of endzone opportunities against Detroit, 12 failed to execute them.
@MichiganPacker posted:No question Aaron Rodgers is showing his age. But in 2012, his WRs were Randall Cobb, Jordy Nelson, James Jones, Greg Jennings & Donald Driver. #Packers’ current WR1 — Allen Lazard — wouldn’t have even made the team. A front office needs to give an aging QB more help, not less.
You mean 12 hasn't forgotten how to play football overnight? Shocking...
The void in talent at WR is disgusting. 12 is literally playing with a bunch of dudes that have no idea what they're doing. The passing game is about timing, rhythm and running precise routes. 12 isn't getting that at all.
It's pretty damn eye opening when you consider GB's "#1 receiver" wouldn't even have made the damn roster 10 years ago.
The Warner video is just sad. Jesus fuck.
