The faults in the Atlanta trade

HenryYou rang?

I keep hearing that Atlanta thinks this is the one piece to put them over the top. In a perfect world, yes, their starting roster looks pretty solid on both sides of the ball and Julio Jones will potentially make a impact.

Problem: you just pissed away your picks to keep adding depth. How much depth does Atlanta really have? What if Atlanta gets popped with half the injuries the Packers dealt with last year? I think they just doomed themselves to having nothing left in the bank as far as depth and having to chase their tail to keep up the skill level.

May peak for 2 years then crash hard. They sure the hell aren't going to have the gravy schedule they had last year.

BTW, Tampa is a flash in the pan. I think they are about a .500 team.

4/30/119:49 AM

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DaleMember

If you just look at the playoff game, there is no way they are 1 player away from the SB. Their D needs plenty of help. That was actually the only playoff game that I had no concern about the outcome. I thought GB would bet PHI and CHI, I knew GB would beat ATL.

4/30/119:55 AM

gbIdahoMember

Agree Hankster. Heard some mumbo jumbo on the radio yesterday that Atlanta felt they could not stretch the field with the personnel they had (sans Roddy White) with Gonzalez losing speed and Turner a power back. Granted yes, the Jones pick gives them the potential to stretch the field -- but their real weakness - the defense, was neglected and they also lost bullets in the gun with giving up the picks in this and next year's draft. Some folks like the brass it took to make that trade and pick. I guess time will tell.

4/30/119:55 AM

HenryYou rang?

To me it's a Snyderbrenner move. To me it says you really don't know your team.

4/30/119:58 AM

barristerMember

Agreed. Terrible trade. The type of trade that can set a team back a few years. Considering that Atlanta was looking like one of those teams that could challenge the Packers for the NFC crown over the next few years, I loved seeing them give away all of those draft picks to an AFC team. Sure, they got another playmaker on offense, so their offense may improve. But in the process, they essentially gave up 4 players that could help their defense, either as starters or quality backups. Like you said, depth is key. Exhibit A: 2010 Packers.

Apparently Atlanta forgot how Rodgers & Co. hung 48 on them. While our defese did well againt their offense, at the end of the day, it was their defense that failed to even keep them in the game. We didn't punt the entire game.

I have a co-worker who is a Falcons fan. He is not happy about the trade. Most sane Falcon fans feel the same. Here was one of our exchanges:
"Did you see some of the footage with the draft picks celebrating with their friends and family after their name was called?"
"Yeah."
"Well did you see the one of Holmgren & Co. in the Browns' warroom, after their trade with the dirty birds?"

4/30/119:59 AM

barristerMember

I kept looking at the camera in the Falcons' warroom, expecting to see Synder and Mike Ditka hanging out in the corner.

4/30/1110:00 AM

TschmackMember

When have those types of deals worked out?

I go back to Dallas trading multiple picks for Roy Williams. They got Brandon Pettigrew and Derrick Williams and Aaron Brown out of it.

More importantly, it allowed Detroit to get Stafford and Delmas and still add those other guys.

4/30/1110:01 AM

barristerMember

For the record, I would not be shocked if Cobb turns out to be a better pro than Jones.

4/30/1110:03 AM

CoachAt the head of the table

quote:
Originally posted by Henry:
To me it's a Snyderbrenner move. To me it says you really don't know your team.

Not really. They just completely over-reacted to the beatdown the Packers gave them.

Playoff hangover driving Falcons

They're in a bit of denial about it, too.

"We're not one player away"

They turned that team around using primarily the draft and a couple of FA signings, and this move flies in the face of that.

If the 2010 rules are in place, the FA talent pool on defense isn't likely to be as rich as they may have hoped it would be either.

4/30/1110:58 AM

vitafloMember

Two 1st round picks, a 2nd round pick and two 4th round picks. For one guy. Look over the last two years for the packers. Those picks would have netted something like Matthews, Bulaga, Neal, Lang and Quarless. Would you trade all of those guys for Julio Jones?

The whole "must win this year" mentality is stupid. The Vikings are proof that mortgaging the future to try to win it all *now* tends to blow up in your face for years to come. I'd much rather compete every year. As the Pack showed, all you need is the chance and a hot streak, not another WR.

4/30/1111:09 AM

The GBP RulesMember

"Supposedly" they are signing Ray Edwards. Even at that they still have nobody to play coverage.

Some disagreed with me but I felt that team was overrated all year. They got every bounce possible and did not have many injuries, just look at the 1st Saints game, the 49ers game and the Ravens game. They were closer to a 9 or 10 win team than a 13 win team. Sure I didn't think the Packers would mop the field up with them but out of the 4 playoff games that was the one I really was not worried about. I just felt the Packers were head and shoulders better. Bucs/Saints will likely finish ahead of them in that division.

I read something according to the draft chart that they only got screwed by 100 points. But that does not take into account the fact that it seriously kills depth. Those 4 other picks they gave up (not counting their 1st rounder that they swapped) 1 or 2 could have been major impact players for them in the years to come.

Julio Jones will likely be a very good player. But at the cost of 4 other guys I'm not sure it's worth it. I find it interesting teams are unwilling to give up a 1st and 2nd rounder for a proven star player but they're willing to give up 2 firsts, 2 fourths and a second rounder for a guy who has never played a down.

4/30/1111:10 AM

SmedleyMember

I thought it was funny when one of the talking heads said that Atlanta made the trade to get a receiver because of what Green Bay did to them in the playoffs. Um...the Packers scored 48 points. Does this guy play defense too?

4/30/1111:33 AM

H5Keyboard Warrior, troll hunter

quote:
Originally posted by Coach:
Not really. They just completely over-reacted to the beatdown the Packers gave them.

This was my initial thought, complete desperation move. Surprisingly, I have not heard or read (media types) any comments to this effect.

They went all-in on an offense that was already pretty good, and now they will not have the defense to compete at the top.

IMO, NO took back that division Thursday.

4/30/1111:37 AM

The GBP RulesMember

quote:
Originally posted by Smedley:
I thought it was funny when one of the talking heads said that Atlanta made the trade to get a receiver because of what Green Bay did to them in the playoffs. Um...the Packers scored 48 points. Does this guy play defense too?

Good point - if it had been Patrick Peterson it still is too much, but if Peterson does indeed live up to all the hype surrounding him it's much better value. But for a WR I just don't get that at all. There are a lot more big time WR in the league than true shut down corners. Many of them have been late first round and beyond picks (Jennings, White, Dwayne Bowe, Reggie Wayne, etc). Only top 10 guys I can think of that are studs are Fitzgerald and Johnson.

Tedy Bruschi just nailed it. He goes "48-21 and Julio Jones doesn't play defense last I checked".

4/30/1111:38 AM

HenryYou rang?

quote:
Originally posted by The GBP Rules:
"Supposedly" they are signing Ray Edwards. Even at that they still have nobody to play coverage.

Some disagreed with me but I felt that team was overrated all year. They got every bounce possible and did not have many injuries, just look at the 1st Saints game, the 49ers game and the Ravens game. They were closer to a 9 or 10 win team than a 13 win team. Sure I didn't think the Packers would mop the field up with them but out of the 4 playoff games that was the one I really was not worried about. I just felt the Packers were head and shoulders better. Bucs/Saints will likely finish ahead of them in that division.

I read something according to the draft chart that they only got screwed by 100 points. But that does not take into account the fact that it seriously kills depth. Those 4 other picks they gave up (not counting their 1st rounder that they swapped) 1 or 2 could have been major impact players for them in the years to come.

Julio Jones will likely be a very good player. But at the cost of 4 other guys I'm not sure it's worth it. I find it interesting teams are unwilling to give up a 1st and 2nd rounder for a proven star player but they're willing to give up 2 firsts, 2 fourths and a second rounder for a guy who has never played a down.

Completely agree. Saints had a down year and injury issues. The NFC South was playing the "mighty" AFC West and NFC West and two games against Carolina.

They are a good team but overrated and they just let the future slip through their fingers. Saints should win the division easily.

4/30/1111:51 AM

TschmackMember

ATL did play within a competitive NFC South division, but their schedule outside of the division was really weak. The tough teams they did play either beat them (i.e. Pittsburgh or Philly) or should have beaten them (i.e. Green Bay or Baltimore) but were close losses.

The Falcons were 22nd overall last year against the pass. They got exposed when playing teams that could throw the ball.

Julio Jones is a good player but that's an awful lot to give up for one guy that wasn't even the best prospect at his position.

4/30/1111:53 AM

TDMember

As I said before, he's comparable to JJ Stokes in so many areas and Atlanta overpaid just like the Niners did.

Good for Matty Icecream. He'll have another excuse when the Fulcons blow.

4/30/1111:55 AM

18c3vMember

Rookies are not usually impact players in their first year. Even if Jones turns out to be a great WR, it is a longshot that he will really scare anyone as a rookie. Everybody points to Randy Moss's first season, but he was an exception. Most guys take a year or two to get going. If they think their window is now, they should be looking at high priced FA's (whenever free agency finally gets started).

4/30/1112:14 PM

Armored N.O. SaintMember

quote:
Originally posted by Henry:
I keep hearing that Atlanta thinks this is the one piece to put them over the top. In a perfect world, yes, their starting roster looks pretty solid on both sides of the ball and Julio Jones will potentially make a impact.

Problem: you just pissed away your picks to keep adding depth. How much depth does Atlanta really have? What if Atlanta gets popped with half the injuries the Packers dealt with last year? I think they just doomed themselves to having nothing left in the bank as far as depth and having to chase their tail to keep up the skill level.

May peak for 2 years then crash hard. They sure the hell aren't going to have the gravy schedule they had last year.

BTW, Tampa is a flash in the pan. I think they are about a .500 team.

Agreed, Henry. Jones is a helluva pick, but you don't mortgage a big part of your future to get him. As has been said before, the Falcons' problems are on the other side of the ball. Aaron Rodgers slashed their secondary to ribbons.

4/30/1112:25 PM

TDMember

Mike Sherman's moniker. Piss away second rounders to move up in Round 1 for a guy who will still be there.

4/30/111:49 PM

StarrToDowlerMember

My bad. I thought this thread was about Favre.

4/30/112:25 PM

IL_Pack_FanMember

quote:
Originally posted by vitaflo:
Two 1st round picks, a 2nd round pick and two 4th round picks. For one guy. Look over the last two years for the packers.

That's what gets me about draft day trades like this. I'm not even sure the Lions could get a package like that for Calvin Johnson right now, and Atlanta just dropped that on potential.

4/30/112:40 PM

LegacyMember

quote:
Originally posted by Smedley:
I thought it was funny when one of the talking heads said that Atlanta made the trade to get a receiver because of what Green Bay did to them in the playoffs. Um...the Packers scored 48 points. Does this guy play defense too?

I guess he's so good he's going to help them score 58? (He'd better be, at that price!)

4/30/115:28 PM

lambeausouthMember

Only thing this thread is missing is a pic of Mike Smith in a tux, and Julio Jones in a wedding dress.

4/30/115:48 PM

Armored N.O. SaintMember

quote:
Originally posted by lambeausouth:
Only thing this thread is missing is a pic of Mike Smith in a tux, and Julio Jones in a wedding dress.

I'd rather see that than the Falcons' annoying-as-hell NFL "Play 60" commercial.

4/30/115:51 PM

lambeausouthMember

I just imagine the Falcon players on that same bus after getting their asses handed to them by the Packers. I don't imagine any music playing, or heads bobbing.

4/30/115:53 PM

Armored N.O. SaintMember

After the way the Falcons played against the Packers, short bus is more like it.

4/30/115:59 PM

TDMember

Saints are going to own the Falcons this year and hopefully the Bucs do to.

4/30/116:15 PM

CoachAt the head of the table

quote:
Originally posted by Armored N.O. Saint:
quote:
Originally posted by lambeausouth:
Only thing this thread is missing is a pic of Mike Smith in a tux, and Julio Jones in a wedding dress.

I'd rather see that than the Falcons' annoying-as-hell NFL "Play 60" commercial.

I was tortured with that all season.

The one good part is Arthur Blank trying to bob his head to the "music".

4/30/116:20 PM

Diggr14Member

I wonder what the package was that they were offering the Bengals for AJ Green was. Had to be more than this one... clearly they are over reacting with this move. Did they like both guys the same? Or were they over reacting to a playoff loss in hope to get that "playmaker".

You have to question giving up 2 1sts a 2nd and 2 fourths for Jones. I doubt they'd give up that much for Greg Jennings... which makes you wonder what the hell they are thinking sometimes in the NFL.

4/30/116:22 PM

titmfatiedNo Code

I think there's a good chance they'll be targeting James Jones as well.

4/30/116:27 PM

CoachAt the head of the table

quote:
Originally posted by titmfatied:
I think there's a good chance they'll be targeting James Jones as well.

I'm not so sure about that.

They're going to have to spend big to sign Julio Jones (depending on how rookie cap shakes if there is one), and Roddy White is making large dollars.

To get James Jones, I would imagine it's going to take at least #2 WR money. They still have Jenkins too, although he could be released to save money.

They're also going to have to spend to get defensive help too....

I think James Jones ends up someplace else, but that's just speculation.

4/30/116:34 PM

NJWISMember

quote:
Originally posted by titmfatied:
I think there's a good chance they'll be targeting James Jones as well.

so you think JJ is going to go from being the #3 on the packers to #3 on the falcons?

I wonder where you guys think this stuff up.

4/30/117:15 PM

artisMember

Beyond what's already been talked about, I have major reservations that Matt Ryan is the guy to put the ball out to 2 big WR threats. He makes his living off checkdowns, and Tramon exposed his weak arm before halftime in the playoffs. You can have an embarrassment of riches on the outside, but if you lack the big armed QB to get the ball to them, that threat can be minimized.

4/30/118:15 PM

PackerJoeMember

I thought it was a stupid trade too. It might have made a bit more sense if the guy they landed was Patrick Peterson, because problems with the defensive backfield was the biggest reason they got knocked out of the playoffs.

As far as potential depth issues, that can always be fixed through signing a couple free agents. For some reason there is still this perception that free agency is about the Julius Peppers-type signings, but teams can use free agency in other ways.

I still definitely prefer Thompson's approach more than the other approaches, the way he stocks the team with young players and doesn't give out big contracts to players that will become fat and lazy with the money in the bank. But there are other ways to put a roster together and be successful. In the four drafts prior to this one, the Jets drafted a total of 17 players (only 4 per draft), and they were picking 30th this year and picked 29th last year, so their minimalist approach to the draft has worked for them.

5/1/118:00 AM

HerschelMember

quote:
Originally posted by Henry:
To me it's a Snyderbrenner move. To me it says you really don't know your team.

I don't get that impression, I just think it's an over-reaction to the philosophy of making one unit great while the other make good (enough). I don't think their defense is good enough. When you give up 45 points in a playoff game, your problem wasn't your offense. (although the turnover was absolutely a HUGE part of it)

5/1/119:31 AM

H5Keyboard Warrior, troll hunter

It's a move a desperation which could be classified as Snyderesque, Jones-like, or something Sherman would do.

5/1/1110:36 AM

turnip bloodMember

Fans tend to over value first round choices and under value the later rounds. This move seems so amateurish that I suspect that the under wanted, perhaps for now other reason to put butts in seats.

5/1/1110:39 AM

Rusty42 inch pythons brother!

quote:
It's a move a desperation which could be classified as Snyderesque, Jones-like, or something Sherman would do.

Not that drastic. Sherman would have traded a #2, a bunch of 3rd day picks for a backup, and then sign said backup to an 8-year 100-brazilian dollar contract.

5/1/1110:51 AM