And here I thought Darren Sharper was no longer a Packer. Little did I know he morphed into a TE who is still convinced he's the greatest thing since sliced bread.
That YOTTO crap can go away now. Franchise him. See what he does in 2012. If he cant cut it then another team can deal with him and that ego.
quote:Originally posted by Fandame:
And I agree with whoever said they didn't like to see Rodgers blaming every route on Finley. It does remind me of Favre, and I hope Rodgers is a better leader than that.
I'd agree with that if I didn't see Finley not be where Rodgers thought he would be in several games now. Rodgers has said time and again he can live with players getting beat, dropping passes, etc, but that the mental mistakes is what really irk him. Finely's hesitation was that mental mistake, he should have made a clean cut and in. I'm guessing at this point Rodgers is not giving him the benefit of the doubt anymore like he did Jennings, who is obviously more consistant.
For another example of inconsistency leading to loss of patience with Rodgers, see James Starks.
This is where ROTTT comes in; Ted will have to make some cold hearted decision this offseason. Before I guess what Ted would do a review of where the rest of the league is at needs to be done. From what I understand the CBS rules about spending 99% of the cap will not be full implemented until the 2013 season. Next season will be the last opportunity for teams to improve their bottom line by not spending up to the cap limit.
There are more free Agents this year than ever has been; I think the number is greater than 200 perhaps as much as 1/3 of all players.
From what little I know about other teams fincial postions Ted may just let Finley test the market.
There are more free Agents this year than ever has been; I think the number is greater than 200 perhaps as much as 1/3 of all players.
From what little I know about other teams fincial postions Ted may just let Finley test the market.
quote:Yeah, Rodgers may get the blamed for that last incomplete to #88. But if you watch the replay, Finley comes out of his break and stutter steps (for a blink of an eye) and then the pass is catchable but a little out of reach.
Exactly.... He didnt run the route all the way through as #12 expected and it led to the ball being a step in front of him.. If he runs his route, that hits him in stride and he has some nice YAC.
I'm not sure why some are determined to assign all the blame to Finley on that play when there's plenty to go around. AR was off all day and needs to throw a better ball in that situation.
As long as the contract is reasonable, then re-sign him. Talk of a franchise tag and big contracts should be off the table before free agency even starts.
"Hi, my name is DJ. You'll be seeing a lot of me next season."
quote:Originally posted by Goalline:
Finley is only 24.
Exactly.
Who's to say he would have even caught it if that pass hit him in the numbers
The biggest need the Packers have is another pass rushing threat from either the DE position or the OLB position opposite CMIII.
If franchising Finley and dealing him helps get us to that point (i.e. for a draft pick) then I'm all for it. Finley can certainly help this team, but for whatever reason he's not been the same player since coming back from injury.
The other way I look at this is that if you said name me the 10 best TEs in the league - who else comes to mind? Gronk, Gates, Graham, Davis, and probably Hernandez jump out right away. Then other guys like Pettigrew and Gonzales, Heath Miller, Witten, Dallas Clark come up. Heck, you could make a case that Owen Daniels and Jake Ballard are just as good.
The point of this is that if Finley played for another team would he make your Top 10 list? He might, but it wouldn't be tough to name 10 other TEs in this league that are just as effective (or not better).
If franchising Finley and dealing him helps get us to that point (i.e. for a draft pick) then I'm all for it. Finley can certainly help this team, but for whatever reason he's not been the same player since coming back from injury.
The other way I look at this is that if you said name me the 10 best TEs in the league - who else comes to mind? Gronk, Gates, Graham, Davis, and probably Hernandez jump out right away. Then other guys like Pettigrew and Gonzales, Heath Miller, Witten, Dallas Clark come up. Heck, you could make a case that Owen Daniels and Jake Ballard are just as good.
The point of this is that if Finley played for another team would he make your Top 10 list? He might, but it wouldn't be tough to name 10 other TEs in this league that are just as effective (or not better).
Finley's staying unless TT can rob someone trade-wise after he's been re-signed. How many games this year did we see defenses contorting themselves to try and take him away and thus opening it up for other receivers? Jordy Nelson certainly benefited from this (although Jordy generally made the plays when they were there to be made). I like the other TEs on the roster but they're not JF in terms of potential. Silver lining is all this is that Finley's play this season makes him affordable.
I think Rodgers timing was off with all of his receivers. This probably a result of him not having played in a real game since before Christmas. I still am upset about him not playing, at least a quarter, in that final game. I agree the time off helps heal your injured players, but ARod wasn't injured, and IMO would have benefited more from some playing time.
I say franchise Finley, trade Rodgers and sign Flynn to a major contract.
I say franchise Finley, trade Rodgers and sign Flynn to a major contract.
quote:Originally posted by Goalline:
Finley is only 24.
This.
Finley gets tagged, and then maybe traded. Can't see Thompson letting him go for nothing.
Rob Gronkowski NWE 16 90 1327
Jimmy Graham NOR 16 99 1310
Jason Witten DAL 16 79 942
Aaron Hernandez NWE 14 79 910
Tony Gonzalez ATL 16 80 875
Dustin Keller NYJ 16 65 815
Brent Celek PHI 16 62 811
Fred Davis WAS 12 59 796
Vernon Davis SFO 16 67 792
Antonio Gates SDG 13 64 778
Brandon Pettigrew DET 16 83 777
Jermichael Finley GNB 16 55 767
Kellen Winslow TAM 16 75 763
Jared Cook TEN 16 49 759
Owen Daniels HOU 15 54 677
Top 15 yardage TE's.
How many is yadda really better than
Jimmy Graham NOR 16 99 1310
Jason Witten DAL 16 79 942
Aaron Hernandez NWE 14 79 910
Tony Gonzalez ATL 16 80 875
Dustin Keller NYJ 16 65 815
Brent Celek PHI 16 62 811
Fred Davis WAS 12 59 796
Vernon Davis SFO 16 67 792
Antonio Gates SDG 13 64 778
Brandon Pettigrew DET 16 83 777
Jermichael Finley GNB 16 55 767
Kellen Winslow TAM 16 75 763
Jared Cook TEN 16 49 759
Owen Daniels HOU 15 54 677
Top 15 yardage TE's.
How many is yadda really better than
I realize production drives price in this game, but lets not confuse stats with talent. Even as frustrating of a player as he is, there's maybe 3 guys on that list who compare with what he's capable of.
None of those teams - not even NO - spread the ball around like this offense. There certainly may be an argument that that lowers his value to this team in particular, but lets not question whether he belongs with the top 15 at his position from a talent perspective.
None of those teams - not even NO - spread the ball around like this offense. There certainly may be an argument that that lowers his value to this team in particular, but lets not question whether he belongs with the top 15 at his position from a talent perspective.
Waiting for Finley to break out will be like waiting for farve to retire.
I would take a 50 year old Tony Gonzalez or a 40 year old Antonio Gates over him in a second
At age 24, I think its crazy to even consider letting him go. I understand the frustration at his drops, and I think he's pretty full of himself, but with Driver likely gone, Jennings in a contract year in 2012, I think keeping Finley around is crucial to the future passing game. I think Rodgers and Finley will be playing pitch and catch in several super bowls to come. Like my aunt Naji used to say about me, he's a moron, but he's our moron.
ESPN says the whiteboard in the Giants locker room said "Play physical football and beat the hell out of number 88"
Telling that the player they wanted to focus on was Finley. At 24 years old, he is a talent, and the Packers aren't going to let him leave. Hopefully next year, instead of boasting about "taking over", he just goes out there and let's his play do the talking.
Telling that the player they wanted to focus on was Finley. At 24 years old, he is a talent, and the Packers aren't going to let him leave. Hopefully next year, instead of boasting about "taking over", he just goes out there and let's his play do the talking.
I just think Finley has lost his confidence and may never get it back in Green Bay. Just too many games with multiple drops can do that to you and loose the faith from the fans. He is a talent but may need a change of scenery at our cost.
quote:Originally posted by LJames:
Like my aunt Naji used to say about me, he's a moron, but he's our moron.
Aunt Naji sounds like a real bitch.
Incidently, after a night of sleeping on it, I've come back to the conclusion that Finley is a guy to keep. And, yes, he has been infuriating at times with his lapses in focus.
so the Giants specifically identified one player to concentrate on...
Yes they did.
And they also chose to take their best pass rusher, JPP and have him disrupt that one player instead of going all-out after Rodgers
And they also chose to take their best pass rusher, JPP and have him disrupt that one player instead of going all-out after Rodgers
True, but he is the only one who had the drops in a ton of games all year long.quote:Originally posted by who:
No, don't get rid of Finley. He wasn't the only one dropping balls last night.
He got served some humble pie last night. Hopefully, he'll be smart enough to eat some.
Not sure where the "official" stat is, but the top 5 guys for drops were...
1 Roddy White Atl 15
2t Dwayne Bowe KC 12
2t Greg Little Cle 12
2t Brandon Marshall Mia 12
5 Jermichael Finley 11
(next TE would be Dallas Clark with 9)
That is pretty bad, not the top 5 you want to be in. I think it is actually worse when you look at targets and see the percentage of dropped balls.
White (181) 8.2%
Bowe (141) 8.5%
Little (121) 9.9%
Marshall (145) 8.2%
Finley (93) 11.8%
Confirms what we already knew, he dropped the ball way to much this year. So he sucks, right?
Jennings (101) 43
Nelson (96) 47
Finley (93) 44
First number is targets, the second is first downs. It's really no wonder this offense did well, those guys know how to make those catches count. That ranks then 20th, 28th and 31st in the league. Maybe with one of them out those numbers just go up to league leaders for the other two, maybe not. Maybe first downs is a useless way to evaluate a pass catcher.
PS- Jordy Nelson had a 14% drop percentage last year, but didn't have a noteworthy tweet, so he's OK.
1 Roddy White Atl 15
2t Dwayne Bowe KC 12
2t Greg Little Cle 12
2t Brandon Marshall Mia 12
5 Jermichael Finley 11
(next TE would be Dallas Clark with 9)
That is pretty bad, not the top 5 you want to be in. I think it is actually worse when you look at targets and see the percentage of dropped balls.
White (181) 8.2%
Bowe (141) 8.5%
Little (121) 9.9%
Marshall (145) 8.2%
Finley (93) 11.8%
Confirms what we already knew, he dropped the ball way to much this year. So he sucks, right?
Jennings (101) 43
Nelson (96) 47
Finley (93) 44
First number is targets, the second is first downs. It's really no wonder this offense did well, those guys know how to make those catches count. That ranks then 20th, 28th and 31st in the league. Maybe with one of them out those numbers just go up to league leaders for the other two, maybe not. Maybe first downs is a useless way to evaluate a pass catcher.
PS- Jordy Nelson had a 14% drop percentage last year, but didn't have a noteworthy tweet, so he's OK.
The issue with Finley is whether his potential has been or can be fully utilized. It is hard to say if his knee injury in 2010 was a factor in his decline this year or not - even Grant took a long time to regain his prior form. Quarless was developing nicely until his injury. If Quarless had stayed healthy, I would be more willing to let Finley walk. I agree with those who say to franchise Finley and let him prove he is a top 5 TE.
Lots of folks say that..."Quarless was progressing nicely before the injury". Really? He was almsost a non factor in the passing game all season, and last season when he was the starter by default he wasn't much of one either. He did lay a couple of nice chip blocks on edge rushers as I recall.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not ready to throw him out with the bath water. I don't think he's anywhere near Finley in terms of being a weapon in this offense, though. Not by a longshot.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not ready to throw him out with the bath water. I don't think he's anywhere near Finley in terms of being a weapon in this offense, though. Not by a longshot.
yup
Q was a beast as a blocker and a damn nice #2
Q was a beast as a blocker and a damn nice #2
Immaturity is at the heart of Finley's problems. There's a 100% cure rate for that.
And his crappy season is exactly why you sign him. His price just went down.
And his crappy season is exactly why you sign him. His price just went down.
Finley and Rodgers need to sit down and have a talk. Rodgers gets on his case a lot (not that he doesn't deserve it most of the time), and Finley needs to air out his grievances against Rodgers that he mentioned earlier as them not being on the same page. If they can get squared away, then I see Finley getting his mojo back and contributing. If not, then Finley needs a new address.
I also think it would help Finley an awful lot to quit with the sophomoric "fin" thing he does after getting any sort of decent reception. I don't think it fits well with the Packers' being a class organization, and I don't know that Rodgers sees it as productive; after all, Rodgers got him the ball but you don't see him "rodgering" down the field. Ditto for his YOTTO schtick -- you have to produce a whole lot better before you can "take over."
All I know is that I was sick to see him do "the fin" after his one decent reception yesterday when I think we were down on the scoreboard.
Sign him to two years at decent pay with incentives. If he reaches them, he'll score big bucks two years down the road when he's still only 26; if not, then it's on him, and we don't break the bank for his talent but lack of production.
I also think it would help Finley an awful lot to quit with the sophomoric "fin" thing he does after getting any sort of decent reception. I don't think it fits well with the Packers' being a class organization, and I don't know that Rodgers sees it as productive; after all, Rodgers got him the ball but you don't see him "rodgering" down the field. Ditto for his YOTTO schtick -- you have to produce a whole lot better before you can "take over."
All I know is that I was sick to see him do "the fin" after his one decent reception yesterday when I think we were down on the scoreboard.
Sign him to two years at decent pay with incentives. If he reaches them, he'll score big bucks two years down the road when he's still only 26; if not, then it's on him, and we don't break the bank for his talent but lack of production.
I don't find "the fin" any more obnoxious than "the belt". I just want him to catch the ball more.
Two things: 1) Rodgers doesn't even do "the belt" any more, and 2) Rodgers never did "the belt" after throwing a simple 15-yard pass for a first down. He only did it after touchdowns. If Finley kept his "fin" to only after scoring, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.
I'm from the Barry Sanders school of play: let your play do the talking, not your antics.
I'm from the Barry Sanders school of play: let your play do the talking, not your antics.
The celebrations don't bug me, I'm actually excited when he does it because it means he caught a pass. If guys are producing, they can dance all they want (provided they don't get flagged).
Correct me if I'm wrong, but AR only did the belt after RUNNING for a TD. And that was last season.
I'm still not convinced they won't franchise Wells. They've clearly made no progress towards a contract and there's no back-up plan/heir.
There's also a Transition Tag to think about. Maybe Finley gets franchises, Wells gets the transition tag, or the other way around. Either way, I think the lack of a contract for Wells is far and away the most interesting free agent storyline of the offseason for the Packers.
There's also a Transition Tag to think about. Maybe Finley gets franchises, Wells gets the transition tag, or the other way around. Either way, I think the lack of a contract for Wells is far and away the most interesting free agent storyline of the offseason for the Packers.