Giants Pos/Neg Discussion

Completely outcoached. Timeout usage bit them. Passive defense.

- Offense

-- Defense

--- Play calling

+ maybe a dose of reality

+ First Half

- Second Half

I'm seeing a pattern here.

Royce Newman’s time as a starter maybe up after today.  Getting run over by Dexter Lawrence to force a sack to take the Pack out of scoring range just fed into the Giants’ momentum.

This is not a playoff team.

+

Nothing of note.

-

Packers appear to be pretenders rather than contenders.

MLF outcoached every week

Joe Barry

Royce Newman is not a starting caliber NFL player

Darnell Savage- see Royce Newman above. Savage gets worse every year. He's fast but can't tackle and can't cover

Joe's Barry's seat needs to be getting warm if it isn't.

Game turned when this guy got trucked

-Dumb ass team 2 sacks wiped out by penalties. Key first down given by dumb ass penalty

@michiganjoe posted:

Joe's Barry's seat needs to be getting warm if it isn't.

I couldn't agree more but there is no way MLF will make a change during the season. He showed his complete incompetence with how he handled the Drayton situation last year.

+++Cobb played well. BIG DOG

---Defense on the ropes, all game. 3 bombs by AROD to go 3 and out, on one drive. Lack of Dillon, late. Is it Love time, yet? NYG's run game defense is not good, so we pass to covered receivers. Up 20- 3, at one point,  to lose 27 - 22.

- - - - - - -

Green Bay does not know how to play defense and has not known how to play it for 11+ seasons.

The Pack were healthy on defense today, the Giants were not.

The Giants played aggressive defense, and the Packers played their typical sit-back and wait for the other team to make a mistake BS approach to defense.

This is a deep-rooted failure of the organization that has spanned now 3 different (bad) defensive coordinators. This soft, bend don't break, passive approach to defense is apparently what the organization wants out of its defense.

No matter how many 1st round picks the organization spends on the defense, it is still fundamentally flawed.

Players and coaches really need to figure out what and who they are.  I get the QB is making some serious coin but it’s not a bad thing to run the ball and take the will out if defense.  Kind of what happens to this defense far far routinely.

- Savage - and the fifth-year option makes him hard to jettison and may cost them Amos.

- Fredokunst - Throw 12 picks at an offensive line and can't get a decent starting five.

- Fredokunst - Make sure you're lacking talent and experience at receiver when try to hit the tail end of your window.

- MLF - Outcoached and outmaneuvered throughout the second half.

- Joe Dingleberry - That bit of turd hanging around and serving no purpose. Finally given tools the previous coordinators weren't and doing even less. 

- Royce Newman - Caleb Schlauderaff reincarnated.

- Fredokunst - no pass rusher depth worth a shit showed in the second half.

This defense has the talent use it.  What the fuck are you sitting back waiting.   Guys wide open by 15 yards would be enough fo me to fire Barry today. 

This team should probably be 1-4. They’ve had all the breaks go their way.

+++ Special Teams, Cobb

--- Play calling, DC are a joke. Savage is Ha Ha Clinton-Dix. Amari Rodgers couldn't play in the USFL. NFL loves parity, and referees are way too much a determining factor. This bend don't break defense is chickenshit coaching that allows the DC to lay the blame on the players.

-I listened to the game, I love Wayne and Rock but dam is Wayne getting crabby in his old age.

-I agree with the Savage comments-just watching the brief highlights is enough to see how badly he played this AM. Ha Ha Clinton Dix redux

+  - it's early  yet and the games have been competitive ....but it is rough knowing the future mortgage coming due for the shot this season was to give

Jones and Dillon, 19 carries. Rodgers, 39 passes.

Can you imagine a Tom Brady quarterbacked team ignoring its strengths like that? Rodgers is done as a championship QB.

+
no major injuries

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Everything else.  Totally uninspired coaching and play.  With less talent than we have, we got completely outplayed and outcoached by the Giants.  The Giants!

A few observations.  Newman and Amari need to be cut.  Surely we can find upgrades.  Time for Savage to ride the bench and give someone else a try.  Maybe move Alexander to the star position, Rasul  is way better outside.  Alexander can play anywhere.  I’m starting to think Stenovich is over matched.  Ever since Jerry Gray took over for Berry last year for that one game, I’ve thought he’s the better DC.

@Goalline posted:

Jones and Dillon, 19 carries. Rodgers, 39 passes.

Obscene.

@ilcuqui posted:

Obscene.

Same exact shit happened with Bert on his way out. Once they're the hero it's tough to get them to play within the offense

@Goalline posted:

Jones and Dillon, 19 carries. Rodgers, 39 passes.

Can you imagine a Tom Brady quarterbacked team ignoring its strengths like that? Rodgers is done as a championship QB.

The only way Rodgers wins a title at this point would be to have a team around him like the 2015 Broncos had.  Our defense isn’t in the same stratosphere as that one was though.

The hype  about this 2022 defense just seems like it was just a fantasy at this point.  They looked good against a Bucs team missing their top 3 WRs and 2 starters on the O-Line.  That’s it though, that’s the only game the Pack’s D was at least decent.  Even against that awful Bears offense I was shocked how easily the Bears running game gashed them.

@WolfPack posted:

Same exact shit happened with Bert on his way out. Once they're the hero it's tough to get them to play within the offense

It's not like he was calling audibles all day. That was the game plan.

Who *isn't* crabby with that Packers performance today?

Wow, not good. D sounds discouraged

@itszacharyj:  Some players in the locker room — including Jaire Alexander — were talking about potentially losing next week to the Jets. "We've got to check ourselves on that because that's not winning football," said Aaron Rodgers. "Ja's my guy, but we don't need to be talking about that."

The problem with the NFL is that everything is on tape.  Teams have figured out GBs defense and they’ve figured out MLF and his tendencies.  

Given how done Russ Wilson appears the Packers completely fucked up not trading Rodgers to Denver for multiple 1sts and/or players because I’m not sure this team is much of a threat with or without 12.

@ilcuqui posted:

Wow, not good. D sounds discouraged

@itszacharyj:  Some players in the locker room — including Jaire Alexander — were talking about potentially losing next week to the Jets. "We've got to check ourselves on that because that's not winning football," said Aaron Rodgers. "Ja's my guy, but we don't need to be talking about that."

That's frustration on the game plan by both sides of the ball. Alexander must be going out of his mind. He talked before about being like Woodson and being able to blitz the quarterback. Not in this defense.

They paid Douglas and Jaire to be cover corners.  They drafted Stokes the same way.  Let them D up and stop this zone shit.  

Is it possible to be conservative with contracts and injuries but aggressive with defense?

It's possible the NFL has figured out the Packer Jet sweep.

There has to be a counter to that play to keep defenses honest.  I know people are pissed 12 threw as much as he did (with a line that could not block), but damn if I wouldn't love a screen here and there

@"We"-Ka-Bong posted:

It's possible the NFL has figured out the Packer Jet sweep.

There has to be a counter to that play to keep defenses honest.  I know people are pissed 12 threw as much as he did (with a line that could not block), but damn if I wouldn't love a screen here and there

They did that on the TD to Mercedes Lewis.

@antiworst posted:

That's frustration on the game plan by both sides of the ball. Alexander must be going out of his mind. He talked before about being like Woodson and being able to blitz the quarterback. Not in this defense.

Wasn't there a moment last season where Barry had to be told by his own guys and MLF to switch things up? They had a stretch against I believe Seattle and Arizona where things started clicking. And as they came down the stretch the same stagnance reared its head again.

There's no excuse for this defense to not hit the ground running this year. The talent is there. I find it hard to believe that guys like Jaire and Douglas and Stokes can't handle the slop at wr for the NYG. Put your guys in position to make plays and utilize their strengths. As it stands right now, the most marginal of offenses are dictating everything against this unit.

Given travel back to the States and early Sunday game i expect the Jets won’t be a pushover.  It’s quickly becoming put up or shut up time for the Packers.

Anyone else get the feeling that the whole quarterback/coach respect thing is a one way street on this team?

This is the NFL...there are no pushovers.

This kind of feels like the Cardinals loss where MM was fired afterwards. Going to be tough for the team to recoup on the flight and be ready for the Jets. Should be a gimmie, but so was this one… especially up 20-10*.

Couple of bigger issues for me....

- How much talent and first round picks have to be on the defense before they are worth a shit?  This absolutely has to be scheme versus personnel.  GB has as much talent as anybody in the league on defense...

- On offense, Rodgers clearly has taken a step or two back.  The last two throws were horrible decisions, especially the last throw that was swatted out of the air.  Lazard wasn't even open on that play and he threw it anyway.  My guess is 12 is given a play and the freedom to run or pass... if true, he's making some shit decisions.  Jones and Dillon were the correct options on both of those plays.

This was a very poorly coached football team that started with preparation and continued into the game.  The schemes sucked and are quite obviously very predictable.  The team was flat again in the 2nd half.  

I'm sure they'll beat the Jets but they're going to run into a gauntlet of buzz saws here pretty quick and the L's are going to start stacking up.