@Blair Kiel posted:I’m at 904-867-5309...
So much nutscaping is going to happen
Silverstein weighs and makes several good points. Per usual, national writers/pundits have this wrong. Rinse. Repeat:
Let’s say Rodgers really wants out, which is ridiculous if you think about it since he was the one bored with Mike McCarthy’s offense and sought to play for someone who ran Matt LaFleur’s offense and was thrilled to have a general manager who spent $56 million in free-agent signing bonuses to rebuild a crumbling defense.
The Packers thought enough of Rodgers to negotiate a four-year, $134 million contract that paid him $57.5 million upfront and gave him the highest yearly average salary of any player in the NFL.
After the Packers made it to the NFC championship game last year, Gutekunst shocked everyone by moving up in the first round to select quarterback Jordan Love, leaving the Rodgers worshipers to suggest he blew a chance to turn 2020 into a Super Bowl year.
Only they never point out which wide receiver it was that was going to turn it around for them. The very best of them – Jerry Jeudy, CeeDee Lamb, Justin Jefferson – were off the board long before the Packers picked Love
To say that Brandon Aiyuk, Tee Higgins, Michael Pittman or Chase Claypool would have contributed more than Marquez Valdes-Scantling or Allen Lazard is probably wishful thinking. At best, they would have filled Equanimeous St. Brown’s position, especially given how particular Rodgers is to those who don’t make rookie mistakes.
Besides that, Gutekunst made up for it with the selections of running back AJ Dillon and tight end Josiah Deguara, two promising offensive players whose rookie seasons were derailed because of COVID-19 and a torn ACL, respectively. It was not his fault their seasons were shortened and it also wasn’t his fault that free-agent wide receiver Devin Funchess opted out of the season because of COVID-19.
What’s more, Gutekunst had put tons of effort in building an offensive line that would keep his 37-year-old quarterback upright and somehow predicted that right tackle Rick Wagner had enough left in him to keep the line functioning when injuries hit. Nobody could have foreseen the loss of left tackle David Bakhtiari, whom Gutekunst signed to the richest offensive lineman salary in history in order to keep Rodgers protected for years to come.
Somehow, without a first-round receiver, the Packers still managed to earn the No. 1 seed in the NFC and had the highest-scoring offense in football. So, let’s get over the Gutekunst didn’t do enough for Rodgers narrative because it just doesn’t fit.
With three years left on his deal, Rodgers is not untradeable. The Packers would gain just under $5 million in cap space if they did deal him.
Green Bay Packers: Aaron Rodgers should avoid taking Brett Favre path (jsonline.com)
Just saw #12s weekly appearance with Pat McFee and AJ Hawk and he said he would not even address all the false stuff he has been seeing and it is flat out false. He went on to say he has been having conversations all along with MLF, Murphy, and Gute. He said they all sit down every year to look at where they are at and where they are going.
The interview was short but he sure didn't act like someone who wants out.
@packerboi posted:So, let’s get over the Gutekunst didn’t do enough for Rodgers narrative because it just doesn’t fit.
HEY SILVERSTEIN. EVER HEARD OF THIS THING CALLED DEFENSE?
A fucking FG.
Rodgers said the goal of going on @PatMcAfeeShow's show was to "silence all the douchebags out there who were talking for me."
— Peter Bukowski (@Peter_Bukowski) January 26, 2021
🔥🔥🔥
LMAO. Thanks Aaron. Much-a-do about nothing.
Next.
Wasn't he the one who said his future is uncertain?
@H5 posted:GD, did you listen to the Kuhn comments? It's not just about ARs future. Kuhn mentioned there is the potential for a lot of changes in personnel this off-season (Lewis, Jones, Linsley) that has a direct impact on ARs future - and not just if he is with the team, which is where everyone jumped to, but who will be around him to make another run.
Key point- "where everyone jumped to." We're not even 48 hours removed, and an article pointedly written to gin up controversy-by a particularly hostile source- is working like a charm. People took 100% speculation and made it credible. The original article is garbage. The same kind of garbage that Florio has thrown at the wall the previous two years. First, AR got McVince fired, he's power hungry and it's a huge problem. Next, AR can't possibly co-exist with a younger HC that is inferior to the knowledge AR holds in his pinky finger. 13-3, 13-3, MVP season, conference title game both years. And we're going to STILL feed into this bullshit clickbait? People should be afforded the time to collect their thoughts, beyond the 20 minutes before postgame PC's. Every team invested a ton into this pandemic plagued season. Some guys, like Rodgers, Brees, Ben, Rivers fully understand the stakes with regard to their own careers. We can't even let a disappointing loss sink in before we start talking about a writer using total conjecture in an effort to undermine a player and organization that he despises but can't admit it to himself. I won't buy in to his bullshit. Rodgers and the organization will talk when they choose. This season was emotional enough that everyone deserves to choose how long they take to come to grips. It isn't up to some infantile gossip peddler to decide things for any of them.
Okay, so nobody has to call Kiel anymore other than with your scrot pics.
It’s the collect calls that are pissing me off.
@Fandame posted:If they restructure Rodgers, you'll see Love moved. Rodgers doesn't want Love standing over his shoulder, and Love doesn't want to wait all day behind Rodgers. So Murphy, Gut, and MLF have to agree that they have seen enough of Love to know that he's not going to be another HOFer, and they have to take the PR hit and let him go. You only keep Love if you are 100% sure you have another 10-year starter who is a top-three guy. Something has to give somewhere. You have to keep Boyle, who's probably happy to be where he is, and he knows what's up.
And you have to do something about the D. Pettine gone is most likely. When your QB walks down the sideline imploring his D to get a stop so he can get the ball back, you know you have problems. Rodgers knew they were in trouble and that he hadn't played well either, but when they needed a big stop, it wasn't there to pick him up.
If they restructure Rodgers I don't think having Love will matter at all either way. They aren't going to guarantee Rodgers another year at 35+ million in Green Bay (which would take him to at least the end of 2022) and not play him if he's healthy. Jordan Love is under Packer control until the end of the 2024 season. If he's not the top backup next year it's a sign they know they screwed up by drafting him. You'd like to assume that a first-round pick would be at least a serviceable backup after two years in the system and he's cheaper than most top-level backups for the next several years. Having a decent backup helps Rodgers too, since we all saw what happens when you have to pretend that a guy like Hundley gives a chance to stay within striking distance of a playoff spot if Rodgers has to miss 2-3 games for something like a concussion or a non-season ending injury (like Brees this year).
You could really make the case after this year to set it up so commit to Rodgers as your starter until the end of 2023 when he'll turn 40. Love would be your backup and would likely play at least some snaps as a guy approaching 40 is likely to miss some games at some point. Then, in 2024 you move onto Love. If there is an issue at that point with Rodgers wanting to continue, then you let him move on like Manning, Rivers, and Brady did. You then see what Love can do before you commit to his big extension.
I don't blame Rodgers at all if this is his play. He could have thrown a fit this offseason by seeing the writing on the wall and knowing they were going to jettison him after 2021. Instead, he had one of the best years of his career and basically can throw down the gauntlet by saying "I know you can save 22 million against the cap by cutting me after this upcoming season, I kept my head down, was a great teammate, and now I want you to commit to at least three more years with me as a starter." Even if declines by 20% over the next 2 years, is Jordan Love ever going to be 80% of Rodgers? If so, that would be great.
@packerboi posted:Silverstein weighs and makes several good points. Per usual, national writers/pundits have this wrong. Rinse. Repeat:
Let’s say Rodgers really wants out, which is ridiculous if you think about it since he was the one bored with Mike McCarthy’s offense and sought to play for someone who ran Matt LaFleur’s offense and was thrilled to have a general manager who spent $56 million in free-agent signing bonuses to rebuild a crumbling defense.
The Packers thought enough of Rodgers to negotiate a four-year, $134 million contract that paid him $57.5 million upfront and gave him the highest yearly average salary of any player in the NFL.
After the Packers made it to the NFC championship game last year, Gutekunst shocked everyone by moving up in the first round to select quarterback Jordan Love, leaving the Rodgers worshipers to suggest he blew a chance to turn 2020 into a Super Bowl year.
Only they never point out which wide receiver it was that was going to turn it around for them. The very best of them – Jerry Jeudy, CeeDee Lamb, Justin Jefferson – were off the board long before the Packers picked Love
To say that Brandon Aiyuk, Tee Higgins, Michael Pittman or Chase Claypool would have contributed more than Marquez Valdes-Scantling or Allen Lazard is probably wishful thinking. At best, they would have filled Equanimeous St. Brown’s position, especially given how particular Rodgers is to those who don’t make rookie mistakes.
Besides that, Gutekunst made up for it with the selections of running back AJ Dillon and tight end Josiah Deguara, two promising offensive players whose rookie seasons were derailed because of COVID-19 and a torn ACL, respectively. It was not his fault their seasons were shortened and it also wasn’t his fault that free-agent wide receiver Devin Funchess opted out of the season because of COVID-19.
What’s more, Gutekunst had put tons of effort in building an offensive line that would keep his 37-year-old quarterback upright and somehow predicted that right tackle Rick Wagner had enough left in him to keep the line functioning when injuries hit. Nobody could have foreseen the loss of left tackle David Bakhtiari, whom Gutekunst signed to the richest offensive lineman salary in history in order to keep Rodgers protected for years to come.
Somehow, without a first-round receiver, the Packers still managed to earn the No. 1 seed in the NFC and had the highest-scoring offense in football. So, let’s get over the Gutekunst didn’t do enough for Rodgers narrative because it just doesn’t fit.
With three years left on his deal, Rodgers is not untradeable. The Packers would gain just under $5 million in cap space if they did deal him.
Green Bay Packers: Aaron Rodgers should avoid taking Brett Favre path (jsonline.com)
Always informative to see how the Packer braintrust really views a situation by reading what the mouthpieces in the local press have to say. Could not imagine the PR department at 1265 Lombardi doing a better job here.
Understandably, if disingenuously, Silverstein starts out with the premise "Let’s say Rodgers really wants out ..."
Has anyone -- Florio, Silver, Charles Robinson, Schneidman, Aaron Rodgers, anyone, claimed that Rodgers specifically wants OUT of Green Bay?
Anyone?
Seems like Rodgers wants GB's front office to do everything it can to win, and win while he remains the team's QB, rather than out of GB.
With that red herring out of the way, Silverstein defends the team's approach to competing in 2020 by correctly noting that Gutey did move to improve the Pack's roster last offseason - specifically the underrated Wagner signing.
He then almost completely glosses over the decision to use the team's FIRST & FOURTH round selections on Love as if that did not occur ... other than to say Gutey "made up for it with the selections of running back AJ Dillon and tight end Josiah Deguara, two promising offensive players ..."
Leaving aside the unknown (to anyone other than Tommy himself apparently) as to whether Deguara definitively qualifies as a promising offensive player based off his 1-game 2020 performance ..." what exactly did Gutey have to MAKE UP FOR if the decisions to use the 1st and 4th round picks on a single player who would not help the team until sometime after Rodgers was gone was not a mistake?
Do folks generally MAKE UP FOR things they got right?
Tommy never gets round to splainin' himself on that issue.
The issues surrounding the Love pick are not complicated.
The only rational explanations for using 1st and 4th round selections to take Jordan Love in the 2020 draft, with Aaron Rodgers still under contract for 4 seasons and basically un-moveable until after the 2021 season, is either that GB's front office (A) believed Rodgers play was deteriorating to such an extent that it was time to move on from him (likely after 2021 when it would be financially feasible) and it was time to go get his successor or (B) Love was such a potentially generational talent at QB that the Organization could not possibly bypass him.
Rodgers then went out and won the 2020 MVP, so if the answer is A, then the Pack's front office obviously got the level of deterioration of ARod's game wrong and is now sitting out there with a "pretty big matzo ball" staring it in the face.
If the answer is B, no one will know whether the decision to take Love was the correct one for several years.
But the notion that the Pack went "all in" to win the Super Bowl in 2020 when it used its 1st and 4th round pick on Jordan Love is demonstrably and indisputably false ... and Tom Silverstein knows it -- even if he completely ignores it in his piece.
I'm in, glad we have that figured out. Now move onto the OLine, Dline, Cback, Lb, Slot, punter and maybe kicker.
Qb is the easy problem to solve.
@ammo posted:Rodgers should take less money, not more. This is a results driven league. The Packers paid Rodgers to get them into and win the Super Bowl. He did not do that. In fact if every player took a reduction in pay equal to the % the salary cap is reduced the Packers would be in ok financial shape. They all talk about doing what is good for the team, well live up to your words.
We’ve been admiring the team around Brady for years, but the reason that is possible? Brady always takes less. The man knows that without a great team he won’t win anything.
“To say that Brandon Aiyuk, Tee Higgins, Michael Pittman or Chase Claypool would have contributed more than Marquez Valdes-Scantling or Allen Lazard is probably wishful thinking. At best, they would have filled Equanimeous St. Brown’s position, especially given how particular Rodgers is to those who don’t make rookie mistakes”
This!!!
@ilcuqui posted:Interesting speculation from Jason Wilde.
“ @jasonjwilde: ... this is my belief: Rodgers wants his contract restructured to give him more guaranteed money so he's not a lame duck in 2021. Converting base salary and roster bonus to signing bonus helps both sides.
He said in May he wanted to finish his career in Green Bay, and the Love pick made that less likely. His contract makes it financially advantageous for #Packers to cut him after 2021. I think he wants a longer commitment to not be a lame duck. Not to be traded. Just my $.02.
... I'm not here to carry water for him. This is an informed opinion, no more. “
There was a time when "J", as Rodgers now calls him, had a somewhat inner circle connection with the QB. That day is long gone.
Wilde is likely right about the "Rodgers wants his contract restructured to give him more guaranteed money". To me that is about his value to the org and not about some perceived stability.
Disagree with the idea that the Love pick makes it less likely that AR finishes his career in GB or not. The only factor(s) there are Rodgers/his play and how the Packers FO sees his value. Back-to-Back NFCCG appearances. MVP season, possibly his best statistically, and a great relationship with his HC.
They moved on from Favre because Favre became un-coachable. Anyone see Rodgers becoming un-coachable?
The dude spent time on machu picchu. His head is in a great place.
@Goalline posted:We’ve been admiring the team around Brady for years, but the reason that is possible? Brady always takes less. The man knows that without a great team he won’t win anything.
Aaron needs to marry a super model who makes 70 billion dollars a year 1st.
@Pikes Peak posted:Qb drama in the off season......should be fun.
Stafford, Watson, Wentz and of course AR. With the TOG chiming in every now and then.
Enjoy.
Or just ignore it.
Can we just point out the elephant in the room when we're talking about mistakes? Yes, MVS, ESB and even Lazard have been just freakin' flawless.
Come on.
@michiganjoe posted:Rodgers said the goal of going on @PatMcAfeeShow's show was to "silence all the douchebags out there who were talking for me."
— Peter Bukowski (@Peter_Bukowski) January 26, 2021
🔥🔥🔥
If you listen to the actual interview he was referring to when they invited him to be a weekly guest on the last year and why he was excited.
That quote has nothing to do with what happened from Sunday up until today.
@Henry posted:HEY SILVERSTEIN. EVER HEARD OF THIS THING CALLED DEFENSE?
A fucking FG.
Drafting a third-string RB was maximizing a chance to win this year?
The obvious thing is that they had already decided not to extend Aaron Jones and were drafting a replacement. That's a defensible strategy.
Drafting DeGuara was probably as much as admission that they missed on Sternberger as anything else.
But yes, there is no real way to argue they did much to improve the defense from the previous year and were banking on improvement from Gary (and maybe Savage) as the main way to get better.
A lot of wasted bandwidth here for an article written by dipshit Florio.
@Goalline posted:“To say that Brandon Aiyuk, Tee Higgins, Michael Pittman or Chase Claypool would have contributed more than Marquez Valdes-Scantling or Allen Lazard is probably wishful thinking. At best, they would have filled Equanimeous St. Brown’s position, especially given how particular Rodgers is to those who don’t make rookie mistakes”
This!!!
I would have been happy with the Pack spending its 4th rounder on Tampa Bay rookie WR Tyler Johnson out of Minnesota.
He certainly was better than ESB on Sunday and throughout the 2020 season.
And it is not like he wasn't on at least some folks radar prior to the draft.
@Floridarob posted:Aaron needs to marry a super model who makes 70 billion dollars a year 1st.
Does he need to knock up another celebrity girlfriend first before moving on to his Giselle equivalent?
By all accounts Brady seems to be a good father to his oldest kid (he went and got him from the stands after the game on Sunday), but this TB is a saint stuff because he didn't max out his money in NE is overboard. Giselle has a net worth of almost half a billion dollars without any contributions from Brady. Together their net worth approaches 700 million.
The logical extension of this argument is that Brady really should just play for the veteran minimum.
@SteveLuke posted:I would have been happy with the Pack spending its 4th rounder on Tampa Bay rookie WR Tyler Johnson out of Minnesota.
He certainly was better than ESB on Sunday and throughout the 2020 season.
And it is not like he wasn't on at least some folks radar prior to the draft.
I was OK with WR depth.
I wanted some LBs that could run and maybe another DB. They needed defensive help. The other thing is their special teams suck and the LBs and backup DBs are your core special teamers. DeGuara would have helped had he stayed healthy, but they needed to do more for that unit as well.
@Pikes Peak posted:Wasn't he the one who said his future is uncertain?
Technically, everybody's future is uncertain. The Yellowstone supervolcano could blow tomorrow for all we know.
@packerboi posted:Silverstein weighs and makes several good points. Per usual, national writers/pundits have this wrong. Rinse. Repeat:
Only they never point out which wide receiver it was that was going to turn it around for them. The very best of them – Jerry Jeudy, CeeDee Lamb, Justin Jefferson – were off the board long before the Packers picked Love
Does Silverstein know that you can make improvements outside of the draft as well?
@Fedya posted:Technically, everybody's future is uncertain. The Yellowstone supervolcano could blow tomorrow for all we know.
I’m more concerned about Henry’s flatulence after Taco Tuesday that I am at that.
@Pikes Peak posted:Wasn't he the one who said his future is uncertain?
He's not wrong. While 2021 is the future I don't think he was talking about 2021. He was talking about 2022. He knows how his contract is structured. He knows they spent a 1st and 4th round pick on a QB. Yeah, that's an uncertain future.
@Blair Kiel posted:I’m more concerned about Henry’s flatulence after Taco Tuesday that I am at that.
This Taco Tuesday:
Or this Taco Tuesday:
@Fedya posted:Technically, everybody's future is uncertain.
And the end is always near
I’m sure there’s a lot of soul searching going on this week.
Aaron Jones had a brilliant year, but all some will remember is the costly fumble and him getting hurt.
MLF has been excellent and (like Andy Reid prior to KC) is now known for getting conservative late in a close game.
Billy Turner and Rick Wagner player fantastic this year but got absolutely schooled by JPP and Shaq Barrett off the edge.
Kevin King had a solid season but he played like Josh Jackson in the biggest game of the year in a contract year.
I’m sure there are others.
I said this on another thread but as much as we want to think a Patrick Queen or Tee Higgins or Chase Claypool would have saved their asses on Sunday I’ve got news for you. None of those guys played CB. None of them played OT. It wouldn’t have mattered.
What mattered was drafting guys like Quentin Rollins and Damarious Randall and Jason Spriggs and Josh Jones and Josh Jackson. They all sucked and had a double whammy effect in that they had to use additional draft capital or free agent dollars to cover up the mistakes. In the case of CB and S they had no good fall back options - it was Will Redmond and Chandon Sullivan. Both guys that were completely exposed multiple times by Brady.
One of the saddest things I ever saw.....a A J Hawk Jersey on the best offer rack on Saturday at a garage sale.
Marked down from 25 on Thursday, 10 on Friday to best offer on Sat.
True story.
@Blair Kiel posted:I’m more concerned about Henry’s flatulence after Taco Tuesday that I am at that.
You're the one who suggested chorizo and stadium cheese dip.
@Pikes Peak posted:One of the saddest things I ever saw.....a A J Hawk Jersey on the best offer rack on Saturday at a garage sale.
Geez, did not know AJ was that hard up for cash
or is this an analogy for making a tackle 6 yards past the line of scrimmage
It's pretty cool to see how much Arod enjoys being on this show.