Runyan was playing LG to start season then switched to RG. I know all you experts think it is simple.
@Herschel posted:I hate to say this, but I think Myers regressed noticeably this year (and Runyan didn't seem to progress either, tbf). Was it a "Sophomore slump", a coaching issue or is there just a hole in his game?
On the plus side, in two of the three it's fixable, but on the down side, with the way they hold possibly crappy coaches, in two of the three it has a good chance not to.
He wasn't the only one.
Of course, Daktari and Jenks were hampered by injury rehab/recovery, but Yosh, Myers, Runyan, and even Newman didn't play as well this year.
I think there is some combination of coaching change, player performance, and/or injury that had an effect, but no idea what was most responsible.
They moved Stenavich to OC. That was a loss as far as I'm concerned. For the prior two years, he coached the OL and it was always a strength, even when they lost a lot of guys due to injury and had to shuffle people around. Everyone commented on how good the OL was. My guess is Butkus is not nearly the OL coach Stenavich is.
@GBFanForLife posted:Runyan was playing LG to start season then switched to RG. I know all you experts think it is simple.
He was also bad on the left side.
Don't really think you can blame 1 guy. The lineup they threw out their to begin the year was garbage
Lot of really interesting discussion about a string of subjects so here is my take on them separated by group.
1) Oline- This group did not develop any cohesion this year. Lots of time missed and different positions for a good piece of the season! Oline-is a marriage and trust and there was little this year. Stunts were a problem all year and there was alot of film on Nimen and his shortcomings were exploited much more this year. The revolving door inside also left AR uncertain and it often showed. I suspect some higher draft capitol will be added to this group, On a positive note Zach Tom reminded me of a young 69. Sean Ryan was a huge disappointment and perhaps his offseason work will convince GB to pass on draft additions as he and 50 could be young studs on this team,
2) WR's no need to recap this group- we all saw the good and bad- only question is will GB add a high draft here into a very young room or get a quality vet to grow the pups. They all demonstrated what rookies usually do good and bad and the need to mature physically and for sure mentally.
3) Did anybody else feel Dillon seemed different this year several fumbles and way too may negatative plays on 3rd an 4th and short. Jones also had several untimely fumbles this year- perhaps linked to the o-line issues.
4) The D for sure needs an infusion of talent at safety and edge rusher. Amos became a turtle his year and Savage is not the answer! He lacks instincts and surely doesn't play to his athletic potential. I get it that he plays defense b/c of his hands but gosh he can't tackle has stone hands and doesn't seem to understand the game! After 3 seasons you must have a better understanding of the defense! This may be where the 1st pick is headed in spite of the desire for a top level WR.
5) The Rodgers question will get answered soon and if it is he is staying will Love demand a trade!
Did anyone read that?
I tried.
The season was a clusterfuck they cobbled together an offensive line that was offensive. Rodgers didn't do shit in the preseason except smoke shit and they almost made the playoffs but Rodgers Favred the last game
According to Acme Packing Co., there are18 players that become FAs this year.
Following their format, we can discuss possibilities and opinions (that will likely cause some name-calling, bickering, and insults per x4 tradition) .
Keeping in mind, of course, assumptions have to be made (it works with the salary cap, the players we would want to keep are willing to make a deal, etc.), I'll share my opinions
There are 7 UFAs:
CB Corey Ballentine Keep at/near vet min. ST core.
S Rudy Ford Keep with a modest deal. ST core and made some plays on defense.
Edge Justin Hollins. Keep. Same deal/comments as Ford.
S Dallin Leavitt Keep. Same as Ballentine.
LB Eric Wilson Who?
CB/KR/PR Keisean Nixon. Priority keep. Can't break the bank, but make it work.
WR Allen Lazard Priority keep. The Packers are much better with him, and he has value for both the rush and pass.
7 players that have contracts that void March 15 (league year start) and will become FAs, but can be re-signed before Feb. 25 (league void deadline) for salary cap purposes:
S Adrian Amos. Keep if a deal can be worked out.
WR Randall Cobb Keep. Same as Amos. However, he has the least 'wiggle room' for the roster as far as young receivers development is concerned.
K Mason Crosby Don't keep. Sorry, Mason, It's time to move on. Providing there is an adequate replacement, of course.
TE Marcedes Lewis I lean more to the don't keep side, but the Packers are going to have to shit or get off the pot for TEs. If Tonyan, Deguara, or a draft pick can make it obvious it's time to move on, it may make the decision easier.
DL Dean Lowry. Don't keep. Same as Crosby, but there's too many others that need to play to justify a roster spot for him. Wyatt probably sealed his fate.
DL Jarran Reed Keep. More of a mid-level priority, but somebody has to replace Lowry's snaps.
TE Robert Tonyan Keep. A high priority (see comments above about TEs).
3 players that are RFAs:
LB Krys Barnes I'm more don't keep. There's not much priority, although if something worked out and the Packers keep him, I wouldn't mind.
TE Tyler Davis Don't keep. Not much value that I've seen and his spot would be better served by a draft pick.
OT Yosh Nijman Priority keep. Too much value and experience to let go of.
1 ERFA
C Jake Hanson Keep. He should be cheap enough, and good depth versatility.
Apologies for a long post, but I hope it spurs discussion, and I look forward to your comments. Besides, what else do you have to do between now and Saturday?
Here is a long but interesting take by Herman of if AR comes back how we could go "all in"
It's interesting that the majority of the UFA's are primarily special teamers. Eric Wilson was a key addition on special teams and I believe was the leading tackler on STs. Aside from Nixon who I agree is a must re-sign because he also can play quality snaps on defense, Hollins and Lazard are the only other UFAs that should be offered a contract. Tonyan and Nijman should also be offered contracts. I'm hoping Tonyan shows more a year removed from ACL injury. Nijman may be a borderline starter but is definitely a quality swing tackle. On the others, need to substitute younger players and turn over the roster.
lizard is gone. he will be a bear or lion next year
@Timmy! posted:According to Acme Packing Co., there are18 players that become FAs this year.
Following their format, we can discuss possibilities and opinions (that will likely cause some name-calling, bickering, and insults per x4 tradition) .
Keeping in mind, of course, assumptions have to be made (it works with the salary cap, the players we would want to keep are willing to make a deal, etc.), I'll share my opinions
There are 7 UFAs:
CB Corey Ballentine Keep at/near vet min. ST core.
S Rudy Ford Keep with a modest deal. ST core and made some plays on defense.
Edge Justin Hollins. Keep. Same deal/comments as Ford.
S Dallin Leavitt Keep. Same as Ballentine.
LB Eric Wilson Who?
CB/KR/PR Keisean Nixon. Priority keep. Can't break the bank, but make it work.
WR Allen Lazard Priority keep. The Packers are much better with him, and he has value for both the rush and pass.
7 players that have contracts that void March 15 (league year start) and will become FAs, but can be re-signed before Feb. 25 (league void deadline) for salary cap purposes:
S Adrian Amos. Keep if a deal can be worked out.
WR Randall Cobb Keep. Same as Amos. However, he has the least 'wiggle room' for the roster as far as young receivers development is concerned.
K Mason Crosby Don't keep. Sorry, Mason, It's time to move on. Providing there is an adequate replacement, of course.
TE Marcedes Lewis I lean more to the don't keep side, but the Packers are going to have to shit or get off the pot for TEs. If Tonyan, Deguara, or a draft pick can make it obvious it's time to move on, it may make the decision easier.
DL Dean Lowry. Don't keep. Same as Crosby, but there's too many others that need to play to justify a roster spot for him. Wyatt probably sealed his fate.
DL Jarran Reed Keep. More of a mid-level priority, but somebody has to replace Lowry's snaps.
TE Robert Tonyan Keep. A high priority (see comments above about TEs).
3 players that are RFAs:
LB Krys Barnes I'm more don't keep. There's not much priority, although if something worked out and the Packers keep him, I wouldn't mind.
TE Tyler Davis Don't keep. Not much value that I've seen and his spot would be better served by a draft pick.
OT Yosh Nijman Priority keep. Too much value and experience to let go of.
1 ERFA
C Jake Hanson Keep. He should be cheap enough, and good depth versatility.
Apologies for a long post, but I hope it spurs discussion, and I look forward to your comments. Besides, what else do you have to do between now and Saturday?
I agree with most of what you said except no Jake Hanson please!!
Agree with almost everything, except that I would hinge it on whether or not AR comes back. If AR comes back, then we might as well hold on to Mason, Big Dog, and Cobb. AR may make that a condition of his coming back, but without them, AR will most likely be unhappy (which it seems he is most of the time on the field these days anyway).
If AR decides not to return, I would draft a new TE and cut Big Dog, not resign Mason, and consider cutting Cobb as being slower and older, although on the flip side, he adds a vet presence for the young guys.
@Timmy! posted:According to Acme Packing Co., there are18 players that become FAs this year.
Following their format, we can discuss possibilities and opinions (that will likely cause some name-calling, bickering, and insults per x4 tradition) .
Keeping in mind, of course, assumptions have to be made (it works with the salary cap, the players we would want to keep are willing to make a deal, etc.), I'll share my opinions
There are 7 UFAs:
CB Corey Ballentine Keep at/near vet min. ST core.
S Rudy Ford Keep with a modest deal. ST core and made some plays on defense.
Edge Justin Hollins. Keep. Same deal/comments as Ford.
S Dallin Leavitt Keep. Same as Ballentine.
LB Eric Wilson Who?
CB/KR/PR Keisean Nixon. Priority keep. Can't break the bank, but make it work.
WR Allen Lazard Priority keep. The Packers are much better with him, and he has value for both the rush and pass.
7 players that have contracts that void March 15 (league year start) and will become FAs, but can be re-signed before Feb. 25 (league void deadline) for salary cap purposes:
S Adrian Amos. Keep if a deal can be worked out.
WR Randall Cobb Keep. Same as Amos. However, he has the least 'wiggle room' for the roster as far as young receivers development is concerned.
K Mason Crosby Don't keep. Sorry, Mason, It's time to move on. Providing there is an adequate replacement, of course.
TE Marcedes Lewis I lean more to the don't keep side, but the Packers are going to have to shit or get off the pot for TEs. If Tonyan, Deguara, or a draft pick can make it obvious it's time to move on, it may make the decision easier.
DL Dean Lowry. Don't keep. Same as Crosby, but there's too many others that need to play to justify a roster spot for him. Wyatt probably sealed his fate.
DL Jarran Reed Keep. More of a mid-level priority, but somebody has to replace Lowry's snaps.
TE Robert Tonyan Keep. A high priority (see comments above about TEs).
3 players that are RFAs:
LB Krys Barnes I'm more don't keep. There's not much priority, although if something worked out and the Packers keep him, I wouldn't mind.
TE Tyler Davis Don't keep. Not much value that I've seen and his spot would be better served by a draft pick.
OT Yosh Nijman Priority keep. Too much value and experience to let go of.
1 ERFA
C Jake Hanson Keep. He should be cheap enough, and good depth versatility.
Apologies for a long post, but I hope it spurs discussion, and I look forward to your comments. Besides, what else do you have to do between now and Saturday?
I agree on just about everything in this post,well done. TE though could use some new blood imo. I would like to see the Washington TE GA Bulldogs in the draft . I get the Black Gronk vibes from him ! Lewis replacement/swap.
@Fandame posted:Agree with almost everything, except that I would hinge it on whether or not AR comes back. If AR comes back, then we might as well hold on to Mason, Big Dog, and Cobb. AR may make that a condition of his coming back, but without them, AR will most likely be unhappy (which it seems he is most of the time on the field these days anyway).
If AR decides not to return, I would draft a new TE and cut Big Dog, not resign Mason, and consider cutting Cobb as being slower and older, although on the flip side, he adds a vet presence for the young guys.
Staying or leaving, I trust they will know soon. With him or without him they need to build a team. I hope he doesnât string them along.
GB Packer's Daily reports that the Indy Colts just finished an interview with Rich Bisaccia, for their Head Coach position.
Dang. Just when we get a good STs coach, he may be poached. I know he did a good job when he took over for Gruden and took them to a wild card game. The players liked him and wanted him as HC, but McDaniel was the sexier pick.
Brandt also said he was certain AR was gone a couple years ago. FWIW.
My 94-year-old father-in-law calls me frequently just desperate to know what Rodgers is going to do. I tell him I donât know and I donât care, but he asks me anyway.
You people (TM) are just like my 94-year-old father in law. ð
If Us People (TM) are just like your father in law then your father in law must be a very handsome man.
@Blair Kiel posted:You people (TM) are just like my 94-year-old father in law. ð
Because we intimidate you or because your wife loves us more?
Bunch of bullies here.
My therapist says not to internalize the hate and take solace in the fact that Iâm still more popular than Fedya.
BK's therapist sets a low bar.
The rapist
For $500, Alex!
So, is Lazard leaving the Pack??? 
If he demands huge bucks yes let him enter the market cuz heâs not worth a huge contract
@Goldie posted:So, is Lazard leaving the Pack???
@YooperPackfan posted:If he demands huge bucks yes let him enter the market cuz heâs not worth a huge contract
I guess MVS is as good a comparison as anyone.
He signed a 3 year/$30M contract with KC, $6M signing bonus, $8.56M guaranteed at signing, with an additional $6.44M guarantee on 3-17-2023.
He will have an $11M cap hit for the '23 season, but only a $4M dead cap hit, so he essentially could have a 1 year contract for @$10M.
Lizard needs to come in at about half of that, ideally. The Packers paid him slightly under $4M last year, which was roughly 2 1/2 times more than all other previous contracts with the Packers.
If he is looking for a similar increase for 2023 and beyond, that would put him at roughly $10M/year average (reference MVS deal). If another team offers that, or close, I don't think the Packers can match it. They may want to, but may not have cap room for that kind of money.
@Iowacheese posted:The rapist
Irregardless, I could care less
@MikeGarafolo: The #Falcons are working on a deal with veteran defensive coach Jerry Gray to join new coordinator Ryan Nielsen, sources say. Gray, who has been with the #Packers the past three seasons as DBs coach/pass game coordinator, coached with HC Arthur Smith in Washington 2007-08.
Ed Donatell is available to replace him. 
It would be interesting IF both Jerry and Rich went elsewhere. Perhaps they are not interested in a rebuilding team.
@ilcuqui posted:@MikeGarafolo: The #Falcons are working on a deal with veteran defensive coach Jerry Gray to join new coordinator Ryan Nielsen, sources say. Gray, who has been with the #Packers the past three seasons as DBs coach/pass game coordinator, coached with HC Arthur Smith in Washington 2007-08.
Douglas and Savage tweet:
ððð https://t.co/GK3HGCG6bL
â rasul (@rd32_era) January 29, 2023
âĶâĶ https://t.co/UEdX2iNbDk
â rasul (@rd32_era) January 29, 2023
The million dollar question is, was this Jerry, or was this Dingle Barry refusing to listen and constantly putting these players out of position and ignoring Gray's advice? I am afraid to believe it's the latter.
Players and coaches respect Jerry Gray, but I canât imagine this was that heartbreaking for Gray or the Packers.
â Peter Bukowski (@Peter_Bukowski) January 29, 2023
Coverage busts and undisciplined play from veteran DBs were problems all year. And Gray didnât seem to love Joe Barryâs approach. Best for both sides to move on.
Iâm sure Jerry Gray is a very solid coach but youâll have to excuse me if Iâm not super bummed about a coach leaving after a group of veteran dbâs didnât learn to communicate in the secondary until about week 16. I sincerely wish him nothing but well but think GB will be fine.
â Andy Herman (@AndyHermanNFL) January 29, 2023
Gray was already on staff when Barry arrived to take over as DC two season ago.
There was obvious friction between Barry's vision for the defense and Gray's execution of that vision, especially last season.
The Pettine, Barry, Mennenga, Drayton, and now Gray coaching moves do not exactly engender confidence in MLF's staffing decisions, though Bisaccia finally seems to have resolved the black hole at STs Coordinator.
The jury is still out on the Stenavich and Butkus promotions last offseason.
Lot of rumblings about coaching dysfunction last season, MLF needs to pick up his game in 2023.