I've been sick of this talented but underachieving team for a long time. They almost pull out a win against Atlanta while undermanned only to lose to a team AT HOME they should easily beat. Same thing every year. It even happened in 2010 but they managed to go on a run. 2011 was the only odd year but then they blow it AT HOME again! 
Maybe the best thing to do is finish 3rd, miss the playoffs and FINALLY REALIZE that something needs to be done!
Herschel posted:Fedya posted:Grave Digger posted:Jesus dude, we just disagree....
There ain't no good guy; there ain't no bad guy
Damn it, my first thought was the same as Fedya's! :-)
Written by Manitowoc's Jim Krueger.
I've jammed with him, recorded him, and we've watched Packer games together in CA.
http://journaltimes.com/news/n...92-d2f812c53f91.html
Who knew....
Blair Kiel posted:Please let your second thought be, "Jump!".
Well, if you want to taste his kisses in the night.... 
There needs to be a change and I think it needs to include TT as well as the coaching staff. It's time to let Elliot run the show. TT is too loyal to fire MM. We may end up with a worse coach, but if we don't give it a try, we will only have more of the same from MM until he or Rodgers leaves.
DocBenni posted:There needs to be a change and I think it needs to include TT as well as the coaching staff. It's time to let Elliot run the show. TT is too loyal to fire MM. We may end up with a worse coach, but if we don't give it a try, we will only have more of the same from MM until he or Rodgers leaves.
In DocBenni I trust.
Something seriously wrong at 1265.
And I hate it.
A major change, if it comes, may be to late.... a proactive move a couple of years ago when the core was in their prime would have been the way to go.
I kinda hate that we are even talking about a complete change in Coaching and in GM as well. But I hated to go through with my divorce too. I remember lots and lots of hurt feelings. But after a rough start I am more happy than I have ever been. It was a risk but worked out for me. This combination we have with GM, coach and starting QB has been good but the arrow is pointing down. RR and MS were let go for the same reason.
I am willing to eat crow if I am wrong but this is what I am seeing from this team since 2012 season.
DocBenni posted:There needs to be a change and I think it needs to include TT as well as the coaching staff. It's time to let Elliot run the show. TT is too loyal to fire MM. We may end up with a worse coach, but if we don't give it a try, we will only have more of the same from MM until he or Rodgers leaves.
100% agree.
I'll add that I think the team is lacking talent and what we see now is an avg talented team with avg QB play. Thus 4-4. MM isn't the entire problem but he isn't doing enough to overcome the shortcomings either. It's kinda exposed him for who he is, just a guy.
On the issue of talent I think that we have a good many talented players. I also think that we have been hurt by injuries (pun intended). I also think that we could have managed the roster better with a couple of free agents now and then. My take as an admitted outsider is that better coaching would have resulted in putting the players in a better position to win. I even wonder if MM had some say in the acquisition of talent by Ted and got the type of players that MM wanted.
PackerPatrick posted:I kinda hate that we are even talking about a complete change in Coaching and in GM as well. But I hated to go through with my divorce too. I remember lots and lots of hurt feelings. But after a rough start I am more happy than I have ever been. It was a risk but worked out for me. This combination we have with GM, coach and starting QB has been good but the arrow is pointing down. RR and MS were let go for the same reason.
I am willing to eat crow if I am wrong but this is what I am seeing from this team since 2012 season.
I feel the same way about my divorce as it turns out it was the best thing that ever happened to me since I met my new wife.
Anyhow, my thoughts on the GM, coach and QB issues are that I don't think we will see a house cleaning all at once it will be gradual. I just don't see this organization operating that way and stability has always been their way of operating. So if I was a betting person I think either TT or MM steps down sometime this offseason but they will not clean house with both of them at the same time.
One thing we probably would need to prepare ourselves for is that if MM is fired or quits he wont be unemployed long (if he choses to). Jobs like San Fran, Jax, Miami, Buffalo, and yes Chicago could be open. If he keeps coaching I hope it would be in the AFC.
The Heckler posted:PackerPatrick posted:I kinda hate that we are even talking about a complete change in Coaching and in GM as well. But I hated to go through with my divorce too. I remember lots and lots of hurt feelings. But after a rough start I am more happy than I have ever been. It was a risk but worked out for me. This combination we have with GM, coach and starting QB has been good but the arrow is pointing down. RR and MS were let go for the same reason.
I am willing to eat crow if I am wrong but this is what I am seeing from this team since 2012 season.
I feel the same way about my divorce as it turns out it was the best thing that ever happened to me since I met my new wife.
Anyhow, my thoughts on the GM, coach and QB issues are that I don't think we will see a house cleaning all at once it will be gradual. I just don't see this organization operating that way and stability has always been their way of operating. So if I was a betting person I think either TT or MM steps down sometime this offseason but they will not clean house with both of them at the same time.
One thing we probably would need to prepare ourselves for is that if MM is fired or quits he wont be unemployed long (if he choses to). Jobs like San Fran, Jax, Miami, Buffalo, and yes Chicago could be open. If he keeps coaching I hope it would be in the AFC.
Agree, A total "cleaning house" is unlikely. And MM is good enough to get consideration by other teams. Good for him but his time in GB may have passed.
To those who wonder if there are no other options I submit the possibility of someone like Josh McDaniel. Young yet with a history of working with a great QB in the Bill Belichick led system, which many of us wish we would emulate.
It's an off-season issue.
This season can still be saved. I believe Mike can do it. I am on board with him for 8 more games.
Blair Kiel posted:Please let your second thought be, "Jump!".
My second thought was looking for my Employee Assistance Program reference card.
DocBenni posted:There needs to be a change and I think it needs to include TT as well as the coaching staff. It's time to let Elliot run the show. TT is too loyal to fire MM. We may end up with a worse coach, but if we don't give it a try, we will only have more of the same from MM until he or Rodgers leaves.
WTF good would that do? Elliot is another cog in the staff.
That's also too drastic a change, IMO, but if they're going to "clean house" then they need to truly clean house.
Team has really been on a downward trajectory since the devastating collapse in Seattle but I just don't see Murphy pulling the plug on TT. Stafford is the best QB in the division largely because of Jim Bob Cooter and he's someone that should deserve consideration.
If the problem is lack of execution at this stage of the season, it's because either the scheme is too complex for the players or they are unmotivated. Either way, it's a failure of the coaching.
I can see MM being let go but removing TT necessitates finding someone just like him. His is the model the Packers can survive with. With open books there's no other way to maintain success.
Build through the draft, extend your stars early at market rates, don't overpay your FA vets, sign only bargain free agents.
MM just said in his presser that both Cook & Starks would practice today in what he would describe as a "limited fashion". Would then see how they made it through today & padded practice tomorrow. Said he didn't have a "bead on" CM's condition.
An actual TE and an actual RB would be Jim Fricken Dandy in my book. And not really, ah, too much to ask for.
A TE & RB position remakes could be coming this off season. TT may have to .... (heaven forbid) .... sign a FA. But it could happen. If the Cubs can win the WS and Trump win the Presidency, and the Lions win the SB, then TT can sign a FA.
FTL
TE & RB as receivers could be huge this week. SD's accounted for 12 catches / 150 yards last week vs. Tenn.
TT stays, but cleans house. Too many bad decisions by MM during games, too loyal to bad coaches, too set in his ways of playing offense, a toxic relationship with his star QB... it all leads to change.
Unless, they win their next 11 games.
I don't know. What if they win their next 10, go heavily favored into the 11th vs. an opponent nobody took seriously and then poop the bed in crunch time like we've seen so many times?
Herschel posted:WTF good would that do? Elliot is another cog in the staff.
That's also too drastic a change, IMO, but if they're going to "clean house" then they need to truly clean house.
You never know, Eliot may have different views from TT. I'm sure he shares a core vision for the organization, much like Schneider, Dorsey, and McKenzie, but those all guys don't follow the TT blueprint 100%. I think they're very much behind the Draft and Develop strategy, as they should be, but we've seen all of the venture out in the trade market or FA market occasionally in ways TT never does. Eliot is obviously a smart guy, he's risen fast, so I'm sure he will adapt his strategy as GM toward what is working in the NFL.
FLPACKER posted:TE & RB as receivers could be huge this week. SD's accounted for 12 catches / 150 yards last week vs. Tenn.
Melvin Gordon caught 4 for 65 yards on top of the 196 yards he had rushing. Montgomery is almost the same size and clearly has some shiftiness, but until he carries the ball 20+ times in a game and shows can absorb that type of pounding, it's a long shot for him to have that level of impact.
DH13, another SEA type debacle in that 11th game (or the heavily favored scenario) would be the end of it for me.
In Green Bay, it's about winning Championships!
Everyone is always predicting doom and gloom. Just take it one game at a time and move on.
GB needs to send a couple scouts to Electoral College. Seems like they hang 270 on someone every time they play. At least talk to their OC.
Capers must have been calling plays against the Electoral College.
Week 10 and I've already caught myself daydreaming about Josh McDaniels roaming the sidelines. God help us all.
The fresh approach the offense needs is a TE that can either block or run. RichRod can't do either. It's like playing 10 on 11 for a running play and he can be covered by a LB.
The Packers stuck by Davante Adams for longer than many of us would have liked, and that looks like it may have finally paid off. Maybe we should give the Packers the same benefit for the doubt for RichRod? I just can't see it. Watching him get ragdolled on blocks and then flashing his 4.9 speed on crossing patterns is maddening. Quarless was a good to great blocker. Finley was a head case, but he was a matchup nightmare in the passing game.
RichRod gives you nothing in either the running game or the passing game. I know they signed Cooks for this reason, but what was the rationale behind RichRod as the 2nd TE? Is there anyone on the board that's watched practice? Does he flash something there we just don't see in games?
Clydesdale!
Now people want to ditch DickRod and Janis!
Who will catch hail marys you dum dums?
I want the Packers to be up so they can take a knee, rather than needing a Hail Mary. 
MichiganPacker posted:Maybe we should give the Packers the same benefit for the doubt for RichRod?
No, but play Jordy there.
And more Rip. Seems the QB likes him.