Arming teachers is a comedy I think they are considering
(my wife subs, she thought this was funny)
Henry posted:What he said and things.
Cop/Teacher buddy sitcom? Needs to happen.
They could be BROTHERS. Switch jobs occasionally. Hilarity.
My folks are retired teachers Dad at the college level and mom at the high school level. They worked 12 hour days routinely, during the school year. During the break dad authored books, performed research studies and represented the university in other countries, and mom tutored kids, and taught special classes. Iâd like to see most folks put in these kind of hours. Teachers do it all the time.
And thatâs another reason the younger generation doesnât want to become teachers: too much work for too little pay. Of course, they donât see the intangibles, but the tangibles are out in the open.
Way to go, QO! Iâll pitch my own experience in here. I couldnât wait to retire! And I thought I had PLENTY to do in retirement and would never be bored. But I found it more challenging than I ever would have guessed.
I highly recommend you read a book called _What Will I Do All Day_ that I found on Amazon. I bought a number of self-help books for retirement, and most were a waste, but this little book was amazingly helpful.
A year before I retired I was hospitalized with a pulmonary embolism that could have killed me. Since retiring (year and a half now), Iâve had a 2nd PE and a heart attack (September). There is so much I wanted to do in retirement! But I have to take it easy as Iâm still recovering from my heart attack.
If youâre healthy when you retire, do the traveling, active âbucket listâ things asap so you donât have health severely limit what you can do! In my case, I have a wife who has had chronic health problems for over 20 years, so weâve had challenges for a long time. The thing I never anticipated is that Iâd have health problems so early, as well.
But we have also been blessed with 4 grandkids in the last few years, with a 5th on the way. And that is exciting and gives me a lot of motivation to be around for many more years to get to watch them grow.
Oh, and in the last year and a half Iâve taken some of the greatest fly fishing trips of my life! And that was a big goal of mine. All too often when buddies did great trips in the past I couldnât because of limited time off or limited funds. Iâm making those things happen now, and they are keeping my charged up and excited.
Good luck, QO!
Hey, Royal! You be careful out there! Do what the docs say and be good. Not too many people know what a Royalwulff is and weâd hate to lose ya! :-)
Fandame, thanks. Nice to know someone understands the RW moniker.
A size 14 is a winner for me!
Fandame posted:And thatâs another reason the younger generation doesnât want to become teachers: too much work for too little pay. Of course, they donât see the intangibles, but the tangibles are out in the open.
I actually heard this said during a dinner conversation "yeah teachers dont make much but they only work 9 months a year, have great pensions, and never have to pay for healthcare or a dollar for a prescription". Amazing the stuff that comes out of the human pie hole.
Packdog posted:Fandame posted:And thatâs another reason the younger generation doesnât want to become teachers: too much work for too little pay. Of course, they donât see the intangibles, but the tangibles are out in the open.
I actually heard this said during a dinner conversation "yeah teachers dont make much but they only work 9 months a year, have great pensions, and never have to pay for healthcare or a dollar for a prescription". Amazing the stuff that comes out of the human pie hole.
My Rx copay is $50-$60. And they take 10.25% out of every check to in part fund that pension. I donât agree with a lot of what Scott Walker believes but I do agree with him that public employees should contribute half the cost of their pension.
Congratulations, QuietOne!
YATittle posted:Packdog posted:Fandame posted:And thatâs another reason the younger generation doesnât want to become teachers: too much work for too little pay. Of course, they donât see the intangibles, but the tangibles are out in the open.
I actually heard this said during a dinner conversation "yeah teachers dont make much but they only work 9 months a year, have great pensions, and never have to pay for healthcare or a dollar for a prescription". Amazing the stuff that comes out of the human pie hole.
My Rx copay is $50-$60. And they take 10.25% out of every check to in part fund that pension. I donât agree with a lot of what Scott Walker believes but I do agree with him that public employees should contribute half the cost of their pension.
Unfortunately (down here in San Diego anyway) - the government is going broke trying to pay for the pensions of the public employees. Hence, this lovely city is starting to turn into the ugly mess of San Francisco and L.A. because there is no money to keep to fix the aging infrastructure and keep it as "America's Finest city".
EDIT: just to clarify: the city's Public Employee Union does not include teachers. They are PERS. We contribute to STRS instead. And YA is correct, teachers have increased their contributions quite a bit over the past few years.
Yeah back in 1999 fool politicians thought the business cycle had been outlawed and stopped contributing to pension funds while raising benefits because Wall Street was making so much money. Glad that Brownâs pension reform makes that illegal.
The bigger problem is "defined benefit" pensions (roughly the 2%/30 years model) as opposed to the "defined contribution" model (think 401k plans and the like). The private sector switched to the latter much earlier because of the liabilities. Government didn't in part because the government-sector unions had a vested interest in fighting in, and in part because the legislators aren't the ones who have to pay for it. Either they can tax people (to a point) or, in the case of the feds, inflate the people into penury.
They tax us as I said 10.25% every paycheck. Thatâs a huge chunk.
My take has always been that people pretty much know what they are getting into before they choose a profession. We had a math teacher once that during contract negotiations time was running his mouth about how much engineers made. I told him "did they tell you when you decided to be an education major that you'd make as much as an engineer"? Furthermore (what I didn't tell him), I don't think he would have cut it as an engineering major. On the other hand when I hear people complain about all the time off educators have I tell them "you can always go back to school and get your education degree if you think it is so great" . Point is, there are plus & minuses in every profession, everyone has a choice in what direction their life goes, be happy with what you have chosen & do the best job you can within that chosen profession. My father was a factory worker, my mom a housewife, I was the only one in my family to go to college, I feel very grateful for what I have.
Thanks for posting that FLPacker. My dad was a factory worker for 43 years and my mom a housewife (well, cook, maid, babysitter, etc.). We had six kids. 2 of us went to college. But I agree. Be thankful for what you have and do. It always could be worse. If you enjoy going to work each day and enjoy the company of who you work with...it's really not "work".
Well said
El-Ka-Bong posted:I always compare teaching and law enforcement, only because every asshole out there has seen it second hand and thinks they can do it just as well, bad eggs get overgeneralized to all the hardworking folks busting ass out there, and neither of them get appreciated enough for how much they make their communities better.
I would add Nurses to this mix, as well. Too many idiots who think they can do those jobs have no clue, whatsoever, of what it takes to do those jobs. They put down the people who are educated, trained and able to do those jobs just to hear themselves complain while they do nothing to improve their own situations at home or in their lives. Instilling some respect for others, some sort of discipline and a code of conduct, or manners, their children will have to adhere to in the classrooms, on the streets and at home would go a long way to easing the negative crap teachers, law enforcement and nurses face on a daily basis.
We haven't even mentioned other conditions teachers face daily and are held accountable for, such as ever increasing class sizes where teachers do not have the time to give individual help to those who need it, having to teach to the test, teaching in outdated facilities, to name but a few.
You mean the complete systematic attack & disassembly of the education system over the past 40 years? Michigan's public education system is flourishing.
On another note that isn't completely obvious, I read an article about flipping the concept of homework. Essentially having students view the lectures out of class, then answering questions about the lecture and doing the work in class. I could see this being a solid alternative approach, especially for those who learn in different manners. (fleeting thought)
What's intriguing about the above statements on education, nursing and law enforcement is this. "Hi, I'm relatively healthy and educated. I see other options than those that would involve a run in with law enforcement. Options that would be of value to the society rather then being fodder for the private prison system".
Generalized? Sure, but tell me I'm wrong.
After listening to the Sec of Education last night on 60 minutes I am confident our education system is in good hands .
1.) I am a math teacher who could have been an engineer or actuary...I am very happy with my choice and do not complain about my pay. This is the profession that selected me and I am very happy with all aspects of it.
B.) The flipped classroom is a very interesting concept. I had a colleague who attempted it a couple of years ago. He found that way too many of his students didn't do the required viewing at home and thus he was teaching them the material the next day while other students had no one to help them with their classwork. I think it can work, but the students have a heavy responsibility that they have to carry out.
Personally, I love teaching in a block schedule (90 minute classes for covering a semester in a year). The extra time allows for me to give the students guided practice in class every day.
III.) Don't get me started on teaching to the test. Wisconsin requires every student to take the ACT. Great concept, but it really puts students who are not interested in an advanced college degree (and their teachers) under a microscope. Teaching to the test when the students have no interest or desire to take the test can be a recipe for failure on many levels.
justanotherpackerfan posted:1.) I am a math teacher
I knew there was something wrong with you.
justanotherpackerfan posted:1.) I am a math teacher
B.) The flipped classroom is a very interesting concept. I had a colleague who attempted it a couple of years ago. He found that way too many of his students didn't do the required viewing at home and thus he was teaching them the material the next day while other students had no one to help them with their classwork. I think it can work, but the students have a heavy responsibility that they have to carry out.
III.) Don't get me started on teaching to the test. Wisconsin requires every student to take the ACT. Great concept, but it really puts students who are not interested in an advanced college degree (and their teachers) under a microscope.
1. I am an English teacher. FWIW, IMHO, LOL.
2. Flipped classroom. I cannot for the life of me see where this is a good idea for 75 percent of students. It sounds awesome, but "My parents made me go to dinner for our grandmother's birthday," "I had a soccer game an hour away one way," "Our internet/computer/printer at home isn't working," "I can't afford a computer," etc., etc. It's just not practical.
3. Just was presented with our state testing schedule. Goodbye to a minimum of four days of instruction plus one at least of pre-test prep for April alone. And all our students take the ACT as well, plus other mandated tests.
I knew what I was getting into when I signed up to teach, but I think people would be amazed at how little time actually goes into making teachers the best they can be (that's called "summer required hours"), and how much more goes into record keeping, quasi-parenting, meetings with parents and others, dealing with kids' mental health issues, etc., etc.
And don't get me started on DoDo DeVos!
Good posting. So true. Out here at my school....we are a "performing arts school"....besides the other extra-curriculular activities...
Students miss a lot of class time because they have a function to go to DURING THE SCHOOL DAY. or they miss class because of a different function....or we have different bell schedule with periods missed due to an assembly. We have had so many assemblies and alternate schedules that I had started to keep track...over the last 2 years at least one-third of our 180 day school year we were on a different schedule and kids missed instruction. We are told that these kids will make up any missed work...but...they don't.
Our State TEsting schedule covers 3 weeks of school. We don't test on Mondays or Fridays. It's a block schedule of 100 minutes for each of the testing sessions. We try to squeeze in the other periods, but they are shorter class times. Also, one year, I only saw my Period 4 class ONCE in those 3 weeks. I know, it's the administrator who puts out the schedule, but it's also that we test our kids way too much.
So, yes...IF teachers are allowed to teach and students told that they must be in class....then everything is fine...
whew...I feel better now. Thanks Fandame!
No problem, SDPF! Us teachers have to stick together! 
Do you guys/gals think students should have some responsibilities as a student?
I realize there will always be situations that mean students miss class time, but the ones who are just being lazy and playing video games instead of putting in the required study should have to 'pay' some kind of penalty that doesn't affect the rest of the classroom.
Yes, I do, Timmy, but what I've found is that NCLB fostered a passivity in students that is appalling--"just give me the right answer"--that sure doesn't fit with the "lifelong learners" meme. Curiousity has been beaten out of too many of them.
Teaching to the test has made a lot of educators and students into robots. And yes, students are responsible for their own learning. The biggest challenge is getting them to stick with something that requires sustained effort. The internet has made so much so easy that âif I canât find it in three clicks, I give upâ is the new mantra. The internet is a double-edged sword.
Fandame posted:Teaching to the test has made a lot of educators and students into robots. And yes, students are responsible for their own learning. The biggest challenge is getting them to stick with something that requires sustained effort. The internet has made so much so easy that âif I canât find it in three clicks, I give upâ is the new mantra. The internet is a double-edged sword.
I had my fun times, I was in on the BB boards early before I even went to college in 1987 (modems and phone bills, much to mine and my friends parent's phone bills chagrin, were the punishment).
There were no wars to be motivated to join the Military, it really was about either trying to get into College or get out of your parent's house and make a life of your own.
I suffered internally when I had to ask for help for a car repair. I had enough pride and enough shame to admit when I screwed up and needed help. (Be it rent, car repairs, whatnot, I worked hard to never have to ask)
I used to believe advanced education teaches you how to learn in the real world. Sure you learn things, but what gets taught often is a few years behind current reality. But now I am not as sure.
It's still up to the student to learn how to learn. I believed that then and I believe that now. Every year raising my taxes so each student gets an iPad that they use for games or social media drives me nuts. But it seems so many choose not how to learn if they can't google it or even WANT to move out from home and get out on their own.
WWII vets/families are often called the greatest generation. There is NO WAY NO HOW that I could ever seen modern day America rally around a cause and do what needs to be done to handle the adversity that came upon that generation.
It's because of exactly what you note @Fandame, if they can't find it in a couple of clicks they give up.
I was part of the early interwebs, by the time it grew I didn't have the money to invest but I used it in manners that helped me on a daily basis. It was never a crutch and I can't imagine where the world is heading because of the lack of conceptuality that has grown with the latest generation.
Meh. Get off my lawn.
Whatever.
I try to instill a sense of pride in my students, too. I tell them that college isn't for everyone. There are so many good options for kids: Tech School; Jr. College; ROP Classes; military; or just try to get a job somewhere to build confidence and then decide what you want to do.
As was mentioned earlier, I tell my students that this will always get them to success: show up on time; have good hygiene; respect your boss (elders); respect others; treat others like you want to be treated....and...SMILE more...and then No matter who you are, there are people that will take a chance on you and help you succeed.
SanDiegoPackFan posted:I try to instill a sense of pride in my students, too. I tell them that college isn't for everyone. There are so many good options for kids: Tech School; Jr. College; ROP Classes; military; or just try to get a job somewhere to build confidence and then decide what you want to do.
As was mentioned earlier, I tell my students that this will always get them to success: show up on time; have good hygiene; respect your boss (elders); respect others; treat others like you want to be treated....and...SMILE more...and then No matter who you are, there are people that will take a chance on you and help you succeed.
A 4 year college and worthless degree isn't the right choice for many.
Trade schools and actual skills can set someone up well for life. My company BEGS for skilled welders for stainless steel at a food grade level. So much that they set up competitions between local high schools with the reward being a full welding setup station for the shop class of the school and a scholarship for the kid that wins.
Being a you tuber or blogger or an IT admin isn't necessarily the only way to have a career. I hope the kids get guided and find their place. Going 200k into debt for a degree by the destroyed secondary academy is not always the way to go.
First of all...I want to note that Cavetoadâs avatar is perfect for this conversation.
Second..I couldnât agree more with the idea that the internet has made everyone lazy. I had a theory even before the whole google everything came into society that video games were teaching our kids that failure was acceptable...âthatâs ok, I will just restartâ. And itâs not just the kids with the âjust tell me the answerâ attitude..there are some parents out the with the same thought.
i watch kids use or try to use apps like Slader or wolfram alpha to get all the answers for assignments and the wonder why they fail the tests.
Finally, as I always do after I find myself complaining, I need to point out there are a ton of intelligent, mature, motivated kids out there who will do just fine and be great leaders. I never want to forget about them...they deserve the best I have to offer (actually all the kids do).
"I had my fun times, I was in on the BB boards early before I even went to college in 1987 (modems and phone bills, much to mine and my friends parent's phone bills chagrin, were the punishment)."
I graduated from High School in 1972. the only Bulletin Boards were the ones made of cork in the classrooms that one would tack notices on. There were no personal computers. A friend of mine had a computerlike device made of plastic that was nothing more than an Americanized version of an abacus. When I got to college I took a statistics class where we had to use punch cards to run our program through a main frame computer. The key punching stations filled a room as did the main frame computer. There were Vocational Tech/trade schools but all they taught were carpentry, HVAC, welding and maybe a course or two on being a dental hygienist. There was no internet. We had things like encyclopedias that stored information in groupings like Aardvark- Astronomy or Girl to Grab. Everyone would scramble to the library to get the latest edition of Time magazine for a current events assignment. Today, Vocational Technical schools offer a real option for those not wanting a college degree, for whatever reason. We need people who know how to fix things, to install things properly, to build things that will last. We need careers that offer people a future, taught by inspired teachers who aren't restrained or constrained by political rules and insane policies. Open those minds and let the light of discovery in.
SanDiegoPackFan posted:I try to instill a sense of pride in my students, too. I tell them that college isn't for everyone. There are so many good options for kids: Tech School; Jr. College; ROP Classes; military; or just try to get a job somewhere to build confidence and then decide what you want to do.
As was mentioned earlier, I tell my students that this will always get them to success: show up on time; have good hygiene; respect your boss (elders); respect others; treat others like you want to be treated....and...SMILE more...and then No matter who you are, there are people that will take a chance on you and help you succeed.
Exactly. And plumber, welders, etc., by us earn more than the teachers--learn a trade, a skill somone will pay for.
Cavetoad posted:SanDiegoPackFan posted:I try to instill a sense of pride in my students, too. I tell them that college isn't for everyone. There are so many good options for kids: Tech School; Jr. College; ROP Classes; military; or just try to get a job somewhere to build confidence and then decide what you want to do.
As was mentioned earlier, I tell my students that this will always get them to success: show up on time; have good hygiene; respect your boss (elders); respect others; treat others like you want to be treated....and...SMILE more...and then No matter who you are, there are people that will take a chance on you and help you succeed.
A 4 year college and worthless degree isn't the right choice for many.
Trade schools and actual skills can set someone up well for life. My company BEGS for skilled welders for stainless steel at a food grade level. So much that they set up competitions between local high schools with the reward being a full welding setup station for the shop class of the school and a scholarship for the kid that wins.
Being a you tuber or blogger or an IT admin isn't necessarily the only way to have a career. I hope the kids get guided and find their place. Going 200k into debt for a degree by the destroyed secondary academy is not always the way to go.
I strongly support this and not only for the jobs themselves. It's another false mentality seeping into the culture that blue collar is somehow less than, which is ****ing stupid.
This is a really interesting article about Japan and their shift from quantity to quality, borrowing and improving American standards from decades past.
How Japan Copied American Culture and Made It Better.
After decades of recessions and a lagging economy the Japanese have figured it out.
We lose the idea of quality by looking down on craftsmen, merchants and builders. We consume a steady diet of social media and disposable **** from China. It would be nice to see a revival of craftsmanship and with it an eye for quality in our economy. We need every form of education to be on the same pedestal.
I have always wanted to learn old school blacksmithing. Turns out my great grandfather was the blacksmith for River Falls.
River Falls Journal July 16, 1887
A special meeting was held at the River Falls Courthouse last week to discuss the rash of injuries caused by horses throwing their shoes. Pops Cernohous, owner of the River Falls General Store reported two instances where horse threw shoes in front of his store causing a window to be broken on one occasion and a jar of peppermint sticks to shatter on the second. Also, the school marm, Sadie Cudd reported that one of her students was nearly injured when a thrown shoe wrapped around the students ankle. She did go on to report that the students have begun to play a game where they throw shoes and try to wrap them around each otherâs ankles and score points accordingly.
The meeting did not find a solution to the problem. Local blacksmith, Hank OâHenry could not be reached to comment on the situation as he was currently across the river in Minnesota trying to educate some no account slackers.
mrtundra posted:"I had my fun times, I was in on the BB boards early before I even went to college in 1987 (modems and phone bills, much to mine and my friends parent's phone bills chagrin, were the punishment)."
I graduated from High School in 1972. the only Bulletin Boards were the ones made of cork in the classrooms that one would tack notices on. There were no personal computers. A friend of mine had a computerlike device made of plastic that was nothing more than an Americanized version of an abacus. When I got to college I took a statistics class where we had to use punch cards to run our program through a main frame computer. The key punching stations filled a room as did the main frame computer. There were Vocational Tech/trade schools but all they taught were carpentry, HVAC, welding and maybe a course or two on being a dental hygienist. There was no internet. We had things like encyclopedias that stored information in groupings like Aardvark- Astronomy or Girl to Grab. Everyone would scramble to the library to get the latest edition of Time magazine for a current events assignment. Today, Vocational Technical schools offer a real option for those not wanting a college degree, for whatever reason. We need people who know how to fix things, to install things properly, to build things that will last. We need careers that offer people a future, taught by inspired teachers who aren't restrained or constrained by political rules and insane policies. Open those minds and let the light of discovery in.
I also think that we need to get more kids in to fields such as welders, plumbers, HVAC guys, electricians, carpenters etc. I think that too often these days parents for some reason think their kid isn't a success and they don't go to college but instead go to a trade school. As Henry said we have this habit of looking down at people in these fields and I think we are wrong to do so I say we encourage kids to go down that path. A good example is my son in law. He isn't ever going to be a Rhode's scholar and he just isn't the college type. He isn't dumb at all he is more of the get his hands on things and make it work type of guy and he loves it. And I tell you what he is the best mechanic I have ever been around and is doing quite well for himself in his early 20's.