He was more valuable to the team when he was injured.....BadaBoom!!!
I’m kidding.
The Kittle TD wasn't King's fault, but let's face it. He is a targeted weakness along with Martinez in the passing game. Every team has holes, so it can't be an excuse.
I am beginning to lose faith in Pettine. He has been given a big influx of talent, but we're still seeing the same issues. The LAC game was particularly damning. To his credit, the defense forced a bunch of 3 and outs against the 49ers in the first half and the offense and ST did not hold up their end of the bargain. But it is the huge chunk plays over and over again. He's got a month and half to right the ship.
Look, I LOVE Mike Pettine. But his passive, constantly-giving-up-big-plays bullshit can only be tolerated for so long. He was hired by the previous head coach and reportedly strongly pushed onto the current one. But it wouldn’t surprise me at all if LaFleur wanted his own guy.
— Aaron Nagler (@AaronNagler) November 27, 2019
Faith in Pettine does appear to be on the wane.
Oooohhh....Nagler with a Hot Take! Never seen that before.... 
🙄 it’s year two of a soft rebuild. Some things are better some things are not. Pettine isn’t perfect, but there are gaps in talent and they’re at key spots (ILB, DL2, CB2/3/4). It’s great having Jaire and KC and the Smiths, but when you have obvious gaps like King, Martinez, Lowry, etc. then you can work around those stars. You don’t need 11 stars, but you need 11 starting caliber players. I don’t think Pettine has 11 starters right now.
I hear you... but I think he's got enough talent to work with to not be the 28th ranked defense in the league. Detroit, Miami, Arizona and Cincy are the only teams ranked worse than GB.
From packerswire...uggh and yikes...but fits with what we see on sundays.
Its hard to find legitimate excuses for Mike Pettine and the highly disappointing Packers defense.
Yet the Packers are 14th in points allowed per game and 22nd in DVOA.
Despite a strong start, the Packers have allowed the third-most yards per play (6.1) this season. Seven times in the last eight games, the Packers have allowed 22 or more points.
Za’Darius Smith and Preston Smith, the team’s two prized free-agent acquisitions, both have 10 or more sacks. Gutekunst hit home runs with both. But it hasn’t really mattered.
Five quarterbacks in the last eight games produced a passer rating over 100.0. against the Packers.
Only five teams have allowed more yards per attempt (8.2) than the Packers this season. Only five teams have allowed more rushing yards per attempt (4.8). This is one of the most inefficient defenses in the NFL on a down-to-down basis.
As a result, there’s been a lot of bending. Overall, the Packers are 27th in the NFL in forcing three-and-outs per drive. And the defense has allowed more passing yards, more rushing yards and more total yards per game than last season
Sufferinginmn posted:....highly disappointing Packers defense.
Sums it up very well in only four words.
packerboi posted:Rashan Gary: 13 snaps.
Josh Jackson: 0 snaps.
Montravious Adams: 6 snaps.
Orin Burks: 0 snaps.
That's a whole lot of high round draft picks who did nothing yesterday. And that's hardly an outlier. It's been this way nearly all season.
If I'm Gutekunst, wouldn't you be asking why? Either these players don't fit the system or they lack the talent. Neither is good.
I understand it's early, but Gary to this point is particularly damning. This is the 12th overall pick in the draft who Gute drafted to be a very part time back up player. That simply cannot be what he envisioned when he took him 12th.
Burks was projected by many to be a 6th round pick and was viewed as a huge reach. It’s looking like taking him in the 6th would have been a huge reach at this point. Horrible pick
Pakrz posted:Detroit, Miami, Arizona and Cincy are the only teams ranked worse than GB.
Where is Green Bay ranked as far as points allowed?
50k Club posted:The Kittle TD wasn't King's fault, but let's face it. He is a targeted weakness along with Martinez in the passing game. Every team has holes, so it can't be an excuse.
Looks like these PFF scores for the season support this:
D. Adams 86.1 A. Jones 85.4 Z. Smith 84.6 AR 81.5 Sullivan 74.6 J. Williams 74.2 t. Williams 73.7 Bulaga 72.4 Amos 72.2 K. Clark 71.1 Bak 71.0 Alexander 70.7 Lazard 70.0 P.Smith 69.5 Lewis 67.9 Jenkins 67.7 Lancaster 65.3 Savage 64.9 Kumerow 64.4 Frackell 63.2 Campbell 62.7 Linsley 62.1 Turner 61.8 Tonyan 61.8 Lowry 58.8 MVS 58.6 J. Graham 57.5 Martinez 56.9 Gary 56.5 Allison 55.3 K. King 54.0 |
Boris posted:Pakrz posted:Detroit, Miami, Arizona and Cincy are the only teams ranked worse than GB.
Where is Green Bay ranked as far as points allowed?
I'm sure you know the answer to that question or you wouldn't have asked.
If you want to defend Pettine and his shit defense, more power to you. I'm not buying it. There's clearly some good individual players, but collectively, that defense consistently needs to be much, much better.
Stats are great when they support my view.
Pakrz posted:I like weinies. Is that good or bad?
In life context is everything.
Agree the defense needs to be MUCH better. Starting with disallowed explosive plays
I get irrationally I rated by people citing PFF stats. I thought it was common knowledge that these are garbage
"There's lies, damned lies, and statistics." -- Mark Twain
“I never tweeted that.” - Mark Twain
"I lied. But I controlled the airport." --George Washington
"The Bears Still Suck!" - Abe Lincoln's corpse
Green Bay Packers’ Defense Has Gone Backwards Under Coordinator Mike Pettine
“I just think that continuity going into Year 2 for the defense is going to be critical because I think you’ll see there’s always a learning curve in Year 1,” LaFleur said the day he announced Pettine’s hiring. “And I’m excited to see what the defense can do in Year 2 moving forward.”
That excitement has undoubtedly turned to disappointment, which has raised some questions about Pettine’s future with the organization.Green Bay currently ranks 28th in total defense, 26th in rushing defense and 23rd in passing defense. The Packers are 14th in scoring defense, 18th in opponent quarterback rating, 17th in sacks and 10th in turnovers.
Some interesting statistical comparisons in the piece to Dom's defense. It's a bottom line business and the bottom line is the defense hasn't been good enough considering the health of the unit and the investment made by the team last off-season.
In addition to the backend making communication mistakes which have led to big plays, three guys who should be cornerstones on defense have not had good seasons; Lowry, King, & Martinez have really been exploited this season. Lowry had one good game but has had a lot of trouble getting off blocks. King has been wildly inconsistent, & Martinez just can't react quickly enough to both run (can't move up into the hole) and pass(can't drop fast enough to take away the middle seam).
I don't think we've seen a lack of adaptation by Pettine but results speak for themselves. The defense as a whole has done enough to get to 8-3. What is the fail point? Over evaluation of current defensive talent? Inability to adjust maximizing talent (Norvening)? Or inability to adjust due to lack of talent (TT, the farewell tour)?
The Wizard and McVince had damn near a decade to showcase their incompetence. Quite frankly the new regime from FO to sidelines is still mopping up their shit and taking their blame. Yes, I'd like to see what another year of talent acquisition and cohesion could produce. You simply cannot discount how effective the FA additions have been. Uncle Tranny Ted created quite a hole.
YET, the biggest "self scout" any person in the organization should be doing is for complacency. We saw how McVince kept turning over assistants only to replace them with other turds while hanging onto the King Shits of the coaching world. If Pettine isn't a fit then Mayo better have serious considerations as to next steps and if urgency or patience is what's called for.
As a 1st year/time coach with a 2nd year DC that's a lot to digest. But hey, The Wizard and McVince's sins ended up on his plate.
This observation applies to the Pack and frankly all teams. Just wrapping up and using proper tackling techniques would make a lot of third and ones into third and sevens. See it every week in every game.
Fundamentals still count.
You could make the case they're fundamental.
Seattle has shown the world how to tackle....wrap up & twist. That's how they're coached. It works really well. There is zero reason the Packer coaches aren't teaching this. Zero.
Boris posted:Seattle Rugby has shown the world how to tackle....wrap up & twist. That's how they're coached. It works really well. There is zero reason the Packer coaches aren't teaching this. Zero.
Fixed.
FLPACKER posted:50k Club posted:The Kittle TD wasn't King's fault, but let's face it. He is a targeted weakness along with Martinez in the passing game. Every team has holes, so it can't be an excuse.
Looks like these PFF scores for the season support this:
D. Adams 86.1
A. Jones 85.4
Z. Smith 84.6
AR 81.5
Sullivan 74.6
J. Williams 74.2
t. Williams 73.7
Bulaga 72.4
Amos 72.2
K. Clark 71.1
Bak 71.0
Alexander 70.7
Lazard 70.0
P.Smith 69.5
Lewis 67.9
Jenkins 67.7
Lancaster 65.3
Savage 64.9
Kumerow 64.4
Frackell 63.2
Campbell 62.7
Linsley 62.1
Turner 61.8
Tonyan 61.8
Lowry 58.8
MVS 58.6
J. Graham 57.5
Martinez 56.9
Gary 56.5
Allison 55.3
K. King 54.0
I can't take any site seriously that has P. Smith below Lazard and King below Gary and Allison.
But if you do take that site seriously, then LaFleur should be coach of the year. The Packers have a lot of low-rated starters for an 8-3 team.
#Packers defense is going to give up yards, as it showed once again vs. Giants. It also showed why it can still make a deep playoff run: stiffening in red zone, harassing the QB, and making game-changing plays.
— Ryan Wood (@ByRyanWood) December 2, 2019
The blueprint for a Super Bowl chase: https://t.co/lfaYJXpOfK
A player that appears to have fallen out of favor. Link
Where is Montravius Adams? The third-year defensive lineman didn’t get on the field until mop-up time and had only six snaps. After getting 24 snaps at the Los Angeles Chargers and 15 against Carolina, he had only six snaps last week. Kenny Clark, Dean Lowry and Tyler Lancaster got the huge majority of playing time among the defensive linemen Sunday, and rookie Kingsley Keke, not Adams, was the first lineman off the bench.
#Packers Red Zone Defense
— Ben Fennell (@BenFennell_NFL) December 2, 2019
🔸Scoring Efficiency - 75.0% (3rd)
🔸QB Rating - 65.9 (2nd)
🔸Completions - 45.9% (2nd)
🔸TD Percentage - 11.5% (1st)
🔸Interceptions - 4 (1st)
Team gives up chunk plays & 3rd downs conversions.. but they are one stingy team when the field shortens up
But I want them to be f***ing stingy before the opposing team gets to the red zone!
The Packers have some serious deficiencies in talent on both sides of the roster.
The defense has really only one good DL - Kenny Clark. Lowry, Lancaster, Keke, Adams are all mediocre if even that good.
They have two good OLBs. I am liking Fackrell more and more this season has he seems to have added strength and can hold the point much better than he has in the past. But beyond that they have not much.
ILB is a disaster. I know Martinez racks up tackles, so what? He isn't confident enough to shoot gaps and make plays. He is lost in coverage and a complete liability. Every TE in the league from star to putz eats him up. And he's the best one they have!
CB: I actually think King is pretty good. He does have 4 ints (2nd in the league I think) and 17 pass break ups. (That's Stephone Gilmore type numbers, not that I'm comparing their play levels). King get's thrown at because opposite him sits pocket Hercules. T Williams can't really run anymore. Anyone with speed can beat him. The rest are JAGS.
I like the safeties. I think Amos is a stud. Savage has lots to learn and I'd like to see him be much more aggressive but I think he's getting there. Behind them? Not even sure what they have other than some swing type guys.
Until GB fixes the DL and ILB they are going to give up lots of yards. That's just the hand the coaches have been dealt. Like i said in another thread, I'd play Burks if he can handle the calls and live and die with him. He can run and he can hit but I think he's one of those mechanical type players that doesn't have a feel for the ILB position. That's a spot where experience and feel for he game is invaluable.
From above:
Team gives up chunk plays & 3rd downs conversions.. but they are one stingy team when the field shortens up.
That's because you can't give up plays of 40+ yards when the opponent is inside your 20.
So Carolina fires their coach and they're likely to jettison their franchise QB, anyone think there's a chance they jettison some other high cap hit players like...Luke Kuechly? Just go full rebuilding mode. IF, hypothetically, they decided they were open to moving Kuechly, what would you give for him? 2 1sts? More?