This Packers Offense...

RE: Adams. The holding call he earned yesterday was some of the most piss poor blocking technique I've seen from a Packers WR in a long time. His hand placement was WAY outside the pads and he essentially hugged the Dallas player in the most half ass way I've seen. That's stuff you see in an 8th grade game.

And IIRC, the end of that series got him a trip to the bench for a couple series.

Stuff like this has nothing to do with his ankle. That's about shotty ass effort and not really giving a damn. And that should lead to a decreased role on this O.

Cobb isn't having the kind of year he envisioned. But I'll say this. He's blocked his ass off all season including several key blocks that lead to huge gains for Lacy/Starks yesterday.

Exactly Packerboi. I was at a high school game Friday night on the sideline and I didn't see blocking like that from the WRs...

Koopla Krash posted:

That's it, Cuqui.  I have really questioned the dual role of Alex Van Pelt as the QB/WR coach.  MM has essentially admitted his mistake with the over-promotion of Clements.  IMO, he made a similar mistake with putting a journeyman back-up QB as the instructor for young WRs.  Under his tutelage, Adams has regressed.  Janis has not developed.  Have to wonder how much Montgomery/Abbrederis will learn from Van Pelt.

so it's Van Pelt's fault that DropVante sucks this year, that's rich. Then why not include Winnie Moss in the conversation? This thread should be renamed "Please don't criticize DropVante"

What posts are you reading?  Are you concussed?

Adams is still very young. Totally premature to write him off right now.

2016 should feature: a healthy Jordy Nelson, Randall Cobb, a healthy Ty Monty and perhaps a high draft pick at either TE or WR. That line up alone may squeeze Adams out of significant playing time unless he rededicates his game and himself to being the kind of WR many including myself thought he'd be in 2015,

The train that is the NFL won't wait around. He's got a limited window of time to right his ship.

Bubbleboy,

Yes, but it is not premature to demote him and go with someone else for now.

In fact it is overdue.

FYI: Jordy Nelson was demoted in his 2nd year to the 4th WR. In part because of a nagging on-off again knee injury (*cough* Davante's ankle *cough*) and in part for lack of production. It's not like MM's never done it before.

packerboi posted:

FYI: Jordy Nelson was demoted in his 2nd year to the 4th WR. In part because of a nagging on-off again knee injury (*cough* Davante's ankle *cough*) and in part for lack of production. It's not like MM's never done it before.

And in his rather unspectacular 3rd year I remember wanting to kill him for dropping a wide open crossing pattern that we needed badly to get our mojo back in the 3rd quarter of the Superb Owl, no less.

People forget...he didn't go ape**** until his 4th year.

oldschool posted:

I don't want to poop in the punch bowl, but I might stir it with a turd shaped spoon just a little.

Lets not forget we were playing a Cassel led Dallas team Sunday. Putrid 

The victory had more to do with the Packers offense vs a decent defense.   They rolled up points on a bad team like they should've.  Still clunky but signs of life.

oldschool posted:

packerboi posted:

FYI: Jordy Nelson was demoted in his 2nd year to the 4th WR. In part because of a nagging on-off again knee injury (*cough* Davante's ankle *cough*) and in part for lack of production. It's not like MM's never done it before.

And in his rather unspectacular 3rd year I remember wanting to kill him for dropping a wide open crossing pattern that we needed badly to get our mojo back in the 3rd quarter of the Superb Owl, no less.

People forget...he didn't go ape**** until his 4th year.

I recall the drop you are referring to. I also recall that in Super Bowl XLV, Nelson -- not Greg Jennings or Donald Driver or James Jones -- caught nine passes for 140 yards and a touchdown.

 That game showed us what was to come from him.

As I recall, Jordy dropped the pass on 2nd down and Rodgers went right back to him on 3rd down and he almost scored a TD.  Rodgers hit Gerg for a TD on the next play I believe.

Janis will never be Jordy.  Jordy possesses unique body control and former QB smarts that combined with his physical measureables make him what he is.  

But it would be great if he could develop into a #3/deep threat.

We also had other options when Jordy was demoted. We had Gerg, Driver, and Jones all playing well. Demoting Dumvante means Jared Glassedaris and old man Jones are playing a lot of snaps with Janis Jackson running deep on every play.

They should run Janis deep on every play.  No moves, no double moves, no stutter and go, just balls out sprint down the sideline down after down.  Same sideline.  I'd pay to see that entertainment.  

WHat DH13 said. Takes the safety out of the play, I'll bet, and if they give up eventually and figure he's a Trojan Horse, Rodgers can hit him long. 

 

All it takes is once.

I was being facetious.  Watching whoever is calling the game notice it and point out a WR doing wind sprints on offense, I find...comical?

Grave Digger posted:

We also had other options when Jordy was demoted. We had Gerg, Driver, and Jones all playing well. Demoting Dumvante means Jared Glassedaris and old man Jones are playing a lot of snaps with Janis Jackson running deep on every play.

I think the biggest problem with Adams is not just the drops, it's the inability to carry out assignments. If he just wasn't getting things done because he wasn't physically able to it's one thing. However, he there has been a lot of comments about him quitting on patterns, not being able to make pretty standard blocks on DBs, and just looking like he's going through the motions on patterns at times.

I'd rather have a guy going all out - even if he was doing things wrong at time  - than to put a guy out there that is half assing it but "in the right place."

It also may come out that Adams has been playing badly hurt all year and he was gutting it out all year. I think that's unlikely at this stage, but if he is gutting it out, it changes the way you think about him.

Grave Digger posted:

Demoting Dumvante means Jared Glassedaris and old man Jones are playing a lot of snaps with Janis Jackson running deep on every play.

They could not and would not be worse.

Janis would be worse than Adams has been playing. Abbrederis runs very clean routes and as MP pointed out, Adams has been half-assing it out there for some reason.

MichiganPacker posted:

... It also may come out that Adams has been playing badly hurt all year and he was gutting it out all year. I think that's unlikely at this stage, but if he is gutting it out, it changes the way you think about him.

Gutting it out implies a hell of a lot more effort than we've seen, IMO. If an injury is responsible for the way he's comported himself on the field then he should have been inactivated or IR'd. What he's been about is simply not acceptable.

Inactive? At one point all they had was Adams with a bad ankle, Jones and Cobb. I believe it is all mental at this point. He got hurt and came back too early. Then for some reason Rodgers and/or Clements decided they should play catch during the game. Same back shoulder over and over. 21 frickin times. ****ed up.

MichiganPacker posted:

 

... It also may come out that Adams has been playing badly hurt all year and he was gutting it out all year. I think that's unlikely at this stage, but if he is gutting it out, it changes the way you think about him.

Maybe not too far-fetched at all.
Because of the run of injuries at WR, I think it likely his treatment was 'fast-tracked' to have him available on the QT. I can also imagine plenty of "we need you", "we're counting on you", and similar pressure coming from coaches.

Jody posted:

Koopla Krash posted:

That's it, Cuqui.  I have really questioned the dual role of Alex Van Pelt as the QB/WR coach.  MM has essentially admitted his mistake with the over-promotion of Clements.  IMO, he made a similar mistake with putting a journeyman back-up QB as the instructor for young WRs.  Under his tutelage, Adams has regressed.  Janis has not developed.  Have to wonder how much Montgomery/Abbrederis will learn from Van Pelt.

so it's Van Pelt's fault that DropVante sucks this year, that's rich. Then why not include Winnie Moss in the conversation? This thread should be renamed "Please don't criticize DropVante"

Did you even read what I wrote?  I mentioned more than just Adams - I was focusing on the young WRs development - I mentioned 4 WRs - who are being led by what I feel is an over-promoted/unqualified journeyman QB.  You reference Adams' pass-catching (I didn't).  I was underscoring running routes, run blocking, reading defenses, etc.  Based on sentiment I saw on Adams after his rookie year, there was excitement about him taking the next step.  He has obviously regressed.  Janis has been living in No-Where Land.  Monty/Abby have played in roughly a combined half season in their careers.  Heck, even 25-year old Randall Cobb has struggled this year.

The WR position is so prone to the diva mentality, I believe you need someone coaching them that has earned "street cred" - Edgar Bennett has that as he was an accomplished receiver out of the backfield.  I don't believe Van Pelt can demonstratively run crisp routes nor display proper blocking fundamentals by doing it in practice/putting on a former game tape of him doing it.  Instead these players get their instruction from a 45-year old former QB with less than 500 pass attempts that looks more like Jared Lorenzen now than a NFL WR.  Lastly, since Van Pelt is also the QB coach, I feel he will more likely be an advocate for the QB position (since he was a former QB) opposed to sticking up for the WRs - think that might build any resentment/lack of trust?

Another potential contributing factor to the seemingly drop in development/production for this group to this is the loss of not having Jordy to lead by example - the youngsters can't watch how the consummate professional does it in practice/games.

BTW, your inclusion of Winston Moss in your response was extremely nonsensical.

It's clear the timing between Rodgers and Adams is off. Adams has had some head scratching drops, but so did Jordy early in his career. Remember the drops he had in the SB? The timing of the whole offense looked better against Dallas and actually it seemed Adams had a better game...fewer targets than other games, but he and Rodgers looked more in sync. Perhaps Clements screwed timing and rhythm for this O affected Adams more than we realize!

Adams was only targeted three times in the Dallas game an neither he or DickRod were much of a part of the game plan. Don't really care for some of Adams' histrionics when he feels a penalty should have been called but haven't got the impression that he's somehow turned into a diva. I understand he's a favorite target of fans' frustrations but he's a second year player going through a rough patch and people need to maintain some perspective.

I agree with that. I don't think he's a diva, just a young player who is frustrated. This year has been very challenging for him, it's a good test of what kind of mental makeup he has. He has the physical tools to be a special player, let's hope he has the mental tools to match. Same can be said for Eddie Lacy, although we are already seeing him rebound and get back on track.

Out of the 73 receivers with 50 or more targets, Football Outsiders rates Adams 72nd (i.e. second worst in the league) on DVOA (basically effectiveness per play).  Ty Montgomery would rate in the top 5 if he qualified.

Looks like there is room for improvement 

Nowhere to go but up!