IF McCarthy is canned at the end of the season...

None of us know what really is going on behind the scenes in GB.  We as a bunch of noobs on the internet can only speculate on what is going on.  We don'd know if MM has lost the team, we don't know if AR is just doing his own thing, or if it is true that they are at each others throats as some in the media report.

The one thing I do wonder about is what is really behind McCarthy and his contract is perhaps he has had enough of the grind and perhaps will ride off in to the sunset.  I know many will like that a lot and I am coming around to that idea but not fully yet.  So if he does what next? Who should they hire (I sure hope the mentioning of Saban was a joke that would be a horrible hire).

Pettine? has the D been that good so far that he deserves it?  to me that is a no

Philbon? ahhh no

Are they any hot coordinators right now that are up and comers?

I don't think that usually works out but is there a college guy that could be a good hire?  How about the guy Riley (is that his name?) from Oklahoma?  I have read some article that NFL coaches pick his brain for offensive ideas.

If the Packers move in that direction to me this may be the most important hire they have made in a long time because they can't screw this one up.

Today on "What Mike said...."

MM told the local scribes the team isn't going to practice today but instead will spend more time in the "classroom environment"

Ok. Got it......... wait.......WTF?

McCarthy on why Aaron Jones isn't getting the ball more: "Aaron is dynamic with the football in his hands, but I think it's very obvious the balance that we're seeking from our running back position. ... There's more to playing the position than just running the football."

Translation, "Aaron Jones is the best back we have. But when you do a ****ty job of preparing a team and you're down three scores in the first qtr you're gonna need the QB you pretend you're trying to protect start slinging the pigskin all over the ****ing yard which keeps your dynamic playmakers on the sideline"

Starting to think Mike has had enough of the organization having seen enough of him and he's slowly letting water in the boat and by the time he's fired the boat will be underwater. It's the only plausible explanation for what's going on right now. 

It's all Danica's fault.

If there's is more to the running back position than running the ball why hasn't the best back on the team been coached up on those duties?  

It’s becoming obvious the Packers made a mistake by not jettisoning MM at the end of last season as they did with just about everyone else of significance.   He’s basically in full lame duck coaching mode and it’s degrading in spectacular fashion.  

That’s not MMs fault; I blame Murphy and to a lesser extent Gute for not implementing a full house cleaning as they should have after a very disappointing 7-9 season. 

The problem now is they are in no mans land.  There’s a strong chance this dysfunctional arrangement will eventually lead toward MM checking out or 12 checking out or both.  Neither which are good scenarios as it means the potential for another wasted year with no hardware to show for it. 

Personally, I think this week is critical for MM.  If they don’t come out next Monday and play with their hair on fire I would give strong consideration to sending MM on his way during the bye week.  Why prolong the misery if it’s obvious he’s not in the long term plans of the team?  The only concern then is who steps in for the rest of the year but let’s be honest - if they lose this week or look uninspired the upcoming gauntlet of games could get very ugly.  And the story may write itself anyway. 

Sorry but there is no way they send MM packing on the bye week unless MM quits.  It is only my crappy opinion but I think MM gets a lot of leash based upon his long term track record and we also do not know the dynamics behind the scenes is like.  We don't know how how MM interacts with the players,  management, and others in the organization and what they think of him and if he is as stubborn as many believe.   This is very important if you think about it because we don't know what the atmosphere is at 1265.  

Packers don't do knee-jerk. An evaluation of Mike and his future will be conducted after the season.

I don't think getting a new coach will solve everything that is wrong with this team.  That said, it wouldn't shock me at all if McCarthy decided he had enough at the end of the year and stepped down if this team doesn't make the playoffs.

The Pack has had a great run, but I think last year we saw how talent deficient the team was. Due to guys like Matthews, Bulaga, Clinton-Dix, and Crosby all in decline and the exit of Jordy Nelson and Jahri Evans, we might be in worse shape this year.  There's still a lot of weaknesses all over the place and it's going to take minimum 1 or 2 great off-seasons of player acquisition to fix no matter who is coaching.  And maybe the most important thing of all that needs fixing, they need to keep Aaron Rodgers as close to 100% healthy as they can for his final years or nothing else they do with the rest of the team will really matter.

If there is anything to the notion that AR and MM are at odds, I would be curious to know why AR would agree to a contract extension as he recently did. Not likely that any frustration on Rodger's part developed overnight. So does AR know something that hasn't been make public such as MM's departure being imminent after this season, whether voluntary or otherwise? AR will eventually get back on track and show he's worth every dime the Packers have committed.  Agree that any departure of MM at this stage will not be knee-jerk but rather will be orderly so as not to bruise the AR relationship with the team. TT's "departure" is a good example.

Good point on making sure you don't hurt Aarons relationship with the team.  I am not one to believe you consult players on moves but I do think in the case of #12 you may have to think about that.   

FIGHTPHOE93, I agree that perhaps this roster isn't as good as we thought and it might be right in the middle of a turnover in players that seems to happen every few years.  I do think they have some bright spots though and I really do trust the new GM to make the right player decisions as well as what the organization will do with MM.  One thing I will say is that from everything we have seen it sure seems like the new GM will make the right long term decisions for the team.  

Glaring red flags:

The Packers are 23rd In the NFL with a -2 turn over ratio.

They are close to the bottom 3rd in give aways. 

The rank 2nd in the NFL in penalties and yardage per game. 

2 of the biggest staples in football are to take care of the football and don't make mass penalties. They are doing both. 

MM has very little time to turn this schit around. Beyond SF, their schedule gets brutal in a hurry. 

Define long term......seems to me the next 2 or 3 years is what matters most.  But I am  old,  my next shingles will be the 5 yr shingles.  

If Gute decides it’s time for MM to go after the season, that’s fine, but you don’t fire a head coach to appease your star player. 

Why would any good coach want to come to GB if he knows the star QB has influence on your job status?

Ubetcha posted:

If there is anything to the notion that AR and MM are at odds, I would be curious to know why AR would agree to a contract extension as he recently did. Not likely that any frustration on Rodger's part developed overnight. So does AR know something that hasn't been make public such as MM's departure being imminent after this season, whether voluntary or otherwise? AR will eventually get back on track and show he's worth every dime the Packers have committed.  Agree that any departure of MM at this stage will not be knee-jerk but rather will be orderly so as not to bruise the AR relationship with the team. TT's "departure" is a good example.

Rodgers has stated, “if it ain’t broke . . .”  He likes the offense that he doesn’t adhere to as some claim. 

So that would either make him a titanic asshole to lobby for McVince so he could ignore him or he’s simply comfortable and accounting for past successes  on offense. So Rodgers apparent frustration may be an indication he thinks there’s some broke in there now. 

Ubetcha posted:

If there is anything to the notion that AR and MM are at odds, I would be curious to know why AR would agree to a contract extension as he recently did.

I can think of millions of reasons to agree to that contract extension.

packerboi posted:

Glaring red flags:

The Packers are 23rd In the NFL with a -2 turn over ratio.

They are close to the bottom 3rd in give aways. 

The rank 2nd in the NFL in penalties and yardage per game. 

2 of the biggest staples in football are to take care of the football and don't make mass penalties. They are doing both. 

Good post.  Those are not good signs.  Time to start turning it around.

Today Mike said he thought the run/pass balance in the 1st half was good. The thing is. Saying you thought the run/pass balance was good is such a disposable throwback way of self scouting the plan you carried into the game and completely disregarding what the game/defense dictated you should have actually done. 

If the plan / goal was to have a good run/pass balance and you thought you did a good job of it then you're really telling me what was actually available to be exploited on offense in order to gain yardage was less important than making sure you hit the checkpoints of your game-plan. 

If the run is working. You run the ****ing ball until the defense loads up on the line. Then you throw them out of run defense. 

If someone were to ask McVay if he thought his run pass balance was good he'd laugh at the silliness of the question. Like McVay wants to ensure his run/pass balance is a meaningful analytic he's looking to achieve. If Gurley is running wild he's running Gurley until he's stopped. Then he's throwing and leaving Gurley in the game even though Gurley SUCKS as a pass blocking RB. Because, like Aaron Jones, Gurley is really good at catching the ball out of the backfield. A RB that can run and catch increases your percentage of gaining yardage vs a RB who can run and block. 

Well said.

Tdog posted:

Ubetcha posted:

If there is anything to the notion that AR and MM are at odds, I would be curious to know why AR would agree to a contract extension as he recently did.

I can think of millions of reasons to agree to that contract extension.

I guess it's almost always about the money in the end and I'm sure it would be unsettling for AR to know he's not the highest paid QB. Some thought he could have done even better with his contract and if he has a beef with MM,  waiting would seem to give him the leverage. I do believe where there's smoke there's fire and they've done their best to patch it up and make it look good for now. As far as a new coach being concerned about coming to a team with a QB who has influence over his job status: I would think they'd be lining up knowing they would getting a future HOF QB who can still play. 

Keep in mind, it’s not Gute’s call on whether to retain the Sons if the Monongahela, it’s Alfred E. Murphy’s.

GreenBayLA posted:

Word is MM et al don't trust 33 in pass coverage and don't want to get 12 injured. 

In TC McCarthy said they have 3 RBs who can play all 3 downs.

Brak posted:

Doom, despair....

If it weren't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all.  Gloom, despair and agony 

OT Those who were actually thinking that the Saints pick would be a top 5 pick, what were you thinking. As long as Brees is healthy they are at least an 8-win team.  It was silly to imagine the Saints cratering with a healthy Brees.

Brees has been healthy in years where they finished below .500.  In fact they finished 7-9 the three consecutive years before last year.  Some people thought they were lucky last year and then saw them trip out of the gate this season.  In a week to week sport with week to week fans, how do you even ask the question?

If Brees gets hurt, they will be Super Bowl bound with Taysom Hill.

They are 5 games into the season and a lot can still happen.  

Packy posted:

Sometimes when a head coach with past success has been around for a while things tend to get stale.  I think it has in Green Bay.   The play calling becomes predictable based upon what has worked well in the past without regard to current players' talents.   Doubt MM would let Philbin start calling the plays but it might spark something.   If things continue as they have been then a shake up is needed and I think Murphy wouldn't hesitate to make the change.

Best post on this thread.

Henry posted:

Grave Digger posted:

Henry posted:

This is some over the top ****.  It's hilarious.

I think it's funny that so many people think Rodgers wouldn't want to win vs. getting his own way, whatever that is.  

Did you ever think Rodgers really may enjoy collaborating with a young coach or OC?  I'm sure he'd hate a system like McVay''s or Nagi's.

Based on how he cowboys the scheme and does whatever he wants now, I doubt any collaboration would take place with a young coach. It's a fantasy to think Sean McVay or Shannahan or any young coach (or any coach really) could get Rodgers to play within a system. He gets more slack than Favre did because Rodgers doesn't make soul crushing mistakes like Favre, but Rodgers would do to a young coach what Favre did to Sherman. I don't think it's ego driven, I think he thinks he's giving the team the best chance to score/win when he holds the ball, it doesn't have to be one or the other. Most of the time it does gives us the best chance to win, sometimes it doesn't. This season him holding the ball hasn't helped. 

I don't know about the more slack thing.  The guy was out injured last year and comes back to a continuation of the same crap and is getting savaged.  

Did anyone read that article with McVince talking about the offense or are we all assuming that's just a bunch of horse****?

No one is above the team, ever.  Just like some believe Fine Fine OC has still got it, I believe Rodgers wants to win.  Basically, you'd have to think that Rodgers doesn't give two ****s about football anymore and just wants highlights to go along with the losses.  

The guy is dinged and both he and McVince are trying to adjust.  But is there something off about Rodgers other than the knee?  Yeah, appears to be but I'm not exactly sure it has to do with him wanting to have his way.  

Not being facetious here but if McVince truly was just focused on the offense instead of being HC, I think they'd be tearing it up.  Instead of playing in a base offense because of Rodgers injury, an offense that every single frickin' team in the NFL already knows, he could actually be working in some KILL principles into that base offense to account for the injury.  I think Rodgers goes all Rodgers when guys are covered up in a predictable base offense and he's just flat out missing reads but McVince is calling some of those plays too.  

Rodgers has definitely missed some reads and passes but there are a lot of drops too.  Meaning, the whole offense has a funk about it.  Timing, routes, the kind of stuff the vets shouldn't think twice about.  I'm still baffled how they haven't gotten Graham and Lewis truly involved in this offense yet.  This is not meant to absolve Rodgers, he's way off.   

Having a fresh perspective and getting excited about the offense again can do miracles.  As rough as the defense has been you can see a level of energy and ideas happening.  Pretty tough to overcome those holes and rookie mistakes but it's there.  The offense feels like The Wizard Country Club defense right now.

Nice work as well. You should be commended.

Tavis Smiley posted:

Henry posted:

 

You should be commended.

You spelled committed wrong.

michiganjoe posted:

Pretty clear with the benefit of hindsight just what a horrible mistake it was letting Jared Cook get away.

This pisses me off. Cook hasn't done **** in this league. Especially when he was in GB minus a few games and one big catch. (See Kitrick Taylor). If you don't believe me then look it up. I'd show you, but I don't know how to copy and paste like a normal 2018 person. A lot of sense on here and a lot of nonsense on here.

excalibur posted:

OT Those who were actually thinking that the Saints pick would be a top 5 pick, what were you thinking. As long as Brees is healthy they are at least an 8-win team.  It was silly to imagine the Saints cratering with a healthy Brees.

To be fair, they got lit up by Fitzpatrick week 1 and squeaked by the Browns week 2. That’s when most people thought there was a chance the Saints might actually be below average and weren’t wrong for thinking that. It’s why the playoffs aren’t decided by the first 4 games.

Henry posted:

McVince

 

I'm not getting this 'McVince' thing. Obviously it is a combo of McCarthy and Vince Lombardi but why is this being used as a rip is the question. I don't think anybody puts him in Lombardi's league.

I get McStupidface. M3 actually looks like a guy I went to high school with so I call him 'Jay.'

You would be wrong as usual.  

The Heckler posted:

Gloom, despair and agony 

I think those are 3 of the dwarves that could be like a wife in bed!

Brak posted:

Tavis Smiley posted:

Henry posted:

 

You should be commended.

You spelled committed wrong.

While what you say may be true, it is not germane to the argument of the greatness that is VinciBill McLardichek.

Tavis Smiley posted:

I'd show you, but I don't know how to copy and paste like a normal 2018 person. 

Here you go buddy.

I consider you a close friend in name only.