BECAUSE TJ WATT WENT TO WISCONSIN YOU IGNORAMUS! #****TJWatt #TTGotCute
It seems that Clay also got hurt in the Denver game based on post-game conference and locker room interviews. Wow. OLBs are getting hit hard. 4 of 6 are injured.
I think the biggest concern right now is getting healthy and OL depth. A bit surprised that TT didn't invest a higher pick this year on OL. Amichia is a year away. I know that is probably the way the board fell, but relying on UDFAs all along the interior is not a good bet. And none of the UDFAs have played well consistently. Denver game was a disaster for the 2nd+ string OL.
Brainwashed Boris posted:
I know TJ Watt is the 2nd coming of Ray Lewis, Dick Butkus & Jack Lambert but can we limit the crying to 1 or 2 threads please.
He was the last of the first-round, top pass rushers on the board. Meanwhile King, Wilson, Tabor, Awuzie, Moreau and even Sidney Jones were still on the board, as were lots of Corners in the 3rd if he still wanted Josh Jones. It was a good year for OLBs, and a great year for corners, even ones with size. They're likely going to cut at least two of their draft picks among the RB/WR group, so those picks could have been used to maneuver a bit in the earlier rounds. They really needed two pass rushers out of this draft, one who could earn some snaps early, as well as a corner who could play fairly early. They were in pretty much perfect position to do this.
Fennel thought the OL play in the second half was the worst he's ever seen.
Only Moreau was available to GB in r2 and the best CB available in r3 was Cam Sutton. I think TT knew, as most GMs probably did, since many CBs didn't go in r1 that there would be a big run on CBs in round 2. I think the most important thing for them was to come out with one of the really talented CBs early because of the glaring need.
But he had picks that are going to be cut anyway that he could have maneuvered up with in the second or third to get a CB (though I like Sutton and could've dealt with Moreau). Cordrea Tanksersley and Rasul Douglas were also still there in the third.
Moving up in the 3rd would require using like a 4th and 5th to move up, moving up r2 would have required even more. None of those CBs were worth moving up for in any round.
Nothing as rewarding as rehashing who we should've drafted.
Thompson doesn't over-pay when trading picks, so to say he could've / should've used picks to move up that will now be cut is beyond fantasy football type talk.
IL_Pack_Fan posted:How anyone could watch Ladarius Gunter "cover" Julio Jones in the NFCC then argue with taking the most physically gifted CB with their first pick is beyond me.
Because said CB wasn't a Badger.
It wouldn't cost much to move up a couple of spots in the second, for example, and that's just the easiest way. I like Biegel as a prospect well enough, but it wasn't like the delay due to the foot injury should have been a surprise. OLB pass rush was a concern, with squat for depth and placing all their eggs in the basket of an injury-prone pair.
Guys like Smoot, Willis and Hall were on the board in the end of the second/top of the third, also.
Assuming they can stay healthy I expect Rollins and Randall to rebound this year. Randall in particular looked decent against Denver.
House isn't a shutdown corner by any stretch but he is capable of starting.
Gunther is Gunther- he's a borderline roster guy.
King should help them but has a lot of development in front of him. Same thing with Jones.
To me, the real interesting development is the quality depth at safety. It's possible GB could play a lot more nitro or 3-3-5 type defensive formations to get their best defensive players on the field.
The DB concern to me wasn't as significant as pass rushing talent given the way Dom uses corners and safeties interchangeably. If they can't apply pressure this D is toast. That's why another good DL or LB would have made sense.
Biegel could be that guy but given his injury history it's also possible he may never really play much for GB.
Packdog posted:Nothing as rewarding as rehashing who we should've drafted.
Especially when NONE of them have played a real down of football yet
But again, they're counting on oft-injured guys to stay healthy. That's bluffing with a pair of 2s and a goofy grin with sweat running down your face.
Tschmack posted:
The DB concern to me wasn't as significant as pass rushing talent given the way Dom uses corners and safeties interchangeably. If they can't apply pressure this D is toast. That's why another good DL or LB would have made sense.
We were 4th in sacks & 11th in pressures last season, but 31st in pass defense, which means that even with pressure "this D was toast". I don't get how people think we needed rushers over CBs
When the DT Daniels is faster than the #1 CB (Gunter), that's a problem.
When your top 3 corners get hurt that's going to impact your performance. No one could have predicted that.
Banking on CMIII and Perry to stay healthy is a different matter. As in it won't happen. Fackrell and Elliott to the rescue? **** me
I'm not saying they didn't need DB help. But they signed House and drafted King and Jones. And took a gimpy Biegel later and no one else to shore up the rush?
FLPACKER posted:Tschmack posted:
The DB concern to me wasn't as significant as pass rushing talent given the way Dom uses corners and safeties interchangeably. If they can't apply pressure this D is toast. That's why another good DL or LB would have made sense.
We were 4th in sacks & 11th in pressures last season, but 31st in pass defense, which means that even with pressure "this D was toast". I don't get how people think we needed rushers over CBs
I agree that CB should have been the top priority. Consider the challenge to know which hole to prioritize when you lose Shields, Randall, and Rollins to injury, Datone Jones and Julius Peppers to FA, and your ILB are just guys. When its March / April and you have to take your best guess as whether Randall and Rollins are going to rebound or Fackrell is going to step up, can you re-sign Perry, or can Clay stay healthy ?? All in all I like the approach they took - the secondary and D-line look promising, but LB has a ways to go.
Perry & CM3 combined for 16 sacks & 6 missed games last year. The two guys we lost (peppers & Jones) combined for 8.5 sacks. So really what the Packers are banking on is that the combo of Elliot, Frackell, Biegel, and Gilbert? will provide 8.5 sacks, or the interior d-lineman will increase their sack totals to make up the difference. You can say that Perry & CM3 can not be counted on to stay healthy, but you could say that about nearly any OLber in the league.
Brainwashed Boris posted:Packdog posted:Nothing as rewarding as rehashing who we should've drafted.
Especially when NONE of them have played a real down of football yet
And with perfect 20-20 hindsight vision. If my crystal ball results were actual history, I'd have been retired when I was 30.
Brainwashed Boris posted:An injury is never the correct answer.
Mike Wahle, TJ Lang & Josh Sitton had issues too when they first started
Hell...EVEN DARYN COLLEDGE lasted a while in the league.
Spriggs has some issues right now but I believe the base is there. As fans we want instant gratification & All-Pro status. That ain't realistic bro. He stoned Von Miller on 1 play last night. Surprising. Then Von beat him on a spin move. It happens.
Spriggs has what it takes but needs time to develop. Let's not forget that important aspect of the Draft & Develop philosophy.
Boris, I think you are correct, everybody must have amnesia, just look at the threads when Sitton was cut- everybody feared Lane Taylor but he did ok! The reason he had time- the flaws in his game were fixed by two seasons on the practice squad- Spriggs has much more talent and his failing (hand placement & the grey area between his ears) much easier fixes than Taylor who may be a mastodon but lacks many athletic skills!
Herschel posted:But again, they're counting on oft-injured guys to stay healthy. That's bluffing with a pair of 2s and a goofy grin with sweat running down your face.
Crap! That's my "can't miss" move...
Pack88 posted:Boris, I think you are correct, everybody must have amnesia, ........
Hey, I resemble that remark. I don't have amnesia, I have old age. Although the end result is the same, the process is different. 
Spriggs hasn't looked as bad as has been discussed.
He's still pretty raw. His biggest problem in college was the same thing we're seeing now, it's the deep oversetting and the inability to shift to handle quick inside moves. I think that was a result of what his offense asked of him at IU and how defenses attacked that offense. IU ran a Zone blocking scheme and ran so much RPO and so many quick passes that I bet he rarely ever saw power or inside moves from a pass rusher like he's seeing now. Most Ends or OLBs are going to be responsible for edge containment against an offense like that, even against the pass. I think we have a guy who needs to learn to play OT in a pro style offense and still hasn't shrugged some bad habits. It's concerning that he's not picked that up yet considering how fast Bahk, Bulaga, Sitton, Lang, Taylor, Linsley, etc. picked up and improved their fundamentals, but some guys learn at different speeds I guess.
I've seen this pic circulating as a great example of what the Packers staff is probably showing Spriggs as a "do this/ not this".
Bak is fully anchored. You can't go around or inside and you can't bull rush that set. Spriggs has a nasty habit of playing with his feet too close together. A bull rush would absolutely destroy him here.
The overall consensus on Spriggs and Murphy seems to be the same. Spriggs is far too athletic to simply give up on him. Needs more snaps/reps and work on footwork. Murphy isn't athletic enough to have bad mechanics.
THanks GD. That's some of the best analysis that I have heard on Spriggs. Someone also posted that with the year in the weight room he was adjusting to a stronger but slightly different body. Often work with weights alone can change how a persons body moves. My father called it "muscle bound". That's an extreme view but it may take him a bit to get used to a slightly different body and that can explain some new flaws that have cropped up that weren't there before.
Yeah too soon to give up on Spriggs, but its frustrating that such an athletic specimen looks to have slow feet. Hopefully its either technique (using too narrow of a base like in above frame) or that he's overthinking due to the NFL volume, both can be corrected.
FLPACKER posted:Perry & CM3 combined for 16 sacks & 6 missed games last year. The two guys we lost (peppers & Jones) combined for 8.5 sacks. So really what the Packers are banking on is that the combo of Elliot, Frackell, Biegel, and Gilbert? will provide 8.5 sacks, or the interior d-lineman will increase their sack totals to make up the difference. You can say that Perry & CM3 can not be counted on to stay healthy, but you could say that about nearly any OLber in the league.
Dline. It pretty much has to be a serious uptick with Clark ramping up his game and maybe Adams adds something if he isn't hurt. Lowry, Clark and Daniels are going to need to make up the slack. I don't think that's unrealistic.
I would be happy with average OLB backups that can at least hold up against the run.
Shot 1 - Derek Barnett's first professional sack. Beats Jason Spriggs inside. He has been working on similar rushes all offseason pic.twitter.com/ckdmrOuxyJ
— Fran Duffy (@fduffy3) August 15, 2017
Watch Spriggs feet .... who the **** is coaching this ??
YATittle posted:For every Bakhtiari, there's a Spriggs.
For every Bak there are a 1000 Spriggs.
That's more accurate. They reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally lucked out on Bahk.
Yeah, crazy how Bahk lasted so long and so many teams (Bears, Vikes) struggle to find decent OTs.
ChilliJon posted:
Chilli, what's a Smash Burger?
Do you sit on it?
Smash Burger has an entirely separate bag of issues going on this morning. In N Out is suing smash after smash introduced their new "Triple Double" burger. A little to close to In N Outs Double Double for their liking.
All this reminds me of the 7 minute abs scene in Something About Mary.
Lets just get back to Spriggs and his footwork.
ChilliJon posted:Smash Burger has an entirely separate bag of issues going on this morning. In N Out is suing smash after smash introduced their new "Triple Double" burger. A little to close to In N Outs Double Double for their liking.
Don't have either in my hood, but I still have the "in n out urge"!