I think we all know the real motivation for my dislike of Opie Whizburger.
He's not Australian.
Brak posted:No late 5th round pick has been historically bad. Not possible, by definition.
Alexander=Carroll
Scott=Sander
Good stuff early.
Jackson = Joey Thomas
I wonder if the guy who made Carroll's boxing gloves has Jaire's hand measurements yet?
Brak posted:No late 5th round pick has been historically bad. Not possible, by definition.
Alexander=Carroll
Scott=Sander
Good stuff early.
Not the point but run with it.
PackLandVA posted:Henry - I get your angst with the pick. Has the potential to be a historically bad pick. But you seem to be under the assumption that whoever may have been available in the fifth round would somehow:
No, it's having the roster spot to at least try to improve the position. Mid to late round Oline are relatively safe in comparison to other positions. Note the word, relatively. It's having a guy there that could be a Sitton or a Tauscher. A punter isn't stopping the pass rush.
make the team
add depth
have an impact
somehow stop AR from getting injured
i get that Vogel was at least adequate last year, if not much better than adequate. But even if the Packers found another Sitton or Linley in the later rounds, there’s no guarantee the player even sees the field this season. If the Packers were really concerned about the O line, they would’ve drafted that position with one of the first couple of picks. Those are the rounds that usually add instant depth/starters. Clearly, Gute felt other areas of the roster were more important to upgrade. And I believe he didn’t think the players available that he wanted on the roster would justify a 5th round pick. Aren’t most on this board all about BPA?
The areas of need are pretty prevalent. It would've been nice to see a pass rusher but getting Jackson and Alexander is crazy good. So while they may feel better about the Oline vs. the backfield (think about that) they still do not have a true tackle as a backup or heir apparent, especially with Buluga's injury history and Spriggs history of suck.
This whole farce of "there's no guarantee", well no ****, but everyone going on about how this guy is a sure thing sounds pretty ****ing stupid after they just finished saying no player is a sure thing.
And even if Opie Whizburger improves the punting situation I'd still rather have a shot at a guy who could improve a unit that would keep the punter off the field in the first place. LS? Love the pick (even after laughing due to the Opie Whizburger pick), they needed a LS.
And again, Vogel was a rookie last year. A rookie. It's not like he was some worn out journeyman. The guy does a pretty damn good job as a rookie so let's potentially burn a pick on the premise Opie Whizburger gets beat out. Or you use a resource on a guy who could improve the punting, PUNTING, on this team.
As stated, it would need to be a pretty solid, long term improvement to justify not have used that pick to, at minimum, take a shot at finding a guy who can contribute on the Oline, which needs players. Even with McCray's performance and adding Madison who is quality depth on the Oline? Guffinpuff just did a shotgun draft on CB and WR again like TT had in the past. Is it really unreasonable to think taking a shot at a 5th round Oline guy is somehow a waste?
You guys are tripping all over hypocrisy here.
As I said in another post: I’m not too concerned about the Vikings as it’s onlt April. And I’m not too concerned about the Packers depth because, well, it’s April.
Jackson = Joey Thomas?
I'd bet against that.
I hated this pick - I don't think the difference a punter makes in a game warrants a draft pick when you get at least an average punter as an UDFA or a street free agent. Teams usually don't pay big money in free agency for punters because the value just isn't there. A 5th round pick almost always makes the team.
He's also never punted in a game in college in cold weather. At least you know Vogel can function there. Maybe Scott will be the next Lechler, but I'm skeptical. Hope I'm wrong.
A long snapper in the 7th round is a bit odd, but the 239th pick in the draft is probably 50/50 to make the team anyway.
Too much wad blowing going on around here.
R-E-L-A-X
Henry - Are you a proponent of BPA when it comes to the draft? Do you believe GMs should reach to fill a position of need? How would you grade Gute's first draft overall?
It's clear to me that the GM and scouting staff didn't think there were many, if any, offensive lineman to take using the 5th, 6th or 7th picks. Otherwise they would've. So assuming this is the case, you're suggesting Gute take a player that isn't graded anywhere near the round he's picking in. That goes against the whole BPA rationale which I think you and most on this board subscribe to (generally speaking). What OL was available in the later rounds that you would've spent a pick on?
I don't disagree with you about Vogel versus Scott, and the significant improvement (if any) the team will see. Maybe it's not about Punting. I don't know if Vogel was the holder or not, but maybe it has to do with Crosby's comfort level with the holder. He had a few PAT misses, a blocked FG and several misses last year. As another poster said, every point count in the NFL. Maybe the coaching staff thinks they needed an upgrade there.
Again, it's April. I count 28 OLs who are still available as free agents, not counting any UDFAs. And more will become available by June. There's plenty of time and possibilities to add depth.
I'm concerned about the OL depth as well, but I also remember the days after Wolf let Hentrich go and then regretted it. Punting does matter quite a bit, but then so does Rodgers health, as we saw quite clearly last season.
If Rodgers is healthy, I don't think we're going to do a lot of Punting.
Might be doing a lot of kickoffs though & holding for FG's / Xtra Points.
Packers scout Malaspina talked about Scott being able to do it all consistently: distance, hang time and directional kicking plus kick offs and holder responsibilities. Conventional wisdom says you don't take a punter in the 5th, but who knows. Time will tell on this pick (and all of them). Malaspina did mention it's not an indictment of any other Packer player, but it's about competition and getting better. FWIW.
PackLandVA posted:Henry - Are you a proponent of BPA when it comes to the draft? Do you believe GMs should reach to fill a position of need? How would you grade Gute's first draft overall?
“I don’t think you can fill all your – you know, it’s not about filling holes,” Gutekunst said.
It's clear to me that the GM and scouting staff didn't think there were many, if any, offensive lineman to take using the 5th, 6th or 7th picks. Otherwise they would've. So assuming this is the case, you're suggesting Gute take a player that isn't graded anywhere near the round he's picking in. That goes against the whole BPA rationale which I think you and most on this board subscribe to (generally speaking). What OL was available in the later rounds that you would've spent a pick on?
“I don’t think you can fill all your – you know, it’s not about filling holes,” Gutekunst said.
I don't disagree with you about Vogel versus Scott, and the significant improvement (if any) the team will see. Maybe it's not about Punting. I don't know if Vogel was the holder or not, but maybe it has to do with Crosby's comfort level with the holder. He had a few PAT misses, a blocked FG and several misses last year. As another poster said, every point count in the NFL. Maybe the coaching staff thinks they needed an upgrade there.
“I don’t think you can fill all your – you know, it’s not about filling holes,” Gutekunst said.
Again, it's April. I count 28 OLs who are still available as free agents, not counting any UDFAs. And more will become available by June. There's plenty of time and possibilities to add depth.
“I don’t think you can fill all your – you know, it’s not about filling holes,” Gutekunst said.
Sorry, too busy with work. Going for the gag.
How is it conventional wisdom when 6 out of the top 10 punters in 2017 were drafted?
PAKRZ - I'm referring to the Packers' situation regarding selecting a Punter in the 5th, specifically as it relates to Henry's angst outrage with the pick; not drafting a Punter in general.
I'd prefer outrage over angst thank you very much.
I don't think it's genuine outrage. More like angst, but going for some gags. 
But I FIFY anyway.
I'm with ya... I don't drafting specialists to begin with. With that said, sometimes you gotta do it and hope it turns into Mason Crosby that plays at a high level for a decade or so.
Speaking of draft picks and how it relates to Mason Crosby. Mason was drafted in 2007 and is the only player left on the roster from that draft class. That says something to me.
Henry posted:I'd prefer outrage over angst thank you very much.
Do you see that cat? He is wearing a tiny top hat and spoking a pipe. That's CRAZY!
I'M BRIAN FELLOW!
Pretty decent article from Acme Packing Company: Link
"Both punters possess big legs, with the ability to get off a booming kick. However, Scott does have a few qualities that may give him an edge over Vogel. The first is his ability to place punts inside the 20-yard line — he placed at least 25 punts inside the 20 in each of his four years at Alabama. Vogel, meanwhile, appeared to focus more on forcing fair catches and avoiding touchbacks, but he had just 19 punts land inside the 20 for the Packers in 2017.
Another area where Scott is experienced is as a holder on place-kicks. The Packers’ kicking operation was less smooth last season than it had been in the past with Tim Masthay serving as the holder. While Vogel cannot be held entirely responsible for that — the team’s revolving door of long snappers was also a key factor — the fact is that he did show some shakiness in that area.
Finally, Scott is also adept as a kickoff specialist, with 57 touchbacks on 133 career attempts. Mason Crosby has handled those duties in Green Bay over the years, but is regarded as average at best in that area."
Pakrz posted:Too much wad blowing going on around here.
R-E-L-A-X
I blame the goat porn
Crosby just doing XP's and an occasional FG may be a good thing.
El-Ka-Bong posted:Pakrz posted:Too much wad blowing going on around here.
R-E-L-A-X
I blame the goat porn
“I don’t think you can fill all your – you know, it’s not about filling holes,” Gutekunst said.
That's not what you do with goats. I'll explain later.
I see a new x4 tagline
Interesting draft this year. Brought us posts about goat porn, wad blowing, and filling holes. Maybe that's why the Packers have consistently been given the top grade for this draft.
So, OL picked after Opie.
Sam Jones, C, ARI St
Jamil Demby, G, Maine
Matt Pryor, OT, TCU
Greg Senat, OT, Wagner
Colby Gossett, G, Appalachin St
Bradley Bozeman, C, ALA
Jordan Mailata, OT, he comes from the land down-under
Will Clap, C, LSU
Rod Taylor, G, Miss
Korey Cunnigham, OT, CIN
After looking at this list, I have no issue with the Opie pick.
I'm on the Whizburger wagon!!! Next stop, Punter HOF!!
I don't trust a punter who doesn't jump when punting. He's clearly half assing it with that lazy approach.
That would make Wb the second P in the HoF.
Not historic, but still worthy of it's own thread.
BrainDed posted:I don't trust a punter who doesn't jump when punting. He's clearly half assing it with that lazy approach.
Zook will fix it, no?
BrainDed posted:I don't trust a punter who doesn't jump when punting. He's clearly half assing it with that lazy approach.
After watching the reel, I was going to mention the “no-jump” style as well. I don’t think I’ve ever seen it before.
It looks weird to me. Are there more who do that?
Hungry5 posted:So, OL picked after Opie.
Nothing
But
Friggin
Chopped
Liver
Yuk!!
WTF?!?!?
After looking at this list, I have no issue with the Opie pick.
Exactly - don't jump the board.
We all knew this OL class sucked after the top 5 guys or so. Vogel has competition now & the Long Snapper probably makes the team by default.
I said earlier all 12 picks ain't making this team.
You can't manufacture a player that doesn't exist.
Don't jump the board. EVER!
BrainDed posted:I don't trust a punter who doesn't jump when punting. He's clearly half assing it with that lazy approach.
I was thinking he might be more prone to a serious injury if he ever gets his plant leg rolled on. Hopefully that won't be an issue for the future HOFer
Nice edit of my post there Boris.
I heard they brought this kid in to see if he could throw a pass over AJ Hawk.
He could.
AJ was in Cleveland at the time
"That's allowed? Punters can throw passes??? Settle down Shaun.... get it together. That's the worst thing that's going to happen to you today" - Shawn Slocum's mind.
Thunderbird posted:BrainDed posted:I don't trust a punter who doesn't jump when punting. He's clearly half assing it with that lazy approach.
I was thinking he might be more prone to a serious injury if he ever gets his plant leg rolled on. Hopefully that won't be an issue for the future HOFer
Didn't Reggie Roby punt without jumping for 16 years?