Cavetoad posted:By what remains, they have plenty of juice to move up into the 3rd and maybe even the 2nd if they choose.
They don't have a lot of juice to move left, IMO. They could really use a receiver, another corner, a TE, an ILB who can run, at lest one pass rusher and an O-lineman who can play early. They were going to have trouble getting enough good bodies as it was, especially with not a lot of cap space left.
Brainwashed Boris posted:Even if he busts, that's a win for the Packers
I don’t think they have the luxury of too many missed high picks. Spriggs made sure of that. If things don’t go as planned at least Alexander can play slot and return guy. I hope this doesn’t turn into another smorgasbord board of DB drafts.
Herschel posted:Cavetoad posted:By what remains, they have plenty of juice to move up into the 3rd and maybe even the 2nd if they choose.
They don't have a lot of juice to move left, IMO. They could really use a receiver, another corner, a TE, an ILB who can run, at lest one pass rusher and an O-lineman who can play early. They were going to have trouble getting enough good bodies as it was, especially with not a lot of cap space left.
Gotta wonder if there may be some trades floated as well. The Bulaga article casts a few things in a new light.
pkr_north posted:lambeausouth posted:Overreaction Thursday. New GM trades his first ever draft pick, and the F bombs fly. Bed wetting ensues.
Get a clue people. We had no idea who the Packers were targeting. We have a good number of needs. More pass rushers. A completely revamped secondary. A new right tackle to protect the franchise would be nice. Another receiver to compliment ‘te to make the franchise happy.
You can’t judge a GM’s football intelligence based on a single pick. And jumping off the ledge because the Packers moved down four slots ultimately (picking up a first next year) is the definition of insanity.
at the time, we had no idea he would move back up - and it is his first draft, so no, we have no basis to go off - so its not unbelievable that we would crap our pants, when we had 2 really good prospects sitting there. i would have stayed and picked edmunds btw. i had flashbacks of owning the 7th round ala teddy.
And, I get that. It was hard passing on Davenport when he was there. I literally said, "I'm going to trust Gutekunst, and wait to see the whole picture before I even think about forming an opinion on day one for the Packers.
Thread crapping for fifteen minutes straight, and telling the new Packer GM to "F off" not once, but twice in mere minutes, is analogous to telling da Vinci "F you, you suck as a painter" two brush strokes into painting the Mona Lisa. It's childish as hell. Expressing concern, or disappointment is one thing. But going absolutely ape sh#t is completely over the top.
Tre’Davious White is a better comparison than Carroll, except Alexander is faster than White. Carroll was a raw athlete who was dumb as a box of rocks, character or intelligence haven’t come up once with Alexander. Honestly measurables all come out similar to Sam Shields (who wasn’t as tall as you think, measured just under 5’11”) as much as they do anyone with the height/weight/speed combo. Plus they both have the WR background.
Can’t ignore the lack of wizardry. Alexander is the best press man cover guy after Ward.
Hard to imagine what the defense could be because Capers mind ****ed everyone so badly.
Landry. That’s a lot of player to still be on the board.....
Rashaad Penny is going to be a good football player.
Henry posted:Herschel posted:Cavetoad posted:By what remains, they have plenty of juice to move up into the 3rd and maybe even the 2nd if they choose.
They don't have a lot of juice to move left, IMO. They could really use a receiver, another corner, a TE, an ILB who can run, at lest one pass rusher and an O-lineman who can play early. They were going to have trouble getting enough good bodies as it was, especially with not a lot of cap space left.
Gotta wonder if there may be some trades floated as well. The Bulaga article casts a few things in a new light.
Bulaga, Matthews and Perry could all easily be gone next year (if not sooner for Bulaga). That's three important positions.
ChilliJon posted:Rashaad Penny is going to be a good football player.
Agreed.
That’s a lot of cap though.
Now THAT'S amazing!
Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
Timmy! posted:Now THAT'S amazing!
Great moment, so glad he was able to do it.
Henry posted:That’s a lot of cap though.
It is, but top-shelf guys are ridiculously expensive on the open market. I'm as much of a Biegel homer as many, but I'm not exactly confident he or Gilbert are exactly front-line starters-in-waiting.
Harold Landry, Connor Williams, Josh Jackson, Will Hernandez, and James Daniels still on the board. If any of them are still on the board at 45, I'd be happy.
Grave Digger posted:Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
What's he going to say? "He's a cocky little prick who rubs people the wrong way but man, can he run!"
Comments about Carroll at the time were that he was a hard worker and good kid.
Has there ever been two brothers drafted in r1 the same year? I think there’s a 3rd Edmunds still at VTech. Considering their father also player, the Edmunds NFL tree is establishing itself!
There’s a lot of great players that were/are cocky little pricks. That doesn’t preclude him from succeeding.
He could just leave off any mention of his personality and just say they like his skills. I don’t get the hate for Alexander, he’s a talented player and was arguably the BPA.
We've got a new defensive skipper. Based on reputation, I can safely say that Mike Pettine has exhaustively reviewed tape of every single player on the roster that lines up on D. He knows what he needs to put his system in place.
What did Blake Martinez say a few weeks ago about when he met with Pettine early in the offseason? He preached "No missed assignments. No mental errors."
Accountability.
We'd all like the sexy top 15 defensive edge rusher. You can never have too many impact pass rushers. But keep in mind, Pettine got Mo Wilkerson, a guy who is going to be hungry to prove that he's still a Pro Bowl caliber defensive linemen. The guy already has the pedigree, with two 10 + sack seasons. The fire is lit under his ass. Bank on it. Matthews and Perry are both still there, and while it would be insane to expect both to play sixteen games, they're pieces to the puzzle. Vince Biegel, who missed all of last season, will be healthy. He can bring it. He's a piece to the puzzle. Kenny Clark looks like a future Pro Bowler. Montravius Adams will continue to develop. Daniels is an elite nose tackle, and he can collapse the pocket around any QB.
Would you rather have one elite pass rusher that can be double teamed, or a handful of guys coming from every direction creating chaos? Obviously, having both would be preferential, but our secondary was a sieve, and we needed another corner back. We got him. Yes, he's slightly undersized, but he's a ball hawk. A big time play maker. When was the last time we had a true play maker in the secondary? We have some good veteran corner backs. Bringing back Tramon Williams is a boon to the pass coverage. He was strong last year, and Jaire Alexander and Kevin King will have a great technical pass cover guy to learn from. I seem to remember Williams making big plays at the biggest moments. He's ideal to add depth, and to help our young studs develop.
This draft has a lot of depth. A hell of a lot. We have a lot of picks left, and some of those could be packaged to move up again. The one thing we do know, already, is that Gutenkunst is not afraid to wheel and deal to move where he wants. I'm not going to be a homer. Invariably, the decisions made have to pay off, or all this talk is folly. But I like the aggressiveness I've seen from our new GM. A new bargain D lineman that can maul the passer, and a new toy for the franchise. A former Packer that will add a lot of depth (and smarts) to our pass coverage unit. Williams is smart enough where he can be the defensive play caller to replace Morgan Burnett.
Trust the process, and wait until the draft is done before you even begin to form a premature opinion. Ultimately, it will take a few years before we know how well we did.
Will Hernandez is coming off the board next.
Herschel posted:Grave Digger posted:Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
What's he going to say? "He's a cocky little prick who rubs people the wrong way but man, can he run!"
Yep, that's why his teammates voted him a Team Captain---because he rubs people the wrong way.....
From what his D did in NY, he puts a lot pressure in CBs to match up 1 on 1 with receivers often. We needed more guys who we can rely on to win on an island. Pettine can manufacture a pass rush, you can’t manufacture coverage to make up for CBs that can’t win in man coverage.
Herschel posted:Grave Digger posted:Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
What's he going to say? "He's a cocky little prick who rubs people the wrong way but man, can he run!"
...
Similar, but I doubt you can run.
Wow. The guy with character concerns goes to Minny. Who knew.
slowmo posted:Herschel posted:Grave Digger posted:Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
What's he going to say? "He's a cocky little prick who rubs people the wrong way but man, can he run!"
Yep, that's why his teammates voted him a Team Captain---because he rubs people the wrong way.....
What are they going to do, NOT vote him team captain? “You’re a good teammate and a talented player, but we just can’t have a thin guy under 5’11” leading us...”
That's a very non-New England pick.
Grave Digger posted:slowmo posted:Herschel posted:Grave Digger posted:Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
What's he going to say? "He's a cocky little prick who rubs people the wrong way but man, can he run!"
Yep, that's why his teammates voted him a Team Captain---because he rubs people the wrong way.....
What are they going to do, NOT vote him team captain? “You’re a good teammate and a talented player, but we just can’t have a thin guy under 5’11” leading us...”
Again, you're hind-sighting Carroll. He had the rep of a hard worker, etc.
Corners had better be cocky, don't get me wrong, but Alexander and Carroll have a lot of similarities on paper and in play.
lambeausouth posted:We've got a new defensive skipper. Based on reputation, I can safely say that Mike Pettine has exhaustively reviewed tape of every single player on the roster that lines up on D. He knows what he needs to put his system in place.
...more common sense....
Trust the process, and wait until the draft is done before you even begin to form a premature opinion. Ultimately, it will take a few years before we know how well we did.
Yup, and I think there seems to be a solid plan. Jettonsing who they have already shows that they get what they have and know what they need. Beyond Spriggs, there is a great history for finding OL that not only works but excels.
Who know, maybe that may turn around.
Regardless, good fun. I am sad I will miss tomorrow night and Saturday.
Grave Digger posted:slowmo posted:Herschel posted:Grave Digger posted:Jon-Eric Sullivan says Packers like what Alexander brings to the table as a player AND as a person. That last part alone is a huge departure from Carroll.
What's he going to say? "He's a cocky little prick who rubs people the wrong way but man, can he run!"
Yep, that's why his teammates voted him a Team Captain---because he rubs people the wrong way.....
What are they going to do, NOT vote him team captain? “You’re a good teammate and a talented player, but we just can’t have a thin guy under 5’11” leading us...”
Yep, you got me. They voted the "cocky little prick who rubs everybody the wrong way but can run" as team captain not because he was popular among his teammates and didn't rub them the wrong way---they only did so because there wasn't anybody else to select from among the other 30+ starters or those who get significant playing time.
ChilliJon posted:Wow. The guy with character concerns goes to Minny. Who knew.
ChilliJon posted:Wow. The guy with character concerns goes to Minny. Who knew.
They're shocked the Cowboys missed him.
Dallas will never live it down. Jerry Jones will sign any thug not currently in jail so long as they can run a 4.5 40. Yet, he passed on Randy Moss.
Can you provide a link to where anyone referred to Carroll as a hard worker pre-draft or was a team captain or was mature or any positive character trait? I don’t remember much from that year, but I remember everyone drooling over his physical ability, don’t remember hearing much else.
This where the Viking fan posted when he is not allowed to
Rapist of the draft. He’ll be joining Bill Cosby very soon.
Goalline posted:Same post
Rapist of the draft. He’ll be joining Bill Cosby very soon.
Birds of a feather....
Goalline posted:And again
Rapist of the draft. He’ll be joining Bill Cosby very soon.
Maybe he'll get a pardon.
Grave Digger posted:Can you provide a link to where anyone referred to Carroll as a hard worker pre-draft or was a team captain or was mature or any positive character trait? I don’t remember much from that year, but I remember everyone drooling over his physical ability, don’t remember hearing much else.
Here you go, from the then Head Coach/GM Mike Sherman:
"But Sherman is confident Carroll will succeed because of what he's learned about his work ethic and family values -- abstractions that Sherman holds dear even though they cannot be measured like Carroll's 4.37-second 40-yard dash time.
"There are a lot of guys that have talent but not character. If you said to me, 'Identify character,' I would say it means that you're honest, you do what you're supposed to do when you're supposed to do it, you give an honest day's work for an honest day's pay," Sherman said. "That doesn't mean they always go to church on Sunday, it means they work. And they get it. People with character usually get it, and people who don't have character usually don't.
"So is it important to me? Yeah, it's important to me. Is it more important than talent? No. You draft talent, talent finds character and it's a pretty damn good combination." http://chippewa.com/sports/car...dc-b13ced2b35ab.html
Grave Digger posted:Can you provide a link to where anyone referred to Carroll as a hard worker pre-draft or was a team captain or was mature or any positive character trait? I don’t remember much from that year, but I remember everyone drooling over his physical ability, don’t remember hearing much else.
Quick Google also pulled this.
http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/p...nd/story?id=23371226
....he is young and he didn't have a whole lot of spring ball at Arkansas because he was running track, but this is a guy that is a worker," Sherman said. Carroll, who is represented by agent Eugene Parker, said he's confident he can earn a starting job as a rookie. "I've got the ability. I've got the speed. I've just got to listen to my coaches," he said. "I've got some good coaches, I'm going to go with a good tradition, a good program. If I just listen, I'll be a great player."
I stopped reading after GM Mike Sherman
Thunderbird posted:I stopped reading after GM Mike Sherman
That article was certainly a trip back to nausea land. After praising Carroll, the next part of the article was Sherman crowing about his selection of BJ Sanders. A choice quote: ""I know (the decision to draft) the punter will be criticized, but he's a hell of a punter, and I couldn't care less," Sherman said..." (and he traded away a 4th and 5th round pick to move up and get Sanders.)
