@BrainDed posted:If Gute / MLF hire Leonhard, I might stop crying about TT passing on TJ.
I don’t believe you. I won’t stop, and poor TT isn’t even with us anymore. Talk about
@grignon posted:I will be surprised if the Packers' defense is better next year with a new co-ordinator.
There were 4 back breaking plays in the NFCCG. 3 came from the offense- 1 each by their 'studs'. The defense' lapse came from a known weak link.
They didn't necessarily qualify as "back-breaking" but the number of 3rd down conversions the defense allowed- especially in the first half and then on the last TB drive - definitely contributed to the outcome.
I've heard some rumors that whomever this new DC is, it's going to immediately impact 2nd round pick Josh Jackson, and 3rd rounders Burks and Adams. Either it will send them out the door or it may save their careers.
And that perhaps Gray or Evero or even Leonhard could salvage them. For those who don't remember, Jackson fell so far down the depth chart, he didn't even make ST's as an active player by the end of the season.
Most are assuming he just plain sucked. And maybe that's accurate. Then again, maybe Pettine couldn't find a way to use him or Burks and one of these DC's can.
I hardly think it's the deciding factor one way or the other. But Kevin King is almost certainly gone and axing Jackson would be yet another 1st/2nd round CB the Packers couldn't develop.
@BrainDed posted:...Fun fact, JK Scott was drafted in front of MVS.
...I disagree, that fact is not very fun.
Regarding Richard...often times there is baggage with guys we don't know about that affects their hirability.
Not saying that's the case here, but if a former, very successful DC sits out an entire year, and the best he can do going forward is a secondary position, that tells me there is more to the story than meets the eye.
@packerboi posted:I've heard some rumors that whomever this new DC is, it's going to immediately impact 2nd round pick Josh Jackson, and 3rd rounders Burks and Adams. Either it will send them out the door or it may save their careers.
Burks may have saved his own career if he's willing to play for the league minimum. His ST performances were fairly solid (not saying much I know) the last month or two.
@Chongo posted:@PackerBoi
Lose him now, or lose him later. Leonhard is a rising star, only a matter of time before he moves up. Would you rather him be a Packer or go to another Big 10 school as HC?
Worst of all is losing him at Wisconsin and seeing be a D coordinator for another NFC team. Make him our choice Gute.
@packerboi posted:I've heard some rumors that whomever this new DC is, it's going to immediately impact 2nd round pick Josh Jackson, and 3rd rounders Burks and Adams. Either it will send them out the door or it may save their careers.
Are they hiring Jesus Christ? Maybe Buddha?
Nagler reports that Jim Leonhard is interviewing for the DC position with the Packers.
Jimmy L would be an interesting choice.
Some suggest he’s a Pettine clone, but if you’ve watched the Badgers under his watch his teams blitz a lot more and the corners do not play off as much as the Packers did.
I forgot who else mentioned it, but it’s not like JL has been blessed with elite players and athletes. Yet the Badgers have had an elite level D for the last several years.
With @RobDemovsky reporting that #Badgers DC Jim Leonhard is interviewing for the Packers DC job. It's relevant to remember last offseason @AlbertBreer reported Sean McVay had "great interest" in Leonhard. Packers HC Matt LaFleur is friends with McVay. https://t.co/sNjFelpZIj
— Josh Schafer (@_JoshSchafer) February 2, 2021
I forgot who else mentioned it, but it’s not like JL has been blessed with elite players and athletes. Yet the Badgers have had an elite level D for the last several years.
In the past 4 drafts the Badger D has produced 4 players who are current contributors to their NFL team. You will see a theme with these guys.
2016 Round 4 - Joe Schobert (Pro Bowler)
2016 Round 4 - Vince Biegel (Role Player)
2017 Round 1 - TJ WhaaaT (All Pro)
2019 Round 5 - Andy Van Ginkel (Role Player)
If the Packers do hire Leonhard, they have to give him LB's to work with.
https://www.pro-football-refer...isconsin/drafted.htm
I also like the fact that these guys were not 'blue' chippers like from OSU or down south...he works with tier 2 recruits and makes them work. that's important.
Per Bukowowski this will be a strong candidate...
Leonhard keeps turning down other major college DC jobs (Bama, TAMU, FSU, probably others), so it's only a matter of time before someone in the NFL scoops him up. He seems able to get a high effort from his squad and certainly his NFL DB experience would only benefit our young, talented DB group.
Nielsen looks like a great candidate also. NO DL is pretty solid.
@Chongo posted:With @RobDemovsky reporting that #Badgers DC Jim Leonhard is interviewing for the Packers DC job. It's relevant to remember last offseason @AlbertBreer reported Sean McVay had "great interest" in Leonhard. Packers HC Matt LaFleur is friends with McVay. https://t.co/sNjFelpZIj
— Josh Schafer (@_JoshSchafer) February 2, 2021
Id' be willing to guess McVay and Kyle Shannan's opinion would weigh heavily on MLF's eventual choice. And I'd guess those 2 have also lent their opinion about Pettine long before he was not renewed.
@Grave Digger posted:Leonhard keeps turning down other major college DC jobs (Bama, TAMU, FSU, probably others), so it's only a matter of time before someone in the NFL scoops him up. He seems able to get a high effort from his squad and certainly his NFL DB experience would only benefit our young, talented DB group.
Nielsen looks like a great candidate also. NO DL is pretty solid.
Was he offered jobs by those teams?
Just as interesting is the name that hasn't popped up as a candidate- Wade Phillips. Suspect McVay moving on from him probably played a pretty big role in his omission.
@Chongo posted:@PackerBoi
Lose him now, or lose him later. Leonhard is a rising star, only a matter of time before he moves up. Would you rather him be a Packer or go to another Big 10 school as HC?
What C-Boy wants is JL to stay at WI until Barry retires, Chryst takes Barry's AD job and Jimmy moves to HC.
@Pikes Peak posted:Was he offered jobs by those teams?
Supposedly he turned all of them down yeah.
The best coaches are the ones who scheme based on the personnel they have, and their strengths. Sure you have base concepts, and a blueprint of how you want things to go, but you are not going to force a square peg into a round hole.
I think MLF is that kind of guy...he has been flexible with his offense and gotten a lot out of it the last two years. Way more than McVince would have..."we do what we do."
I hope whoever they hire as DC is cut from that same cloth, because IMO, Pettine was too much like McVince in that respect...like consistently putting P-Smiff into coverage.
Leonhard seems like the kind of guy you'd want...he's going to put they players he has in the best position possible to be successful.
@Grave Digger posted:Supposedly he turned all of them down yeah.
Read an article when Saban was interested in him as DC in Alabama where he said that Madison was home for his family. His sons are still pretty young, but I don't think he'd interview if not willing to move the 2 + change hours to GB.
@Chongo posted:The best coaches are the ones who scheme based on the personnel they have, and their strengths. Sure you have base concepts, and a blueprint of how you want things to go, but you are not going to force a square peg into a round hole.
IMO, Dom's best work in GB was the 2010 run -- and that team was hit hard by injury. Capers had a lot of moving parts, he had no choice but to scheme to their strengths -vs- same as it ever was.
Barnett, Burnett, Chillar, Harrell, B.Jones, Neal, Poppinga, D.Martin. All landed on IR and were not available for the playoff run. Sure, some guys in that group, but the point is he didn't have a lot of opportunity to teach scheme with so many moving pieces - much of it at LB.
... LB
Bigby and Jenkins also missed games.
2010 defense was good because they were a turnover machine. Same thing that propelled the Saints to a Superbowl...that defense gave up yards but not points...because they had a nose for the ball.
@Chongo posted:Per Bukowowski this will be a strong candidate...
He looks happy to be alive in that picture.
@Chongo posted:2010 defense was good because they were a turnover machine. Same thing that propelled the Saints to a Superbowl...that defense gave up yards but not points...because they had a nose for the ball.
They had what might have been the best secondary in Packer history (or at least the best one post-Lombardi).
Charles Woodson is a HOFer. Nick Collins made multiple Pro Bowls. Sam Shields and Tramon were also Pro-Bowl level players. Peprah wasn't a star, but he didn't screw up.
When your secondary is that good and you your edge rusher (CM3) and your DL (Prime Raji, Cullen Jenkins, and Ryan Pickett) is that strong, the other 2 LB positions aren't as critical and pretty much every scheme has a chance to work.
That 2010 defense was oustanding. They were 2nd in the league in points allowed and Top 5 by almost every metric.
https://www.pro-football-refer...m/years/2010/opp.htm
The downfall for that defense (which was also good for most of 2009 except for the Cardinal playoff game) was Nick Collins getting hurt and Charles Woodson losing a step the following year.
Any mention of the greatness of that secondary is null and void without mentioning...
@Chongo posted:Any mention of the greatness of that secondary is null and void without mentioning...
They need someone with his attitude on special teams.
Much of the discussion around a new defensive coordinator has included Jerry Gray as the most prominent internal candidate. I've always thought highly of him based on his past work, but this section from Ryan Wood's article in the GBPG gives me pause. Were the defensive lapses on Pettine, or on the coach of the secondary, where the majority of mistakes occurred?
It’s easy to envision Brady being stuck in LaFleur’s mind when the coach spoke of his defensive backs needing to be more situationally aware.
Brady picked apart the Packers' secondary. He dropped back to pass on third or fourth down 14 times, including a Kenny Clark sack on third-and-10 in the first half. Of his 12 passes, eight were completed for 163 yards and a touchdown. Another pass, the final time Brady threw on third down, was defensive interference on King.
The Packers would be playing in this week’s Super Bowl if not for their third-down coverage. It was shocking how poorly they covered when presented a chance to get off the field. There was the 14-yard screen to Godwin on third-and-13. A 52-yard bomb to Godwin deep down the middle of the field on third-and-9, when safety Darnell Savage was in position to make a play but didn’t. A busted coverage when nobody covered Godwin out of the backfield, resulting in 19 yards on third-and-2.
Taking way too long IMHO...I understand due diligence, but this is a little ridiculous. As a HC, you should always have a running list of guys you'd like to when staff leaves.
This could be the only DC he gets to hire. I could understand being diligent in the process.
@RochNyFan posted:Were the defensive lapses on Pettine, or on the coach of the secondary, where the majority of mistakes occurred?
Impression I got from MLF's comments was that he's looking for a less passive approach from the defense. Think that would fall squarely on the DC.
Appears due diligence includes 2 rounds of interviews. If that's what it takes to find a guy MLF is comfortable with, so be it. Have to also agree MLF is looking for a "punch you in the mouth" style of defense. The Packers have had a rep of being a soft/finesse style D forever. You'd have to go back to Woodson/Raji/Collins days to find a D teams feared.
Sounds like second interviews have or will start to take place. https://t.co/qqIsipxx05
— Rob Demovsky (@RobDemovsky) February 4, 2021
@RochNyFan posted:Much of the discussion around a new defensive coordinator has included Jerry Gray as the most prominent internal candidate. I've always thought highly of him based on his past work, but this section from Ryan Wood's article in the GBPG gives me pause.
The Packers would be playing in this week’s Super Bowl if not for their third-down coverage. It was shocking how poorly they covered when presented a chance to get off the field.
It is shocking that Tampa Bay's passing game weapons were effective even while playing in elements they were completely unused to playing in this season and for some, like Godwin and Evans, had never played in (and frankly there were a couple of fortuitous drops by the WRs that helped keep it a ball game).
It is even more shocking that Tampa Bay was able to come through even with Antonio Brown (who had been Brady's go to receiver down the stretch) not playing and thus having to rely upon 4th WR Scotty Miller (he of the infamous before the half TD over King) and 5th WR Tyler Johnson (who had a critical diving catch for a key 3rd down in the first half to keep the drive going and the game clinching move on King that resulted in King grabbing him to prevent the catch).
Perhaps the most shocking aspect of Tampa Bay's passing performance in the NFCCG, however, is that it included not just a rookie (Tyler Johnson) who contributed to the win but a rookie who was taken in the 5th round of the draft.
Seems odd that some Packer fans are so adamant that a rookie WR could not conceivably have helped the Packers in 2020 (including a WR that would have been available to the Packers in the 4th round if they had not dealt that pick to select Jordan Love) when WR5 Johnson was clearly the superior player (in his 19 snaps) in the NFCCG when compared to Packer WR4 -- 3rd year WR Equanimious St. Brown (he of the dropped 2-point conversion as the most notable contribution in his 17 snaps).
@packerboi posted:Appears due diligence includes 2 rounds of interviews. If that's what it takes to find a guy MLF is comfortable with, so be it. Have to also agree MLF is looking for a "punch you in the mouth" style of defense. The Packers have had a rep of being a soft/finesse style D forever. You'd have to go back to Woodson/Raji/Collins days to find a D teams feared.
Sounds like second interviews have or will start to take place. https://t.co/qqIsipxx05
— Rob Demovsky (@RobDemovsky) February 4, 2021
That and Mayo needs to find a guy he can work with too. I'm sure a big chunk is chemistry and background as well.
@Chongo posted:Taking way too long IMHO...I understand due diligence, but this is a little ridiculous. As a HC, you should always have a running list of guys you'd like to when staff leaves.
Or is he waiting to interview someone from a SB team coaching staff? Mike Caldwell perhaps. Kacy Rodgers (DL coach) is Todd Bowles #2 guy and has DC experience, so if wants that system or style then perhaps he's waiting until Monday.
@packerboi posted:The Packers have had a rep of being a soft/finesse style D forever. You'd have to go back to Woodson/Raji/Collins days to find a D teams feared.
Being "feared" coincides with being talented. The 2010 defense had 6 First round draft choices, with 3 of them being top 10 picks. This year's defense was no where near the talent level of that defense.