Put 'im on the rack! That'll stretch 'im!
Do you think they would draft him even with having 3 safety's they seem to be happy with (Ha Ha, Burnett, & Brice) ?
Baker is where a Honey Badger comparison actually applies.
And with Gunter possibly being a fourth safety?
This kid just signed his letter of intent with Illinois State. Then twitter melted to the ground....
Kobe Buffalomeat at left tackle. He wins best football name ever. We can close the voting booths now.
chickenboy posted:To clarify, I wasn't referring to the position he plays, only to the comments that make it appear that he could fall. HB fell to the third round and has performed as first round talent.
Jabril Peppers has been rumored to have run a 4.34 (Harbaugh has predicted a time in the mid to high 4.3s at his Pro Day).
If Peppers runs that time he won't make it out of the top 10. If he's that fast and given that he seems to have a natural ability to make plays, I'd trade up for him. Even without the measurables the guy just makes plays - like Charles Woodson, Chris Borland types in college. With the measurables, there is no way he makes it to the Packers position in the draft.
YATittle posted:And with Gunter possibly being a fourth safety?
According to local sources they're ALL safeties.
Grave Digger posted:The biggest knock on Baker is his size being 5'10" and about 195 lbs., which is small for a Safety, but to me that is something that can be remedied. Nick Collins played his whole career at 5'11"/205 lbs., I don't see a reason why Baker couldn't add some muscle to get to that size.
He's a guy worth keeping an eye on IMO.
Earl Thomas size.
FLPACKER posted:Do you think they would draft him even with having 3 safety's they seem to be happy with (Ha Ha, Burnett, & Brice) ?
I think it's possible, depth isn't great and we will see some changes in the coming seasons. Hyde is a UFA this year, so our we may or may not have him as an option going forward. Burnett will be a UFA after this season and will be 29, so there may be some need to look for a long term option. They will likely exercise the 5th year option for Dix, which will keep him until the 2019 offseason, so we will have him for a couple more years. I'm not sold on Brice as a legit option, he wasn't that good IMO. He was good at making big hits, but I didn't see anything that would make me want to bank on him being the future. He's also more of a SS than a FS. Baker makes sense in the long term as an option to pair with Dix for the future.
And if we do that maybe move Burnett to LB. Hybrid version.
Grave Digger posted:Adoree Jackson might have the most upside of any player in the draft. He has the athletic upside to be a lock down #1 CB, if he's there at 29 then I would be surprised if TT passes.
I like Jackson too, mainly because he played WR as well as CB (and was good at both). He's also a great kick/punt returner, and even lined up in the backfield several times and blocked a few kicks on ST. He's also incredibly fast. Kid is just a football player.
I'd take him over Peppers in a heartbeat. Peppers has the swagger and might have a faster 40 time but he doesn't look like it on the field compared to Jackson. Jackson has that Usain Bolt thing where he looks like he's running slow but he out runs everyone by miles. Peppers, while quick, always seemed to get caught up in traffic.
I just think Jackson has had better overall results, even if he's not as flashy doing it.
I think Jackson is a raw talent that could be molded in to an elite player once he spends 100% of his time at 1 position. College players get a limited amount of practice time as it is, but to spend time at CB with a little bit of time at WR, KR, PR, etc. has probably hindered his development at CB some. Same goes for Peppers. He's such swiss army knife of a player that it doesn't seem like UMich really let him grow at a position. Peppers is overrated by the media and fans, but he's still a really good player and, like Jackson, has the physical tools to develop into a good pro. I don't think teams will be blinded by the hype of Peppers, I think he will go where he probably should go.
Looking forward to seeing all of these guys at the combine.
The most encouraging thing I noticed about Jackson is his make up speed and his ability to control his body at top speed. You will see a receiver beat him on the route but by time the ball gets there Jackson has put himself back into position and looking for the ball. Probably an indicator of him needing to develop his shadowing skills some more but with that kind of athleticism he shouldn't have a problem. Also a big plus to have a CB that can actually catch.
I think we are going to have to go with cornerback first. I think Spriggs was TT's acknowledgement that we will need a serious replacement guy in the next year or so. Since Lang's injury was ankle and not a blown knee, I think he has some time left. I would almost rather see the Packers find some veteran CB (I know it won't happen, but I can dream) because I think this collection of really young guys needs a veteran leader.
I really think OLB is something we will have to address. Perry looked improved, Matthews is around, Peppers is gone. Just not sold on Fackrell or these other guys as serious rotational players. ILB is something I have been begging for for years. Ryan and Martinez are solid and legit NFL players, but neither is special.
Listened to a JJ Watt interview on the drive to work this am. He said TJ is the best pure athlete of the Watt boys and that he's a better football player at this stage of his career than JJ felt he was when he left WI. Might be nothing more than JJ blowing smoke to move his brother up in the draft. It was interesting to listen to JJ talk about the intensity and energy TJ has had as long he can remember.
I know TT generally re-signs his draft choices, even if maybe he shouldn't (*cough* AJ Hawk *cough*) but I'm not sold on Perry being back and, to be honest, I wouldn't be all that disappointed of only Matthews and Fackrell were back at the position next year and they re-stock the position. If the pass rush had been able to step up. the issues in the secondary wouldn't have been so glaring. Even good corners can only cover so long and the lack of pass rushing talent was extremely evident in the playoffs especially.
This probably means drafting one early, drafting one middle-ish, signing a rotational guy and a flier, say John Simon and Dion Jordan, and a UDFA or two. A team really needs three consistent pass rushers and another couple of decent ones.
Also draft a good, fast corner prospect early and keep taking late and UDFA shots with raw guys who can run.
That probably means re-signing Lang, Tretter, Cook and Lacy, but I don't think too many would argue keeping those guys anyway.
I think Cook and Lacy are very good bets to be re-signed. Lang is a MM guy and that wouldn't surprise me either however Scott Wells, Marco Rivera, and Mike Wahle would beg to differ.
I don't see Tretter being re-signed unless he just gets no offers in FA which I don't see either. When he's healthy, he's a really good C and can be used at LT in a pinch as well. There are plenty of teams with crap at the Center position. Tretter would be a fine starter if he can shake the injury bug.
I don''t understand those who do not want to re-sign Perry. He outplayed CM this past year & played with a cast on his hand for the last part of the season.
FLPACKER posted:I don''t understand those who do not want to re-sign Perry. He outplayed CM this past year & played with a cast on his hand for the last part of the season.
$8 million minimum
I don't get it either. He was their best OLB. We already needed at least 1 more good edge rusher - which is hard to find. You lose him and you have to find TWO good edge rushers in 1 offseason. That math don't work.
"If Peppers runs that time he won't make it out of the top 10. If he's that fast and given that he seems to have a natural ability to make plays,"
Where does this come from? 1, pick, 1 FF and 4 sacks last year. With the way he was used, I would hope to see more production. There are numerous guys with better stats that were forced to line up in the same spot and play within the scheme.
In 2015 he had 0 picks 0 sacks. What plays do you speak of exactly?
Stats schmats, he can play. Maybe not a high first but he will be a player.
I see Taylor Mays (who I thought would be a good player)
Why don't we just keep Tretter? He's a better Center than Linsley, who looked very rusty this year I thought. I don't see Linsley as a Scott Wells, more of a Grey Reugamer. Tretter won't be expensive to keep considering he's basically only played in 2 full seasons worth of games and only started 10.
I agree, Tretter is more athletic & gets to the second level in the run game. Has had some difficulty with heavy NTs . Linsey's strength has been his ability to anchor, but got rag-dolled on bull rush by Hegeman on the AR sack in championship game & also appeared to fail to pick up delayed blitz by LBer.
BrainDed posted:"If Peppers runs that time he won't make it out of the top 10. If he's that fast and given that he seems to have a natural ability to make plays,"
Where does this come from? 1, pick, 1 FF and 4 sacks last year. With the way he was used, I would hope to see more production. There are numerous guys with better stats that were forced to line up in the same spot and play within the scheme.
In 2015 he had 0 picks 0 sacks. What plays do you speak of exactly?
Agree. I really worry about players with the physical tools but no real production to show for it. Peppers also only had 1 pass defended last year as well.
Compare to Jackson with 4 INT and 15 pass defended. Jackson had more tackles last year too.
Like I said, Peppers really looks the part, big, physical and has that swagger, but the stats don't really line up.
J-Barn posted:I think we are going to have to go with cornerback first.
I've mentioned it before, but is going into next season with our top 4 CBs being under the age of 25 a good idea? If we draft a CB, he'll still need to be developed. We're drafting #29, which is hardly the slot you draft a day one starter at cornerback. And Randall, Rollins and Gunter also need heavy development. I still think those three are worth developing so IMO, we have enough young, inconsistent talent in the secondary. What they need is a solid, consistent veteran that won't have those ups and downs (or in the case of 2016, downs and further downs). That's why I think they should spend and sign AJ Bouye, Trumaine Johnson or Stephon Gilmore. I just don't know if our secondary problems will be solved in 2017 by adding another young guy to the pool.
If a CB drops and is the best player available, by all means draft him. But I hope they don't need to target one in the first round after they sign one in free agency.
Seems to me his production in those categories is low because he played in such a variety of positions. Some CB, some SS, a lot of LB, some edge rusher. He had 66 tackles, 13 TFL, 3 sacks, 1 INT, 1 PD. Compare it to highly rated OLB prospect Takarisf McKinley: 61 Tackles, 18 TFL, 10 sacks, 0 INT, 6 PD. What that tells me is that Peppers was miscast at OLB. He was never going to produce legit sack numbers, but it does appear he can attack the ball and make plays behind the LOS. Maybe he will produce more when he's at the position he belongs at? Nickel Back is possible with his athleticism, but now I'm thinking SS is more likely. He won't be expected to snag a lot of INTs, but will support the run (Chancellor averages 80 tackles/year and very few INTs). He's not a polished player, but he's a damn fine athlete and that certainly counts for something.
DH13 posted:The most encouraging thing I noticed about Jackson is his make up speed and his ability to control his body at top speed. You will see a receiver beat him on the route but by time the ball gets there Jackson has put himself back into position and looking for the ball. Probably an indicator of him needing to develop his shadowing skills some more but with that kind of athleticism he shouldn't have a problem. Also a big plus to have a CB that can actually catch.
Guys like Jackson and Peppers are supposed to have speed. That alone is a step up. Shields was raw when drafted but had that make up speed. He is gone. We have a need for speed at that position.
vitaflo posted:BrainDed posted:"If Peppers runs that time he won't make it out of the top 10. If he's that fast and given that he seems to have a natural ability to make plays,"
Where does this come from? 1, pick, 1 FF and 4 sacks last year. With the way he was used, I would hope to see more production. There are numerous guys with better stats that were forced to line up in the same spot and play within the scheme.
In 2015 he had 0 picks 0 sacks. What plays do you speak of exactly?
Agree. I really worry about players with the physical tools but no real production to show for it. Peppers also only had 1 pass defended last year as well.
Compare to Jackson with 4 INT and 15 pass defended. Jackson had more tackles last year too.
Like I said, Peppers really looks the part, big, physical and has that swagger, but the stats don't really line up.
He also had 13 tackles for a loss this year and had 10 passes defended the year before. There was a reason he was Big Ten DPOY this year. A lot of teams game planned to avoid him.
I'm not a UM fan, but I end up seeing a lot of their games. This guy is good. I'd be willing to bet, barring injury, that he'll be one of the 2-3 best players out of this draft.
YATittle posted:Tretter deserves a shot to start elsewhere.
I'd argue Tretter deserves the chance to start in Green Bay. I like his game better than Linsley's.
Grave Digger posted:Seems to me his production in those categories is low because he played in such a variety of positions. Some CB, some SS, a lot of LB, some edge rusher. He had 66 tackles, 13 TFL, 3 sacks, 1 INT, 1 PD. Compare it to highly rated OLB prospect Takarisf McKinley: 61 Tackles, 18 TFL, 10 sacks, 0 INT, 6 PD. What that tells me is that Peppers was miscast at OLB. He was never going to produce legit sack numbers, but it does appear he can attack the ball and make plays behind the LOS. Maybe he will produce more when he's at the position he belongs at? Nickel Back is possible with his athleticism, but now I'm thinking SS is more likely. He won't be expected to snag a lot of INTs, but will support the run (Chancellor averages 80 tackles/year and very few INTs). He's not a polished player, but he's a damn fine athlete and that certainly counts for something.
Chancellor 4.69 6'3" 232 pounds
Earl Thomas 4.43 5'10" 202
Jabrill Peppers 6'1" 207 (a rumored 4.34 in the 40).
Even if he runs a 4.40, he's much more Earl Thomas than Chancellor.
The other thing that might have depressed his stats is that Harbaugh had him playing RB (3 TDs on 27 carries for 167 yards), KR, PR, and on defense.
FLPACKER posted:I don''t understand those who do not want to re-sign Perry. He outplayed CM this past year & played with a cast on his hand for the last part of the season.
The guy at a high-dollar position finally has a decent year in his SECOND contract year, still isn't healthy, and regression to the mean is most likely scenario. I doubt his demands are "reasonable" when starting edge guys get paid.
I don't see how a broken thumb would equal "still isn't healthy" & predict lower output when he is able to play without a cast. It isn't like a lower body injury.
We just haven't seen that side of Peppers to suggest he could be a ball hawking FS. Perhaps TJ Ward is a more apt comparison as a SS. The point wasn't to compare him to Chancellor though, the point was that playing him SS is the most like destination based on what we've seen from him so far. He's really only piled up Tackles with few INTs or PD's, similar to the stats Chancellor has as a SS.
Herschel posted:FLPACKER posted:I don''t understand those who do not want to re-sign Perry. He outplayed CM this past year & played with a cast on his hand for the last part of the season.
The guy at a high-dollar position finally has a decent year in his SECOND contract year, still isn't healthy, and regression to the mean is most likely scenario. I doubt his demands are "reasonable" when starting edge guys get paid.
We already have a tough task of finding another good/very good edge rusher to add to the 2016 roster. Lose Perry and you need to find 2 in one offseason for the 2017 roster. And we probably lose Peppers.
And what mean exactly are you referring to? That he will continue missing games with injuries? His stats while he wasn't playing? His stats when he was playing healthy are pretty damn good.