@pkr_north posted:big question I think is what are the Jets doing...I am not entirely convinced on QB...I think they could also trade down...how would that be for SF...lol.
They'll take whoever they can get at 3...
It will be interesting, for sure.
This guy will be the best value from that Miami front. No idea where he goes, but he’s going to be pushed down boards. Had a really good pro day today. The ACC was freakin stacked with edge players...the Miami boys, the Pitt boys, the Wake Forest kid! If I’m looking for a Tackle, I’m pulling one from the ACC...gauntlet of pass rushers!
PFF has an initial grade of 5th round for Roche, due mostly to what they deem to be "undersized".
He graded high as a pass rusher, though. Selecting him somewhere in the middle to late rounds would be getting value.
@Packmeister posted:They'll take whoever they can get at 3...
It will be interesting, for sure.
A few things to note....
- Saleh is there in NY now
- There is zero chance SF trades up to #3 & doesn't get the guy they're targeting. Unless....
- Someone offers the Jets a TON of draft capital & trades out. (Atlanta?) Then....
- The Jets will draft Sewell the OT even if they stay at #2
Here's some recent mocks....one from our hero Chad Reuter & an interesting article from SI.
https://www.nfl.com/news/lance-zierlein-2021-nfl-mock-draft-3-0-eagles-land-jaylen-waddle-after-trading-d
https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/gm-report/penei-sewell-vs-jamarr-chase-one-nfl-team-may-have-tipped-their-hand
Trey Lance?
https://www.nfl.com/news/four-round-2021-nfl-mock-draft-2-0-49ers-pounce-on-trey-lance-at-no-3
Thanks, Boris...I may have been over-generalizing when I said they would take any qb...that's probably not the case...They most likely are targeting a specific player there.
Shannahan heavily implied they’re drafting Mac Jones at 3. Wilson to NYJ at 2 is supposedly the worst kept secrets in the NFL. Urban literally said they’re taking Lawrence at 1. Falcons can’t NOT take a QB with how Ryan’s arm looks, so Lance is likely the #4 pick unless they just love Fields. Bengals HAVE to take Sewell and Dolphins are either going to grab Pitts or Chase. I’m betting the Lions will field some offers for whoever covets the next QB available, whether Fields or Lance, to jump Carolina to get him (DEN, CHI, maybe NE?). If not then you have to think they will take the next best receiver, whoever MIA doesn’t take (Pitts or Chase). Denver needs basically everything so who knows where they go, probably Parsons or Horn or Slater.
@Grave Digger posted:Shannahan heavily implied they’re drafting Mac Jones at 3. Wilson to NYJ at 2 is supposedly the worst kept secrets in the NFL. Urban literally said they’re taking Lawrence at 1. Falcons can’t NOT take a QB with how Ryan’s arm looks, so Lance is likely the #4 pick unless they just love Fields. Bengals HAVE to take Sewell and Dolphins are either going to grab Pitts or Chase. I’m betting the Lions will field some offers for whoever covets the next QB available, whether Fields or Lance, to jump Carolina to get him (DEN, CHI, maybe NE?). If not then you have to think they will take the next best receiver, whoever MIA doesn’t take (Pitts or Chase). Denver needs basically everything so who knows where they go, probably Parsons or Horn or Slater.
I wasn't thrilled with the Jordan Love pick, but I wonder how teams would rank Jordan Love relative to this draft class? I can't imagine he wouldn't be in the conversation if he'd have come out this year.
Lawrence looks like the real deal, but it's hard to fairly evaluate guys like him, Mac Jones, and Justin Fields when they play on teams that are more talented at every position than almost any opponent they face. Trevor Lawrence still looked like an NFL QB in the 2 playoff games Clemson lost the last two years, but he didn't look like a future NFL superstar in those games. Not coincidentally, he was playing against teams with more NFL-level talent (2019 LSU and 2020 Ohio State) than any of Clemson's other games. He's had one elite game against elite competition in college (beating Alabama to win the 2018 title as a freshman), but otherwise it's a lot of games against teams that Clemson has beaten before they even set foot on the field because they recruited more 5-star talent during the recruiting battles. Tua looked like a future superstar and Miami may not even want him. Jalen Hurts looks fairly pedestrian. Dwayne Haskins?
@Grave Digger posted:Shannahan heavily implied they’re drafting Mac Jones at 3. Wilson to NYJ at 2 is supposedly the worst kept secrets in the NFL. Urban literally said they’re taking Lawrence at 1. Falcons can’t NOT take a QB with how Ryan’s arm looks, so Lance is likely the #4 pick unless they just love Fields. Bengals HAVE to take Sewell and Dolphins are either going to grab Pitts or Chase. I’m betting the Lions will field some offers for whoever covets the next QB available, whether Fields or Lance, to jump Carolina to get him (DEN, CHI, maybe NE?). If not then you have to think they will take the next best receiver, whoever MIA doesn’t take (Pitts or Chase). Denver needs basically everything so who knows where they go, probably Parsons or Horn or Slater.
I wonder how many teams will start playing QB chicken after the first 3 QBs, whoever they are, are off the board. As you mentioned, a lot of those guys played with an absurd amount of talent that may not translate to the NFL.
I think teams like the Falcons and Bengals take the best talent available and scramble for position in the late first/early second for whoever drops. Kind of like Gunt did with a HOFer running the team.
@MichiganPacker2 posted:I wasn't thrilled with the Jordan Love pick, but I wonder how teams would rank Jordan Love relative to this draft class? I can't imagine he wouldn't be in the conversation if he'd have come out this year.
You asked:
Green Bay Packers: How Jordan Love compares to 2021's top draft QBs (jsonline.com)
"The scout who graded Love the highest had him again as a top-10 prospect at No. 3 in this year’s class. Last year, he had Love behind Burrow and Tagovailoa, and ahead of Herbert. This year the same scout ranked Love third behind Zach Wilson and Trevor Lawrence, and ahead of Justin Fields, Trey Lance and Mac Jones."
Yeah, and we see what a fucking stud Tagavailoa is! WOOO!!!
Drama in Whiner land...I wonder how Jimmy Goombatz will feel if they use #3 to draft LT Peni Sewell?
@Chongo posted:Yeah, and we see what a fucking stud Tagavailoa is! WOOO!!!
He was a rookie!!! That fucking Peyton Manning was such a bust with his 29 rookie year picks, no? Aaron Rodgers couldn't even get on the field.
The Niners just can’t get out of their own way. Saying you want to take a QB at 3 but Jimmy is “your guy?” What a crock of shit.
Consider yourself judged.
I'm bring back the permanent record.
@MichiganPacker2 posted:I wasn't thrilled with the Jordan Love pick, but I wonder how teams would rank Jordan Love relative to this draft class? I can't imagine he wouldn't be in the conversation if he'd have come out this year.
Lawrence looks like the real deal, but it's hard to fairly evaluate guys like him, Mac Jones, and Justin Fields when they play on teams that are more talented at every position than almost any opponent they face. Trevor Lawrence still looked like an NFL QB in the 2 playoff games Clemson lost the last two years, but he didn't look like a future NFL superstar in those games. Not coincidentally, he was playing against teams with more NFL-level talent (2019 LSU and 2020 Ohio State) than any of Clemson's other games. He's had one elite game against elite competition in college (beating Alabama to win the 2018 title as a freshman), but otherwise it's a lot of games against teams that Clemson has beaten before they even set foot on the field because they recruited more 5-star talent during the recruiting battles. Tua looked like a future superstar and Miami may not even want him. Jalen Hurts looks fairly pedestrian. Dwayne Haskins?
Teams are more QB needy this year then last year it seems also I don't think the 2022 QB crop is looking great. I think Love would have been in the top 10 or at least top 20 conversation with Carolina, Denver, NE, Miami, etc. I don't think GB was alone in rating him a R1 talent, but not every team uses the Ron Wolf philosophy of staying true to your board and always drafting QBs. Knowing what they know now about how their QB situations have shaken out I have no doubt that HOU (Watson wanting out), SF (Jimmy G injury prone) and SEA (RW wanting out) would have been hot after Love in 2020.
@Chongo posted:Hey don't judge me! You're being racist.
Henry says I can't be racist. Apparently, he is keeping that super power to himself.
@Henry posted:Consider yourself judged.
I'm bring back the permanent record.
SEE? Wait till he drops a H-bomb.
@Goalline posted:SEE? Wait till he drops a H-bomb.
Wait. H-bomb isn't what I think it is.
The thing with San Fran is there’s no reason for QB subterfuge. The Jets simply can’t afford to trade down so there’s no “tricking” someone else in to giving up major draft capital to move ahead of them.
@Chongo posted:You are the least racist white man I know.
I wish I hadn't told you about my lack of inches.
Would love to know what Gut could get in picks for Love right now.
Concerning Jordan Love...with the Packers a perennial winning team, for the most part, especially with Aaron, when would they ever have a shot at drafting his replacement? They are always drafting in the bottom half or third of the round, and lately, even lower. It's hard enough finding a franchise qb at the top of the draft, let alone the bottom.
You certainly wouldn't want to wait until he retires, would you? If you do, you're forced into a needy situation, and all the other teams would certainly enjoy that, I'm sure.
As controversial as it may seem, it looks to me like they decided it was their best chance to land a quality quarterback, one who can learn from one of the best to ever play the game.
The only controversy is continuing this middling approach of not doing everything to win the Super Bowl. Yes, let Rodgers retire and rebuild. There’s always some “can’t miss” or “boom/potential” prospect every year. There will be plenty of other Jordan Loves out there.
Look how many top flight QB do exactly jack shit in the NFL...
Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen, Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziere, Turdy Bilgewater, Jameis Winston, Marcus Mariota...ad nauseum...
"We have to pick a QB because who knows when we will be in the position to get one this good again," is bullshit. QB that will be successful no matter where they go are rare...Manning, Brady, Rodgers...those guys come along maybe once every 10 years. Most QB prospects are like Jared Goff...they don't elevate the team.
12 has consistently elevated this team more than any QB in franchise history. The success of this franchise since he came on board can largely be attributed to him. And some of us believe it's just wrong to not use draft picks to get him another ring.
@Henry posted:Considering how he’s supposedly valued, think about getting a top 10 pick or a handful of second day picks. That would be a nice infusion.
You would take a 2025 7th rounder.
@Chongo posted:Look how many top flight QB do exactly jack shit in the NFL...
Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen, Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziere, Turdy Bilgewater, Jameis Winston, Marcus Mariota...ad nauseum...
"We have to pick a QB because who knows when we will be in the position to get one this good again," is bullshit. QB that will be successful no matter where they go are rare...Manning, Brady, Rodgers...those guys come along maybe once every 10 years. Most QB prospects are like Jared Goff...they don't elevate the team.
12 has consistently elevated this team more than any QB in franchise history. The success of this franchise since he came on board can largely be attributed to him. And some of us believe it's just wrong to not use draft picks to get him another ring.
Good point, but we were lucky to even get Rodgers in the first place.
@Goalline posted:You would take a 2025 7th rounder.
That's pretty steep.
On a serious note, not a lot of tape on Love's first year because of COVID. Teams would have to go on their initial assessment.
This is all just fun and games. I highly doubt Gerp would do such a thing considering he just signed that powerhouse Lancaster.
The flip side is that the worst time to draft a QB is when you need one. SF just gave up 3 first round picks as a gamble on a rookie, chances are those picks are NOT going to be pick 32 each year. There’s no right time to pick a QB.
Personally, I don't think the act of drafting a DT or WR late in the 1st round can be described as going all in. Very few of those players are ready to go in year one. Drafting a QB instead will help protect the future of the team without giving up the "all in". You want to go all in, sign more grizzled desperate vets.
Alexander did just fine. I'm not expecting a DT/DE to be an instant starter but if they're worth their salt they definitely can provide rotation to that murderer's row of Dean Lowry and Tyler Lancaster.