Way early look at draft

There are some pretty big carrots dangling at FA positions the Packers need to fill. In the TT era, I wouldn't even bring this up. With Gutey. gladly we can.

FA WR's who are UFA include Amari Cooper, Emmanuel Sanders,  Davante Parker, Robby Anderson, among others. It's also a very deep draft at WR in 2020 so we will see what the market is like for WR's in FA.  

ILB's include Joe Schobert, Danny Trevathan, Kyle Van Noy, Cory Littleton, Patrick Onwuasor among others. 

The Packers will shed Graham's salary and have a decision to make with Bulaga. I'd love to see Brian here on a team friendly deal but I fully get it if some team throws gobs of money at him.

But, if the Packers make moves at say ILB and WR in FA, obviously that affects how Gutey approaches the draft.    

On WRs, there's plenty of guys out there, including Randall Cobb of all people.  Hey, he's only 29 and AR loves the guy.  

I think Bulaga is a guy that you almost have to bring back if the cost is "doable."  When healthy, the guy is one of the top RTs in the game. I get health has been an issue but those dudes don't grow on trees.  I think this Veldheer guy also plays into the equation with what to do with Bulaga.  

GB desperately needs another MLB.  Not to replace Martinez, but to play next to him.  

No, to replace Martinez. He's weak in the run and passing game. Oh, but like AJ, he's seldom injured.

Not everything shows up in the stats.

You have no idea what you're talking about. Stop listening to dumdums on this board looking to find a convenient whipping boy.  

YATittle posted:

Not everything shows up in the stats.

But sometimes they do show up in stats:

2019 Passes Defensed – Linebacker

Eric Kendricks Vikings 12

Luke Kuechly Panthers 10

Joe Schobert Browns 9

Demario Davis Saints 9

Matt Milano Bills 9

Lorenzo Alexander Bills 8

Corely Littleton Rams 8

K.J. Wright Seahawks 8

Jayon Brown Titans 7

Tremaine Edmunds Bills 7

Fred Warner 49ers 6

Jaylon Smith Cowboys 6

Hasson Reddick Cardinals 6

Jordan Hicks Cardinals 6

Lavonte David Bucs 5

Preston Smith Packers 3

BLAKE MARTINEZ PACKERS ZERO (0)

2019 Interceptions – Linebacker

Joe Schobert Browns 4

Jordan Hicks Cardinals 3

Jamie Collins, Sr. Patriots 3

Neville Hewitt Jets 2

Josh Bynes Raves 2

Darius Leonard Colts 2

Luke Kuechly Panthers 2

Ryan Connelly Giants 2

De’Vondre Campbell Falcons 2

Cory Littleton Rams 2

Devin Bush Steelers 2

BLAKE MARTINEZ ZERO (0)

Easy, PAKRZ...I like how you're ready to defend Blake. We're all fans here. One thing that needs to happen is he needs to be kept clean. He gets too caught up in the scrum, and doesn't disengage well from blocks. He also doesn't have them fluid hips to turn and cover receivers. He's still a very good linebacker.

I do think we could use a faster guy in the middle. If we're stuck paying out a big contract for a MLB, I'd rather the team go after Schobert.

I also wouldn't mind us moving up in the 1st for Murray, either, if he's the missing piece in the middle of the defense.

Grave Digger posted:

My favorite ILB is Miami ILB Shaq Quarterman. I think he's a true ILB, not a tweener or a hybrid Safety type that draftniks seem to be enamored with and overrate. He's a dog in the middle, he doesn't get much love because he's not blazing fast (probably 4.6-4.7) and he's not elite in coverage, but he's going to be a good run defender in the NFL.  

Sounds like Bernardo Harris 😁👍

Pakrz posted:

You have no idea what you're talking about. Stop listening to dumdums on this board looking to find a convenient whipping boy.  

 

I'm basing it on what I see with my eyes and decades of watching all levels of football. Not what I read on this or any other message board.

Guys like Blake Martinez are tricky.  I think he's a nice average ILB in today's NFL maybe even a tick above average, but I fear that someone will pay him as if he's well above average.  I don't really want the Packers' paying him like that if at all possible.  If there's a bidding war for him, let someone else "win" it. 

BPA, there are plenty of spots on this team in need of an upgrade.  LB, TE, OL, DL, WR could all use a infusion of top notch talent.   

SteveLuke posted:

YATittle posted:

Not everything shows up in the stats.

But sometimes they do show up in stats:

2019 Passes Defensed – Linebacker

Eric Kendricks Vikings 12

Luke Kuechly Panthers 10

Joe Schobert Browns 9

Demario Davis Saints 9

Matt Milano Bills 9

Lorenzo Alexander Bills 8

Corely Littleton Rams 8

K.J. Wright Seahawks 8

Jayon Brown Titans 7

Tremaine Edmunds Bills 7

Fred Warner 49ers 6

Jaylon Smith Cowboys 6

Hasson Reddick Cardinals 6

Jordan Hicks Cardinals 6

Lavonte David Bucs 5

Preston Smith Packers 3

BLAKE MARTINEZ PACKERS ZERO (0)

 

2019 Interceptions – Linebacker

Joe Schobert Browns 4

Jordan Hicks Cardinals 3

Jamie Collins, Sr. Patriots 3

Neville Hewitt Jets 2

Josh Bynes Raves 2

Darius Leonard Colts 2

Luke Kuechly Panthers 2

Ryan Connelly Giants 2

De’Vondre Campbell Falcons 2

Cory Littleton Rams 2

Devin Bush Steelers 2

BLAKE MARTINEZ ZERO (0)

Now roll out the rest of the stats.

SteveLuke posted:

YATittle posted:

Not everything shows up in the stats.

But sometimes they do show up in stats:

2019 Passes Defensed – Linebacker

Eric Kendricks Vikings 12

Luke Kuechly Panthers 10

Joe Schobert Browns 9

Demario Davis Saints 9

Matt Milano Bills 9

Lorenzo Alexander Bills 8

Corely Littleton Rams 8

K.J. Wright Seahawks 8

Jayon Brown Titans 7

Tremaine Edmunds Bills 7

Fred Warner 49ers 6

Jaylon Smith Cowboys 6

Hasson Reddick Cardinals 6

Jordan Hicks Cardinals 6

Lavonte David Bucs 5

Preston Smith Packers 3

BLAKE MARTINEZ PACKERS ZERO (0)

 

2019 Interceptions – Linebacker

Joe Schobert Browns 4

Jordan Hicks Cardinals 3

Jamie Collins, Sr. Patriots 3

Neville Hewitt Jets 2

Josh Bynes Raves 2

Darius Leonard Colts 2

Luke Kuechly Panthers 2

Ryan Connelly Giants 2

De’Vondre Campbell Falcons 2

Cory Littleton Rams 2

Devin Bush Steelers 2

BLAKE MARTINEZ ZERO (0)

I don't see Bobby Wagner or Roquan Smith on either list.  Tell me those guys are shitty linebackers too.  

Packmeister posted:

Easy, PAKRZ...I like how you're ready to defend Blake. We're all fans here. One thing that needs to happen is he needs to be kept clean. He gets too caught up in the scrum, and doesn't disengage well from blocks. He also doesn't have them fluid hips to turn and cover receivers. He's still a very good linebacker.

I do think we could use a faster guy in the middle. If we're stuck paying out a big contract for a MLB, I'd rather the team go after Schobert.

I also wouldn't mind us moving up in the 1st for Murray, either, if he's the missing piece in the middle of the defense.

Believe me, I understand Martinez has his limitations.  There's no denying that there's better MLBs in the NFL.  But to just brush his production aside like he shouldn't even be on the field is ridiculous.  I agree with your take that he is "Still a very good linebacker."  He absolutely is... with limitations. 

I also agree with most that GB needs to be careful to not get into a bidding war for him.  Again though... if GB can retain him at a reasonable rate, they should because the kid can play.  How "reasonable" is defined is obviously debatable.  

Martinez would be fine NEXT to Bobby Wagner. Asking him to be Wagner is setting him up for failure. His stats are fine, but he’s not making key plays consistently enough that we need from ILBs. We also heard Philip Rivers mention there’s no cat and mouse with the defense, that’s on Martinez for not making the right pre-snap reads. That was one of Clay’s biggest strengths and it’s what great ILBs can do. Put a better guy next to Mart and we’re fine at ILB. 

In regards to Martinez, I think it is underappreciated that he essentially is THE only real linebacker that plays on defense. Most of the time he is paired with a safety or a second teamer like Goodson. I think this has a big part of his liabilities of getting off blocks etc...

I'd still like to see passing yards allowed at ILB. I think that would show more if Blake is average in that area or truly near the bottom of the pile. Of course that will also be higher based on the high number of snaps he takes. Maybe yards per target or something. 

Grave Digger posted:

Saw a quote from Pettine recently that made me think they don't think as poorly of King as folks here do. Said he had things he wants back and things he needs to improve on, but seemed to almost imply some instances were also Safety related. Said they put CBs in tough spots a lot and that was also part of it. King has 1 more year on his rookie deal, so I'm betting they don't pour another R1 pick into the mix this year in the hopes that he turns it on fully in 2020. King might end up being a good player IF he can improve on the mental side because I see his instincts and awareness as huge liabilities right now. When he guess right on the route, he can stick and plays well, but when he guesses wrong (which is often IMO) he can't keep up. 

 

The issue is they play nickel so often they need another corner who can play right away. If Xavier McKinney were a bit faster, he'd be an interesting guy. I suppose they could lean need and go something like this:

That would lean more toward building depth at safety, though it kind of repeats  Moore/MVS/EQ (except Hill and Cephus have very good hands). I suppose they could do worse than going in to next season with Adams, MVS, maybe Lazard and the rookies. 

I think they will add WR's both via the draft at FA next year. I'd like to see Parker from Miami. 26 years old and coming off a career season. His stats before this year were pretty "meh" but so was QB situation in Miami. 

Adding Cooper & Schobert would significantly improve both sides of the ball. 

I can understand if Cephus has a strong desire to get out of college, but as a junior, wouldn't he increase his earning potential with another year in college? 

To play every snap and have 0 passes defensed after 12 games is almost as hard to believe as a team having negative punt return yards in December.

Pakrz posted:

You have no idea what you're talking about. Stop listening to dumdums on this board looking to find a convenient whipping boy.  

 

Pot meet kettle.

Anyone here think Gute might trade up for a player in the first round?

El-Nuke-the-Hurricanes-Bong posted:

I can understand if Cephus has a strong desire to get out of college, but as a junior, wouldn't he increase his earning potential with another year in college? 

Maybe, but with the arrest probably being the biggest factor I’m not sure it would. 

If the glove don't fit....you must acquit! Acquitted!

If I'm Cephus, I GTFO - He's probably a 3rd or 4th rounder right now

Joe burrow is a damn good qb 

Heisman a lock.

mrtundra posted:

Anyone here think Gute might trade up for a player in the first round?

Only if there's a player there who can put either the offense or the defense into the upper echelon of the league. I wouldn't be against it, but it has to be "the guy".

We're talking here about getting Aaron & Co. to the Super Bowl, right?

We could still get there this year, so a lot depends on how things go from here.

This is about the most relevant thread to add this news.
It may not have a direct impact on the draft, but indirectly, re-signings/extensions or possible FA acquisitions could.

Salary Cap Expected To Increase At Least $8M In 2020

Give it all to Kenny!

Kenny & Bulaga most likely. 

And Mason. Want his reliability in the future.

I thought last year may have opened the door for Gute to find a new kicker but after seeing some of the shit shows other teams have at the position, you gotta go with the steady vet.

WR is the deepest position in the draft...so yeah, I'd think they will snag one or two. Time to cut the bag loose on the GMo and WW Jebus experiments.

Grave Digger posted:

Draft mandate: get a fucking receiver. Get 3 maybe. These stiffs (aside from Adams) aren’t cutting it. Rodgers doesn’t make receivers great anymore, which is fine, so get him some talent so they can elevate each other. Oh find a TE too.

He made receivers with some talent good. It's hard to make receiver good who can't get open. The only one who comes to mind is James Jones. He couldn't get open either but he was just stronger than DBS and took the ball away.

DH13 posted:

I thought last year may have opened the door for Gute to find a new kicker but after seeing some of the shit shows other teams have at the position, you gotta go with the steady vet.

Like Adam Vinatieri?

Vinatieri is like George Blanda of kicking but has/had a rough year. 

Mason Crosby is far & away, the steady vet most teams would covet.

Yeah I think there's a good few years (likely more) minimum of Crosby remaining a reliable, solid kicker.  

Given that one guy is 35 and the other is 46 it's a pretty dumb thing to even bring up. Pretty amazing he's 16/17 (94%) this year. If he can get through this game he could set the Packers record for FG accuracy in a season with 2 dome games to follow. Jan Stenerud holds the record of 22/24 for 91.7%. 

This one fell strangely with the first three guys sliding, but I'd be great with something like this even though it doesn't potentially close some major gaps.

Chaisson is and athletic freak and would replace Fackrell. Depth at pass rusher is probably the biggest part of the defensive improvement and I think someone may offer Fackrell mid-level starter money. Chaisson lost 2018 to a knee injury, but looks well over it.

Fromm in Round 2? Yes, please. not having the fifth-year option is kind of a drag on the timeline but worry about that if/when he develops.

Lawrence at that spot is again way too good to pass up and is probably a need, as well. 

Jordyn Brooks in the 4th would seem a great value, as well. Maybe not quite as sure a thing as an earlier pick, but passing on those guys, if available, would have been wrong.

Antoine Brooks has corner experience and would seem to be a versatile piece to find a home for. 

Waiting until Hodgins and Mims to get wideouts is kind of a drag, but they're both really talented guys.