I got an idea.  Let's talk about what the team record will be next year without Rodgers.

Let's see.  Essentially a rookie QB running the show or a vet journey man that doesn't have a full grasp of the offense yet.

11-6?  10-7?  I'm thinking 7-10 is more likely.

Didn't do much to fill the DT/ILB again.  I'm sure there won't be any issues without a guy like Rodgers driving your offense covering deficiencies.

How about that Davante guy basically saying he'd have to reconsider what would happen when he becomes a FA?  Wait, fuck that guy amirite!

I'm sure other players on the team will be looking forward to future contract negotiations as well.

Boy, this all sure is swell.  At least we won't have to worry about NFCC heartbreak again.  So relieved.

to me predicting the record could be tough based upon what do the Packers get in players in the trade (or if they get players)?   If they were to get some nice defensive assets to fill some gaps to finally fix the defense or a RT or WR to help on offense?

One key thing that could help the team is that MLF makes a real effort to run the damn ball.  There is no bigger friend to a QB and your own defense than running the ball.  if they could run the ball and play keep away and have a game manager at QB? they might be ok.

If they couldn't get some DE/ILB help they could be in trouble defensively IMHO and especially so if they can't find someone to play RT without shuffling OL around too much they also could be in trouble.

They might get nothing if Rodgers is determined to sit out. 

Either way, compensation for Rodgers is likely going to be picks.  If they were going to get players as well hopefully it's defensive players to fill those fucking holes that keep being ignored.

Murphy should have been fired two minutes after he said "don't be the problem"  and for that AR should take his ball and go somewhere the head people would appreciate him. It has been a privilege and honor to watch him play these last 13 years. He deserves better than the front office ineptitude of Ted, Gute, Murphy, and MCCarthy.

Murphy and Ball should've been fired after the whole TT/McVince collapse.  TT was noticeably declining and everyone could see how damn stale McVince was and he did nothing.  The entire organization went with the "let Aaron handle it" that McVince was so fond of. 

I think they did decent in getting Mayo but Murphy obviously fostered this bullshit tough guy approach, which is a total management failure. 

If Love isn't the real deal this team will go south in a hurry.

Only a complete idiot like Murphy would make a comment like that.  “Don’t be part of the problem” is dumber than the Fox News talking heads telling LeBron and Greg Popovich to “shut up and play and coach” not understanding the pull both of those guys have.  

They should have canned Murphy after he told the media “we aren’t talking about Rodgers” when asked.  The guy just cannot be trusted to say the right things at the right time and unlike Jerry Jones (who says plenty of stupid shit) he doesn’t have equity and actual stake in the business.  

The more I read about TT and his failing health and Ball and Murphy trying to play GM the more sickening it gets.   All along I thought TT fucked up those last 2-3 drafts. It sure sounds like the bean counter and sales guy were a lot more responsible.  Only a finance guy could pass on TJW and try to get more in return with Biegel and King in the aggregate.  No way even Ted could screw things up that badly.

Rodgers best play is really his only play.  Return to GB.  But he and the team have to be agreeable on his (Rodgers) terms - which likely means more guaranteed years and more money.   Again, 3 years and a raise would seem reasonable.  But that assumes both parties are in a mood to be reasonable.  

A trade is Rodgers next best move but only if he’s going to a team equipped to win now and only a team that is willing to give GB picks and assets back in return.  It has to be both.  2-3 players that are starters or upgrades and 2-3 picks.   Again, possible but less likely than him coming back.

Retirement or a hold out wouldn’t seem to make a lot of sense.

@Henry posted:

Murphy and Ball should've been fired after the whole TT/McVince collapse.  TT was noticeably declining and everyone could see how damn stale McVince was and he did nothing.  The entire organization went with the "let Aaron handle it" that McVince was so fond of.

I think they did decent in getting Mayo but Murphy obviously fostered this bullshit tough guy approach, which is a total management failure.

If Love isn't the real deal this team will go south in a hurry.

If I recall there were some on this forum who didn’t see it.  

There was some banter about Ted, but I think some of us chalked it up to his quirky aloof personality and not failing health issues.  It sure would explain the 2015-2017 timeframe.  There were a lot of head scratching moves for a guy that had a solid career as a personnel guy.

Russ Ball interim GM.   JFC!

@Henry posted:

Aren't we going to bitch about the contract that has guys like fucking Dak Prescott making more money?

Valid point. It's outside the control of the GB FO what happens around the league in terms of throwing $$$ at marquee or high profile players. But it does affect the entire league in the message it sends. Namely, it says guys like Dak or Matty Ice are on some equal footing with the likes of Rodgers. Does Rodgers take that as a slight? If you're David Dunn, looking out for your client and no one else, you're probably pointing that out to AR at some point, if not every day. Is such a premise realistic? In most cases, no. Overpaying for players drives up the market price, skews the market commensurate with each position, and strongly limits a team's ability to field a viable 53. Rodgers knows this, but he's in a position to leverage such a thing and has a very small window to extract some amount. This is considered fair play, right?

Many people are of the opinion that it isn't about that with Rodgers, that it's about going all in to win a ring, or that he was not phoned to alert him to a drafted qb, or that he wants more commitment from the franchise he's been dedicated to for so many years in lieu of the Love pick. So if it isn't about money, chances are that it would seem easy to rectify. Kiss his ass and tell him his shit don't stink. Convey to him that you're committed to him being the guy, if you haven't done that already after 16 years. If it's truly your desire to finish your career in GB, hearing such a thing might be a step in the right direction, no? If it wasn't your camp who dropped the news on draft day, then you missed giving an opportunity to the FO to prove they make picks with you in mind, yes?

Even if you believe the FO is unquestionably at fault here, why is it ok for AR to let the media dance around and offer new bits each and every day? Is he being up front about his grievances with the organization? Maybe, but you'd be hard pressed to believe that given all the bullshit that's come out. No, it's not his responsibility to correct the record of the feeding frenzy it has become. But if you need people to believe you have acted in good faith all this time, this would be a funny way of proving that. At some point, if you're trying to play it both ways, the tide might easily turn against you.

The one thing the Packers have done right in the past two weeks is shut their mouths. If nothing else, that could be a small sign that they value the process and are keeping up their end in the form of some type of good faith. Can we say the same of the Rodgers' camp? Hard to tell. I do know that dragging this on will lead to more guys like Adams being quoted in the press and every bit of it will be milked for all its worth. Is such damage just a natural consequence, or will it have lasting effects even if a trade were to go down? I believe AR has been dedicated to this team and the town and to the fans. But at the same time, by playing the media and public opinion game, he is allowing further damage to be done, and potentially poisoning the well by watching teammates and players around the league take sides-possibly even recruiting players to join him.

Are the stakes for him that high to leave such a trail of wreckage, especially when objectively the best situation for him to win a ring remains right here in the place he so needs to prove his point? Is he really smarter than everyone and comes out on top of whatever fight he has convinced himself this is? Is vindication really going to be worth this complete mess? Abiding in good faith also includes owning up to your part in any damage done. That applies to both sides in this case. If he's willing to watch it burn for the sake of gaining some real or imagined "respect", it will end up he was playing by the Brett Favre playbook, and everyone will regret all of this. That will be tragic for the fans and the town and the storied team we all revere so highly, particularly since we just went through the same thing a minute ago.

It's his legacy, just like it was Brett's legacy. I hope it means to him what it means to most Packer fans, in the end.

Significant long term offer on the table.

https://www.foxnews.com/sports...-offer-aaron-rodgers

Was listening to "Moving the Chains" today. Pat Kerwin basically said  Aaron needs to speak, Called the term "disrespect" childish and said Devante should shut up. Work out a deal where Rodgers guarantees he'll show up and be all in this year, then after the season  work out a deal with a team he wants. He's earned that. And Devante, Franchise tag him. And if he doesn't like it trade him to the Jets. (I added that part)

Dunn gets it both ways if the Packers trade AR. He represents AR and Love so the only way he can save face with both his clients is to get AR traded to a team of his choosing and have Love ready to take the ball as the QB for Green Bay.  Somebody needs to explain how this is not a conflict of interest for this guy. Any other scenario hurts Love.

@Gsands posted:

Significant long term offer on the table.

https://www.foxnews.com/sports...-offer-aaron-rodgers

I don't think this is new. McGinn (The Atlantic) reported on 5/6 that there was a massive offer, bigger than Mahomes $$. Problem is, no one knows if or when there was actually an offer, or if there was are they still negotiating or did AR decline.

Nothing has changed since Jan 25th.

@H5 posted:

Nothing has changed since Jan 25th.

Don't tell the Denver media.  Not exaggerating, the Denver radio guys have spent no less than 60% of their air time on Aaron Rodgers since draft night.  Things they report as "news" - Colin Cowherd recommending how the Packers should handle this, random NFL Network personalities coming up with projected trades, and Daniel Jeremiah tweeting what he thinks about the situation (inviting Jeremiah on the show to discuss).  This is all analyzed and discussed as if something has happened, yet nothing has happened.  I hope Rodgers doesn't go to the Broncos just to see the fans' fantasy get crushed haha.

And no, Mark Schlereth has not apologized for his ridiculous "imminent trade" comment on draft night.  And the other hosts won't even bring it up.  Probably in their contracts to not hurt Mark's feelings.

Problem with a new contract - the old one still has $38m of dead money.  To make him the highest paid QB in the NFL, it'd be something like 4 years for $162m (slightly higher than Dak's $160m deal).  But with $38m of cash paid on the old deal that hasn't hit the cap yet, it's really a 4 year $200m contract (at least from the cap's perspective).  That's pretty tough and with Rodgers coming to the end, there are only so many years you can kick the can down the road.  Cap hit comes due eventually. 

So, I'm guessing the new deal may have been offered but likely wasn't enough for Rodgers because of the cap restraints of that $38m still on the books.  Only way to make it work would be to add a bunch of dummy years but that doesn't seem like something Gute and Ball would do. 

Packers best bet is to make the 2021, 2022 and 2023 salaries guaranteed.  That should give Rodgers the clarity he wants - he'll be the Packers QB til he's 40.  If Rodgers just wants more money though, then I don't see it happening.  But I don't think it's about the money, I think it's getting clarity on his future and the lack of communication from the front office. 

Dunn is a numbskull douchebag blood sucking agent.  If Rodgers is as smart as he says he is then dump his sorry ass.  You are paying this guy what 5%?  It’s like real estate agents.  What the fuck do they do but demand 6%?

Rodgers can advise with a real attorney and keep 99% of his money.  Sports agents are a fucking joke unless you are a fringe player that requires their “services” because you can’t market or sell yourself.

These decent players don’t need agents to represent themselves.  Throwing a lot of money down the drain if you ask me.

Former #Packers HC Mike Sherman on the @nflnetwork on a potential QB battle between Rodgers and Love:

"I don't think Aaron is afraid of the competition. I don't think there will be much competition for quite some time until Aaron decides there will be competition."

— Daniel Plocher (@DanPlocher) May 11, 2021

Former #Packers Head Coach Mike Sherman on why Aaron Rodgers hasn't talked yet: "I don't think he wants to say anything that he would have to take back."

via the @nflnetwork

— Daniel Plocher (@DanPlocher) May 11, 2021

He continued: "He's not up against the wall. He still has plenty of time left to decide what he wants to do and the #packers are certainly going to stand pat and hold him to his contract, coming back to Green Bay."

— Daniel Plocher (@DanPlocher) May 11, 2021

🤔 https://t.co/oUptE7IFqe

— Ryan Horvat (@RyanHorvat) May 11, 2021

Read this in your David Letterman voice:

Top 10 Reasons To Trade 12

1) Rodgers no longer wants to play for the Packers

While Rodgers doesn’t have the cojones to say these words himself, he’s gotten the message out loud and clear through his friends around the NFL and in the national media. And give him credit; he’s been able to make himself look like the wronged party – which isn’t an easy thing to do when you’re one of the highest-paid players in the league.

2) These aren’t the Green Bay Rodgers

It’s embarrassing to watch Gutekunst and coach Matt LaFleur grovel. Meanwhile, Rodgers has to be loving it. Seinfeld‘s George Costanza once talked about the importance of having “hand” in a relationship. Well, Rodgers has plenty of hand now, and if he comes back, you can be sure he’ll use it to bitch-slap the franchise for the next few years.

3) Rodgers turns 38 in December

Watching Tom Brady win Super Bowls in his 40s makes it easy to forget that he’s the anomaly when it comes to aging quarterbacks. Most – think John Elway, Peyton Manning, and Drew Brees – are either retired or running on fumes by the time they approach the Big 4-0. And the end usually happens quickly. So while Rodgers was named MVP last season, that doesn’t mean he’ll keep playing at the same level next season – let alone three years from now.

4) Rodgers’ value will never be higher

No reigning MVP has ever been traded, so you can be sure more than a few teams will be extremely interested should Rodgers be made available. It’s not hard to imagine Gutekunst getting four high picks and a quality young player in return. That would be quite the haul for a QB who turns 38 this season and who doesn’t want to play for the Packers.

5) Jordan Love was drafted for a reason

Gutekunst isn’t dumb, so he had to know exactly what his actions on that April night in 2020 would mean. He obviously thinks highly of Love, so he should let the youngster take his lumps in 2021 – much like Rodgers did in 2008 – and then trust that his instincts developed under the great Ron Wolf and honed over 20 years of scouting were right.

6) Love is a very talented player

There’s no way of knowing what kind of quarterback the former Utah State star will be, but it’s not like the Packers would have to replace Rodgers with Seneca Wallace, Graham Harrell, or Scott Tolzien. Love has the skill set to be a very good QB in the NFL. As good as Rodgers? Probably not, but he doesn’t have to be. If Gutekunst uses all those extra draft picks wisely, the Packers could surround Love with one of the most talented rosters in the league.

7) This offense doesn’t need a great QB

LaFleur learned offense under Kyle Shanahan and Sean McVay, and he watched both of his buddies have great success with less than stellar play at quarterback. There’s no reason why Love can’t be at least as good as Jimmy Garoppolo (49ers) and Jared Goff (ex-Rams); In fact, he should be better. The Packers would surround him with a solid offensive line, a first-team All-Pro wide receiver, multiple talented young tight ends, and a Pro Bowl running back.

8) Rodgers counts for 20% of the cap

Trading Rodgers would go a long way in fixing what has become an ugly situation with the salary cap. Not only would it clear $15 million after June 1, but it would give the Packers some much-needed breathing room next offseason. Plus, if a trade happened to bring back a quality young wide receiver like the Broncos’ Jerry Jeudy, Gutekunst wouldn’t have to spend between $18M and $22M a year to keep Davante Adams, who turns 30 in 2022.

9) The Packers already blew their best chance

Aside from the injury to star tackle David Bakhtiari, everything went right for the Packers last season, and they still couldn’t get to the Super Bowl. They had a bye. They had home field throughout the playoffs. They didn’t have to deal with the 49ers. They intercepted Brady three times in the second half of the NFCC. And they still couldn’t get it done.

10) The Packers haven’t played in a Super Bowl since 2010

In all likelihood, Rodgers will be better than Love next season, the season after that, and the season after that. Heck, he might be better five years from now. But Love doesn’t need to be as good as Rodgers. He just needs to be good enough. The Packers have gone an entire decade without playing in a Super Bowl, and Rodgers was superb in most of those seasons. Maybe a lesser quarterback supported by a stronger 53-man roster is the way to go. And building a stronger 53-man roster should be a lot easier with all the additional high draft picks acquired in a trade.

Top 10 Reasons To Trade 12 – PACKERS NOTES

Of the 10, #4 is probably the best point if you make the move.

@H5 posted:

I don't think this is new. McGinn (The Atlantic) reported on 5/6 that there was a massive offer, bigger than Mahomes $$. Problem is, no one knows if or when there was actually an offer, or if there was are they still negotiating or did AR decline.

Nothing has changed since Jan 25th.

I keep seeing this recycled article by McGinn.  There hasn't been shit, these clowns trying to make a name for themselves just keep spewing the same garbage.

Really looking forward to Lindy Infante’s thoughts on this.

Lindy's ghost don't care.

@packerboi posted:6

Read this in your David Letterman voice:

Top 10 Reasons To Trade 12

1) Rodgers no longer wants to play for the Packers

While Rodgers doesn’t have the cojones to say these words himself, he’s gotten the message out loud and clear through his friends around the NFL and in the national media. And give him credit; he’s been able to make himself look like the wronged party – which isn’t an easy thing to do when you’re one of the highest-paid players in the league.

2) These aren’t the Green Bay Rodgers

It’s embarrassing to watch Gutekunst and coach Matt LaFleur grovel. Meanwhile, Rodgers has to be loving it. Seinfeld‘s George Costanza once talked about the importance of having “hand” in a relationship. Well, Rodgers has plenty of hand now, and if he comes back, you can be sure he’ll use it to bitch-slap the franchise for the next few years.

3) Rodgers turns 38 in December

Watching Tom Brady win Super Bowls in his 40s makes it easy to forget that he’s the anomaly when it comes to aging quarterbacks. Most – think John Elway, Peyton Manning, and Drew Brees – are either retired or running on fumes by the time they approach the Big 4-0. And the end usually happens quickly. So while Rodgers was named MVP last season, that doesn’t mean he’ll keep playing at the same level next season – let alone three years from now.

4) Rodgers’ value will never be higher

No reigning MVP has ever been traded, so you can be sure more than a few teams will be extremely interested should Rodgers be made available. It’s not hard to imagine Gutekunst getting four high picks and a quality young player in return. That would be quite the haul for a QB who turns 38 this season and who doesn’t want to play for the Packers.

5) Jordan Love was drafted for a reason

Gutekunst isn’t dumb, so he had to know exactly what his actions on that April night in 2020 would mean. He obviously thinks highly of Love, so he should let the youngster take his lumps in 2021 – much like Rodgers did in 2008 – and then trust that his instincts developed under the great Ron Wolf and honed over 20 years of scouting were right.

6) Love is a very talented player

There’s no way of knowing what kind of quarterback the former Utah State star will be, but it’s not like the Packers would have to replace Rodgers with Seneca Wallace, Graham Harrell, or Scott Tolzien. Love has the skill set to be a very good QB in the NFL. As good as Rodgers? Probably not, but he doesn’t have to be. If Gutekunst uses all those extra draft picks wisely, the Packers could surround Love with one of the most talented rosters in the league.

7) This offense doesn’t need a great QB

LaFleur learned offense under Kyle Shanahan and Sean McVay, and he watched both of his buddies have great success with less than stellar play at quarterback. There’s no reason why Love can’t be at least as good as Jimmy Garoppolo (49ers) and Jared Goff (ex-Rams); In fact, he should be better. The Packers would surround him with a solid offensive line, a first-team All-Pro wide receiver, multiple talented young tight ends, and a Pro Bowl running back.

8) Rodgers counts for 20% of the cap

Trading Rodgers would go a long way in fixing what has become an ugly situation with the salary cap. Not only would it clear $15 million after June 1, but it would give the Packers some much-needed breathing room next offseason. Plus, if a trade happened to bring back a quality young wide receiver like the Broncos’ Jerry Jeudy, Gutekunst wouldn’t have to spend between $18M and $22M a year to keep Davante Adams, who turns 30 in 2022.

9) The Packers already blew their best chance

Aside from the injury to star tackle David Bakhtiari, everything went right for the Packers last season, and they still couldn’t get to the Super Bowl. They had a bye. They had home field throughout the playoffs. They didn’t have to deal with the 49ers. They intercepted Brady three times in the second half of the NFCC. And they still couldn’t get it done.

10) The Packers haven’t played in a Super Bowl since 2010

In all likelihood, Rodgers will be better than Love next season, the season after that, and the season after that. Heck, he might be better five years from now. But Love doesn’t need to be as good as Rodgers. He just needs to be good enough. The Packers have gone an entire decade without playing in a Super Bowl, and Rodgers was superb in most of those seasons. Maybe a lesser quarterback supported by a stronger 53-man roster is the way to go. And building a stronger 53-man roster should be a lot easier with all the additional high draft picks acquired in a trade.

Top 10 Reasons To Trade 12 – PACKERS NOTES

Of the 10, #4 is probably the best point if you make the move.

And #7 is the absolute fucking dumbest, with #10 not very bright either. QBs get paid and the next contract is bigger regardless of whether the QB is actually better. That’s QB contracts in the NFL.

@packerboi posted:

Read this in your David Letterman voice:

Top 10 Reasons To Trade 12

8) Rodgers counts for 20% of the cap

Trading Rodgers would go a long way in fixing what has become an ugly situation with the salary cap. Not only would it clear $15 million after June 1, but it would give the Packers some much-needed breathing room next offseason. Plus, if a trade happened to bring back a quality young wide receiver like the Broncos’ Jerry Jeudy, Gutekunst wouldn’t have to spend between $18M and $22M a year to keep Davante Adams, who turns 30 in 2022.

Of the 10, #4 is probably the best point if you make the move.

On first glance, totally agree with your assessment of @#4 as his value will never be higher so if you are planning a future without him do it now vs later.

I think #8 is actually pretty accurate and closer to the real answer though. Soon as Love was drafted it pointed to AR being gone in 2022 (at latest it now appears). If you do get rid of him, I can't see any way that Adams would want to reup or the FO would want to throw the $$ required at him. I'd be shocked if the Smith Brothers or Amos play here beyond 2021 and if so, you've moved on from 4 of the top 7 cap hits in 2022.

And then you are really on to the next generation roster. And, the philosophy becomes - you aren't building around a QB as much as you're trying to build a balanced team across the board. Start with a very solid OL. A decent enough QB that moves the chains. A stable of 2-3 RBs that are good and easily replaceable in future drafts. A group of #2/3 guys at WRs without having to overpay for a diva #1. TEs that have one receiver, one blocker, etc. And a defense led by a top notch group of DBs.

And I think a lot of that concept is tied to Jaire Alexander and Elgton Jenkins, both of which will need new deals. Will be far easier to absorb those deals if AR isn't at $35M and Adams at $20M.

I get the concept in the abstract. Instead of a team that is built around an A+ at QB with a B here and some Cs/Ds elsewhere; try to get a team that has B type grades at every position group.

I personally think this roster is miles away from a B grade at either DL or LB, but if you can shore those spots up via an AR trade, FA, or draft; Love just needs to be "fine" and anything above that is gravy.

That’s why the Broncos as a trade destination can make a lot of sense.  They have some young, decent players at position of need for GB, and some of them are still on rookie deals for the next 2-3 years.  Namely guys like Surtain, Jeudy, Fant, and Hamler, and Dre mont Jones.   Surtain would be longer.

To me, the players are more important than picks at this point.  I’d rather have a Jeudy or Fant than a first round pick.

If Rodgers goes I would actually consider moving Adams as well.   If he’s not interested in extending then you need to get as much as you can for him in his final year.  

@Timpranillo posted:

On first glance, totally agree with your assessment of @#4 as his value will never be higher so if you are planning a future without him do it now vs later.

I think #8 is actually pretty accurate and closer to the real answer though. Soon as Love was drafted it pointed to AR being gone in 2022 (at latest it now appears). If you do get rid of him, I can't see any way that Adams would want to reup or the FO would want to throw the $$ required at him. I'd be shocked if the Smith Brothers or Amos play here beyond 2021 and if so, you've moved on from 4 of the top 7 cap hits in 2022.

And then you are really on to the next generation roster. And, the philosophy becomes - you aren't building around a QB as much as you're trying to build a balanced team across the board. Start with a very solid OL. A decent enough QB that moves the chains. A stable of 2-3 RBs that are good and easily replaceable in future drafts. A group of #2/3 guys at WRs without having to overpay for a diva #1. TEs that have one receiver, one blocker, etc. And a defense led by a top notch group of DBs.

And I think a lot of that concept is tied to Jaire Alexander and Elgton Jenkins, both of which will need new deals. Will be far easier to absorb those deals if AR isn't at $35M and Adams at $20M.

I get the concept in the abstract. Instead of a team that is built around an A+ at QB with a B here and some Cs/Ds elsewhere; try to get a team that has B type grades at every position group.

I personally think this roster is miles away from a B grade at either DL or LB, but if you can shore those spots up via an AR trade, FA, or draft; Love just needs to be "fine" and anything above that is gravy.

Good points here.

Regarding, Adams, as great as he is,  I really get the feeling that Gute and MLF feel like they don't need a superstar WR either to make this offense run. And when you look at the success of these other Shanahan style offenses, there are far more "JAG's" making their offense work vs say KC or Dallas, which is loaded with big name offensive players

Cam Akers, Cooper Kupp, Josh Reynolds, Jeff Wilson, Brandon Aiyuk are the team leaders at WR and RB for the Rams and Whiners. Hardly household names outside of George Kittle at TE. Good players, yes. But not in the Julio Jones, Hopkins, and Adams categories nor are they at that level in terms of money either (where Adams will certainly be).

And look at the numbers dudes like Robert Tonyan and even MVS put up under MLF. Same with Lazard who I think has a much bigger season if he doesn't end up with a core injury.  Williams and Jones were pretty damn good as pass catching WR's.

Now throw in Amari Rodgers and Josiah Deguara  in 2021.

If GB moves on from 12 and 17, I think those dollars are going to the defensive side. The other thing these Shanahan teams have in common are powerhouse defenses.

I truly believe MLF wants a top 5 defense at minimum. That also takes a hell of a lot of pressure off your QB, including Love. Gobs of money  not spent at QB and WR goes a long way to making that happen   

How many Super Bowls have the Rams and 9ers won recently? 

If you're going to have a average to slightly above average QB a top 5 defense is a necessity and you're going to have hope you get a lot of productive skill guys on rookie contracts. 

For all of the complaining about Rodgers contract how much does he cover up for on defense and at skill positions?  Say you go in on FA's for defense with Love being a glorified game manager.  What percentage of the cap goes to guys that you need to have a great defense?  How much goes to skill guys that you need to create YAC if your QB is Alex Smith?  You're throwing in a huge chunk on defense and oline, which I think is mandatory, and likely getting the same results; bounced out of the playoffs. 

A "B" grade team across the board is a wild card team at best.

Trade Rodgers and Adams to the Broncos for 2 firsts, 2 seconds, 1 third, Jeudy, Surtain, Jones, and Bridgwater.  2021 is a transition year with Bridgwater as starter and Love learning, then the team is Love's in 2022.  Then back to back Super Bowls in 2023 and 2024 . 

You really have to ask yourself if it's possible to win a Super Bowl with your QB and WR combining for over 25% of your cap.  A Super Bowl winning QB has never had a cap hit over 13%.  Rodgers is 20%.  You can't ignore that.

Can they throw in Trevor Story and the Joker?

now we got 17 going in a trade, what has the world become.

@pkr_north posted:

now we got 17 going in a trade, what has the world become.

If we throw in Jaire Alexander, Aaron Jones, and Bakhtiari for even more future picks we can become the Oklahoma City Thunder of the NFL.

Well, if the FO hadn’t fucked up the 2015-2017 drafts as bad as they did it’s possible that they could still survive paying Rodgers and Adams huge money.

I realize it’s water under the bridge, but the team that passed on TJW had to overcompensate by spending 100MM+ on the Smiths and had to burn a top 15 pick on another pass rusher.  The guy was sitting right there in 2017.   They also burned up a crapload of money and draft capital at safety with Amos and Savage because their DB picks during 15-17 were awful.

Gute has been playing catch up with the roster ever since.

With the roster as assembled and Bridgewater and Jeudy instead of Rodgers and Adams this is probably an 8 or 9 win team.  A fringe playoff team.   Obviously the future draft picks would help, but any way you slice it 2021 will be ugly if Rodgers and Adams are dealt.

Not to say if Denver gives us a couple of more players and a couple of draft picks they can’t be competitive in the future but Rodgers and Adams in place the next 3 years is still the best case scenario.

Considering how much Rodgers is in decline I think some posters are fooling themselves as to how much Rodgers will fetch.

@Tschmack posted:

With the roster as assembled and Bridgewater and Jeudy instead of Rodgers and Adams this is probably an 8 or 9 win team.  A fringe playoff team.   Obviously the future draft picks would help, but any way you slice it 2021 will be ugly if Rodgers and Adams are dealt.

Not to say if Denver gives us a couple of more players and a couple of draft picks they can’t be competitive in the future but Rodgers and Adams in place the next 3 years is still the best case scenario.

I would say more like a 5 or 6 win team. Adams makes any QB better, but he'd be especially important for a guy with marginal arm strength like Bridgewater. Adams was the only guy other than MVS that could get separation and MVS would be wasted with a guy like Bridgewater that can't throw deep well.

As of right now there is almost as  much difference between D. Adams and Jeudy as there is between Rodgers and Bridgewater. D. Adams still put up good numbers with Brett Hundley.  Trading from HOF level talent at QB and WR to a journeyman QB and a WR who might eventually be good is never going to be a good move. But it would save us a bunch of future cap space that we could use to try to eventually find a really good QB and WR.

I’m basing more of my opinion (on Adams) because of Rodgers situation.

If Rodgers doesn’t return I think is 80/20 that Adams won’t sign an extension with the Packers.   The question would be what would a team give up for potentially a one year rental?   I don’t know.  Probably less than we think.

They would be a better team in 2021 with Adams no matter what.  But let’s say a team offered a 1st rounder for Adams?  Or a decent LB or DE?  I think you’d have to consider it.   I don’t know that it would make sense to sign a 30 year old WR to a massive extension if Rodgers isn’t the QB.  Not because Adams isn’t decent, but they could use that money to round out other positions.

@Henry posted:

How many Super Bowls have the Rams and 9ers won recently?

If you're going to have a average to slightly above average QB a top 5 defense is a necessity and you're going to have hope you get a lot of productive skill guys on rookie contracts.

For all of the complaining about Rodgers contract how much does he cover up for on defense and at skill positions?  Say you go in on FA's for defense with Love being a glorified game manager.  What percentage of the cap goes to guys that you need to have a great defense?  How much goes to skill guys that you need to create YAC if your QB is Alex Smith?  You're throwing in a huge chunk on defense and oline, which I think is mandatory, and likely getting the same results; bounced out of the playoffs.

A "B" grade team across the board is a wild card team at best.

I agree, and I think people are going to be in for a rude awakening how many worts a generational QB covers up on any roster.

@CUPackFan posted:

You really have to ask yourself if it's possible to win a Super Bowl with your QB and WR combining for over 25% of your cap.  A Super Bowl winning QB has never had a cap hit over 13%.  Rodgers is 20%.  You can't ignore that.

The thing I can't figure out is why any QB is kept past his rookie contract.  If you can't win with a QB and now a WR taking up so much cap it sure seems like futility to pay that money in the first place. 

Wouldn't it be better just to keep drafting QBs continually and turn the team over every 5 years?

Rodgers wants to play into his 40s, and could very likely follow Breese and Brady and play at a high level until he's 42-43. That gives him 5-6 more seasons right now.

At the time Love was drafted it was 6-7 more seasons. Yet BG and MM traded up for the interception leading quarterback in the nobody cares conference who never suited up during the regular season despite the fact he would have gotten live snaps in a few games.

Apparently they didn't want 12 for 6-7 more seasons, yet also don't want Love. Smart.

Rogers deserves a team that wants him and his MVP status long term.