Well, that did not work out. So if we cannot trade for a great defensive player, why not trade for a great offensive player ?
Johnson anyone? https://profootballtalk.nbcspo...e-the-season-starts/
Henry posted:GreenNgoldBlood posted:michiganjoe posted:Price reportedly was two firsts and a player.
Which means Gutey dropped the ball on this one..they weren't willing to give up two LOW #1's and say Nick Perry?? Not sure what Gutey was thinking here...I think in this instance too much Ted rubbed off on him. Bet #12 isn't happy either...days after signing his deal and mentioning putting his faith in the organization to make the right moves to keep the winning culture they are accustomed to...aaaand they just punt on Kalil Mack. Not a good look Gutey.
I am shocked you of all people were the first one to board the piss and moan train.
And who says they would've taken Perry with his injury history.
Why, he did. He knows because he wished it. Duh!
David Johnson for Ty Montgomery?
If Mack had actually been available in a trade these past few weeks he would not be a Raider this morning. But he is.
Mack is going to sign a $22.5 million per deal with Reggie any day now.
Maybe Reggie wanted someone else to define the parameters of the deal?
Doubt it, sounds like he'll be a Bear.
The Bears have always been one of those teams that try to make splashes in free agency and have failed miserably, now they’ve given up at least 2 first round picks and no fewer than one current player. The cap hit is gonna be huge in the not so distant future and have yet to find a franchise qb. This move could paralyze their future just as the John Hadl trade did to ours in the 70’s plus i think of the fleecing the Queens took from dallas. This was a great non move by Gute. Thanks Gute!! Thanks for not mortgaging out future!!!
if the Bears actually offered two 1st round picks AND a player then Reggie did his job well. That’s Herschel Walker territory. Maybe not next door but it’s in the same neighborhood.
I was wondering how much of an impact they would attribute to Mack.
Even if he elevated Chicago from a 7-9 team to 9-7, the Bears are still the third best team in the division and on the outside looking in on the playoffs.
This only makes sense if they feel that Mitch Trubisky is about to emerge as an elite NFL QB and Mack is the missing piece for a SB run in the next two or three seasons.
I don’t necessarily agree with that TOOO. Anytime a team can add one of, if not the best, player on defense you have to do what you can to get it done. Chicago apparently has the compensation to do it and the cap space to pay the guy. Makes sense to me.
Is Trubisky able to shoulder the weight put on his plate? Mack entirely and absolutely removes Trubisky’s safety net. If Mitch fails. They are ****ed. For a long, long time
Trade official, source tells ESPN:
— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) September 1, 2018
Bears get: Khalil Mack, a 2020 second-round round pick and a conditional 2020 fifth-round pick.
Raiders get: 2019 first-round pick, 2020 first-round pick, 2020 third-round pick, 2019 sixth-round pick.
So Bears get back second-round pick, too
ChilliJon posted:Is Trubisky able to shoulder the weight put on his plate? Mack entirely and absolutely removes Trubisky’s safety net. If Mitch fails. They are ****ed. For a long, long time
A good defense takes a ton of pressure off a QB. It is scary to think how good Rodgers would be if he didn't feel he needed to score every possession to win.
This reminds me of when the Bears signed Peppers. They are going to have a pretty good defense this year and some WRs to throw to so I don't think they are limited to a 7-9 or 9-7 season. NFL seasons always have twists and turns.
As much as I would have loved to see him in Green and Gold, Mack going to the Pack did not make total sense based on the cost. As much as Perry and Mathews have been underproductive, with the horrible secondary they were playing in front of, I think an improvement there and adding big Mo in front AND a decent DC will provide the atmosphere for them both to have better years IF healthy.
I am happy to go to war with the starting 22, I am scared as hell when the injury bug starts.
Im concerned with the thought of Bulaga handling Mack twice a year.
I’m in love with the thought of Minny and Detroit handling him twice. Bulaga is the best RT in the conference.
Lewis at TE helps quite a bit with a guy like Mack roaming around in the division.
michiganjoe posted:Trade official, source tells ESPN:
— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) September 1, 2018
Bears get: Khalil Mack, a 2020 second-round round pick and a conditional 2020 fifth-round pick.
Raiders get: 2019 first-round pick, 2020 first-round pick, 2020 third-round pick, 2019 sixth-round pick.
So Bears get back second-round pick, too
Very disappointed Gutey couldn't have/didn't top this...that really is not THAT much all things considered, especially since the Bears got a 2nd back
Not that much????? Gute should have topped this? Grab a little perspective and calm down.
You are forgetting the $23 million cap hit Chicago is on the hook for after giving away two draft years.
If Trubisky turns out to be decent you just ****ed his full potential.
This isn’t fantasy football.
ChilliJon posted:Not that much????? Gute should have topped this? Grab a little perspective and calm down.
You are forgetting the $23 million cap hit Chicago is on the hook for after giving away two draft years.
If Trubisky turns out to be decent you just ****ed his full potential.
This isn’t fantasy football.
You are like one of those Brewer fans that HATES every trade Stearns makes, because they are so in love with all prospects, they act like they are their own kids. The bottom line is, the window for Arodg is closing..he's 34 years old..they should be in win now mode...and they would have likely given up two LOW 1st round picks..I will ALWAYS take the proven talent over unknowns any day. Anyone that doesn't think the Bears got better today is sadly mistaken. You couldn't be more wrong. if you don't think K mack wouldn't nake the Packers better right now, you are also sadly mistaken.
This type of trade actually makes more sense for the Packers or another team that can realistically compete for a championship now than it does for the Bears. The Bears are probably at least 2-3 years away if everything goes right - meaning Trubisky turns out to be a Pro Bowl level talent. If Trubisky turns out to be even just average, this trade is a waste for the Bears.
The Bears have now given up 3rd and 4th round picks in the 2017 draft and a third in the 2018 draft to move up ONE spot for Trubisky and traded two future firsts, a future third round, and a future sixth round for Mack and a second rounder. That means (counting the selection of Trubisky himself) they have invested three 1st round picks, three 3rd round picks, one 4th, and one 6th round pick for Mack, Trebisky, and a second rounder. And they are paying what will likely approach 100 million guaranteed for Mack.
I see some people comparing this to getting Reggie White. Mack is obviously good, but I don't see him as a Reggie White, Lawrence Taylor, once in a generation type talent. The other thing is the Packers gave up nothing in terms of draft picks or players to sign White.
Players traded for two first-round picks since '86: Jay Cutler, Ricky Williams, Keyshawn Johnson, Joey Galloway, Jeff George, Herschel Walker, Fredd Young, Eric Dickerson and Jim Everett, per @ESPNStatsInfo.
I just hope our O line is up to Mack’s rushes......gulp, am hoping two games out of the year the Packer O line is up to the task.
GreenNgoldBlood posted:ChilliJon posted:Not that much????? Gute should have topped this? Grab a little perspective and calm down.
You are forgetting the $23 million cap hit Chicago is on the hook for after giving away two draft years.
If Trubisky turns out to be decent you just ****ed his full potential.
This isn’t fantasy football.
You are like one of those Brewer fans that HATES every trade Stearns makes, because they are so in love with all prospects, they act like they are their own kids. The bottom line is, the window for Arodg is closing..he's 34 years old..they should be in win now mode...and they would have likely given up two LOW 1st round picks..I will ALWAYS take the proven talent over unknowns any day. Anyone that doesn't think the Bears got better today is sadly mistaken. You couldn't be more wrong. if you don't think K mack wouldn't nake the Packers better right now, you are also sadly mistaken.
The baseball prospect reference is completely unrelated to this discussion. So. Whatever.
Rodgers window isn’t closing. His patience might be. But his window is floor to ceiling and wide open with an ocean breeze of opportunity.
The Bears absolutely got better today with Mack. Are they a good team though? Are they better in 2019? 2020?
Trubisky better be really good though. Really good. If he isn’t then Chicago is ****ed for years. I’m sure he didn’t want the s**t that got placed on his lap today. It’s his job to justify Mack’s signing.
I’d never give up what Chicago did for Mack. Mack would have been a great piece for a 1 and 6. But he’s not the missing piece in GB.
OL is the only thing keeping GB from running off a few Lombardi’s.
It’s very possible Chicago is a 5-6 win team this year even with Mack. That means the 1st rounder might be 8-12 range. Best case scenario the Bores win 7-8 games but it’s still a decent 1st rounder. And they get a #1 the following year - again likely a top 15 pick. Sure they trade a 3rd rounder for a 2nd rounder but IMO they cancel out given where both teams will likely draft.
Then there’s the huge cap hit and as it’s been stated already they have to believe that Trubisky is the next Wentz otherwise why make that deal??
I would have been OK with GB dealing two 1s for Mack because those 1s are likely in the 25-30 range. Not close to the Bears. Not to mention Rodgers ain’t Trubisky.
Oakland got over big time on this trade.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/...mack-oakland-raiders
The Chicago Bears reached a record-setting six-year, $141 million extension with Khalil Mack on Saturday, a source told ESPN's Adam Schefter, after acquiring the pass-rusher from the Oakland Raiders earlier in the day.
Mack becomes the highest-paid defensive player in NFL history. The deal, which averages $23.5 million per season, includes $90 million in guaranteed money and $60 million at signing, a source told ESPN.
The Bears gave up first-round picks in 2019 and 2020, a third-round pick in 2020 and a sixth-round pick in 2019 to acquire Mack earlier Saturday, a source told ESPN. In return, the Bears also received s a second-round pick in 2020 and a conditional fifth-round pick in 2020.
MichiganPacker2 posted:Players traded for two first-round picks since '86: Jay Cutler, Ricky Williams, Keyshawn Johnson, Joey Galloway, Jeff George, Herschel Walker, Fredd Young, Eric Dickerson and Jim Everett, per @ESPNStatsInfo.
Lots of marginal (at best) players and busts on that list.
Herschel is the most obvious exception, followed by Dickerson, and maybe Everett.
Who the hell is Fredd Young?
GreenNgoldBlood posted:You are like one of those Brewer fans that HATES every trade Stearns makes, because they are so in love with all prospects, they act like they are their own kids. The bottom line is, the window for Arodg is closing..he's 34 years old..they should be in win now mode...and they would have likely given up two LOW 1st round picks..I will ALWAYS take the proven talent over unknowns any day. Anyone that doesn't think the Bears got better today is sadly mistaken. You couldn't be more wrong. if you don't think K mack wouldn't nake the Packers better right now, you are also sadly mistaken.
From Dougherty's article:
But it’s not clear exactly what the Green Bay Packers general manager offered for the Oakland Raiders’ All-Pro outside linebacker. One NFL source, whose team was in on the Mack sweepstakes, heard it was two first-rounders, but another source said it was only one first-rounder and other unidentified picks.
Yeah, you ****ing know what was offered when you've got two sources from other bidding teams that don't know. And yet it's pretty clear GoFukYerselfGreen"n"goldIdiot went after it hard.
The guy just took control and you're in full simp mode. Throw yourself under the piss and moan train.
Tschmack posted:Oakland got over big time on this trade.
Which is exactly why the Raiders did the deal with the Bears instead of the Packers.
I'm fairly certain GutenFree didn't bust his ass draft day to acquire an extra first rounder just to hand them both over to the Raiders.
Bears are going for it. Good luck against Rodgers & Jimmy Graham. Can't wait to see Travathan try & cover him. LOL
Just because Chicago got better doesn’t mean GB got worse. As good as Mack is, he’s not Reggie White, we didn’t miss out on a once-a-generation type player.
I haven't seen on single play by Crawford but I'm looking forward to him passing Fackerell on the depth chart.
"There’s times when Mike and I were together, we literally had no NFL corners, and yet we found a way to make it work."
I think Chicago got the best of it, but it will take 5 or 6 years to know for sure. IMO there are a lot more first round risks than there are Macks.
Reggie McKenzie said "more than half the league" inquired to trade DE Khalil Mack. Club narrowed suitors to teams who Raiders believed had chance to present high first-round pick in 2019.
— Michael Gehlken (@GehlkenNFL) September 2, 2018
High first rounder appears to have been a priority and GB really couldn't offer it.
So the Raiders had to decide which team would receive the least immediate benefit from Mack.
Brak posted:I think Chicago got the best of it, but it will take 5 or 6 years to know for sure. IMO there are a lot more first round risks than there are Macks.
Chicago only got the better of this if Trubisky turns out to be at least a Pro Bowl QB. Even if Mack is as good as JJ Watt, unless you have a QB you can win with, it won't matter in terms of Super Bowl contention.
I'm saying that the trade in a vacuum is clearly better for Chicago right now. It's unlikely that the Raiders will get another player of Mack's talent with either of the first round picks they got. I don't think the QB situation has anything to do with the value of the trade. They've got 6 years to figure out if Trubisky is the guy or not.
Madden 19 told Chicago to keep digging.
Think this settles the debate.
Reggie White was a transformational, generational player. No matter where he played, he was unstoppable. He made some average players in GB around him better...Pro Bowl better. Sean Jones, Gilbert Brown, Santana Dotson...all benefitted from having #92 reigning Hell down on every snap. He was the best at EVERY facet of DL...he could pass rush, run stop...hell, he could have probably even dropped into coverage.
Khalil Mack, while a very fine player, isn't even in the same conversation as #92. But Chicago just paid for him like he was the second-coming.
To this day, I still haven't seen a physical freak come along like Reggie White. I suspect that some guys that could have been probably are playing basketball instead of football. Just the pure strength that White had to take a 300 lb. offensive lineman and throw him around like a toy is just something that I haven't seen duplicated since he was in the league.
