@Goalline posted:Shit, he is far from perfect.
Ha ha, got that right. ♥️ 💚 💛
Expectations might be a little high. Rodgers took a 12-4 team seeded #1 in the playoffs and went 6-10. He had a great cast of skill position players, all who starting on this team. I'm not blaming Rodgers for that so I'm definitely not blaming Love for what is happening now. I really can't think of one player who has played up to expectations on offense unless it's been Musgrave.
The 2007 Packers were the #2 seed at 13-3. Giants did us a favor knocking out the #1 seed Cowboys (also 13-3) then doubled down on the Packers. 
We thought the Giants did us a favor by beating the Cowboys. LOL.
I read that Jordan Love has one of the lowest completion percentages in the league. His scouting reports said he struggled with accuracy and decision making, which we have clearly seen so far.
But I blame the receivers. Blind love for Love.
@PackerHawk posted:The 2007 Packers were the #2 seed at 13-3. Giants did us a favor knocking out the #1 seed Cowboys (also 13-3) then doubled down on the Packers.
What would it have mattered? You can't expect Favre not to Favre in OT of the NFCCG and you certainly couldn't expect him not to Favre in crunch time vs. an undefeated NEP in the SB.
@H5 posted:
The best stats are the cherry picked stats. My alma mater, UW-Milwaukee is undefeated in football since 1974. Fuck Alabama. 😀
From Lance Zuerlein
Daniel Jeremiah – NFL Network
Jeremiah was a fan of Love and ranked him 20th overall player in his initial top 50, one spot above Justin Herbert.
For NFL.com, he wrote: “Love has ideal size, arm strength and athletic ability. He operates in the gun and he's very fluid and smooth in his setup.
“He throws from a variety of platforms and arm angles. The ball jumps out of his hand. He is at his best on skinny post drive throws and over the top deep balls.
“His decision making was very concerning this season. He forces too many balls into crowds and he doesn't ever give up on a play -- to a fault. His supporting cast isn't very good, but he still fell into too many bad habits.
“He uses his athletic ability to escape and extend plays, but there are occasions when he fails to climb and reset his feet.
“Overall, Love is a raw prospect who will need some time to develop. There is risk with him, but the payoff could be huge.”
After the Packers selected Love, ‘DJ’ reiterated his concerns over Love’s 2019 season at Utah State, in which his play declined significantly, but doubled down on his potential upside.
On the 2020 NFL Draft ESPN/NFL Network simulcast, Jeremiah said: “When you talk about the decision-making being concerning, that is absolutely true, but when you go look at the video and study this kid, he’s got more talent than any other passer in this entire draft".
That draft included Joe Burrow, Tua Tagovailoa and Herbert.
Matt Miller – Bleacher Report (Now ESPN)
Miller echoed Jeremiah’s opinion on Love’s upside, but voiced strong concerns over his potential flaws.
“Love is a case study in traits vs. production. He has the traits scouts love (arm strength, mobility, big-play mentality), but he threw 17 interceptions in 2019. No matter which team drafts him, Love is a sit-and-develop type quarterback, not a rookie starter.
“He must work on cleaning up his decision-making while also growing into a professional quarterback after coming from a conference where his arm strength and athleticism were good enough to win.
“Love is a major boom-bust prospect who could end up being the best quarterback from the class or a journeyman backup.”
Attachments
@DH13 posted:What would it have mattered? You can't expect Favre not to Favre in OT of the NFCCG and you certainly couldn't expect him not to Favre in crunch time vs. an undefeated NEP in the SB.
Maybe Favre has something unfortunate happen in the two weeks (or one week) leading up to the Super Bowl and Rodgers gets his first start in the biggest game of them all. 
He CAN do it. (they were playing LSU)
Jordan Love on the run, dropping it in the breadbasket, against LSU #FlashbackFriday pic.twitter.com/7gPn5ayxu5
— IKE Packers Podcast (@IKE_Packers) October 20, 2023
Team retreat 2023 is underway! @packers | #MUBB pic.twitter.com/0jPsbl2gbn
— Marquette Basketball (@MarquetteMBB) October 19, 2023
Through five games, Love has completed only 6-of-24 passes thrown over 20 yards in the air, per PFF. His deep completion percentage is the fourth-worst among qualifying quarterbacks, while his 18 deep incompletions/interceptions are tied for the most. His 36.3 passer rating on throws over 20 yards is the worst in the NFL.
(Packer News 24/7). I guess he’s having growing pains eh?? Yikes.
Those numbers point directly at the offensive line play. It's all about the pressure he's been under.
Troy Aikman wasn't the most talented QB and in his first three seasons he was under an intense pass rush. His numbers showed it, 31 TDs and 46 INTs. But they built an OL around him and his numbers improved dramatically while he was in his prime as well as the team's W/L record. So this is why I put little stock in any of those types of numbers on plays that require more time to execute.
Our OL has been terrible and without improvement Love's numbers will continue to look bad.
@KurtBenkert:
I see a lot of Jordan Love bashing today, and it’s unwarranted. If the receiver fights back through contact on the last play and draws a PI (like any vet receiver would do) the packers would have had a chip shot field goal to win the game.
Instead, with the youngest roster in the NFL, that doesn’t happen. You have to remember, Jordan has been groomed for 4 years by a guy that did those exact things, the high level parts of the game consistently - with success. But he also had vet guys - his guys - ALL around him that played at an intellectually high level with him.
What your seeing this year is a first time starter, with years of experience learning the game and seeing it a certain way - having to play with players that aren’t at that level yet. And he’s keeping his cool while going through all of that.
Not to mention he’s playing in a scheme with very little answers right now and has his back against a wall most of the game from play 1. They could be making it easier in GB right now for him but haven’t.
I feel for Jordan because this situation isn’t one that many guys would have success in currently.
The conservative playcalling in the first half has led to a dead last 32nd rank in the NFL at 4.3 ppg in the first. Imagine playing every game from behind with the youngest roster in the NFL knowing it shouldn’t be happening that way.
I think that's a very fair assessment. I don't think Benkert is just another disgruntled ex-employee. His criticism of MLF is something more and more fans are agreeing with. The numbers don't lie but the lethargic beginnings of almost every game are what is most alarming.
@ilcuqui posted:@KurtBenkert:
I see a lot of Jordan Love bashing today, and it’s unwarranted. If the receiver fights back through contact on the last play and draws a PI (like any vet receiver would do) the packers would have had a chip shot field goal to win the game.
Instead, with the youngest roster in the NFL, that doesn’t happen. You have to remember, Jordan has been groomed for 4 years by a guy that did those exact things, the high level parts of the game consistently - with success. But he also had vet guys - his guys - ALL around him that played at an intellectually high level with him.
What your seeing this year is a first time starter, with years of experience learning the game and seeing it a certain way - having to play with players that aren’t at that level yet. And he’s keeping his cool while going through all of that.
Not to mention he’s playing in a scheme with very little answers right now and has his back against a wall most of the game from play 1. They could be making it easier in GB right now for him but haven’t.
I feel for Jordan because this situation isn’t one that many guys would have success in currently.
The conservative playcalling in the first half has led to a dead last 32nd rank in the NFL at 4.3 ppg in the first. Imagine playing every game from behind with the youngest roster in the NFL knowing it shouldn’t be happening that way.
Extend him now
@Pikes Peak posted:Extend him now
Love, MLF, or Benkert?
Ya gotta give the kid more time, he shows flashes at times at others he stinks.
How much time? Let’s say by week 12 he is consistently better and is really starting to look the part. Obviously he is our guy. If he looks more down than up by week 15 does the Penn Stater get a shot? He looked pretty good in August, maybe he can be the guy.
Right now and for the foreseeable future Love is our QB. In any case the GM and coaches need to be on top of the situation.
@ilcuqui posted:@KurtBenkert:
I see a lot of Jordan Love bashing today, and it’s unwarranted. If the receiver fights back through contact on the last play and draws a PI (like any vet receiver would do) the packers would have had a chip shot field goal to win the game…….
Not to pile on Love because it’s his first year as a starter, but he’s been consistently inaccurate all season and that’s on him. The first TD yesterday should have been intercepted. He threw behind Glass Watson which of course caused yet another injury. The last two games effectively ended on two bad throws. Yes, his WRs could have made adjustments, but when is Love going to start putting the ball where it needs to be? Are his WRs going to have to bail him out on every pass?
Is Love to blame?? Partially
Does Love need to improve? Absolutely
He certainly isn't receiving very much help and playing from behind in every single game isn't helping now is it??
This is 100% on MLF. PERIOD!!
Inaccuracy was reported all through training camp ....if fundamentals are not the problem, I don't know how much this can be "taught"?
It is too early to give up on Love, young team with injuries and a bad defense. But Love's "regression" is completely on the coaching staff. Love's draft profile listed some of his weakness as:
- Too much staring and telegraphing
- Six games with multiple interceptions, including three pick-sixes
- Below-average decision-making against zone looks
- Allowed coverage to swarm due to lack of anticipation
- Unusually spotty ball placement forced targets to work for catches
- Completed just 31.8 percent of his deep throws
- Needs to use eyes to hold safeties longer
We have seen everything in this list happen on multiple occasions. His throw are late and off target, even when he completes a pass, the receiver is bending or twisting to make the catch. He rarely hits the receiver in stride. I don't understand how you can have a young QB who is pegged to be your future and not having him better prepared after 3 years of "learning" the system.
Eddie, I agree with you on Love and that its way to early to hit the panic button on him. Yes he has been in the system for 3 years and has been practicing in it for all that time. But being 12s backup he only got the minority of snaps in practice because the starter always gets the bulk of the snaps. And he has only started I think 7 games in his career and got some action in a couple of others. Very few if any QBs in history have exploded immediately many need some time. Shoot guys like Peyton Manning, Aikman, and others had some bumpy starts to their careers.
What I think is hurting him is iffy OL play and not having weapons like Jones and Watson available. IMHO that is what affects him more than anything and they need to figure out the OL and how to keep Glass Joe Watson on the field.
@The Heckler posted:What I think is hurting him is iffy OL play and not having weapons like Jones and Watson available. IMHO that is what affects him more than anything and they need to figure out the OL and how to keep Glass Joe Watson on the field.
I agree with this but I'm not holding out hope for Watson being anything more than a #4 WR. He looks like a one trick pony and not the guy you want on the field when you're simply just trying to move the sticks. He does not appear to be very instinctive or a good route runner.
If you look at those pre draft profile issues, I mean, it’s still about 80% applicable now.
His deep throw accuracy is terrible, he doesn’t make quick reads and decisions, and the anticipation on throws is spotty at best.
How much of that is coaching related remains to be seen. I’d feel better if he was drafted a year ago but he’s actually gotten worse the more reps he takes. And let’s be clear - other than New Orleans they haven’t really played a good defense yet.
Much like Christian Watson, Gutey got enamored with the athleticism. Watson was a gadget guy at a small school. Dude isn’t a refined pass catcher and may never get there.
Not to be overlooked, if the defense had stopped the opponents on their last drive, the three close losses would be comeback wins for Love and give him 4 for the season. i realize a team has to et behind to achieve this but nonetheless they have been in a position to win.
The run defense wasn’t good yesterday. Love will take most of the heat.
It isn't that Love isn't bright enough, his wonderlick score was significantly higher than Hurts and Tua. I wonder if the Packers had him take this test
The way it looks right now, it's perfectly conceivable that Love learned more from Rodgers in three years than from the head coach. If that's the case, it shouldn't be surprising that he has struggled in the past month. He's not Rodgers, and chances are he never will be. One of his latest issues might stem directly from mediocre Rodgers a year ago, and that's the snap throws, specifically to the flat that are last second, almost an afterthought throw that catches targets off guard.
AR was terrible on those check downs the last two years, and Love seems to be adopting that bad habit this year. Outlet throws "should" be simpler, but when it's consistently off target, it leaves zero room for guys to make something happen beyond the 3-4 yard completion. This should be correctable, but if it wasn't addressed with Rodgers, can we trust MLF to correct it with a young qb?
What Rodgers had in his first four years was a head coach with an offensive philosophy. Technically three years, since Sherman was still there in 2005. MM knew what he wanted from players in his system. He established that with Favre, and it resulted in one of Brett's most efficient seasons even as he aged. It's well chronicled that AR sifted out the bad stuff Favre did from the good, but he did that after being given the foundation of the offense, and applied the good he learned to add to his game. It also quickly became clear that Rodgers was not going to be the turnover machine his "mentor" was his whole career.
I think qbs that end up being great most times make that jump internally. If you want to be great, you need to personally invest and put the time and effort into preparation. The freakish athletes maybe not as much, but they still have competitive drive.
But to get to that point where it becomes more up to the player than the coaching, it requires the basis of fundamental mastery and a clear understanding of what the goals are of the system. In the case of MLF, if he didn't need to do too much with a hof qb, it begs the question what he was doing with his coveted backup. Because now, not only are we seeing the flaws in Love's game that were predictable, but he's abandoning fundamentals that were present in his game previously in his limited time. Can anyone honestly say at this point that an Andy Reid or Shanahan would not be digging in and finding whatever way they could to help their young qb? All I've seen after six games is the same old stuff. It makes me wonder if La Fleur is the offensive mind he's been touted as.
Love had the benefit of learning the game (and politics) while sitting behind Rodgers.
But what he missed out on were reps, and he is essentially a first year player from that aspect.
He hasn't played particularly well, but, then again, who has?
It's hard to get better when he has to start dodging opposing DLs as soon as he gets the snap.
