I love the gauntlet drill and seeing guys with natural hands when running hard and staying tight. The four guys today that looked good early:
Jake Bobo, Tank Dell, Josh Downs, Demario Douglas
Late: Puka Nacua, Raashee Rice, Tyler Scott, Michael Tinsley
@Herschel posted:People like to point to Mamula, but the combine is still important in evaluation. The shorter interviews kind of suck, but the medicals are invaluable and the drills do provide a direct comparison of guys ranked similarly and can help confirm what teams already think or call attention to take a second look at a guy they maybe had kind of written off. It also lets teams see what the guy is like around a "new team" rather than the college teammates they were so familiar with.
The drills are more informative to "us" in most cases, of course, since we're not on campus practice visits and can only watch so much available video. The draftnik boards will change a fair amount but the team boards very little.
For every Mike Mamula there are 10 guys who were superb college players but not athletic enough for the NFL. Must evaluate both aspects of a playerâs ability.
@Goalline posted:For every Mike Mamula there are 10 guys who were superb college players but not athletic enough for the NFL.
71,000 college football players nets only ~ 260 that get drafted each spring.
Its absolutely insane how elite an NFL athlete is compared to most college dudes
Max Duggan (TCU) throws a nice ball. I wouldn't mid seeing a Day 3 pick going his way if they're in the market for a backup.
Darnell Washington = grown man
This draft is LOADED at TE prospects...with all our picks, if we don't hit on at least one not sure we ever will. No need to go TE in R1...there will be several in R2 and R3 worth taking IMO.
Re evaluating my TE evaluations ..
Musgrave & Kuntz - showed up in the 40, 10 yard split, vertical, and Broad jump. Musgrave could sneak into the First Round , Kuntz would be a good pick in the 4th or 5th round
Washington -- ran better (4.65) than expected and could also get into the First Round
LaPorta - up - ran better than expected but not as big as some of the others , 3rd or 4th round?
Mayer -not First round worthy , ran a 4.72,
Strange & Whyte - not as fast as I thought
@Chongo posted:This draft is LOADED at TE prospects...with all our picks, if we don't hit on at least one not sure we ever will. No need to go TE in R1...there will be several in R2 and R3 worth taking IMO.
But more times than not there is a real difference between a 3rd or 2nd rounder TE vs a first rounder. I say swing for the fences on your first real weakness/need. If its TE then so be it. We can then continue to draft like a science the rest of the draft. Do the research , interviews and trust your scouts. 
Washington looks like a gazelle on crack when heâs running - I would not want to tackle thatâĶ
@Satori posted:71,000 college football players nets only ~ 260 that get drafted each spring.
Its absolutely insane how elite an NFL athlete is compared to most college dudes
Add to the fact there were some elite high school players who never played college ball and it shows you how unlikely making an NFL roster is. Itâs like winning the lottery.
@Chongo posted:This draft is LOADED at TE prospects...with all our picks, if we don't hit on at least one not sure we ever will. No need to go TE in R1...there will be several in R2 and R3 worth taking IMO.
thank you for typing that out yourself and clarify that it was your opinion
iMO JMO IMHO that always help clear things up.
13 seconds, and that's all you could come up with?
@FLPACKER posted:Re evaluating my TE evaluations ..
Musgrave & Kuntz - showed up in the 40, 10 yard split, vertical, and Broad jump. Musgrave could sneak into the First Round , Kuntz would be a good pick in the 4th or 5th round
Washington -- ran better (4.65) than expected and could also get into the First Round
LaPorta - up - ran better than expected but not as big as some of the others , 3rd or 4th round?
Mayer -not First round worthy , ran a 4.72,
Strange & Whyte - not as fast as I thought
For a TE with size, below 4.7 is still pretty decent, but yeah, Musgrave was the only top guy to match Kelce's 40, and only Kuntz and Mallory his Kittle's marks and faster than Tonyan pre-knee.
One of the guys covering combine for NFL Network has picked up on the "below 4.7 forty" as a benchmark for elite TEs in the league. I think he said that the average 40 time for the top 10 TEs (yards gained this past season) is 4.62? I've been beating that horse since we had Jared Cook.... almost every all-pro TE in the last 30 years has been a sub 4.70. ...Kittle, Kelcie, Antonio Gates, Gronk, Graham, Hernandez, Witten, Gonzalez, Sharpe ... etc.
@Iowacheese posted:
thank you for typing that out yourself and clarify that it was your opinioniMO JMO IMHO that always help clear things up.
Your O is anything but H
To me, Iâm not sure what you can take from 40 times.
I mean, how many times do you see a player line up and run in a straight line unopposed and in shorts?
Jermichael Finley was clocked at a 4.82 40. Next to Keith Jackson, Iâd say Finley was probably the most athletic TE Iâve seen in GB in my lifetime. Maybe Jared Cook gets an honorable mention.
Guys climb up or drop down in the draft for a number of really stupid reasons. The size and speed measurables might be the most overrated factors in draft analysis. I mean, I get it you canât be 5â4â and play QB. Or run a 5.25 40 and play WR. But if the draft has taught us anything itâs that truly elite players donât become those players without working their asses off both physically and mentally. Hard work and desire and toughness are undefeated. No truly great athlete will excel at the top of the food chain exclusively based on their ability alone.
Will Mallory is a guy that hits all the athletic markers you want, but will fall because of this perceived lack of blocking ability. Could be a steal...blocking is one thing you can improve IMO.
@Herschel posted:Darnell Washington - Just Do It
With that one handed grasp Washington will never make it out of the first round. Book it !!
From Tony Pauline @ PFN: NFL Combine Takeaways From Day 5
Darnell Washington, TE | Georgia
Darnell Washington was much faster than anyone expected and tested incredibly well. He measured 6â7ââ and 264 pounds, with arms a tad under 34.5 inches and hands 11 inches large.
His forty timed 4.64 seconds with an equally swift ten split of 1.57 seconds and Washington touched 10â2ââ in the broad jump. He caught the ball exceptionally well, easily moved about the field, and played to his forty times. Washington is about to watch his draft stock take off and has cemented himself as a second-round pick.
Zach Kuntz, TE | Old Dominion
Zach Kuntz, who saw his senior season come to a premature end after five games with an injury, had a Combine workout to remember. His testing numbers were outstanding for a tight end who measured 6â7ââ and 255 pounds.
Kuntzâs forty clocked 4.55 seconds, he touched 40 inches in the vertical jump, and his broad jump reached 10â8ââ. Kuntz caught the ball extremely well and often outran passes being delivered by the quarterbacks. Prior to his injury, scouts graded Kuntz as a middle-round prospect, and this workout will revive that conversation.
Also a rundown on LaPorta at the link.
I didn't know Kuntz was also 6'-7". And he ran a 4.55!?
@Tschmack posted:To me, Iâm not sure what you can take from 40 times.
I mean, how many times do you see a player line up and run in a straight line unopposed and in shorts?
Jermichael Finley was clocked at a 4.82 40. Next to Keith Jackson, Iâd say Finley was probably the most athletic TE Iâve seen in GB in my lifetime. Maybe Jared Cook gets an honorable mention.
Guys climb up or drop down in the draft for a number of really stupid reasons. The size and speed measurables might be the most overrated factors in draft analysis. I mean, I get it you canât be 5â4â and play QB. Or run a 5.25 40 and play WR. But if the draft has taught us anything itâs that truly elite players donât become those players without working their asses off both physically and mentally. Hard work and desire and toughness are undefeated. No truly great athlete will excel at the top of the food chain exclusively based on their ability alone.
I agree. I'd rather see more emphasis placed on burst than raw speed. It's the first step or two or three or the ability to cut and burst or outjump someone that really helps separate guys. Defensive players are always reacting, so having the ability to react with a strong burst of speed and strength is essential. On offense, a TE or WR needs that burst to get immediate separation. Without that immediate separation, it takes a bit for a fast WR to get downfield and hopefully get open and that puts a lot of pressure on the OL. Look at Tonyan; everyone said he was a step or two slower this year, but something else that was evident was how his burst to get open was gone. That's one of the hardest things to come back from when it's an ACL.
@DH13 posted:From Tony Pauline @ PFN: NFL Combine Takeaways From Day 5
Darnell Washington, TE | Georgia
Darnell Washington was much faster than anyone expected and tested incredibly well. He measured 6â7ââ and 264 pounds, with arms a tad under 34.5 inches and hands 11 inches large.
His forty timed 4.64 seconds with an equally swift ten split of 1.57 seconds and Washington touched 10â2ââ in the broad jump. He caught the ball exceptionally well, easily moved about the field, and played to his forty times. Washington is about to watch his draft stock take off and has cemented himself as a second-round pick.
Zach Kuntz, TE | Old Dominion
Zach Kuntz, who saw his senior season come to a premature end after five games with an injury, had a Combine workout to remember. His testing numbers were outstanding for a tight end who measured 6â7ââ and 255 pounds.
Kuntzâs forty clocked 4.55 seconds, he touched 40 inches in the vertical jump, and his broad jump reached 10â8ââ. Kuntz caught the ball extremely well and often outran passes being delivered by the quarterbacks. Prior to his injury, scouts graded Kuntz as a middle-round prospect, and this workout will revive that conversation.
Also a rundown on LaPorta at the link.
I didn't know Kuntz was also 6'-7". And he ran a 4.55!?
Washington and Kuntz are the same kind of TE...Packers could make a case to take one of them, and a more athletic Kittle-like guy also. MLF offense needs more capable TE.
IMO
5' 10 1/8 204 lb QB
watch gb draft one of the fallers like bryce young or jalen carter
@Tschmack posted:To me, Iâm not sure what you can take from 40 times.
It's essentially how fast a person can cover 40 yards on foot, usually measured in seconds. You can take that information and determine which person could cover that distance fastest to the person who covered that distance most slowly.
@pkr_north posted:watch gb draft one of the fallers like bryce young or jalen carter
They both my slide, but I doubt either is past #10.
@"We"-Ka-Bong posted:It's essentially how fast a person can cover 40 yards on foot, usually measured in seconds. You can take that information and determine which person could cover that distance fastest to the person who covered that distance most slowly.
Are you saying this could help determine which players were faster than others?
@Chongo posted:Washington and Kuntz are the same kind of TE...Packers could make a case to take one of them, and a more athletic Kittle-like guy also. MLF offense needs more capable TE.
IMO
The first "ability" attribute people brought up about DW after the 2022 season was that he was a 6th OL. I don't know how good of a blocker Kuntz is but that may separate the two prospects. 6'-7" running 4.55 sounds like Jared Cook but I have not seen a lick of Kuntz's tape.
@pkr_north posted:watch gb draft one of the fallers like bryce young or jalen carter
Is there any top prospects with torn ACLs or other injuries where they wonât play their rookie year this year? Those are the players a lot of you people also wish weâd draft for some odd reason
@DH13 posted:Are you saying this could help determine which players were faster than others?
That is, in fact, exactly what that drill does. There are also tests to see who can jump the highest and lift weights the most.
Huh, so it's not just like somebody's opinion then.
@DH13 posted:The first "ability" attribute people brought up about DW after the 2022 season was that he was a 6th OL. I don't know how good of a blocker Kuntz is but that may separate the two prospects. 6'-7" running 4.55 sounds like Jared Cook but I have not seen a lick of Kuntz's tape.
I watched Kuntz on TV today and he did look the part. We would do well with him if DW was gone. Some reason though I have my heart set on DW. Even if we kept Lewis one more year.Which I also hope.
@The Grinder posted:I watched Kuntz on TV today and he did look the part. We would do well with him if DW was gone. Some reason though I have my heart set on DW. Even if we kept Lewis one more year.Which I also hope.
Only question with him is that he played vs. a lower level of competition. He started at Penn St. but didn't stick there, I am sure reasons for that will be explored.
@pkr_north posted:Darnell Washington = grown man
Donnell Washington was the far superior prospect.
I just don't know about Mayer. Was very productive at ND, made a ton of contested catches, tough, can block, ....nicknamed "Baby Gronk", his 40 time is similar to Gronk's, but he is 2 inches shorter and 15 pounds lighter than Gronk. In addition, his 10 yard split in the 40 was the worst of any TE that ran Saturday.
