Official General 2021 Offseason Thread

@YooperPackfan posted:

Don’t get me wrong, I still hope we get him but it never really works out for us

Reggie White, Ryan Pickett, Charles Woodson, Julius Peppers, Santana Dotson, Eugene Robinson, and Sean Jones were free agents that received contracts that were well above the minimum and worked out well over the years. Z. Smith has obviously been great and P. Smith and Amos have not been bad.

Joe Johnson was the big one on defense that didn't work out. He got 6 years and 33 million back in 2002 with about 7 million guaranteed. If you are arguing against signing JJ Watt, he's your cautionary tale as he missed a whole season with an injury in 1998 before coming back and playing well for a couple of years (so an injury risk like JJ). If you look at the cap, it's roughly triple what it was back in 2002, so an equivalent contract in 2020 would be about 6 years, 100 million and 21 million guaranteed (the contract was for all intents and purposes, 3 years and 16 million guaranteed for Johnson, so he it was for more like 50 million in likely money in today's terms).

Hardy Nickerson was washed up by the time the Packers got him too, but his was not for a large amount of money.

The Packers historically have had one big flameout free agent on defense and have been overall excellent when they go after defensive players in free agency. White and Woodson are two of the top 5-10 FA signings in NFL history.

Offense is a different story. Other than minimum-level contracts (Andre Rison, Bruce Wilkerson), it's hard to remember a free agent addition on offense that really contributed to a winning season in a significant way.

JJ Watt is likely not going to get a blockbuster, Joe Johnson-type contract. That would be a huge risk. Something in the 10 million dollar range is a very worthwhile risk and, even if it gets hurt, does not hamper you for years to come.

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

Offense is a different story. Other than minimum-level contracts (Andre Rison, Bruce Wilkerson), it's hard to remember a free agent addition on offense that really contributed to a winning season in a significant way.

Jared Cook in 2016.  The offense was pretty bad without him when he was injured.  He might've been a minimum-level guy though for that one year.

Billy Turner supposedly, but I don't really find that he has played all that well for the contract he got.

In 2012 the Packers tried to get Steven Jackson and ended up getting Cedric Benson instead.

@Phil posted:

Jared Cook in 2016.  The offense was pretty bad without him when he was injured.  He might've been a minimum-level guy though for that one year.

Billy Turner supposedly, but I don't really find that he has played all that well for the contract he got.

In 2012 the Packers tried to get Steven Jackson and ended up getting Cedric Benson instead.

I guess Jared Cook and Jimmy Graham were the additions that were for the biggest money. The best addition of an established veteran was Keith Jackson in 1995. Jackson was as good as many HOF TEs. The Packers gave up a 2nd round pick for him and a 4th round pick (about the same as giving up a 3rd round pick for him) and he didn't report until midway through the 1995 season. Then he lead the team in TD receptions in 1996, won a ring, and retired at age 31.

Just imagine Watt Clark Z Smith and Gary all in on the same play.  Just imagine.  

Watt would be silly to not milk the league for all the money he can get. In that respect he should go to the highest bidder, which likely won’t be GB. Teams that are consistently good, like GB and PIT, are consistently good because they don’t blow their wad on vets like Watt. No offense to Watt, he’s got tons left in the tank, but using the cap strategically and not being in and out of cap trouble is the hallmark of a good team...you use all of your resources, but you don’t over commit.

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

Offense is a different story. Other than minimum-level contracts (Andre Rison, Bruce Wilkerson), it's hard to remember a free agent addition on offense that really contributed to a winning season in a significant way.

We shouldn't forget Desmond Howard.   A minimum-level contract for one year.  One could argue he wasn't "offense" though.  But there's no doubt he heavily contributed to our SB win (obviously, he won MVP).

@vitaflo posted:

We shouldn't forget Desmond Howard.   A minimum-level contract for one year.  One could argue he wasn't "offense" though.  But there's no doubt he heavily contributed to our SB win (obviously, he won MVP).

A good point.

I was thinking more from the standpoint that in the Favre/Rodgers 29 year era, the Packers have arguably added only one high-profile free agent or trade acquisition to the offense during the entire time and that was Keith Jackson in 1995. They've gambled on big-ticket free-agent acquisitions to the defense over and over (White, Woodson, S. Jones, S. Dotson, R. Pickett, Peppers, Z. Smith, Joe Johnson, P. Smith, E. Robinson, Amos). You could argue that 10 of those 11 signings worked out.

The biggest free-agent signing on offense in the last 30 years has been Jimmy Graham in 2018 (and you could argue he's been the only big-money free agent on offense in the last 30 years). And beyond that, since they won the Super Bowl, they've only drafted two offensive players in the first round in 10 years (Sherrod-2011 and Love last year).

@FinnLander posted:

Never?  Reggie White (RIP) says "Hello".

I was basically referring to us acquiring former Badger players/coaches. It seems like what fans want the team doesn’t

@MichiganPacker2 posted:

The biggest free-agent signing on offense in the last 30 years has been Jimmy Graham in 2018 (and you could argue he's been the only big-money free agent on offense in the last 30 years).

Not sure what the Packers paid Andre Rison but he was a big money guy at one time.

@ammo posted:

Not sure what the Packers paid Andre Rison but he was a big money guy at one time.

He was a mid-season waiver claim.

https://apnews.com/article/477...96096550903deffba7be

Decimated by the loss of Brett Favre’s top three targets, the Packers (8-3) claimed Rison off waivers Tuesday from the Jaguars. To make room, the Packers waived six-year veteran split end Anthony Morgan, who was cut by the team at the end of training camp, then re-signed as a free agent Oct. 28.

@ammo posted:

You would really hate to cheer on all those former Badgers wouldn't you?   

Never had trouble in the past cheering for the Badgers that had good careers in Green Bay.

Lets see, there was Tauscher. Great player.

Then there was... uhhh... hey Don Davey wasn't terrible..

And... uhhhh... Randy Wright?

Ken Bowman,  Ken Stills, Lance Kendricks, Jeff Dellenbach.

Oh yeah, forgot about Kendricks. Not sure how I could've forgotten that guy!

Anyway, back to Mark Tauscher.

@YooperPackfan posted:

I was basically referring to us acquiring former Badger players/coaches. It seems like what fans want the team doesn’t

I have always found that interesting that the Packers have had very few Badgers on the roster over the years.  I know back in the dark days it was their philosophy to not take UW players because they thought it was too much pressure for them.I think since the Badgers have gotten good it is crazy more UW players don't end up in GB.

As badly as people wanted him to succeed, nobody remembered he was even on the team.

@DH13 posted:

As badly as people wanted him to succeed, nobody remembered he was even on the team.

The pride of Wautoma, Wisconsin. His case just shows you how good of an athlete you have to be to even make an NFL team. He almost singlehandedly won a state track title for Wautoma (Class B) by finishing 1st or 2nd in the 200, 300 Hurdles, and 110 Hurdles at the state meet. He was known as one of the hardest working athletes his coaches had ever seen.

He long jumped over 21 feet, ran a sub-11 second 100 meter dash, ran a sub 50 second 400, and a sub-38 second 300 hurdles. He was a standout at Wisconsin as a WR.

In the NFL , his limited athleticism is what made it difficult for him. Injuries also played a role as well, but even if he was healthy, we was never going to be a legit starting WR.

He's now a financial advisor in Wautoma.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ja...abbrederis-a220855b/

@"We"-Ka-Bong posted:

Man, I gotta remember to get a picture of this autographed moment I picked up last year in Wisconsin.

I actually think it was health that cut his career short.  It was well known that Abbrederis had multiple concussions while at Wisconsin, and who knows how many he had prior to college ball.

He also didn’t have the body type to take the pounding in the pros.  

Not sure speed and athleticism was as much of a problem.  His official 40 time at the Combine was 4.50 but did run a 4.44 during the Combine.   And the Combine is unofficially a slow track.  

@PackerHawk posted:

Man, I gotta remember to get a picture of this autographed moment I picked up last year in Wisconsin.

Then you should ask Janis and Abbrederis if they'd have gone for two.

1 would say they should have, 1 would say they shouldn't have

If this isn't the biggest no shit statement ever.

Packers want 'better production' out of inside linebacker group

X4 requests better posts (or no posts at all) from Fedya

If the Pack is going to make a change for the better at ILB, it must be someone who has speed to burn. He isn't on the current roster, so he will have to come via the draft or FA.
I think Martin and Barnes were pleasant surprises, but neither of them are anywhere near fast enough to make a real difference.

@"We"-Ka-Bong posted:

X4 requests better posts (or no posts at all) from Fedya

awh, just a little bit short.

@"We"-Ka-Bong posted:

X4 requests better posts (or no posts at all) from Fedya

All I know is that kid is going to have no kids at all.  Probably bent his little pecker in half.

The launch was so promising.

@"We"-Ka-Bong posted:

X4 requests better posts (or no posts at all) from Fedya

Hateful™.

@Henry posted:

All I know is that kid is going to have no kids at all.  Probably bent his little pecker in half.

What the human male needs is a prehensile penis.

Salary cap for 2021 actually goes UP to $180M

Greedy owners and corporate TV fucks got smart and decided to take less of a profit.

What was it this year?

$198.2mm

So only down about 20 mil vs the 30 that was possible.

$180M is the salary cap floor, so I’m guessing we see a stagnant cap or a raise. The floor was $175M in 2020 with the cap at $198M. Can’t imagine they will raise the floor AND lower the ceiling. Good news for GB. As it stands GB's cap is at $202M, so if the cap stays at $198M or goes up even a little then we're good. Giving Davante a new extension/deal could alleviate some space, reworking Rodgers deal, reworking Z's deal, releasing a couple key vets like Wagner and Kirksey and we may not even have to release P Smith.

With Bakh being out for a while, don't see how we can move on from Wagner

Corrected, floor $180mm and the projected cap is $188mm (from what I've read).

There's a lot of predictions out there right now, unfortunately I think a lot of it is Owners and NFLPA leaking numbers to the media to affect negotiations. I saw one report a while back that we won't have a cap number until the start of the new league year which is mid-March I believe. They're hammering out an agreement and I'm honestly not surprised. The idea that the NFLPA would allow the cap to go down despite new TV deals just didn't add up. NFLPA is veteran driven obviously and veteran players will be hit by the cap decrease, not rookies. Rookies have more/less static contract numbers, so any team with negative to <$10M in cap space likely won't even bother with veterans, it will be the teams with gobs of space that will hand out deals. You need around $10M to sign your draft class, RFA's, ERFA's and have some wiggle room in-season to sign injury replacements. NFLPA won't let their own guys get screwed.

I just remembered the Terry Glenn trade in 2002.  Why did he only stay one year?  Seemed to have potential.

@Phil posted:

I just remembered the Terry Glenn trade in 2002.  Why did he only stay one year?  Seemed to have potential.

I forgot about him. He wasn't terrible (56 catches, 817 yards, 2 TDs) in his yearin Green Bay. They gave up a 4th to New England, had him for a year, and then traded him for a 6th rounder to Dallas.

https://www.pro-football-refer...ayers/G/GlenTe00.htm