At least he tries.
I agree with Timmy if the kickoff is that deep......not only is there the chance he doesn't make it to the 25, there's also a chance for a hold or block in the back that happens on most returns anyway.
The co-GM encourages Nixon to bring them out of the EZ.
I see the 2023 Packers STs better than many it seems. Their kicker, Anders Carlson, has gone 7-for-7 on attempts (including 2-for-2 past 50 yards), and has made all XPs. Punter Daniel Whelan is averaging 47.4 yards per punt and has pinned four of his 22 punts inside the 20. After those early deep EZ returns it seems Keisean Nixon has settled down, and Jayden Reed is averaging 9.7 yards per punt return. The Packers aren’t the flashiest special teams group, but they have consistently done their job.
@H5 posted:The Packers aren’t the flashiest special teams group, but they have consistently done their job.
Except for allowing that one return TD...and once or twice Nixon took the ball out from 9 yards deep only to get to the 15 or something.
They've definitely been better than in years past, that's for certain
@Boris posted:Except for allowing that one return TD...and once or twice Nixon took the ball out from 9 yards deep only to get to the 15 or something.
They've definitely been better than in years past, that's for certain
If Bisaccia would have been the special teams coach since 2010, the Packers would have gone to 2 more Super Bowls.
The special teams were the biggest reason they had the meltdown in Seattle (TD on a fake FG and the onside kick debacle).
They lost against SF in Lambeau in 2021 mainly because of punt blocked for a TD in a year where the special teams were the worst coached STs I've ever seen at the professional level.
Nixon made the Pro Bowl as a returner last year. Their offense struggles to generate chunk plays (other than DPI calls in the one game). I think they thought the risk of starting at the 15 or 20 was outweighed by the fact that Nixon might have been their most explosive player available and giving him chances with the ball in his hands are worth it. That was especially true in the games Jones and Watson were out or limited.
ST struggled early in the season with penalties.
@MichiganPacker posted:If Bisaccia would have been the special teams coach since 2010, the Packers would have gone to 2 more Super Bowls.
The special teams were the biggest reason they had the meltdown in Seattle (TD on a fake FG and the onside kick debacle).
I doubt if Bisaccia had been special teams coach the play in NFCC game would have turned out any different. Everyone knew what they had to do by Bostic wanted to be a hero not a team player. The only difference may have been Bisaccia may have cold cocked him right on the sidelines. And Jordy would have helped hold him.
@ammo posted:I doubt if Bisaccia had been special teams coach the play in NFCC game would have turned out any different. Everyone knew what they had to do by Bostic wanted to be a hero not a team player. The only difference may have been Bisaccia may have cold cocked him right on the sidelines. And Jordy would have helped hold him.
Fair point on the onside kick. However, I think they might have been a little more prepared for the fake FG that was the first real turning point in the game. Why would you go aggressive and try to block a FG up 17-0 in the second half of a game where the Seahawks had failed to move the ball well? Guard against the fake. 17-3 is still a huge lead in that situation.
@michiganjoe posted:ST struggled early in the season with penalties.
Yeah, that would be my main concern so far on ST's. But it's also been the case on offense and defense. Many of them can be blamed on the youth on the roster but some vets have made some mental mistakes as well.
Special Teams DVOA ranking is currently 31st out of the 32 NFL teams. (Offense is ranked 19th and the Defense 24th).
The STs Coordinator's hand-picked player just got cut for (a) adding nothing and (b) committing 2 bone-headed penalties on the opening kickoff against the Chargers.
If the STs Coordinator was named Slocum, Zook, Mennenga, or Drayton instead of Bisaccia, would STs be getting a bit more criticism?
Or are poor STs just a feature of the types of players that management prefers in Green Bay such that no coordinator should be expected to be even league average when in charge of the Packers' unit?
Poor ST, Poor Defense, Poor offense are a direct reflection of what the HC is willing to accept. I've said for weeks this is an undisciplined team...key penalties have been a problem. Packers are -13 on penalties...meaning they've had 13 more against them. 4th worst in the league tied with the Jets. Worst is Chicago at -26.
2nd worst believe it or not is KC at -18...but the Mahomes factor pretty much makes it a non-issue.
Penalties isn't the only metric, but it is an important one.
It appears Packer People are too well adjusted to play many of the positions found in professional football.
MLF is soft. He’s beta. And it directly trickles down to the rest of the team. This is a guy who still makes excuses for his DC and likes getting into pissing matches with local media here over bullshit terms that don’t change the fact your defense sucks ass and can’t stop the run.
And of course, this spills over to STs as well. I think MLF is a good offensive coordinator. He doesn’t have the balls and the alpha to be a HC.
I would not have guessed out Teams unit would be ranked that low. I guess after a decade of watching complete failure at the absolute worst moments, this product looks average.
@packerboi posted:MLF is soft. He’s beta. And it directly trickles down to the rest of the team. This is a guy who still makes excuses for his DC and likes getting into pissing matches with local media here over bullshit terms that don’t change the fact your defense sucks ass and can’t stop the run.
And of course, this spills over to STs as well. I think MLF is a good offensive coordinator. He doesn’t have the balls and the alpha to be a HC.
Our next head coach better have eyebrows like this...
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@SteveLuke posted:Special Teams DVOA ranking is currently 31st out of the 32 NFL teams. (Offense is ranked 19th and the Defense 24th).
The STs Coordinator's hand-picked player just got cut for (a) adding nothing and (b) committing 2 bone-headed penalties on the opening kickoff against the Chargers.
Dallin Leavitt?? I didn't realize he was "hand-picked"
STs DVOA ranking up to 28th now, but leading the NFL in STs penalties so there's that.
Young players make lots of mistakes. The more young players seeing game time, the more likelihood of mistakes.
@ilcuqui posted:@TomSilverstein: One thing the #Packers have going for them in the pursuit of Rich Bisaccia as ST coach is that Bisaccia is very tight with defensive coordinator Joe Barry, a source said. They worked together in TB and Barry is Rod Marinelli's son-in-law. Marinelli and Bisaccia are best friends.
Don't know if they are tight, but LaFleur and Manuel were both in ATL in 2015-2016.
Manuel started his NFL coaching career as a ST assistant.
#Packers dropped seven spots to 29th in Bisaccia’s second season as special teams coordinator. https://t.co/Ynn23q6yT1
— Tom Silverstein (@TomSilverstein) January 12, 2024
@michiganjoe posted:#Packers dropped seven spots to 29th in Bisaccia’s second season as special teams coordinator. https://t.co/Ynn23q6yT1
— Tom Silverstein (@TomSilverstein) January 12, 2024
Sometimes you have too much youth. Give the kids a chance.
And yet, Nixon is an All Pro returner. The rest of ST must really suck to balance out that positive from K9.
For as much shit as dingle Barry gets, and deservedly, Richie Rich's unit has really sucked all f'in year. Moving on from both wouldn't exactly be the craziest idea..
Packers special teams rankings by Gosselin's numbers since 2012:
— Zach Kruse (@zachkruse2) January 12, 2024
2023: 29th
2022: 22nd
2021: 32nd
2020: 29th
2019: 26th
2018: 32nd
2017: 16th
2016: 29th
2015: 17th
2014: 32nd
2013: 20th
2012: 12th https://t.co/xjzrWBvNDB
I'd rather Fritz Shurmur turn into Lazarus.
Why is it so hard to have even a top 15 Special Teams??
Well some teams have to be in the bottom half 🤷🏻
@YooperPackfan posted:Well some teams have to be in the bottom half 🤷🏻
At least 1/2 of them. 
But the Packers are in the top half of worst special teams so they've got that going for them.
@EC Pack posted:Can we go back in time and hire Rizzi?
And ruin his career? 
@PackLandVA posted:Young players make lots of mistakes. The more young players seeing game time, the more likelihood of mistakes.
"cough" Jeff Janis, the best gunner ever. Thrown on the scrap heap.
The special teams don't seem nearly as bad to me. I do worry about the field goals, but I don't fear blocked kicks and punts like I used to back in the Drayton era.
I wonder if Gosselin's analysis is still relevant. Other than a 50% FG rate in the 40s, what has been wrong?
@Darryl Hand posted:The special teams don't seem nearly as bad to me. I do worry about the field goals, but I don't fear blocked kicks and punts like I used to back in the Drayton era.
Agree. Don't know all the ins and outs but it doesn't seem like there's been a bunch of explosive plays against our units, we're breaking in a rookie kicker, and we have a returner who they let take it out more than he should early in the season because the offense was sputtering and they were desperate for a spark. They've also been risking field position by kicking off short and trying to pin the other team deep. Long snapper remains a position that would benefit from a upgrade.
This was a developmental year before it turned into what we're watching. Hopefully the live reps with all the techniques pay off this week with a plus performance. I think Dallas has top rated units. Part of what goes into the spread being what it is. Big opportunity to contribute to a win this week for our specials.
Throw all those rankings out the window if they perform well this week. Everything is magnified good or bad for the playoffs . Rooting for specials to do well not only for the win, but also so the organization continues to see quality coaching as worth the investment. Feels like they tried to go cheap on it for a long time and the decision was top down.