Good lord....you both got it Rong....
Ass, gas or grass....
Let's get the history straight.
Didn't read whole thread but I heard Gary Ellerson on The Fan suggest that 1265 may create a co-GM role for Wolf/Ball. Interesting theory.
Meanwhile LeRoy Butler thinks it's Gutekunst who is more qualified than Wolf at this point...
Brainwashed Boris posted:Good lord....you both got it Rong....
Ass, gas or grass....
Let's get the history straight.
Historically speaking, it's abundantly clear what your priorities were.
ammo posted:I thought the term was Favre ball washers??
For the record I'm a huge fan of Favre, AR12 and the Packers. Is that even possible?
Pack88 posted:I continue to be amazed at the national media and the TT suddenly stepped down or the BOD ordered it! This reminds me of the unmarried girl who has a baby ( and failed to inform her parents) and states very glibly "I had no idea I was pregnant'.
Lets review the evidence - I saw at least 6 articles in the MJS(beginning in late Sept) that alluded to just this scenario (TT becoming GM Emeritus) and scouting only. Now who speculates about this issue and exactly that scenario unless somebody not named TT is thinking about it! Second M3 is quietly given an extension for only 1 more year. Odd that a coach with one year left- fresh off an NFC Championship appearance gets only a one year deal and it is not spoken of until Jan of the next year. Third- the rapid departure of very well respected talent evaluator Alonzo Highsmith- usually means someone has read the tea leaves and his name wasn't on it- even before the search team is hired! So only a few know the real story but it is obvious it ain't been in the paper just yet! Looking at how things are shaking out I am trying to find a reason why Brian Gutekunst will not be the guy! I get the E Wolfe hype but how many guys that he has stomped the yard for have been players?? I don't know for certain but 3 years ago when they drafted Kyrii Thorton - he jumped around like he won the Super Bowl so you have to believe he was over that bust! If I were to find out he was high on Jerrell Worthy then please let him go to the Lions!!
The national media no longer surprises me. I've thought for years that most don't even watch the games they base their opinionated comments on. NFL channel on Sirius XM seems to have a balanced, objective and calm demeanor in their reporting and they seem credible on their points. I may not always agree but it appears to be far from the circus you get on cable TV or the internet. That being said, the stories I've heard are not pushing the suddenly stepped down narrative. They seem to think GB will be just fine and the decision is already made and it will be Elliot.
Hungry5 posted:Co-GM would never work.
Wolf, 10 years younger, has essentially the same amount of player evaluation experience.
Many changes in time are arguably not all that good. Moving on from the short cut shorts (tennis and basketball) indeed was good.
Steal Schneider, steal Scot McCloughan and any other top guy from the Seahawks scouting side. Those MFers know how to find defensive talent!
Scot McCloughan isn't employed I don't believe. He does have a grievance filed. Would love to have him back in the Packers front office.
Yeah I wouldn’t hire him as GM with his drinking, but he’s easily one of the top talent evaluators in the league. If they hire Wolf, I hope he’s smart enough to bring in guys like this.
I think the slippage we’ve seen the last few years in TT has been all of the FO personnel losses he’s suffered. We had 3 current NFL GMs working directly under him. The talented guys working directly under him now were all in lower positions where they excelled. Gutekunst is no Dorsey, Wolf is no Schneider, and Highsmith is no McKenzie. I know TT believes in internal development before outside, but I wish he would have brought in the best available FO guys instead of the best available within the organization.
Goalline posted:El-Ka-Bong posted:chickenboy posted:I will also add that I recall most being supportive of the pick as he would have time to sit a bit and learn.People flipped their **** Ted didn't draft someone who would help the team that year. This might be where "Ted is being cute" started.
And I guarantee you BOTH Chickenboy and Digger were among those who bashed the pick. Both were Favre slurpers.
Can't speak for Digger but you can look up the thread and see what I had to say (if I did even post). I was fully in favor because of it what I stated above but I will also add I was 100% slurping the 'QB School' Kool-Aid and figured he would at the very least be 'coached-up' and flipped for a MattHass like bounty if the club decided to allow 4 to continue to do whatever he wanted to do.
Feel free to keep following the leader and post and make any claim you feel like but 'dems da facts and I often admit when C-Boy is rong (see Lacy post from the past couple of days).
Interesting point made by Jason Wilde regarding John Schneider. While many believe he's not just under contract but also does not have an opt out option for the Packers, Wilde noted that because Pete Carroll has final roster say and also has "GM-like powers", a move to the Packers may in fact, by NFL definition, be considered a promotion.
If the Packers gave him complete say in roster decisions, drafts, etc the Packers could argue it's a promotion and therefore they don't need Seattle's permission to interview nor would they be under obligation to make this a trade type move and give the Seahawks a draft pick in exchange.
Murphy may have already decided it's an internal guy like Wolf he wants, but if they went outside, may Schneider is more of an option then some people realize?
I don't want Schneider. He had a couple of nice drafts on the D side but his complete failures at addressing OL are horrendous. He's looking more and more lucky than skilled as each season passes.
The ideal candidate was Dorsey, even if he is more TT like than I want when it comes to FA.
I don't know a ton about the internal candidates to have a strong opinion and what I do know is just assumptions. That said, my preference is Wolf. I want someone young who is willing to get outside of the box a little. I'm guessing that's more Wolf than Ball. Ball, being a bean counter, is probably more likely to be in the mold of TT where he is scared to take a risk here and there.
I don't know if I read it here or somewhere else. But somebody hit the nail on the head regarding TT's failures being linked to him not adapting to the growing cap. He managed FA's and the Cap like it was still going up 1% a year instead of 10% like it is now. (guestimating numbers). I imagine that Ball is part of that problem being the head bean counter.
I understand that Draft and Develop, hording comp picks, plays into that mentality as well as other variables, but I think there is something to the hypothesis of failing to adjust to the changing FA climate and Cap.
packerboi posted:Interesting point made by Jason Wilde regarding John Schneider....
Guessing Wilde got that from my post on page 7. Schneider might require draft picks.Thanks for reading. 
If Schneider make himself available, you get him in .3 seconds. Lucky? Leading candidate for preposterous statement of the year on X4. Has he made mistakes? Sure, as has everybody. But he has several home runs and I like he is not afraid to take risks.
Plus I loved him in Dukes of Hazard
Schneider joined the Seahawks in January 2010. Look at their drafts since then, and tell me he doesn't know how to evaluate talent:
He's also had some great acquisitions via free agency and trades: Bennett, Avril, Robinson, Graham, etc.
I'm not saying he's been perfect, but Schneider's record has been impressive.
I understand and agree with the criticism of his approach to the offensive line. Something tells me he would make that a priority if he was assembling a line to protect Aaron Rodgers.
Schneider's biggest weakness IMO appears to be his inability to put together a good OL. But much of that problem is solved here with C LG LT already solidified plus a potential future RG in McCray. So that leaves RT with options of Murphy, Spriggs and Bulaga (who's very good when healthy).
A lot of other GM's would kill to have that as a starting option along the OL. The Packers DL (especially interior) is already pretty damn good too.
Packers expected to start their GM interviews Thursday, and in-house candidates Russ Ball, Eliot Wolf and Brian Gutekunst expected to be amongst first candidates interviewed, per source. Team would like to wrap up its search next week.
— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) January 3, 2018
Wonder if Reggie McKenzie will get an interview?
Who makes the picks, Schnide or Petey?
packerboi posted:Schneider's biggest weakness IMO appears to be his inability to put together a good OL. But much of that problem is solved here with C LG LT already solidified plus a potential future RG in McCray. So that leaves RT with options of Murphy, Spriggs and Bulaga (who's very good when healthy).
A lot of other GM's would kill to have that as a starting option along the OL. The Packers DL (especially interior) is already pretty damn good too.
Agreed. The Packers GM job really has to be a choice one for several reasons. You don't have a true owner, in spite of what many seem to think the organization knows what it is doing, and there is talent on this roster.
The GM of the Packers is going to inherit the best QB in the game, if the OL is healthy it is not bad, and there is talent on that defense it was just such a train wreck in the coaching department.
I for one would love to see Schneider in GB because he puts together physical defenses. But, I have this feeling it won't be him just a hunch.
Brainwashed Boris posted:Wonder if Reggie McKenzie will get an interview?
If he wants one.
BrainDed posted:I don't want Schneider.
Further reinforcing my desire to bring Schneider back.
I am really geeked that we are talking about all this - just wanted to share that.
pkr_north posted:I am really geeked that we are talking about all this - just wanted to share that.
Couldn't agree more. This is fun!
Can't wait for the dominoes to fall.
packerboi posted:Schneider's biggest weakness IMO appears to be his inability to put together a good OL. But much of that problem is solved here with C LG LT already solidified plus a potential future RG in McCray. So that leaves RT with options of Murphy, Spriggs and Bulaga (who's very good when healthy).
A lot of other GM's would kill to have that as a starting option along the OL. The Packers DL (especially interior) is already pretty damn good too.
Honestly though, I think we are seeing another non-Alex Gibbs ZBS issue. Teams that don't have Gibbs just can't seem to pick the right OL to run it. Schneider had Max Unger already and picked Russell Okung in 2010 before Tom Cable arrived to implement the ZBS. He draft Sweezy and Carpenter the next year, signed Breno and had a pretty good OL in place. I think the assumption was they don't need to spend money to keep those guys, they could find any old schmuck and Cable would coach them up. That's the reason for failure, it wasn't picking OL, it was believing in that psycho Tom Cable.
sschumer - Packer Fan HoF'r posted:Based on Murphy's comments today, I still fail to understand why he and Ted didn't have this conversation the moment John Dorsey surprisingly became available a few months ago and put plans in place to grab him, versus launching a search just weeks after he accepts a GM job with another team. They could have had that agreement done with Dorsey and held off announcing it until the day after the season ended. Who wouldn't think Dorsey would be as good a choice as we could find? But OK, water under the bridge. I now want John Schneider -- another Packer lifer with a proven track record of success as a GM. Why wouldn't he want to push to get out of his contract with the Seahawks to take the GB job? He'd have more power in GB (since Pete Carroll has final say in Seattle), and he'd be fulfilling his dream. And again, who could we hire that'd be better? If we can't get him, then maybe go with Eliot Wolf. While not proven, at least he's learned for years from Thompson, has a Hall of Fame GM father to continue to advise him, and has to feel special about the Packers. Can't get excited about Ball or Gutenkunst (however you spell his name). Keep Ball doing what he does best, managing the cap. Having Ron Wolf in the background is the clear advantage Eliot Wolf has over Gutenkunst in my view. I just hope Murphy knows what he's doing. His hiring Korn Ferry to help is a negative in my view. But will try to remain optimistic, be excited by the final choice.
So nepotism is a job skill?
Capers interviews for Packers GM position.
Murphy hires him.
X4 goes full supernova.
ESPN is reporting that the three in-house guys--Russ Ball, Brian Gutekunst and Eliot Wolf--will be the first candidates interviewed, with the hope that a new GM is in place by the end of next week. Rob Demovsky believes that Russ Ball is the early favorite due to his close relationship with Murphy.
I recognize Ball's value and deeply appreciate what he's done for the organization, but given this limited background in the personnel department, he is my least favorite margin by a wide margin. We need someone to build a championship roster with Pro-Bowl talent. We don't need a contract negotiator and salary-cap manager. You hire someone under the GM to handle those duties. And now is not the time to play favorites. We need the best man to get the position.
Honestly, I don't know that you can go wrong with Gutekunst or Wolf. Both seem extremely talented. Add Schneider to the list, and I'm really excited about all of the options except Ball.
Dom might not be a bad GM 
Lambeau Lobo posted:ESPN is reporting that the three in-house guys--Russ Ball, Brian Gutekunst and Eliot Wolf--will be the first candidates interviewed, with the hope that a new GM is in place by the end of next week. Rob Demovsky believes that Russ Ball is the early favorite due to his close relationship with Murphy.
I recognize Ball's value and deeply appreciate what he's done for the organization, but given this limited background in the personnel department, he is my least favorite margin by a wide margin. We need someone to build a championship roster with Pro-Bowl talent. We don't need a contract negotiator and salary-cap manager. You hire someone under the GM to handle those duties. And now is not the time to play favorites. We need the best man to get the position.
Honestly, I don't know that you can go wrong with Gutekunst or Wolf. Both seem extremely talented. Add Schneider to the list, and I'm really excited about all of the options except Ball.
I totally agree. I am on the Eliot Wolf bandwagon. Get some young blood in as GM.
Brainwashed Boris posted:Dom might not be a bad GM
Assistant to the General Manager Assistant
-Aaron James Hawk, BFI
Hmm...
Michael Rodney
@PackersNotes
According to @RapSheet, one external candidate the Packers could be interested in is former Bills GM Doug Whaley. Coincidence or not, he was a player at Pitt at the same time Mike McCarthy coached there.
I was thinking Reggie to satisfy Rooney Rule but they probably need Raider permission.
I like what the Rooney Rule stands for but I can't stand that they need to interview a person of color to "satisfy" it.
I don't know what the answer is but I wish we could get past all of it.
Whaley would satisfy those who didn't think TT "wheeled and dealed" enough and that would be it.
I think GB's next GM will be somebody from within the family. With that said...
Ball: I don't like it. I'm not getting the impression that he's a football guy at heart.
Wolf: Love the youth and the pedigree. He's young but that could be a good thing with his energy and willingness to shake it up.
Gutenwhatever: I know little about him... What I read is good.
Dorsey: I don't think he was ever a candidate nor is he now. TT's demotion was known amongst insiders and if GB wanted Dorsey, he would have never went to Cleveland.
Mckenzie: I like what he's done in Oakland. The addition of Gruden is going to make it difficult due to Davis' love affair with the Chuckster.
Schneider: He's a GB homer, young enough, uses FA and has drafted very well at times. The decline of Seattle's roster and lack of an oline is concerning but I like what he has to offer.
I would be happy with several of these guys but I still lean towards Schneider first and Wolf second. Wolf intrigues me quite a bit.
Brainwashed Boris posted:I was thinking Reggie to satisfy Rooney Rule but they probably need Raider permission.
I like what the Rooney Rule stands for but I can't stand that they need to interview a person of color to "satisfy" it.
I don't know what the answer is but I wish we could get past all of it.
I don’t think it’s a person of color necessarily but a minority in general, but yeah I know exactly what you’re saying